AL68 Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 To change or not to change, that is the question. Ok so I think I will change it and have had a quote of around £250 though I did not ask if it was only the belt that would be replaced. I am thinking of doing this work myself unless i get some strong reasons for not having a go. I have a few degrees in structural engineering and have replaced gearboxes in LR Discovery, clutches and most recently head gasket on a Fiat Punto which brought me very close to the cam belt. I am retired and have plenty of time but hate spending money!!!! So, any advice or information would be very useful. Is there a workshop manual for these engines? Anyone done it and could point out the tricky bits? Any special tools needed? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 I did buy a Fiat official workshop manual for exactly this vehicle, in fact I still have it on disc somewhere, but I have to tell you it was about as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike. I always used to do all my own maintenance including cambelt changes on the likes of Sierra's, but my advice would be unless you can get something like the old type Haynes manual, and the use of a four post vehicle lift, I'd spend the £250. No doubt others will have a different view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted March 29, 2011 Share Posted March 29, 2011 Hello, It is not the most difficult cam belt to change as the twin cams are synchronised by a chain at the other end of the head that does not get disturbed. However; You will definitely need the correct timing pin set, it is not a job you can improvise on and these will cost you about £30. It is not mentioned in the workshop manual but it is imperative that the bolt that holds the adjustable tensioner is changed during the job. You absolutely must not use the old bolt as it will be stretched and will not properly tighten if used again. Our local Iveco dealer got caught out with this last year and we had a variable timing van! We now do them ourselves following their expensive lesson. I strongly believe that if you have a quote for £250 it would be wise to let them do it, but make sure they are changing the screw if they have not done one of these engines before. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AL68 Posted March 31, 2011 Author Share Posted March 31, 2011 Thanks for the comments, most useful. I have now had another quote for over £500. I will have to have a closer look at what is done for £250. The one for £500 is from a dealership taken from the Fiat Camper website and the other from an independent garage. I suppose labour rates may account for a large part of the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 Hi Nick (euroserve) Is it the same for the 2007 X250. If not where can I get the info' for doing the cam belt myself. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Peter, Neither the information from Iveco or Fiat is accurate or comprehensive for the 2.3 engine and for that reason alone I strongly suggest that you get it done by a professional. However; The case against DIY; If you get it wrong you will have no back-up and no van. If the parts are faulty and you have to make a claim against the supplier you will get the value of the parts only, not any repairs to your van that happened as a consequence. It will take you a long time to do it, and you may break things. You will be worried about the outcome. You will have to buy some special kit to do it. The case for DIY; You (potentially) save about £150 The case for giving it to a reputable garage; Guarantee. No brainer I think. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecal Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Hi Peter, I agree with Euroserve not a difficult task but time consuming and yes you will need a holding kit. Now if you like doing that kind of work and you may think you are keeping your motorhome and maybe going to be replacing the belt again, fair enough, Also there is the satisfaction of knowing you did the job and well but sadly no guarantee if you get it wrong and as you know it can be major. But there is help out there, Regards, Brendan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Off topic I know, but my Avensis has a timing chain, for the life of me I cannot understand why we have this belt change worry. Having had one strip it's teeth on another car I owned despite being changed well within the time/mileage limit I was determined to find a car without this additional hassle, can't do that with my van sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecal Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 Hi, All down to cost, and engine design. Some of the new ones are now going back to chain, Merc Sprinter for example and VW Crafter have chains.The problem with belts becoming shredded may not be down to the belt itself but rather some of the components that are driven by the belt fail, good example ,the water pump, Sure you can be lucky and the pump or belt may not go, but it's a big chance to take, Yes they are available, but also at a cost I am afraid, so most won't build on them only on cheaper models. Regards, Brendan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 1, 2011 Share Posted April 1, 2011 I am interested in Euroserves posting regarding a guarantee, I am led to believe engine damage as a result of premature failure of the belt within time/mileage limits could mean a successful claim against whom exactly, the fitter, supplier, or what. And how likely would it be to have your claim upheld I wonder. (?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wills5138 Posted April 2, 2011 Share Posted April 2, 2011 I had the timing belt and water pump on my 03 plate Peugeot Boxer 2.0 hdi changed last year. The cost was just over £400. The service interval is 8 years or 96,000 miles. I work that out at £50 a year. Why take the risk? You get what you pay for...