flicka Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Bolly Just a thought. Before replacing the pipework. Open your Waste Tank outlet valve / tap & place a bucket in position. Then pour some water down the sink. If it flows away OK, you are building up pressure in your Waste Tank when the valve / tap is closed. It's possible that any small vent holes in your tank may have got 'gunged-up' & not releasing air. i.e. when adding water to the tank, the same volume of air needs to be displaced. To rectify - is it possible to clean the top of the Waste Tank or put some new small holes in it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Collings Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 I am with Flicka, Tanks need to vent, After the saga in France as described by Clive in a recent MMM when I took my fresh tank out and replaced a missing inspection cover my water system suffered from the dreaded splutters. It seeemed tank venting might be the problem and was easily proved by removing the filler cap when the spluttering stopped. What I took to be vent buttons in the top of the tank were either blocked or too small to keep up with the pump. A new venting system has now been installed. Although this was the fresh water system the principle still applies to waste tanks. One way of checking would be to fit an extension hose to the grey tank drain and raise the end higher than the sink and open the tap to allow any pressure build up to escape. If the drains run properly lack of venting is the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 As I said on the earlier thread, the Herald Valencia has its kitchen-sink above the fridge mid-way down the vehicle's length on its left side, while its waste-water tank is towards the rear of the vehicle on its right side. The pipework from the sink has to wend its way around the fridge before going beneath the floor on its way to the tank and it's quite likely that the slow-draining problem results from the path of the drain-hose as it finds its way past the fridge - in fact, this was suggested in MMM's Valencia report when slow sink-draining was criticised. I doubt if inadequate waste-tank venting is contributing to the problem as a) even when the drain-hose was disconnected prior to it entering the waste-tank the sink was still slow to drain and b) in the earlier thread Tony said "I also noticed that the waste tank filled up rather quickly". The waste-tank would need to be dropped to access the vent holes in its upper surface, but filling the tank to overflowing would prove whether the holes are blocked. If the fridge were removed it should be possible to inspect the pipe-run and see if that can be improved. However (if my own Herald was typical of the breed) introducing wider diameter hose or rigid plastic pipework on a Valencia may not be a practicable proposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Collings Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 My last post was a bit of a rush. Forget about adding bits to the drain. To check if venting is the problem just open the grey tank drain to equalise any presure differential. If the sink runs away freely its a vent problem. If there is no difference, back to square one. Grease can really clog drains, Our house has a long run from the kitchen to the outdoor trap and once in a while self cleans, depositing a stinking slimy tube a bit like a snake shedding its skin on the grating. No wonder the small bore stuff in our motorcaravans blocks so easily. My DIY grey tank has anti surge baffles inside and this churns very effectively. Every now and then a slug of grey grease shoots out of the 1 1/4 inch drain tap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Have no time to read entire thread as on holidaz...... but what I do is run hose pipe into van and flush with a strong jet of water...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 6, 2012 Share Posted May 6, 2012 George Collings - 2012-05-05 5:34 PM ...To check if venting is the problem just open the grey tank drain to equalise any presure differential. If the sink runs away freely its a vent problem. If there is no difference, back to square one... Still won't prove anything venting-wise as, even if the waste-tank's vents were blocked, the tank would still be vented via the drain-hose(s) leading to the tank from the drain outlets in the Valancia's washbasin and shower-tray. If you wanted to test the venting theory, you'd need to put drain plugs in the washbasin and shower-tray outlets before draining the sink but, frankly, that's not where the problem lies. (Listen to your Uncle Derek - I owned a Herald for 6 years and I've got bitter memories of their bloody-minded water-draining systems.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted May 6, 2012 Share Posted May 6, 2012 JudgeMental - 2012-05-05 10:08 PM Have no time to read entire thread as on holidaz...... but what I do is run hose pipe into van and flush with a strong jet of water...... Not now, Eddie. haven't you heard, we've got a Hosepipe ban over here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted May 6, 2012 Share Posted May 6, 2012 flicka - 2012-05-06 9:06 PM JudgeMental - 2012-05-05 10:08 PM Have no time to read entire thread as on holidaz...... but what I do is run hose pipe into van and flush with a strong jet of water...... Not now, Eddie. haven't you heard, we've got a Hosepipe ban over here. Coming down your way tomorrow-do you want me to bring you a bucketfull? We've got loads of it! :-D :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Returning to the original posting, there is a caveat regarding experimenting with Tony's Valencia's water-draining system. My own Herald Templar (like Tony's, built by Explorer Group) had drain hoses made from thin-walled plastic resembling the type of flexible 'conduit' used to carry electric cabling. The hose was relatively smooth inside, but its internal diameter was (if I remember correctly) no more than 25mm. I replaced my Templar's pathetically