To carry a jack or not

[Cliffy]

The current thread on whether to carry a spare tyre or not got me to rethink my practice of not carrying a jack or wheel brace. The theory being that I pay for breakdown cover so I might as well use it if I need to and I doubt that I could undo garage tightend wheel nuts with a hand brace. Also I have suffered the effect of incorrect torgueing of wheel nuts on a works mini bus.

What do others think.

Am I also an idiot? :-(

 

[nightrider]

Cliffy - 2012-08-05 11:27 PM

The current thread on whether to carry a spare tyre or not got me to rethink my practice of not carrying a jack or wheel brace. The theory being that I pay for breakdown cover so I might as well use it if I need to and I doubt that I could undo garage tightend wheel nuts with a hand brace. Also I have suffered the effect of incorrect torgueing of wheel nuts on a works mini bus.

What do others think.

Am I also an idiot? :-(

 

I wouldn't exactly call you an idiot but I would say that you are rather foolish not to carry a spare wheel and a suitable jack and wheel brace, what if you had a flat in an out of the way place and couldn't get a signal on your mobile fone when foning the break down service what then?

[lennyhb]

Breakdown services often do not cover you off the highway so if you wake up one morning with a flat tyre on a site it could be expensive. At least if you have a jack if you are not capable of doing it yourself there is a good chance there will be someone around to help.

[BGD]

Many wheel nuts are WAY overtightened by those air-line gun chimps.

 

The wheel bolts on our old 1992 Peugeot J5-based MH were way over the specified 180NM when I first got it. I put that right as part of my initial checking/inspection of everything after purchase, and now insist on any tyre/brake place tightening them by hand using a torque wrench.

 

If in doubt about your actual wheel nut toques (especially when applied by garages using the air-line guns rather than a " proper" torque wrench, then take van to any tyre/brake garage, and ask them to loosen and re-tighten all nuts to correct torque.

 

Most will do this for free, or for a "drink".

 

Then maybe have a go at changing a wheel yourself on your drive, to understand just how easy (or not!) it is in practice on your van.

 

At the correct torque of 180NM, it is not difficult to undo the wheel bolts on our MH, using the supplied wrench plus a short tommy bar which I also always carry.

 

We suffered a flat tyre in literally the middle of nowhere in Italy last year, and really blessed the spare wheel, jack, and correctly torqued wheel bolts that enabled me to change the rear wheel.

[Colin Leake]

lennyhb - 2012-08-06 8:43 AM

 

Breakdown services often do not cover you off the highway so if you wake up one morning with a flat tyre on a site it could be expensive. At least if you have a jack if you are not capable of doing it yourself there is a good chance there will be someone around to help.

 

Green Flag do cover you on site and I have seen the AA on site changing a spare wheel so they must as well.

[Colin Leake]

I have helped out by changing a wheel on other peoples motorhomes for them using the standard Fait jack supplied with the vehicle. If you follow their instructions fit it to the right place, have the vehicle brakes on and make sure it is square and vertical it works fine. One was on solid ground and the second was on somewhat soft grass. The latter one was done with the help of,the site warden who had some very solid wooded blocks to support the jack and some blocks of wood I could use for insurance in case it all went pair shape. Without these I would not have attempted to change the wheel where the vehicle stood. Oddly enough on the second occasion I would have loved to have had a can of wonder gunk handy so that I could have inflated the tyre and moved the vehicle to more solid ground.

 

[Mel B]

We bought a 6 tonne bottle jack from a car boot sale (new) for under £10 (possibly £7 if I remember correctly!) and carry that as well as the 'standard' type jack that DIDN'T come with the van but which we kept when we PX'd our prevous van.

[Clive]

So there we were half way up the alps on a saturday evening with a blow out. Not any life in sight, no mobile phone signal but just a gravel pull off from the road. No passing traffic as we favour white roads. Its times like this that i am glad i have done a dummy run to check i have all the tools to remove the spare from under the chassis, the wheel trims the jack, bits of wood and the wheel nuts. We would never travel where we do without being propetly tooled up. Of course if you stick to motoways then you can rely on the service organisations but self confidencr is good.

C.

[bobalobs]

Just taken out Red Pennant European cover and was told that thereis a £100 excess on the policy if a spare wheel is not carried. I did not investigate further as we carry a spare wheel but presumably the excess applies to any breakdown where the lack of spare wheel causes extra work.

[rupert123]

bobalobs - 2012-08-07 10:32 AM

 

Just taken out Red Pennant European cover and was told that thereis a £100 excess on the policy if a spare wheel is not carried. I did not investigate further as we carry a spare wheel but presumably the excess applies to any breakdown where the lack of spare wheel causes extra work.

 

We to had Red Pennant last year and they told us, followed up with an email, that if the van came with no spare from new it was ok. They would attend and get us to a garage but we would have to pay for any work at garage, which you would have to do anyway. It is ok being smug with all this would never travel without a spare stuff and i agree it is best, but if you do not have one and cannot fit one why worry, we never have.

[Tracker]

I follow Clive's line of thought - always have.

 

It is pointless carrying all this gear if it either does not work properly or the wheel nuts are too tight to shift so I too carry out dummy runs in the secure world of my own drive and if anything does not work first attempt it sure as heck does for the second try!

