Guest Le Thou Posted December 4, 2007 Share Posted December 4, 2007 Had a tow bar fitted today on the the back of the Miami which will be only used for pulling a Smart car on a trailer, I decided against the Aframe because I couldn.t find anything in it's favour. There is too much negativity surrounding the A frame so I now have what I consider to be a fully legal outfit. Looking forward to "rigging" it all up and hoping that towing the Smart on trailer will not be too daunting. Rear view camera ready, spare wheel sorted just need to find the time to get it out for the weekend, (the motorhome Janice,, before you start!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest machra Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Where did you get the towbar done and if you don't mind me asking - how much was it?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 This is just a tow-bar legality-related aside. On page 200 of MMM December 2007, in the Towing Brackets and the Law section, John Wickersham says: "Commencing on the 1st August 1998, only EC Type Approval towing brackets can be legally fitted to M1 light passenger vehicles conforming with European Whole Vehicle Type Approval (EWVTA). This applies to motorcaravans that are based on M1 passenger-carrying vehicles although there aren't many of these." My 2005 coachbuilt Hobby has EWVTA and its Certificate of Conformity gives its 'vehicle class' as M1. Motorcaravans are increasingly being constructed to conform with EWVTA, so, if my Hobby is the norm, there may be a lot more recently-built M1-class motorhomes than JW believes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyishuk Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 machra - 2007-12-05 9:13 AM Where did you get the towbar done and if you don't mind me asking - how much was it?? my 2 penny worth ! Quote from a local fabricator (inc electrics) for a Rapido 907F (basically a Ducatto van with no chassie extensions, but overhanging floor) was £500. rgds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Ord Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Hi, Just a quick comment on A frames. They get a very mixed press in the UK and until this year I'd never seen any other nationality using them but in September on an Aire in Caro France I saw two French registered Motorhomes with A frames so maybe other nationalities are taking the view that as long as nobody is being prosecuted then it's o.k. to use them. Bill Ord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donna miller Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Hi Macra. This is what it cost a friend and myself for 2 tow bars fitted to our 2 Hymers. materials £65 (enough for 3 towbars) welding £60 ( by a coded welder,and coachbuilder before anyone comments) to weld 2 towbars together. wiring sockets £10 paint and accessories £25 Total £160.00 for both. Thats £80.00 YES £80.00 each. Time for us to fit and wire up 1 hour each van. The bars were made from the following materials, Rear bar, 2.02 metres wide, (this effectively fits across the whole of the rear, thus giving protection) 100 x 75 x 4mm box section. mounting struts, measurements taken from official Hymer towbar. 100 x 75 x 6 mm angle section. The mounting struts were over engineered deliberately and require only 3 bolts per side for fitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Le Thou Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 machra - 2007-12-05 9:13 AM Where did you get the towbar done and if you don't mind me asking - how much was it?? Hi It was fabricated and fitted my Mick Parkinson who is located just North of Preston and he supplys and fits them for Hymer UK at Preston. He charged me £325 inc of fitting and electrics and he will do it in the day and will also lend you a courtesy car if you wish to spend the day at Lytham or St. Annes or even Blackpool (Gods nows why). If you want further details let me know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terry1956 Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Hi made mine for the Hymer B544 from 3x2 steel section cost £20 pounds using off cuts from my local steel stock holders and a few bolts, ball etc which I had in the shed. I did my C&G in welding and have my own kit, £500 pounds for a towbar is a total rip off, I think that they see a motorhome and just make the prices up to suit.Like a lot of gear for hobbies know matter what it is, overpricing is a big deal. terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Le Thou Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Bang on the money there Terry, I thought £325 fitted inc was reasonable as some of the quotes I had were ridiculous, one company wanted over£400 for supply only. Do they think we will be falling over ourselves to throw money at them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afandy Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 ...I was quoted earlier in the year from £750...for Fiat Ducato...a well known company in Poole...ended up getting it done for £580 at Watling street ...just outside St Albans...Nice Job done