The perils of Payload and GVW / MAM

[colin]

The 3.5t Twins are built on L3 Maxi chassis and have 3.0L engine, this gives them a book figure of 640kg compared to the 530kg of 3.3t Twin. On early models with front mounted water tank the increased front axle limit kept van legal in most curcumstances, not such a problem on later vans.

[pepe63xnotuse]

Mel B - 2012-10-08 9:31 PM

 

....We do carry more than some people do - our canoes especially weigh 13.5kg each, plus paddles, life jackets, pump, drum etc, so in total, probably about 40kg there. Our folding bikes probably add another 30kg as they're not the lightest, then our 3 dogs add another 40kg, plus food, toys, beds, leads balls, balls and more balls ...

 

Mel...Weight "issues" aside,just where do you put(and secure)that lot,in a pvc with a rear lounge..? :-S

 

We need more photos...this time,of it FULLY loaded.... ;-)

[Derek Uzzell]

According to their advertising, for 2013 Adria will offer four "Twin" ranges - Twin Active comprising models 5.4m long, Twin SF and Twin SP for models 6m long, and Twin SLX for models 6.36m long.

 

Twin Active, SF and SP chassis will be 3300kg MAM (Ducato 33L) for models fitted with the 2.3litre 130bhp motor, or 3500kg MAM (Ducato 35L) for models with the 2.3litre 150bhp motor. A Twin Active with the 3.0litre motor will have a Ducato 35L base, whereas SF and SP models with that motor will have the 35H ('maxi') Ducato chassis. All Twin SLX models, whatever motor is fitted, will have a 35L chassis.

 

Use-payload naturally will vary according to whether the chassis is 3300kg or 3500kg and each model's Mass in Running Order. A Twin Active with the 150bhp motor would have the highest user-payload - 765kg.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Mel, there is no room for more stuff, it is packed to the gunnels....... we take as much as we did in the CB with the exception of chest fridge. can upgrade to 3500kg by fitting air on back but that really would be a pointless exercise.....

 

e bikes are very good ones so about 20 kg each. battery's are removed so about 35 kg on rack

 

 

[colin]

Derek Uzzell - 2012-10-09 9:53 AM

 

According to their advertising, for 2013 Adria will offer four "Twin" ranges - Twin Active comprising models 5.4m long, Twin SF and Twin SP for models 6m long, and Twin SLX for models 6.36m long.

 

Twin Active, SF and SP chassis will be 3300kg MAM (Ducato 33L) for models fitted with the 2.3litre 130bhp motor, or 3500kg MAM (Ducato 35L) for models with the 2.3litre 150bhp motor. A Twin Active with the 3.0litre motor will have a Ducato 35L base, whereas SF and SP models with that motor will have the 35H ('maxi') Ducato chassis. All Twin SLX models, whatever motor is fitted, will have a 35L chassis.

 

Use-payload naturally will vary according to whether the chassis is 3300kg or 3500kg and each model's Mass in Running Order. A Twin Active with the 150bhp motor would have the highest user-payload - 765kg.

 

I should have qualified my post by saying "euro4 models" (Eddies van)

I note you quote SLX 6.36m model having 35L chassis, is this correct? AFAIW all 6.36 chassis are Maxi chassis i.e. 35H or 40H

[Derek Uzzell]

colin - 2012-10-09 11:07 AM

 

...I note you quote SLX 6.36m model having 35L chassis, is this correct? AFAIW all 6.36 chassis are Maxi chassis i.e. 35H or 40H

 

Dunno, that's what Adria's 2013 brochure indicates, but I admit it sounds odd and could easily be a misprint.

[Mel B]

pepe63 - 2012-10-09 8:08 AM

 

Mel...Weight "issues" aside,just where do you put(and secure)that lot,in a pvc with a rear lounge..? :-S

 

We need more photos...this time,of it FULLY loaded.... ;-)

 

Hi pepe - I haven't put much else in as there's not that much to go in now, so here are some photos I took today just for you!

 

1. + 2. Bed photos - the foot end one show the dog beds which Lily and Tazzy sleep in on a night, the larger one is also used when we're travelling as Tazzy lays in it on my knee.