small 36-litre waste-water tank with a bespoke 64-litre tank (article in MMM June 2002, pages 189/190) and considered replacing the drain-hoses at the same time. This proved impracticable because wider hoses would not fit through the tight spaces the converter had allowed for the original narrow-diameter hoses to go through. I then considered replacing the original drain-hoses on a like-for-like basis (at least the new ones would then be clean inside) but found it impossible to source the same type of hose. If Tony's Valencia has the same type of hose as my Templar and agressive methods are used to try to improve sink drainage (eg. by poking wire down the hose), there's a good chance that the hose itself may be damaged. And, if that happens, it may prove difficult to effect an easy repair. I don't know how many forum members are familiar with a Herald Valencia, but its design makes slow kitchen-sink drainage pretty much inevitable. The sink-plunger ploy works temporarily possibly because it causes water in the sink's drain-hose to start to syphon into the waste-water tank, effectively 'sucking' the water from the sink. But syphoning won't take place in normal use when there's not much water in the sink and only gravity is available to cause the water to flow. (My Hobby's sink and washbasin aren't normally that fast draining, despite having wider-diameter drain hoses and less convoluted hose routes than Tony's Valencia. But I can cause very rapid draining if I fill the sink or washbasin near to the brim and provoke syphoning into the waste-water tank.) Some motorhomes have unwelcome characteristics as a direct result of their deign. The Valencia has slow kitchen-sink draining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolly1965 Posted May 7, 2012 Author Share Posted May 7, 2012 Derek Uzzell - 2012-05-07 9:50 AM Returning to the original posting, there is a caveat regarding experimenting with Tony's Valencia's water-draining system. My own Herald Templar (like Tony's, built by Explorer Group) had drain hoses made from thin-walled plastic resembling the type of flexible 'conduit' used to carry electric cabling. The hose was relatively smooth inside, but its internal diameter was (if I remember correctly) no more than 25mm. I replaced my Templar's pathetically small 36-litre waste-water tank with a bespoke 64-litre tank (article in MMM June 2002, pages 189/190) and considered replacing the drain-hoses at the same time. This proved impracticable because wider hoses would not fit through the tight spaces the converter had allowed for the original narrow-diameter hoses to go through. I then considered replacing the original drain-hoses on a like-for-like basis (at least the new ones would then be clean inside) but found it impossible to source the same type of hose. If Tony's Valencia has the same type of hose as my Templar and agressive methods are used to try to improve sink drainage (eg. by poking wire down the hose), there's a good chance that the hose itself may be damaged. And, if that happens, it may prove difficult to effect an easy repair. I don't know how many forum members are familiar with a Herald Valencia, but its design makes slow kitchen-sink drainage pretty much inevitable. The sink-plunger ploy works temporarily possibly because it causes water in the sink's drain-hose to start to syphon into the waste-water tank, effectively 'sucking' the water from the sink. But syphoning won't take place in normal use when there's not much water in the sink and only gravity is available to cause the water to flow. (My Hobby's sink and washbasin aren't normally that fast draining, despite having wider-diameter drain hoses and less convoluted hose routes than Tony's Valencia. But I can cause very rapid draining if I fill the sink or washbasin near to the brim and provoke syphoning into the waste-water tank.) Some motorhomes have unwelcome characteristics as a direct result of their deign. The Valencia has slow kitchen-sink draining. This has to be right. The shower tray drains fine - it's only the itchen sink. I had also come to the conclusion that the sink plunger caused a siphoning effect. I will have a look to see if i can use a wider bore hose when I have a little more time as I can remove the fridge vents and get to it that way. It does take a strange route - forward to beneath the cooker and then through the floor and back again. I can't see why it can't go straight down behond the fridge and through the floor. Well the messing about with the locker lock seems to have worked - worked perfectly this last weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old grey mare Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 We have tried-in our Autotrail Dakota, boiling water and soda crystals-nope. Flushing wThe shower and the vanity sink are fine, just the wretched kitchen sink, oh someone-please help as we are presently full timing due to a delay in house purchase,!!!!!!!!!!! (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggyd Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 I think you might just have to keep the plunger permanently at hand reading back on all suggestions. good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 Either the waste pipe is badly installed, part blocked, or kinked (which is more or less the same thing), or any combination of these. So, you need to thoroughly investigate the installation, to identify the cause. Depending on what you find, make sure the sink outlet is adequate and unobstructed, possibly replace existing with larger bore pipe, possibly improve the pipe route and falls, possibly remove it completely to clear a blockage, or possibly replace it if you can't eliminate a kink. There really isn't much else that can be said, as you give no clue where the problem actually lies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 I reckon dodgy plumbing is common in todays MH's judging by the number of people we see on fully serviced pitches taking their washing up to the communal sinks 