Bulletguy Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 This string is well worth reading through. As of today, there have been 320 deaths from the coronavirus in Ireland, and 9,875 deaths in the UK. Ok, ok, but the UK has a ginormous population, right? Especially compared to Ireland. So we adjust per capita - how many deaths per 100,000 people? As of Saturday 11 April, there have been 6.5 deaths per 100,000 people in Ireland. There have been 14.81 deaths per 100,000 people in the UK. Read the rest....she makes some interesting points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Deaths per million....US is 67 , Ireland is 67. As we have mentioned before not everyone is counting or testing the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spospe Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 There are lies, dammed lies and statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 If you want to know more, try this Wiki: https://tinyurl.com/red2sy9 There are numerous links to other pages, some of which have highly detailed analysis of the virus and what we do, and don't know, about it. It is highly informative but, inevitably, the data are not consistent due to different detection, recording, and reporting norms across countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 and yet.. being surrounded by water - and having weeks if not months of notice, we could have tested and quarantined people coming in to the mainland and avoided it altogether :-( But by the slogans Stay at home, Save lives, Protect the NHS, the Governments spin doctors have shifted the attention of vigilantes to the likes of ordinary folk self isolating in second homes and motorhomes, or driving to a less congested area to take exercise safely, and are harming no-one. I thought the NHS was supposed to protect us, not the other way round. But if we get symptoms we are told not to even contact them, just go 'home' (no mention of those who haven't got one they can self isolate in), and die without our deaths being added to their official statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 John52 - 2020-04-13 12:19 PM and yet.. being surrounded by water - and having weeks if not months of notice, we could have tested and quarantined people coming in to the mainland and avoided it altogether :-( But by the slogans Stay at home, Save lives, Protect the NHS, the Governments spin doctors have shifted the attention of vigilantes to the likes of ordinary folk self isolating in second homes and motorhomes, or driving to a less congested area to take exercise safely, and are harming no-one. I thought the NHS was supposed to protect us, not the other way round. But if we get symptoms we are told not to even contact them, just go 'home' (no mention of those who haven't got one they can self isolate in), and die without our deaths being added to their official statistics. Three people I know in one family,had all the symptoms,temp, dry cough, feel like sh*t for about 14 days but all got over it. They tried calling NHS helpline but never got through. So presumably if they had died would never have been tested so not in the figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 spospe - 2020-04-13 11:36 AM There are lies, dammed lies and statistics. I assume that those people who cut and paste statistics are influenced by them. :'( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 13, 2020 Author Share Posted April 13, 2020 Brian Kirby - 2020-04-13 11:59 AM If you want to know more, try this Wiki: https://tinyurl.com/red2sy9 There are numerous links to other pages, some of which have highly detailed analysis of the virus and what we do, and don't know, about it. It is highly informative but, inevitably, the data are not consistent due to different detection, recording, and reporting norms across countries. Thanks for posting that Brian. Just as the string i posted (shes certainly done a lot of homework on that!), that makes pretty chilling reading and i see one of our top scientists has said UK could end up with the worst death toll in Europe. He gave a more indepth interview on BBC Breakfast last week specifically stating delaying lockdown, self-isolating, lack of early testing, no tracing and no quarantine, not to mention the woeful lack of equipment. https://tinyurl.com/vqqe6xn Regards recording, the ONS have said our actual figure could be at least 8% higher than reported as government only count deaths in hospitals. People dying at home, hospices, care homes etc are not counted so for example, Nazir Afzals brother who died last week, won't be counted even though he'd been tested and confirmed positive, because he died at home. Todays official figure is 11,329 so with ONS +8% takes the actual to 12,314 as of now. :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 I think it’s a lot higher than that, look at all the carehome deaths. Not tested so who knows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conrad Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Perhaps only when it's all over, if it ever is, will the real picture emerge. Hopefully there will be a public inquiry, especially to plan how to better prepare when this all happens again. 3 corona virus outbreaks in human history, all in past 15 years, as population has ever expanded into areas which used to be the preserve of wild animals, and eating them. Next one when? