Help - motorcaravan dump

[Guest Norma]

Oh dear - I'm in trouble. Refering to Carol's posting (New to Motorhomes) from about grey dumping I've landed myself in a quandry. Can someone help - the 'Motorcaravan Dump' on Caravan Club sites, are they for black or/and grey waste? One I'm thinking of is right next to the chemical waste disposal and therefore my assumption was that it would take both. Plus the usual siting of previous waste at the same spot. Though at the weekend it was pointed out that it's for grey only. That to me is not a motorcaravan waste point. So after all the years I've used their sites I've been a naughty plonker - unless you know different. In fact if that is the case I will gladly not rejoin the CC. It was the only reason we have stayed with them. So where can we flush out our marine toilet in this country?

[Guest Brian Ramsden]

Why ask the Forum, why not ask the Caravan Club? Then you will get a definite answer, not someone's opinion. Brian

[Guest Mel B]

I have always thought that the motorhome waste point on campsites was only for grey waste, especially as there's often no way to flush it down afterwards. We have a cassette toilet and this is emptied down the normal toilet point as used by caravan owners. Don't marine toilet's usually come with a hoze so that you can 'dump' in the same toilet waste point as caravans as well??? I've never had one, a marine toilet that is!

[Guest Norma]

That's the trouble Mel, there is often a 'clean down' hose too. Certainly at the site we were on at the weekend. The other point is you have no need of dumping black at the motorhome point so it probably wouldn't occur to you. Whereas we have never known anything else and that's the way our logic went - motorhome dump meant motorhome dump to us. Twits that we are. Our marine bog has a choice of two ways of emptying. Either via the cassette, which we connect to the outflow pipe or via the same drainage pipe (3" diameter) as the grey water. (There is no way the black can get into the grey tank) We do have an extension hose too but it won't push the waste uphill and the hose is fairly short. I think the logical answer is that there are VERY few marine toilets and most people have a cassette only, so I can't expect the CC or CCC would to supply our needs. I would be very surprised if the Europeans don't realise the drainage is for grey only, especially when they are used to aires.

[Guest Ruth]

Hi Norma, well I am interested to hear the answer, as like you we have the Laika dual loo which as you know can be emptied by cassettte but if emptied marine fashion isthen followed by the grey waste which helps flush clean. We like you have assumed all cn be done on the drive over and have observed others doing the same at home and abroad. The CC accomodates RV's who seem to empty in this way, so I guess it ought to be acceptable. As you say extension hoses don't go uphill. After all it all goes into the same sewer and good practice is of course to rinse down thoroughly after emptying, which we always do and trust others would too. If you do clarify with CC would you post here please? Regards, Ruth

[Guest Norma]

Oh thank you Ruth. You make me feel much less of a fool. I did ask at the site at the weekend and they said no (though I have dumped at the same site in the past). Suppose I need to ask HQ. But as far as we are concerned the sign is very misleading. It goes without saying that we flush well afterwards - even if it's only the grey we dump. Does it go in the same sewer? If it does then there is definately no problem ...

[Guest Ruth]

well it does go inthe same sewer doesn't it?? Or is there something new to know about sewers? I may be making a fool of MYself here!! Ruth

[Guest Norma]

Don't know about campsites but certainly at home bath water shouldn't go the same way as the bog - as far as I understand ...

[Guest Brian Ramsden]

Assuming that the site is on mains drainage, then everything finishes up down the same pipe - apart from the ground water drainage. So intheory there should be no objection - but you know how "anti" motorcaravanners the CC is, so they may well be difficult. After all, marine tolets are not fitted to caravans. Brian

[Guest David]

Norma. I dont know where you live but every house I have lived in for the last 50 odd years the bath water and bog go down the same pipe. Very often if a sewer pipe is blocked the bath is filled as ita a nice quantity of water to help flush the pipes. David

[Guest Norma]

See, I learn something new everyday. Thankfully we've never blocked the pipes in the house. Now, as for the van. Well that's a whole new saga. So why can't you dump black down the into the grey waste? Think I will have to be brave and ask the CC. Trouble is where are we if they say no?

[Guest Ruth]

Hi Norma, well if they say no I think we need to challenge it, asking for concrete (and logical) reasons why not. If there is no logical reason perhaps we need to gather evidence of what is practice, say on the continent, to back up the case. I reserve judgment in case it was just one misguided warden, but IF it IS club policy, and IF it DOESNT have a justifiable rationale, then it would be a ludicrous, inconvenient and discriminatory policy. Regards, Ruth

[Guest martin]

If a thousand campers simultaneously dumped down the same drain at the same time using the old formaldehyde based bog fluids then the sewage works would be in serious trouble. Now the fluids are designed not to bring the local sewage treatment plant to it's knees … The CC claims that local authority planners demand separate and expensive pipe work and that the cost is prohibitive – and besides 99.9% use cassettes so what’s all the fuss about? Maybe it is the town hall that has the wrong idea and has visions of plague spreading from illicite dumping? As everyone has observed it all ends up in the same pipe in the same place. What I think the CC doesn’t like are the mucky buggers who don’t clean up after themselves – leaving behind weird shaped papier-mâché sculptures and worse … The population of leafy, suburban East Grinstead swoons in unison at the very thought! Norma should drop a note to the CC magazine using some suitable nom de plume!