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 We had a similar problem with the rear mounted bathroom sink in our previous van . The pipe started off vertical, but then ran horizontal between the floors, forward to the waste tank . If we parked with the van front downhill , the sink drained ok, but if parked uphill, it would not. We then used a plunger to clear that sink load. I think once the flow started siphon action took over. We just lived with it, and kept the plunger in the cupboard under the sink. Brian B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old grey mare Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 The plumbing is not badly installed, There is no kink It is a wide bore pipe of at least an inch ( can't do metric!!!!!) We have flushed, poured , forced and every other thing we can think of!!!!!!!!! :-D *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ips Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 pelmetman - 2012-09-01 6:49 PM I reckon dodgy plumbing is common in todays MH's judging by the number of people we see on fully serviced pitches takinxg their washing up to the communal sinks 8-) i have never understood people who do this, why pay all that money for a van with all amenities and use a communal sink ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 old grey mare - 2012-09-02 1:03 PM The plumbing is not badly installed, There is no kink It is a wide bore pipe of at least an inch ( can't do metric!!!!!) We have flushed, poured , forced and every other thing we can think of!!!!!!!!! :-D *-) Then it should be OK, but clearly is not. The sink waste strainer may not be properly aligned with the "spokes" of the under sink fitting, leaving alternate drainage holes part obstructed. This may make a difference. The connection onto the waste tank may be poorly finished, especially if to a moulded spigot on the tank. A badly cut moulded spigot end, or very restricted internal bore, at this point, might restrict flow. Failing those, I guess it is just as good as it can get! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesFrance Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 If the pipe could be furred up with calcium you could try filling it with vinegar and letting it soak for a while. You may need to disconnect at the bottom and arrange a temporary plug to stop it draining straight through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old grey mare Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Havn't got spokes Done the vinegar trick! Humpppphhhh :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 ips - 2012-09-02 1:20 PM pelmetman - 2012-09-01 6:49 PM I reckon dodgy plumbing is common in todays MH's judging by the number of people we see on fully serviced pitches takinxg their washing up to the communal sinks 8-) i have never understood people who do this, why pay all that money for a van with all amenities and use a communal sink ? Loads of hot water, saves your own water and having to fill up so often if pitched up a few days, something to do, chatting to other campers, stretch your legs, makes your world a bit bigger rather than living in the confines of a van for all of the holiday etc etc etc etc. I am sure there are plenty of other excuses to go wash up at the sinks like get away from you partner for 10 mins. Stops you putting greasy water down your own sink and blocking the pipes and making the waste tank smell! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ips Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 All valid reasons I spose, maybe I am just a lazy antisocial git. :-D Personally ...... We have a big water tank and have never ran out Never had a problem with blocked or smelly waste tank Dont feel the need to escape from mrs ips as I like her :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 ips, I actually just wash up in the van, but my dearest likes to use the sinks. Everyone to their own. Talking of smelly tanks, this year we had a nightmare ( 10th summer trip in this van) with the waste tank. Always in past a little bleach has resolved and then fine in hot weather, but this year no amount of flushing, bleach, coke, would clear the tank going biologically extra terrestial with a terrible stink everytime it was emptied. Only thing which was different was using fairy platinum instead of fairy original. So, bought some original and hey presto, problem solved of a smelly tank. Coincidence? Probably, but makes me wonder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Brambles - 2012-09-03 12:15 PM ips - 2012-09-02 1:20 PM pelmetman - 2012-09-01 6:49 PM I reckon dodgy plumbing is common in todays MH's judging by the number of people we see on fully serviced pitches takinxg their washing up to the communal sinks 8-) i have never understood people who do this, why pay all that money for a van with all amenities and use a communal sink ? Loads of hot water, saves your own water and having to fill up so often if pitched up a few days, something to do, chatting to other campers, stretch your legs, makes your world a bit bigger rather than living in the confines of a van for all of the holiday etc etc etc etc. I am sure there are plenty of other excuses to go wash up at the sinks like get away from you partner for 10 mins. Stops you putting greasy water down your own sink and blocking the pipes and making the waste tank smell! But I did say on a "fully serviced pitch" ;-)................So water and drainage not a problem or hot water as we normally use the electric kettle to boil the water :D............But as you say for some it is an excuse to get away from the partner (lol) (lol)............................Must be why Sue uses them occasionally 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ips Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Yep each to there own but I didnt spend nearly 40k to carry my dirty dishes in a bowl for 50yds and then queue up to use a communal sink. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.