 

3. + 4. View of some of the lockers under the bed, closed and open, in the centre you can see a blue 'bag' this houses one of our folding bikes, the other is in front of it out of sight; the canoes etc are in the locker below these which goes the full length; the right locker is the gas one, you can see the gas bottle and hoses etc in there; the left 'flap' locker goes the full length under the bed and houses our chairs, table, walking poles, wind break and other 'long stuff, plus mallets, pegs, awning mat.

 

In addition to the bottom 'base' lockers shown, there are also large bottom 'upper' storage lockers too, one at each side, and in these are things like kitchen roll, 2 x 5L water containers, towels, spare sheets/duvet covers, 2 x lightweight canoe trolleys, life jackets, bbq etc, again with room to spare (so there's somewhere for dirty washing etc).

 

5. The cab showing Lily's travelling bed and our seat covers.

 

6. View of the front are with Romy's travelling cushion bed between the seats; you can also see the seat back holdalls which I picked up the other day from Tesco for 99p each as they were being cleared out, very useful for things like doggy bags, pens, instruction books, and other bits and pieces.

 

7. View of the dinette with Romy's bed under the table, the Black Royal storage bag for our external screens, and just to the right of it a Fiamma bag with our levellers in. Under the dinette seat the massive storage area houses all our electric bits and bobs, tools, jack, tow rope, gas hob etc and still has lots of space in it.

 

8. Aisle showing my nice 'green' carpet!

 

9. Galley view - I've got a silicone 'baking' sheet on top of the hob to protect the glass and use one of the place mats which you can see propped up against the wall on top of the sink cover when needed.

 

10. The washroom with the bin to the right and the washing bag behind it - I've used a wall mounted waste bin 'carrier bag' type holder which I've fixed a waterproof bag on - inside it is one of several vacuum type 'roll up' clothes bags, that way when it is full it can be rolled tightly to make it much smaller and then be stored under the bed.

 

11. You can see 2 sets of small plastic drawer units and in these are sundry bits and pieces, our wash bags, and an empty drawer to put fresh veg in as it's cooler in there than anywhere else.

 

12. Over the sink you can see that I've used a few 'stick on' bits and pieces including a shower head holder (Bettaware) so that the tap is in a better position and high enough for me to get my kettle under; the small 10x magnification mirror cost 49p from a discount shop (can't remember which one!) and is ideal for when I'm plucking my eyebrows!

 

13. Washroom drying rack which pulls out, hook rack above for hats and easily accessed first aid kit below.

 

14. + 15. Whilst hubby was having a shuftie at the Autocruise handbook he saw mention of being able to put the fridge into a 'storage' position and found that there's a little 'lever' on it, behind the main catch, so it can be secured in the open position.

[silverback]

holy moly Mel

you sure pack a lot of kit in!! (lol)

too many cushions, throws, carpets, stick on things, bins, shoe holders, dog baskets (tongue in cheek)

whats with the bin in the loo? going continental?

and come on green carpet !!! 8-)

nice van tho B-)

bit too cramped for us tho *-)

jon

ps thats a right good fridge catch to leave it open...we use a shoe! (lol)

[silverback]

Tracker - 2012-10-07 5:20 PM

 

This is useful for working out the effects of a heavy rear end.

 

http://www.atoc.info/motorhome%20weights%20check.pdf

 

 

 

 

thats interesting Rich...

the autotrail website..using a swift bolero to calc weights if im not mistaken (lol)

at least keeping it in the uk *-)

jon

[Mel B]

silverback - 2012-10-10 9:47 PM

 

holy moly Mel

you sure pack a lot of kit in!! (lol)

too many cushions, throws, carpets, stick on things, bins, shoe holders, dog baskets (tongue in cheek)

whats with the bin in the loo? going continental?

and come on green carpet !!! 8-)

nice van tho B-)

bit too cramped for us tho *-)

jon

ps thats a right good fridge catch to leave it open...we use a shoe! (lol)

 

Shoe holders????? None of them in there. The bin is in the loo so that when we go out and close the washroom door it stops the dogs being able to raid it! *-)

 

Nothing wrong with a green carpet ... feels like we have the 'outside' inside!!! :D

 

Hubby says I've got a cushion fettish .... :$

[Mel B]

Forgot to say, we took the memory foam topper off the camper bed today and weighed it ... 7.1kg - strewth, I didn't realise it was a much as that!!! 8-) I had been intending to get a mattress protector to replace it but having looked at some decided against them as they are so thin, so instead we put a summer weight single duvet on instead. As the bed is 1.41m wide (nearly 4ft 8in) it doesn't go the full width, but as we don't lay right up to the edge it's not a problem and is held in place by the fitted terry sheet.

