Randonneur Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 I have noticed recently that we have a number of new users that don't put the details of their vehicles so that forum members have to again ask "what vehicle" to that they can reply to their questions. Maybe we all need a reminder in a nice way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 What is actually required is a prompt (or, better still, a demand) for details at the forum registration stage. Then new forum members will have already recorded information about their motorhomes/caravans/tow-cars/tents/etc. before they make any postings and there will be no need for follow-up reminders or educated guesswork. There is an OAL Moderator posting "What are the vehicle details?" (currently 8 down from the top of this webpage) encouraging members to provide vehicle details, but it's easily overlooked. The advantages of being aware of what motorhome a participant on a motorhome forum owns are so obvious that's it's difficult to see how this factor was totally overlooked when the present forum was set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 I have to strongly disagree with Derek here. I believe that making anyone put details on to the forum that they do not wish will stop some from joining, it would me (may not be a bad thing some might say). I will only ever disclose absolute minimum information on any internet site and will never put any information that I do not want openly displayed, if I was forced to enter information to join a site I would enter false details. I do understand that if someone is asking for specific information relating to a particular vehicle then they would need to post that information, however it should be left to them to take that decision at the time of posting. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted May 10, 2008 Share Posted May 10, 2008 So for the new members that don't mind, would you all kindly put your make and model, as people trying to help can not see and have to keep asking . Thank you kindly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 Michele: Frankly my dear you are wasting your breath. There is a frozen posting about this ("What are the vehicle details?" from the OAL Moderator) six threads down from the top of the Motorhome Matters web-page. This, however, will inevitably be overlooked in new members' enthusiasm to post to the forum. As things stand, the only way to display one's motorhome details permanently is to shoe-horn the information into the 'Location' section of one's profile. But this is a perverse method that new forum members won't instinctively follow without being individually 'instructed' how to do it. As I've said before, it would be far simpler and more efficient if there were a prompt at the forum registration stage to encourage members to provide vehicle details (and if Bas wants to say he owns an Inter-Galactic Starship with Ion-drive motor, then so be it!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 Derek, You are most probably correct ! I can understand what Basil is saying and its people choice what to feel that they want to enter. BUT I really can't see how putting the correct make & model on a forum such as this would identify you as a person . It helps people who are trying to help them . May be the Mods could change the registration page . Maybe I can hope in vain and wonder if the people who see this will take any notice and put in their details . Michele in the Nostramo signing off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 I would assume that if someone wants help with their own motorhome they will tell you what they have got, otherwise why do you need to know ? I agree absolutely with Basil. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 malc, Don't get your undies in a twist . Its not that we want to know for nosey sake . Often people pop up and say help and they fail to mention what is the vehicle . Its nice to look and see without breaking and waiting for them to get back to you . especially the old timers who are very knowledable and want to do research or stuff like that . :D If you tell me I will have to kill you :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred grant Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 if us as to permantly put our vehicles in our thingy, does this mean if us owns a fiat it will av a permanent judder. just a thought my biddies. follicallychallengedfred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 michele - 2008-05-11 3:46 PM malc, Don't get your undies in a twist . Its not that we want to know for nosey sake . Often people pop up and say help and they fail to mention what is the vehicle . Its nice to look and see without breaking and waiting for them to get back to you . especially the old timers who are very knowledable and want to do research or stuff like that . :D If you tell me I will have to kill you :D Michele It's very nice of you to worry about my undies but rest assured everything is under control. (...and anyway you've got enough to worry about with that hole in your van). I was backing Basil up because was disagreeing with Derek Uzzel ( 29 th Feb) who suggested that the van details should be DEMANDED at the registration stage. I can't tell you what van I've got now anyway because I don't want to die. ;-) ;-) ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 malc d - 2008-05-11 7:44 PM Michele It's very nice of you to worry about my undies but rest assured everything is under control. (...and anyway you've got enough to worry about with that hole in your van). I was backing Basil up because was disagreeing with Derek Uzzel ( 29 th Feb) who suggested that the van details should be DEMANDED at the registration stage. I can't tell you what van I've got now anyway because I don't want to