as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terry1956 Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Hi, motorhoming like all hobbies is expensive, and i feel that people just spend their money without realy thinking about it. OK i am lucky i the skills needed and a background in engineering so knocking up a good towbar is easy, but realy when one looks at a towbar, how can one pay the asking prices asked, its not a job of any great skill, not much more then a tape and a welder and some knowledge of the metalwork and thats it, to pay more then £300 is just mad. i have seen towbars made up costing over £600 pounds and the are rubbish, weak fixing points, no account made for the weakness of the chassis, just knocked out and painted. Good luck to all who make their own, But please make them right, terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Derek Uzzell - 2007-12-05 9:38 AM This is just a tow-bar legality-related aside. On page 200 of MMM December 2007, in the Towing Brackets and the Law section, John Wickersham says: "Commencing on the 1st August 1998, only EC Type Approval towing brackets can be legally fitted to M1 light passenger vehicles conforming with European Whole Vehicle Type Approval (EWVTA). This applies to motorcaravans that are based on M1 passenger-carrying vehicles although there aren't many of these." My 2005 coachbuilt Hobby has EWVTA and its Certificate of Conformity gives its 'vehicle class' as M1. Motorcaravans are increasingly being constructed to conform with EWVTA, so, if my Hobby is the norm, there may be a lot more recently-built M1-class motorhomes than JW believes. I agree with Derek. My Hobby Van, based on the Mk4 Transit, is also EWVTA approved and M1 Class. Our previous van, based on the a "facelifted" 2005 Fiat Ducato, was imported from France but made in Germany, and was also EWVTA approved as M1 Class. There seems a strong likelihood that all the 2007 model base vehicles will be so approved, and thus M1 Classified. It seems any motorhome based on the "facelifted" Fiats will have that classification and so, I would suppose, will the Peugeot and Citroen clones.The problem seems to be that few, if any, of the UK converters/importers pass on the CoC to the owner, so few can know their vehicles are EWVTA approved as M1, and thus must have Type Approved towbars fitted. I suspect there are few such bars available in UK, where we seem generally unaware of this requirement so far as medium vans are concerned. Those with motorhomes manufactured in Germany, may be able to source their towbars from the converter to stay legal, since it seems German converters are aware of the requirement, and at least some offer - presumably Type Approved - towbars for their vans as options.Fitting a non Type Approved bar where the Type Approved bar is required may not seem significant. However, I think it would be very wise to check the EWVTA status of your base vehicle, the Type Approval status of your towbar and, if there is any doubt or conflict, at least make sure your insurer is aware of this and formally notes it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terry1956 Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 Re EU rules, Please people don,t lets get too into EU rules, OK here in the UK and France the towbar is not part of an MOT, I know that it needs to be tested in Germany (have a look at the Hymer german forum , But making a good strong towbar does not cost anything like the prices being asked, and thats my point, asking between £500 and £750 for a towbar is a RIP OFF. By the way the towbar test is very easy and I have seen this done on my motorhome in germany, I did not have a need by law just out of interest, cost me the price of a beer as i have no need of a cert in german for a French regt hymer. terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 TerryIt wasn't so much the EC legislation that I (and I think Derek) was aiming to highlight, but the possible insurance complications that might result from having a non Type Approved towbar on a Type Approved vehicle. Should the towbar fail and an accident result, the insurer could, presumably, deny liability on the grounds that unauthorised alterations had been made to the vehicle.Don't forget you are obliged to advise the insurer of any relevant departure from the standard specification of the vehicle. The addition of a towbar should be noted on the vehicle insurance file, and the assumption will be that it is of a type appropriate to the vehicle. If it is not (and a non Type Approved bar on a Type Approved vehicle will not be appropriate), the insurer's written agreement must be obtained. To do otherwise, is to mess with your insurance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geof Angi Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 Got a quote for ours from Watling Street of £500, seems like a good price to me as the cost for a car can now cost around £300, apart from which we only live about 45 mins from them Geof Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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