[pepe63xnotuse]

Mornin' Mel...

I must be honest,when you started mentioning canoes,paddles etc,I was envisaging 2 x 7-8ft "craft",just crammed in the back(..with wet suits etc,draped off hangers) (lol) ..

 

...but as they're in that underbed locker,I'm now assuming that they're "inflatable" ..... :$

 

I've another idea/project for you...."Bunk beds.......for dogs!"...eh?..what do you reckon?... (lol) )

 

(..failing that,an Ifor Williams stock trailer...)

 

And still no mention of any underfloor waste container.......yet.... ;-)

(....don't tell us you sold it on with the old van.......? )

[Mel B]

pepe63 - 2012-10-11 9:03 AM

 

Mornin' Mel...

I must be honest,when you started mentioning canoes,paddles etc,I was envisaging 2 x 7-8ft "craft",just crammed in the back(..with wet suits etc,draped off hangers) (lol) ..

 

...but as they're in that underbed locker,I'm now assuming that they're "inflatable" ..... :$

Now I understand why you were being so 'nosey'!!!! :D They're 'proper' inflatable canoes/kayaks though, not toys and being able to store them safely and securely so they don't get damaged was a consideration.

 

I've another idea/project for you...."Bunk beds.......for dogs!"...eh?..what do you reckon?... (lol) )

Funny you should mention that ... I HAD actually 'toyed' with the idea before we got the van in case there wasn't room for the little monsters at the end of the bed. :$ Something along the lines of the old type stretchers with poles on either side which drop into sockets at either end, the old Commer Autosleeper pop-top we had many years ago has such a set-up in the cab. :-D

 

And still no mention of any underfloor waste container.......yet.... ;-)

(....don't tell us you sold it on with the old van.......? )

That was a total waste of time wasn't it ... with us selling the van not that long after! I still have it .... you never know ..... ;-)

[goldi]

Afternoon all,

 

 

We have an adria twin which is 4 years old. Loaded, for a long trip we have 40 kgs left with a gross weight of 3300 kg . I had it uprated to 3500 by sv tech for £200 all in with no alteration suspension ,tyres, lsv or anything. I can now carry a scooter

 

norm

[Guest JudgeMental]

goldi - 2012-10-12 2:19 PM

 

Afternoon all,

 

 

We have an adria twin which is 4 years old. Loaded, for a long trip we have 40 kgs left with a gross weight of 3300 kg . I had it uprated to 3500 by sv tech for £200 all in with no alteration suspension ,tyres, lsv or anything. I can now carry a scooter

 

norm

 

what weight are you putting on the towbar though..and what is the handling like.

 

thought you had to add air suspension for a 3500kg rating on Twin (we have one also)

[Tracker]

JudgeMental - 2012-10-12 2:22 PM

thought you had to add air suspension for a 3500kg rating on Twin (we have one also)

 

I don't think so - I understand that the van was built to be 3500 but downplated for some reason as yet unknown to me - to 3300, which makes replating back to 3500 a paper exercise - but I could be wrong??

 

My own van can be replated to 3700 kg from 3500 as a paper exercise but the axle limits remain as was which does not help increase payload in my case but probably would with a better weight distributed van?

 

SVTech want £240 plus VAT from me which at £288 is a lot more than the £200 stated - how long ago was it?

[Mike88]

goldi - 2012-10-12 2:19 PM

 

Afternoon all,

 

 

We have an adria twin which is 4 years old. Loaded, for a long trip we have 40 kgs left with a gross weight of 3300 kg . I had it uprated to 3500 by sv tech for £200 all in with no alteration suspension ,tyres, lsv or anything. I can now carry a scooter

 

norm

 

Somehow I doubt it as the Fiat is able to cope with a vertical load of 85kgs only. Look in the technical data section of your handbook and the carrying capacity of your towbar which will also be rated at 85kgs.

 

Bearing in mind the towbar and rack weighs around 50kgs I can't see how a scooter can be carried lawfully on a rack but am willing to be proved wrong..

