AndyStothert Posted February 17, 2008 Author Share Posted February 17, 2008 Henry, Have you not considered that the numbers seeing this forum are really quite small in the greater scheme of things and that to have 20 owners complaining about the very same defect which only arises in certain circumstances is very significant? Every one I've driven since buying the thing had been juddering, and I didn't start making all this fuss until I was fairly sure something was certainly amiss. I hope your new motorhome is OK, but please don't whinge if it isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 Going to the show next week to look for a suitable replacement, So, this subject will be foremost on my list when i start to ask questions. Primarily we will be looking for a Renault base vehicle,but if a Fiat looks a 'Possible' I WILL INSIST on a long test drive that includes much reversing up steep hills, then doing it again and again. Realistically i could still be unlucky though, So it's got be a Renault,Ford or a Merc. I hope that Andy and his good lady get their problems sorted soon, 'So Many Roads' is my favourite bit in MMM. and come on Fiat etc., Sort your problem out, come clean ! you'll feel better for it !! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshague Posted February 17, 2008 Share Posted February 17, 2008 is it possible for mmm to tell us the number of people viewing the site and looking at this post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 It says on Main Forum page 1704 views at last count. It doesn't say how many have been revisits, like this one. They probably can't count the number of different visitors separately. Mike H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Andy what you say about numbers viewing this forum are probably correct but my point is I have not seen any other reference to it in the general motoring press or heard any 'mutterings' among my many motor trade contacts. However one thing is for sure if I buy one and it has a problem I will whinge from the tree tops and will certainly let you know about it. I still cannot see it as a reason for not buying a Fiat based vehicle as the number reported with a problem is so small. Now many here may see this as foolish but all new vehicles have their problems and if you want any new one you have to view the problems in a realistic manner, that is most are fine and quickly sorted out by the supplier. Henry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 At the risk of being shot down again by all you indignant drivers out there, I do have to wonder whether driver technique together with an often long lost tendency towards what is known as 'mechanical sympathy' might play a part in all these clutch and gearbox issues? This is not a criticism of any driver or of any driving techniques but it might explain why some do and some don't have a problem? I have not driven a new van yet but even the previous model base vans could judder at times and needing a dipping of the clutch and starting again approach to reversing. Just a theory? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 Rich, Could the reason why there are not more voices raised about this issue be: reversing up a steep hill is not something that we (most of us) do very often ?? indeed if you tow a caravan you CAN'T do it (i know this,'cause i tried once) the over-run brake mechanism stops you. Anyway,back to Andy's broken gearbox. Whatever,on a vehicle thats only at most 18 months old, it just shouldn't happen. AND if it does they should replace it... and bloody quickly before the bad news spreads to potential customers (like ME ) . Even more so if the customer just happens to be a contributor to the best selling motorhome Mag. in the country. I think they are loopy to have let the problem go as far as it has. All i can say is 'Thank you Andy' I too may want to Reverse up a steep hill, and i don't want it to break if i do. Whether i am a 'mechanically sympathetic' driver or not. Bump to the Top ! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted February 18, 2008 Share Posted February 18, 2008 :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Back to page 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 25, 2008 Share Posted February 25, 2008 Rayjsj - 2008-02-18 8:25 PM Rich, Could the reason why there are not more voices raised about this issue be: reversing up a steep hill is not something that we (most of us) do very often ?? indeed if you tow a caravan you CAN'T do it (i know this,'cause i tried once) the over-run brake mechanism stops you. ............. :D No, not very often, but the necessity to do so can arise. For example if you meet a bus, or a large truck while going down a steep, but rather narrow, hill - like a few mountain passes I've encountered. The priority is in favour of the vehicle ascending, and in some countries there is no give and take on this so, if you're the unlucky ones, you may just have to get on with it! Your experience of reversing a caravan was either with an old caravan with no manual release for the over-run mechanism, or a very poorly maintained one where the auto-reversing mechanism had not been properly adjusted! Properly adjusted, the over-run brakes release when the van is reversed, so that brake drag is virtually nil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyStothert Posted February 26, 2008 Author Share Posted February 26, 2008 Brian, This rare circumstance you mention - when on a mountain road in Wales and a lorry towing a small trailer came up the hill forcing us to reverse back up - is what started the whole problem for us. The gearbox chewed its contents amongst all the juddering, and after a new gearbox being fitted I am absolutely sure that should these circumstances arise again then another gearbox or clutch will be wrecked as a consequence. If your Fiat/Peugeot or Citroen judders whilst reversing up steep hills it could result in serious damage when those rare circumstances finally do catch up with you. IF IT JUDDERS COMLPLAIN TO FIAT (or Peugeot/Citroen) then let me know the Case Number. andystothert@blueyonder.