[Guest Bill]

It is quite correct that grey water and black water go down the same pipes: the “sewers”. The interesting thing is that the word sewer actually means storm-water drain, and it is a relatively recent (last 100-150 years) innovation to have separate drains for rain-water. IMHO many of our society’s pollution problems would be solved if we made a further split, such that black water, grey water and rain water each had their own set of pipes. However, the cost of converting existing suburbs would be horrendous.

[Guest Malcolm]

But surely most rural sites will be on cess pool drainage - and when the tanker comes to empty it, it will take it straight to the nearage sewage works so it all ends up in the same place.

[Guest Geoff]

Hi Norma and All, My motorcaravan (Laika) also has a marine type toilet that can be emptied by by cassette or direct dumping.Where ever possible we have used Motorhome sevice points to dump both grey and black waste.(Including CC sites) We take care to ensure that everything is left clean and washed down, exactly as we did when emptying our cassette in our caravanning days.Having the ability to dump waste directly is a major benefit of a motorcaravan and I have no wish to return to the days of carrying full cassettes across campsites. I have used M/H Service Points to dump waste in this way for some years now and this is the first time that I have heard the practice being questioned.If I am in trouble then I am sorry but facilities for the "correct" disposal should be made available, after all the Chairman of the CC has pointed out how much of our money they have spent on site development and we are supposed to be getting better at this sort of thing.

[Guest Norma]

Geoff - I too have used them for all the years we have had the Laika, never having had anything else. We were out with a pedantic newbie who doubted and had me wondering so I stupidly asked! That's what has thrown me off kilter. I shall have to stike up the courage to ask the officials!

[Guest Ruth]

Norma, may I suggest that the collective wisdom shared in these postings gives you the confidence to merely carry on as before, i.e. using the facilities you have paid for to responsibly and hygenically dispose of your black and grey waste by the correct method for your van. You are doing nothing wrong, it has not been questioned before, it is usual practice most other places and there is no rational reason to object. It might be better to not ask... it is probably some stickler who can't actually find an explanation for the rules they think they understand but have actually misinterpreted. Regards, Ruth

[Guest Norma]

Ruth Must say that is my view. Just worried about all those fingers pointing at me - as I raised it in the first place. Like anyone knows me!!! Though I would still be curious to hear the view of the the CC - before I ignore it. Especially with everyone's view here. (The same as mine, till I opened my ususal big mouth)

[Guest malc]

After a similar query last week with a marine toilet, I asked a CCC Manager about the same. The answer is that the health and safety rules issed to the managers from the H&S people are that `ground level discharge points are not acceptable` this is because of the danger of spillage. They ,if provided must conform to a standard of concrete runaways with angled sides and no possibility of soiling outside the discharge point. `Dont shoot the messenger`

[Guest Bill]

I think lots of people including - in fact especially - the health-and-safety gestapo get unduly het up in this area. Many people wash their cars in the streets and let the dirty water and soap-suds go into the gutters and down the storm-water drains, yet we are told that it is a no-no to empty our grey water into those same storm-water drains. What, exactly, is so different between their grey water and ours? Get caught taking a pee in the hedge behind your rig and you'll be thrown off most camp-sites. Yet they quite happily allow dogs to pee on the lawns - to say nothing of foxes, badgers and other wild animals. For Petes sake, we are all mammals, with about 97% gene commonality. The cherry on top is that survival courses actually recommend human male urine as an emergency antiseptic for cleaning wounds! [In case anyone is curious, female urine is acidic] So it's a REALLY dangerous contaminant!!

[Guest Norma]

Please don't bring Pete into this. He's causing enough havoc elsewhere!

[Guest petej]

Don't want to cause havoc as my name is also Pete, but I received an email from karen.edge@caravanclub.co.uk (team leader, Mem Servs Dept)yesterday confirming that it is perfectly acceptable to empty both down the same orrifice - quote; both grey water and sewage are disposed of at the same point. - unquote. pleasant dumping, pete.

[Guest Ruth]

Norma, you can sleep easy now! Regards, Ruth

[Guest Norma]

zzz ... zzzz ... zzzzzz .... (Petej - many thanks for that. 'slright you isn't the havaoc causing Pete I was thinking of. Will print it out and laminate it!! And continue dumping with a clean conscience)