 

But the van is heavy and inherently unstable on any jack and I am not as strong or fit as I used to be so I would much rather let the experts do it at the roadside if it is convenient - but at least I have all the components and they all work if I do have to do it myself.

 

Common sense - isn't it?

[Cattwg]

Working on the principle that ‘if it can go wrong then someday it will’ I try to be as self sufficient as possible. Hence I carry tools, gaffa tape, a multi-meter and a box containing lots of ‘useful’ bits and pieces. So carry a spare wheel? Definitely. Carry a jack? Definitely.

We have break down insurance but I could probably change a wheel in 15 minutes. Waiting for assistance could take a couple of hours. Assuming that you have a signal at your phone in the first place.

Cattwg :-D

[ROND]

Definately carry a jack in my opinion you never know when you will need it and an extension bar.

 

When i had my first of 2 blowouts in France thr breakdown service was there within 30 minutes, the fitter was a big 6ft 2 strong young guy but it took all his strength using a 6ft bar to crack the wheelnuts.No way could i have cracked them off with the Fiat suplied brace.

 

The second blow out later in the day again they were out within 30 minutes but this time the trolley jack they carried was too small to lift the van high enough so he ended up using my Fiat suplied jack.

I now carry a 5 ton bottle jack.

 

I would struggle to get my spare from under the motorhome as it is in such a awkward place to get to but could change the wheel if had to in an emergency. Like it has been said by others I wouldnt fancy getting a major blow out miles from anywhere with no phone access and no spare or jack.

 

RD

[snowie]

Tracker - 2012-08-07 11:21 AM

 

I follow Clive's line of thought - always have.

 

It is pointless carrying all this gear if it either does not work properly or the wheel nuts are too tight to shift so I too carry out dummy runs in the secure world of my own drive and if anything does not work first attempt it sure as heck does for the second try!

 

But the van is heavy and inherently unstable on any jack and I am not as strong or fit as I used to be so I would much rather let the experts do it at the roadside if it is convenient - but at least I have all the components and they all work if I do have to do it myself.

 

Common sense - isn't it?

 

Good advice Tracker;

I persuaded the van dealer to provide a new spare wheel and tyre when we bought our van as it didn't have one, and had a spare wheel cradle fitted later.

I've looked at "hi-lift" trolley jacks and resisted the temptation so far, but the thought of using the standard Ducato jack doesn't thrill me.

Having been fortunate not to have a problem for 3 seasons, I'm wondering if I'm going to run out of luck soon.

A decent hydraulic jack and a torque wrench might be a good idea, and as I've got the latter rom my car restoration days it's not such an outlay. I don't see weight as an issue, as the existing jack is no lightweight, so I've almost convinced myself, just need to check dimensions, lifting range and prices and get on with it I think, this thread has convinced me that I need to be better prepared,

thanks all

regards

alan b

 

[rupert123]

Our last van, as I have said, came with no spare and no room to fit one but it had a very heavy jack, which I threw out. Judgeing by the amount of blowouts you lot have I would suggest that rather than worrying about a spare you buy some new tyres.

[Tony Jones]

DEFINITELY CARRY A JACK!!!

Half-way through this last trip, the base of the bed broke (Only because I sat up suddenly, HONEST!)

So for the rest of the trip, we used the jack each night to support it under the crack.

With no jack, we'd have had to go looking for a timber merchant to get a temporary replacement!

[rupert123]

Tony Jones - 2012-08-09 5:11 PM

 

DEFINITELY CARRY A JACK!!!

Half-way through this last trip, the base of the bed broke (Only because I sat up suddenly, HONEST!)

So for the rest of the trip, we used the jack each night to support it under the crack.

With no jack, we'd have had to go looking for a timber merchant to get a temporary replacement!

 

Hell Tony, never thought of that will put the jack back.

[Franco]

Hi folks- Just to add my 'Tupp-cents!

Thankfully I have not had that puncture to date. I have however tried a number of 'dry-runs' in my own drive.

I have a Compass Castaway van and the spare wheel would take at least 10-15 minutes to get it down and out from the cradle. I have to lie under the van to drop the wheel- inclement weather would not help!

I had a 2 ton hydraulic jack but I found out that in order to use the jacking-handle you were exposed to traffic on the road, or you were in the ditch- there might not be room or solid ground to safely use 3 foot base of the jack! In any event it seems like a nighmare if the roads are busy or late at night.

The jack provided with the van looks sturdy, but it sure moans and groans-or does the van?- as you raise the van, with apparent difficulty and a fair amount of physical effort.

I can open the wheel nuts handy enough.

I now have a 6 ton bottle jack. It lifts the van easily but the question on clearance between the van-raising-point and the ground- so as to put the jack in place- can be problematic. Also, will the jack raise the van sufficiently to allow sufficient clearance to fit the spare wheel? Would I need to use a sturdy piece of wood to raise the closed jack nearer to the raising point, or again would this then mean insufficient clearance to fit the jack? I have not yet tested the jack on this matter, and just hope I can check it before I get that dreaded puncture. More importantly- another major issue is the top of the bottle jack is very nearly fitting through the van raising point, and I may have to get a small piece welded to the top of the jack to avoid it breaking through the lifting point! Meanwhile I feel I must be prepared to use the original jack pro tem, but I feel the bottle jack will do a much quicker, safer, lift when I have sorted out the above issues.

Franco