[thebishbus]

As the SV upgrade appears to be a paper exercise, plus maybe a sticker, why does it cost so much as £288. ?

Brian B.

[Tracker]

thebishbus - 2012-10-12 4:09 PM

 

As the SV upgrade appears to be a paper exercise, plus maybe a sticker, why does it cost so much as £288. ?

Brian B.

 

It also includes an aluminium replacement weight plate stamped with the new weights and we all know how expensive aluminium is these days!

 

The other answer is - because they can charge what they like when they are a monopoly!

[Guest JudgeMental]

Tracker - 2012-10-12 3:26 PM

 

JudgeMental - 2012-10-12 2:22 PM

thought you had to add air suspension for a 3500kg rating on Twin (we have one also)

 

I don't think so - I understand that the van was built to be 3500 but downplated for some reason as yet unknown to me - to 3300, which makes replating back to 3500 a paper exercise - but I could be wrong??

 

My own van can be replated to 3700 kg from 3500 as a paper exercise but the axle limits remain as was which does not help increase payload in my case but probably would with a better weight distributed van?

 

SVTech want £240 plus VAT from me which at £288 is a lot more than the £200 stated - how long ago was it?

 

Dear Richard...I was questioning Goldi's post re an Adria twin he uprated.

 

But what do they actually do (SV Tech) that cant be achieved directly with VOSA/DVLA I wonder. anyone got the paperwork?

[goldi]

Afternoon all,

 

You can do the upgrade yourself but its too techi for me, the data they want to know, so its best for sv to do it.

The towbar is the westfalia which is rated at 150 kgs however, I am not satisfied and i have made some brackets which fasten to the top hinges of the van to provide additioal stability to the rack.This is then fastened by 150 kg rachets straps .The scooter by the way is a sym fiddle 125

[goldi]

Hello again,

 

The upgrade was done about 2years ago and I have toured France with it on without any problems. Afirm over at Ferrybridge did the rack and towbar which is not far from me at Cleckheaton The rack could also be used for other things as well. I reckon the ratchet staps take bout 50 kgs of weight. The scooter weighs about 110kgs. I am perpectly happy with the weight distribution and handiling, ther is very little overhang on these vans and the water tank is under the longe seat , so is quite far forward.

norm

[Tracker]

I have not looked into the paperwork side of re-plating but before the dear old DVLA will issue the documentation and new V5 you will need someone to issue the new weight plate for affixing to the van and I don't know who else but SVTech will do this or whether SVTech will issue a plate at a lower cost - somehow I doubt it?

 

To be fair SVTech do have considerable technical expertise and experience gained in liaison with many makers over the years which to be trusted by the DVLA to authorise re-plating they would need and I guess that it is all the unseen work and techy data that the £240 they charge supports - the other £48 being George's share.

[Guest JudgeMental]

goldi - 2012-10-12 4:57 PM

 

Hello again,

 

The upgrade was done about 2years ago and I have toured France with it on without any problems. Afirm over at Ferrybridge did the rack and towbar which is not far from me at Cleckheaton The rack could also be used for other things as well. I reckon the ratchet staps take bout 50 kgs of weight. The scooter weighs about 110kgs. I am perpectly happy with the weight distribution and handiling, ther is very little overhang on these vans and the water tank is under the longe seat , so is quite far forward.

norm

 

Thanks Norm that is valuable information.....One last question: have you visited a weighbridge by any chance, to see how your rear axle is handling the weight. I presume as you have not added air suspension that it does not hang low at the rear, as you seem happy with the handling etc....

 

 

[Mel B]

Tracker - 2012-10-12 5:01 PM

 

I have not looked into the paperwork side of re-plating but before the dear old DVLA will issue the documentation and new V5 you will need someone to issue the new weight plate for affixing to the van and I don't know who else but SVTech will do this or whether SVTech will issue a plate at a lower cost - somehow I doubt it?

 

To be fair SVTech do have considerable technical expertise and experience gained in liaison with many makers over the years which to be trusted by the DVLA to authorise re-plating they would need and I guess that it is all the unseen work and techy data that the £240 they charge supports - the other £48 being George's share.

 

To add to the above, SVTech are also taking 'responsibility' for confirming that the vehicle will be 'safe and remain legal' when upgraded ... so it's gotta cost them a fair bit for them to be able to guarantee this.