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred grant Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 alice judders every nite i enter the bedromm andrew my biddy. nothing special about that me ansum. f Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 26, 2008 Share Posted February 26, 2008 AndyStothert - 2008-02-26 7:51 PM Brian, This rare circumstance you mention - when on a mountain road in Wales and a lorry towing a small trailer came up the hill forcing us to reverse back up - is what started the whole problem for us. The gearbox chewed its contents amongst all the juddering, and after a new gearbox being fitted I am absolutely sure that should these circumstances arise again then another gearbox or clutch will be wrecked as a consequence. .......... andystothert@blueyonder.co.uk[/quote]But that was my point Andy. I think there are a few out there who may have been telling themselves "it won't happen to me" when, in reality, if you take a break in a motorhome you can never be wholly sure what you'll encounter. Even if you think you'll just follow the easy routes, there are always diversions, or the odd wrong turning, that can take you where you'd never normally dream of going. Mind, sometimes that works for the best, and you find things you'd never have discovered otherwise. Funny old world, isn't it? :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted February 27, 2008 Share Posted February 27, 2008 Hello all. Just heard from the garage, Fiat are going tomorrow to inspect and road test my van. I told them to find a steep hill for the test. Will report back when I know what happens and what they say. Mike H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 Hello again. I've had another one in today (3.0 litre 6 speed) so took the opportunity to try it in reverse on a hill. It vibrates quite badly on a moderately steep hill, on a really steep hill it could well become a judder but it is difficult to suggest what might be causing it. I've got another one coming in next week so I'll try that one too. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 Got the MH back this afternoon. Fiat field engineer, Says "it is a characteristic of the vehicle" On the phone to Fiat tomorrow, telling them, I don't want a van with this characteristic, it wasn't in the brochure, and it wasn't on the options list. So please can I have it removed? Mike H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike H Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Still waiting for Fiat to call me back. Said 10 mins at 14.40. Probably all gone home for the weekend now. Mike H. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 Can't a group lot of you all go to trading standards and send the lot back???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diydoolittle Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 michele - 2008-02-29 6:39 PM Can't a group lot of you all go to trading standards and send the lot back???? I am trying. I am trying but it is not that easy! Must say though very interested in this and the other threads on judder as it is more ammunition for me in my fight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyStothert Posted March 1, 2008 Author Share Posted March 1, 2008 Claire, (Diydolittle) Have you got one of the judderers? If so can you email me - andystothert@blueyonder.co.uk Indeed anyone else with a Fiat (or Peugeot) 2007 model can you try reversing it up a steep (and I do mean STEEP) hill and then if it judders (which can cause premature failure of other components) complain to Fiat (or Peugeot) get a case number and email me. Independently we are helpless, but if we keep all this fuss at the front of folks minds (those who may be thinking of buying a new motorhome) then we may get a resolution to it. Fiat are determined to ignore the complaining owners about this problem, so I'm sorry but until they at least listen we are all gointg to continue boring everybody else to death with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted March 2, 2008 Share Posted March 2, 2008 Dave Newell - 2008-02-28 4:05 PM Hello again. I've had another one in today (3.0 litre 6 speed) so took the opportunity to try it in reverse on a hill. It vibrates quite badly on a moderately steep hill, on a really steep hill it could well become a judder but it is difficult to suggest what might be causing it. I've got another one coming in next week so I'll try that one too. D. Anyone taking their van into Dave for work? Do you want the 'judder' test carried out??? It's a free service!!! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zulurita Posted March 2, 2008 Share Posted March 2, 2008 I must admit I was a bit concerned when I read Dave was doing this reversing test up steep hills on CUSTOMERS motorhomes!!! has he asked their permission? What if it caused a problem? i.e. soon after getting their mh back the gearbox went? If my mh went in for a service or work etc I would not want this test done unless I had been asked first or I had mentioned a problem that necessitated this test!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyH Posted March 2, 2008 Share Posted March 2, 2008 I would think that to have the test done by an engineeringly (is there such a word) sympathetic person like Dave would be more preferable than finding out a few months after the warranty ran out when you had to do it on some remote hill. If you have one of these then it would appear that you have a potentially defective vehicle and the sooner that something is done about it the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 2, 2008 Share Posted March 2, 2008 zulurita - 2008-03-02 3:37 PM I must admit I was a bit concerned when I read Dave was doing this reversing test up steep hills on CUSTOMERS motorhomes!!! has he asked their permission? What if it caused a problem? i.e. soon after getting their mh back the gearbox went? If my mh went in for a service or work etc I would not want this test done unless I had been asked first or I had mentioned a problem that necessitated this test!! So, would he be entitled to drive it forwards up a hill, then Rita, or only barred from driving it backwards? What other normal driving activities would you wish to ban garage/workshop proprietors/mechanics from undertaking? And if a gearbox were to fail after the vehicle had been reversed, what then? These are new vehicles, under warranty. Have you ever heard of a gearbox failing because the vehicle was reversed uphill, apart from Andy's, that is? Is it not significant the Fiat replaced Andy's gearbox under warranty? Would you be able to reverse a motorhome uphill such that the gearbox would not fail, whereas someone else doing so might cause it to fail? Or is it that you would prefer to break the gearbox on your own vehicle all by yourself? The point behind all these questions, of course, is that gearboxes are immensely strong and will not be damaged by normal driving, or even by quite a lot of abuse. If a gearbox were damaged by the act of reversing a vehicle uphill, it will have been a faulty gearbox that would have broken sooner or later. Better that it goes sooner, surely, than halfway up an Alp when its owner is on holiday? I really don't know why this post made me irritable, but it did! Sorry, Rita. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred grant Posted March 2, 2008 Share Posted March 2, 2008 calm down bri my luvver, before you doos yerself a bowel sindrome . ulrike was only makin a sensible point, and you as totally missed it my biddy. ferkinfred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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