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Conrad - 2020-04-13 4:57 PM Perhaps only when it's all over, if it ever is, will the real picture emerge. Hopefully there will be a public inquiry, especially to plan how to better prepare when this all happens again. 3 corona virus outbreaks in human history, all in past 15 years, as population has ever expanded into areas which used to be the preserve of wild animals, and eating them. Next one when? Exactly...this won’t be over. Just be waiting for the next instalment. Even when we start getting our yearly inoculations there will be a strain we haven’t had . Before setting off abroad we won’t be allowed to travel unless we have a certification. Pubs,restaurants,clubs ,cinemas won’t reopen, jobs will be lost,but landowners and the wealthy won’t pay the price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 13, 2020 Author Share Posted April 13, 2020 Conrad - 2020-04-13 4:57 PM Perhaps only when it's all over, if it ever is, will the real picture emerge. Hopefully there will be a public inquiry, especially to plan how to better prepare when this all happens again. 3 corona virus outbreaks in human history, all in past 15 years, as population has ever expanded into areas which used to be the preserve of wild animals, and eating them. Next one when? Three years ago government rejected advice on provision of certain PPE equipment for NHS staff as "too costly" for a flu pandemic. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/27/advice-on-protective-gear-for-nhs-staff-was-rejected-owing-to-cost The original report was published in 2011. A lengthy read but there are a number of interesting points stated within it; https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/213717/dh_131040.pdf 4.16 The Government already has in place stockpiles of facemasks and respirators for health and social care workers. In line with the scientific evidence, the Government will not stockpile facemasks for general use in the community. The responsibility for providing advice on the use of facemasks and respirators, as well as their provision and training, for non-health workers in the public and private sector rests with employers. 4.21 There is very limited evidence that restrictions on mass gatherings will have any significant effect on influenza virus transmission. Large public gatherings or crowded events where people may be in close proximity are an important indicator of ‘normality’ and may help maintain public morale during a pandemic. The social and economic consequences of advising cancellation or postponement of large gatherings are likely to be considerable for event organisers, contributors and participants. There is also a lack of scientific evidence on the impact of internal travel restrictions on transmission and attempts to impose such restrictions would have wide reaching implications for business and welfare. 4.22 For these reasons, the working presumption will be that Government will not impose any such restrictions. The emphasis will instead be on encouraging all those who have symptoms to follow the advice to stay at home and avoid spreading their illness. However, local organisers may decide to cancel or postpone events in a pandemic fearing economic loss through poor attendances, and the public themselves may decide not to mix in crowds, or use public transport if other options are available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdbrain Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Bulletguy - 2020-04-13 5:44 PM Conrad - 2020-04-13 4:57 PM Perhaps only when it's all over, if it ever is, will the real picture emerge. Hopefully there will be a public inquiry, especially to plan how to better prepare when this all happens again. 3 corona virus outbreaks in human history, all in past 15 years, as population has ever expanded into areas which used to be the preserve of wild animals, and eating them. Next one when? Three years ago government rejected advice on provision of certain PPE equipment for NHS staff as "too costly" for a flu pandemic. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/27/advice-on-protective-gear-for-nhs-staff-was-rejected-owing-to-cost The original report was published in 2011. A lengthy read but there are a number of interesting points stated within it; https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/213717/dh_131040.pdf 4.16 The Government already has in place stockpiles of facemasks and respirators for health and social care workers. In line with the scientific evidence, the Government will not stockpile facemasks for general use in the community. The responsibility for providing advice on the use of facemasks and respirators, as well as their provision and training, for non-health workers in the public and private sector rests with employers. 4.21 There is very limited evidence that restrictions on mass gatherings will have any significant effect on influenza virus transmission. Large public gatherings or crowded events where people may be in close proximity are an important indicator of ‘normality’ and may help maintain public morale during a pandemic. The social and economic consequences of advising cancellation or postponement of large gatherings are likely to be considerable for event organisers, contributors and participants. There is also a lack of scientific evidence on the impact of internal travel restrictions on transmission and attempts to impose such restrictions would have wide reaching implications for business and welfare. 