die. ;-) ;-) ;-) :D :D :D malc fair enough you live BUT where the mods have stuck the original thread isn't doing any newcomers justice I was exactly the same full of questions and couldnt wait to post . Its not until later if you stay that you end up looking over that sort of sticky post. I dont think that Basil does not have a fair point BUT, again I say its not like anyone will come to harm by letting people know what make and model we all have . I dont think anything sinister will happen to any of us except get help from people who know about these things . In the end its up to each indiviual but I am sure that not every newcommer or everyone feels like this I think they just dont know about it . Take the comment from Dave newell on my damage thread he couldnt of said that with out me posting it could he ? I know the comment isnt really relevant to this , but you understand what I am saying even if my rambling dont make sense ....Hey guess what I'm off to kill him later :D :D :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 Hi All, I don't believe it is worth getting fired up over this but I just believe that no one should HAVE to give details that they are unhappy about posting on what is basically an open forum. Quite clearly if someone is asking a question that is specific to a particular make/model of van then it would seem pretty nieve to expect other forum members to be clairvoyant so in that case I would expect to see details. On the other hand there are many motorhome related general questions that do not need a new members van's details. I have had personal experience of our van being cloned and had an anxious three weeks waiting to see whether it was ours or the other van cloned it is not very pleasant believe me. So excuse me if I wish to be vague about what detail I place on an open forum. In this day and age with ID theft I believe that it is encumbant on an individual to protect that information that he/ she chooses and so should not be FORCED to give details that they do not wish to, for a new member this could put them off joining the forum. If anyone believes that personal information cannot be obtained from forums they need a reality check. A motor car enthusiasts forum that I am a member of was hacker attacked and all member information was obtained by a third party including complete car details (registration numbers etc) and names, addresses and e-mails . I still get spam e-mails sent via this address which can only have been obtained from the hacker attack. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
libby Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 On the opposite tack I've had contact with members in another club group who by not supplying any personal info have only joined in diguise to con the genuine members. How do the forum members on here who are so disposed to their own non commital feel about that? If we see no clues as to a member's interests we would be justified to assume the worst of you. Remember thieves do not advertise their presence. They do not have 'ROBBER' stamped on their forehead. My view is anyone can challenge me, anyone is welcome to what I have, I'm very open and completely unfrightened of life and what it holds. Remember we live in a frightened society (according to the media) why, because it sells merchandise, make no mistake about that! PS.... but I'm no fool either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted May 11, 2008 Share Posted May 11, 2008 libby - 2008-05-11 10:53 PM On the opposite tack I've had contact with members in another club group who by not supplying any personal info have only joined in diguise to con the genuine members. How do the forum members on here who are so disposed to their own non commital feel about that? If we see no clues as to a member's interests we would be justified to assume the worst of you. Remember thieves do not advertise their presence. They do not have 'ROBBER' stamped on their forehead. My view is anyone can challenge me, anyone is welcome to what I have, I'm very open and completely unfrightened of life and what it holds. Remember we live in a frightened society (according to the media) why, because it sells merchandise, make no mistake about that! PS.... but I'm no fool either. Libby Many years ago, in the early days of the internet, I was sent on a course to find out how it worked / how to get info etc. One thing that was stressed to us from the start was the fact that you will seldom REALLY know who you are in touch with, and many things have to be taken on trust. ( That's why young people are warned about getting too involved with others in chat rooms who claim to be the same age with similar interests ). Generally it seems to me the 'baddies' are more likely to be those who give false information, not those who withold it. It seems to me therefore that it's a bid odd to think you may trust people less on the basis that they haven't told you anything. As for what you refer to as 'non-commital' I think of as committed to freedom of choice. ( Mind you -I do agree with you about the media !) ;-) ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 libby - 2008-05-11 10:53 PM On the opposite tack I've had contact with members in another club group who by not supplying any personal info have only joined in diguise to con the genuine members. How do the forum members on here who are so disposed to their own non commital feel about that? If we see no clues as to a member's interests we would be justified to assume the worst of you. Remember thieves do not advertise their presence. They do not have 'ROBBER' stamped on their forehead. My view is anyone can challenge me, anyone is welcome to what I have, I'm very open and completely unfrightened of life and what it holds. Remember we live in a frightened society (according