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 1footinthegrave - 2011-04-01 2:13 PM I am interested in Euroserves posting regarding a guarantee, I am led to believe engine damage as a result of premature failure of the belt within time/mileage limits could mean a successful claim against whom exactly, the fitter, supplier, or what. And how likely would it be to have your claim upheld I wonder. (?) A good point. It is a widely touted 'benefit' of using a franchised dealer for repairs because within a specified period of time the whole repair (parts and labour) is normally covered for most eventualities and there are few 'get-outs' other than parts failing that were not changed and were not recommended or requested like water pumps. An independent garage will probably have to go to the manufacturer of the belt kit (if it is that that has failed) but may only receive a replacement kit leaving everyone red faced and facing awkward questions about labour charges and other repairs required. The garage will probably have insurance against negligence and the like but it is unlikely that they would be to blame if the kit failed so might well not be able to claim there either. Fortunately it does not happen very often, and replacements tend to go without a hitch, or problems are easily aparrent as soon as the job is done and can be investigated without causing damage. The bottom line is that there are so many associated parts connected to cam belts that it truly is a minefield and the only way to acheive complete reliability is to change everything connected to the belt and have it done at a main agent. That would be so insanely expensive that nobody is going to do that. Best alternative is to get the belt and tensioners done by a trusted mechanic and take his advice on any other items that seem iffy when he has the belt off. Clearer? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AL68 Posted April 4, 2011 Author Share Posted April 4, 2011 Still mulling this one over. I have just had a quote from a main dealer; £474.20. This includes new tensioning bits but not a new water pump. Service manager's response to my enquiry about pump was "how far do you go, if pump is leaking or obvious wear then change pump" The locking tools required appear to cost around £50 and I did find a fitting sheet at http://www.tooled-up.com/artwork/ProdPDF/VS4925.pdf Have to get back and check that quote for £250 which is looking like a bargain but have noted comments about using main dealer with regard to warranty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecal Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Hi, Keep looking around as they should be glad of the work, "vote with your feet". Should be small cost for the water pump to replace as most of the work to get at it is done. you never know some may even price it as part of the job. Ask and if not move on. It is a waste of time replacing all if leaving out a water pump and it goes only to ruin all, By the way "how far will he go if the water pump goes shortly after the TB is done?". Regards, Brendan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AL68 Posted April 4, 2011 Author Share Posted April 4, 2011 Now have a quote for fitting "timing belt kit" plus the water pump and an MOT for £420 incl VAT. It's a garage I have used before and they are used to working on motorhomes so they have the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecal Posted April 4, 2011 Share Posted April 4, 2011 Hi Alan, Well done , as long as your happy and have peace of mind, that's the way to go, May I wish you happy motorhoming. Regards, Brendan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasmineAnders Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 My Peugeot dealer now recommends changing the belt at 5 years/ 50,000 miles. (2.8td engine) They used to advise 9 years/ 90,000 miles but had a few belts break on them during MOT testing-at their cost.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 AL68 - 2011-04-04 12:28 PM Still mulling this one over. I have just had a quote from a main dealer; £474.20. This includes new tensioning bits but not a new water pump. Service manager's response to my enquiry about pump was "how far do you go, if pump is leaking or obvious wear then change pump" The locking tools required appear to cost around £50 and I did find a fitting sheet at http://www.tooled-up.com/artwork/ProdPDF/VS4925.pdf Have to get back and check that quote for £250 which is looking like a bargain but have noted comments about using main dealer with regard to warranty.Great link Al, very useful for when I do mine. Bit more dismantling to do than on the old 2.8 cdti engine though. Is that progress. Still never mind I'll manage I'm sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 Just booked my 2007 2.3/ 130 FIAT motorhome in for 4yr service - though only 25k miles - and FIAT dealer recommends timing belt replaced, and quotes around £460. What should I expect in terms of the 'water pump' scenario? Is this as standard and expect to be included, as so far the only info I've got is that they woudl check it out for 'leaks' !?? Your experienced answers awaited! Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 I see this is dropping down the list, so will repost my enquiry as above...looks forward to getting some useful comments...seem to get varying answers fom the local FIAT service agents. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecal Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 Hi, No I am afraid it is not standard, well most will tell you it's not but to be honest it should. It's madness to bypass the pump when all the work is done down to the pump. Most good garages will factor it in and indeed as it is not too expensive some will fit it as part of the job in hand. Don't forget their reputation is at stake. So shop around, you should get better prices than you quoted. Regards, Brendan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David B Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 I have had 3 quotes for my 2005 Peugeot Boxer 2.2 HDI cambelt kit (tensioners etc) and water pump, labour and VAT. Mileage 29,000, Boxer actually built in 2004, now 7 years old. Peugeot advice is to change belt at : 10 years normal driving, 5 years arduous. I split the difference. Peugeot main dealer A £501 Peugeot main dealer B £449 Local independent £372 (I use him for my car and motorhome servicing) Guess which one I will be dealing with (!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 It seems with the new model the FIAT recommendation is 4 yrs, regardless of mileage.....my locall FIAT dealer won't do the MOT unless Cambelt changed first,they say for MOT max revs required running for some period of time.....they won't match my Motorhome/FIAT dealer on price,but due to time constraints, may well have to use them. ....or else alter our proposed trip dates to france!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melvin Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 I have just checked my Fiat handbook it states 4 years then a * with 5 years ? my milage to date 5500mls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted April 6, 2011 Share Posted April 6, 2011 All this time related cambelt talk seems like nonsense to me. Am I seroiusly going to believe that all these exotic cars held in museums for years are going to have their belts changed without turning a wheel for 10 Yrs. I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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