4.22 For these reasons, the working presumption will be that Government will not impose any such restrictions. The emphasis will instead be on encouraging all those who have symptoms to follow the advice to stay at home and avoid spreading their illness. However, local organisers may decide to cancel or postpone events in a pandemic fearing economic loss through poor attendances, and the public themselves may decide not to mix in crowds, or use public transport if other options are available. 3 years ago with Brexit what ifs and maybes very much on the go and austerity still in place I could well imagine what the likes of you would have said at that time if the Tories had spent money on this ... They cant win with the likes of you ... Is there any chance if you are asked nicely if you'll stop the attempts at political point scoring over Covid as its really not helping anyone and only making you out to be rather bitter ... All the best as always Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 13, 2020 Author Share Posted April 13, 2020 Birdbrain - 2020-04-13 5:55 PM 3 years ago with Brexit what ifs and maybes very much on the go and austerity still in place I could well imagine what the likes of you would have said at that time if the Tories had spent money on this ... They cant win with the likes of you ... Is there any chance if you are asked nicely if you'll stop the attempts at political point scoring over Covid as its really not helping anyone and only making you out to be rather bitter ... All the best as always Stating facts isn't 'political point scoring' and neither is it some kind of game for people to "win". I told you that yesterday in another thread but it hasn't sunk in. As uncomfortable some of those facts obviously are to you, you cannot handle them so are unable to form any kind of logical, credible and sensible opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 jumpstart - 2020-04-13 4:31 PM I think it’s a lot higher than that, look at all the carehome deaths. Not tested so who knows? I agree it must be more than 8% when the default government advice to people with Covid19 is to go home to die without even telling us!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdbrain Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Bulletguy - 2020-04-13 6:31 PM Birdbrain - 2020-04-13 5:55 PM 3 years ago with Brexit what ifs and maybes very much on the go and austerity still in place I could well imagine what the likes of you would have said at that time if the Tories had spent money on this ... They cant win with the likes of you ... Is there any chance if you are asked nicely if you'll stop the attempts at political point scoring over Covid as its really not helping anyone and only making you out to be rather bitter ... All the best as always Stating facts isn't 'political point scoring' and neither is it some kind of game for people to "win". I told you that yesterday in another thread but it hasn't sunk in. As uncomfortable some of those facts obviously are to you, you cannot handle them so are unable to form any kind of logical, credible and sensible opinion. As I expected almost word for word reply ... I presume the attempts at political point scoring will continue then ??? ... Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 jumpstart - 2020-04-13 5:35 PM Conrad - 2020-04-13 4:57 PM Perhaps only when it's all over, if it ever is, will the real picture emerge. Hopefully there will be a public inquiry, especially to plan how to better prepare when this all happens again. 3 corona virus outbreaks in human history, all in past 15 years, as population has ever expanded into areas which used to be the preserve of wild animals, and eating them. Next one when? Exactly...this won’t be over. Just be waiting for the next instalment. Even when we start getting our yearly inoculations there will be a strain we haven’t had . Before setting off abroad we won’t be allowed to travel unless we have a certification. Pubs,restaurants,clubs ,cinemas won’t reopen, jobs will be lost,but landowners and the wealthy won’t pay the price. Perhaps its natures way of teaching us a lesson. Maybe there is nothing that can be done to stop it or further mutations of it. Already the air is cleaner, Dolphins are swimming about in Venice and pollution is down. Perhaps it will show us that our ever increasing obsession with materialistic stuff is not that important. We couldnt change the world and our all consuming and destructive habits ourselves so maybe nature found a way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted April 13, 2020 Author Share Posted April 13, 2020 John52 - 2020-04-13 6:42 PM jumpstart - 2020-04-13 4:31 PM I think it’s a lot higher than that, look at all the carehome deaths. Not tested so who knows? I agree it must be more than 8% when the default government advice to people with Covid19 is to go home to die without even telling us!!!! I think J/start misread my post on that as i said figures are only being counted of coronavirus victims that die in hospital, hence the ONS saying the actual figure could be as much as 8% higher. Those dying in care homes, their own homes, or elsewhere are not in governments figures. https://tinyurl.com/rgw5zry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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