to the media) why, because it sells merchandise, make no mistake about that! PS.... but I'm no fool either. You are of course as entitled to your opinion as I am to mine and it should not be any other way, that is the very reason that I do not agree with FORCING people to place details they do not wish to. In the same way that if I was using an Aire, motorway or otherwise, I would check out what I see and if it did not feel right I would not stop I do the same with the Internet and any forums. When the MMM forum was for subscribers only I was more prepared to be open as all posters were bona fida members, but now it is an 'open' forum I treat it the same way as any other forum that can be joined by anyone. Though slightly off tack but I believe relevent, I strongly believe that this is a mindset syndrome of living in UK today where we are forced by the 'Nanny State' to do their bidding, the latest being 'if you don't make your child have the MMR against your wishes you can't send it to school' bad news to me choice, within the realms of decency and legality, should always be paramount. As always just my opinion. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 Ok fair enough Basil ....Except no one is asking for number plates only the year and model ..what can anyone clone from that I dont know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 12, 2008 Share Posted May 12, 2008 I would have thought that, on a motorhome-related forum, providing a new forum participant with the opportunity to say what motorhome he/she owns would be a facility that most people would consider eminently sensible. How the provision was offered - whether it would be completely optional, strongly recommended, or 'compulsory' - is academic as far as I'm concerned. My own preference, based on a 27 year career in IT, is that you try to discourage people from opting out easily from providing useful data, but do allow them to opt out if they really must. However, the main thing at present is that new forum participants are given NO obvious opportunity to provide motorhome details at forum registration. It may be that the ability to know what motorhome a forum member owns is considered unimportant. I can understand that, if a forum member's participation never involves responding to inquiries where knowing the motorhome details are valuable to the respondant, this facility won't matter to him/her. But I find it useful and, as I've just had a PM that was clearly triggered by the inquirer knowing the make/model of motorhome I own, it's fair to assume others do too. If 'secrecy' is of great concern, then nobody should use internet forums. Of the three contributors to this thread whose Profiles contain no motorhome details, I'm aware of the make/model owned by one (though he may well have sold it by now) because I remember him revealing the information casually last January. Of the remaining two, both are running at around 500 postings per annum and (while I'm certainly not going to wade through all these contributions to prove my point) it's a fair bet the relevant information has been let slip at some time. For the life of me, I can't see what benefit knowing which motorhome I say I own offers a 'criminal'. Besides which, there's no way of telling that what I say is necessarily true. After all, you surely don't believe I'm called "Derek Uzzell" and live in Herefordshire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 Obviously Derek and I are never going to agree on this. I had a look at the Moderators thread on Vehicle Details and it says, in effect " If you want any technical help with your motorhome, include the vehicle details" I couldn't agree more. (.... and incidentally from the 4000 plus members of the Forum there have been over 2000 'views' of that thread so I'm sure many people have 'got the message') Looking back over the last few pages of the 'Motorhome Matters' forum I notice that the majority of the subjects are wide ranging from aires to rattles, and from places to visit, to carrying dogs. I wouldn't have thought that any of these required vehicle details. So, as far as I am concerned it's not a question of 'secrecy' but simply one of relevance. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 I would like to give another little comment on this, I have in the past wanted to see if any other forumites have a vehicle of the same make as mine to ask them something about it. Using the search facility I was able to find another poster, who turned out to be a long lost microcar friend :-> with virtually the same vehicle who gave me help when I needed it. If he hadn't referred to his vehicle in his postings I wouldn't have know. Anyway, the upshot of all this chatter on this thread appears to be .... If you want help with your specific vehicle make sure you include the details somewhere, if not, then don't. Simple innit! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 13, 2008 Share Posted May 13, 2008 malc d: As far as I'm concerned it's not a matter of secrecy or relevance, it's purely a question of common-sense forum software design. I don't care what motorhome you, Basil or Fred own, because you are long-term forum members and should know the 'rules' by now. (Besides which, I don't think your comments ever include any requirement for other people to be aware of what vehicle you own.) However, I do care about new forum members who are given no opportunity at the registration stage to say what motorhome they own and, as a consequence. ask questions that omit this information even though it is valuable/vital for sensible and complete responses to be provided. I don't believe we are really at loggerheads over this. I just want a facility at the forum registration stage where new forum members can say what vehicle they own. I suggested the bodge of putting this information in the 'Location' field because it was the only practical option I could come up with, but I certainly don't favour the idea. If you think that providing this information only on an as-and-when-it's-necessary basis is the better plan, then so be it. It might be interesting to have the views of newish forum members on this, to see if they would have liked to have been prompted at the registration stage for details of the motorhome they own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROON Posted May 14, 2008 Share Posted May 14, 2008 I don't believe we are really at loggerheads over this. I just want a facility at the forum registration stage where new forum members can say what vehicle they own. I suggested the bodge of putting this information in the 'Location' field because it was the only practical option I could come up with, but I certainly don't favour the idea. If you think that providing this information only on an as-and-when-it's-necessary basis is the better plan, then so be it. Hi All, I'm relatively new.. I havn't commented so far because I don't really see this as an argument... if you read the above quote(hope I've done it correctly) Derek says he was only giving a practical option. I hadn't given my vehicle details to date purely because I didn't think it was relevant but I will if someone believes it will help then I don't mind. I don't think it should be compulsory .... I would avoid any site that makes any info compulsory and hate even giving details of name, e-mail addy, etc but know they are necessary. I HAVE encountered snobbery on campsites (mine isn't the most expensive of vans ... but I do love her) and I guess it could be a possibility on websites too. I HAVE had cause on another site to look for a Peugeot Eldiss owner for help .... but we are pretty exclusive (lol) ... or maybe you all know something I don't :-( so I don't know how much work it is for the mods to change the registration asking for vehicle details in case help be needed in future but not making it compulsory field in order to be a member. Make and models are of great interest to a lot of people - bit like train spotting I guess. It's gonna take me three hours to work out HOW to put vehicle details on!!! This site needs support from as many as possible. B-) (lol) B-) Keep smiling everybody.... we're all on the same side don't forget ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 ROON: If you wanted advice from this forum about your Elddis motorhome, you could ask Fred Grant (who posted earlier in this thread) as he owns/has owned an Elddis 300. Of course there's no way of you knowing this fact easily as Fred has chosen to omit it from his Profile and the only way I'm aware of it is because he once mentioned that the vehicle was for sale. You could also try looking for Elddis fellow-owners using the forum's SEARCH facility, but this is a cranky brute nowadays and often reluctant to handle searches that involve large quantities of data. Your comment about 'campsite snobbery' is interesting, as I've occasionally wondered if people who did not provide motorhome details on their forum-postings did this deliberately because they somehow felt ashamed of owning an elderly and/or inexpensive vehicle. (A sort of Motorcaravan Inferiority Complex!) Can't say it would concern me - in fact I'm much more interested in older designs with a bit of character that have stood the test of time than glossy look-alike 'gin palaces'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROON Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 Hi Derek, Thanks for your help re the Eldiss. I will bear it in mind. I know what you mean re the search engine .... tried it a few times and given up. Yes, my vehicle isn't THAT old but I have (not on this site) noticed a few comments that made me think there is a certain 'snobbery' and then had occasion when on a campsite to feel a little upset over a remark made to, and I'm a bit too stupid to be oversensitive. I bought my Eldiss because it was the best I could afford (and it took every penny of my savings) and I knew I would struggle to run it but I mean it when I say I love it to bits. Thanks again for the help. Joy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted May 15, 2008 Share Posted May 15, 2008 Roon, Love your Eldiss!! I, like Derek, am more impressed with cared for 'older' vehicles which is why I get so annoyed over the LEZ problems. Ours will be ten years old this year and whilst we could have any van we desired really we are just happy with what we have and have found nothing that would replace it. So you certainly should have no hang ups about your van, if others have that's their problem. One of my favorite sections of MMM is the Classic Camper section. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randonneur Posted May 15, 2008 Author Share Posted May 15, 2008 Basil - 2008-05-15 10:19 AM Roon, Love your Eldiss!! I, like Derek, am more impressed with cared for 'older' vehicles which is why I get so annoyed over the LEZ problems. Ours will be ten years old this year and whilst we could have any van we desired really we are just happy with what we have and have found nothing that would replace it. So you certainly should have no hang ups about your van, if others have that's their problem. One of my favorite sections of MMM is the Classic Camper section. Bas I totally agree. As you can see ours is 10 yrs old and we went to a gigantic motorhome Expo in Bordeaux last week and only found one motorhome that we would swap ours for. Unfortunately funds don't permit that plus the fact that it was a lot bigger than what we have. So we have decided to keep ours and look after her very carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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