Bolly1965 Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 I've used the heater in our Bessacarr E765 for the first time today. On electric only operation, the fan runs slowly and little heat is produced. The water heating only on electricity works fine. When using gas operation the fan runs fast and it gets good and hot. There is also a little water coming from the external vent on start up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crinklystarfish Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Without the benefit of knowing the type and version of heater I'd have a guess at yes. It's entirely expected that the characteristics will be different, you are using an entirely different system even though it may all be encased in the same actual unit. The water will be condensate. Altogether probably nothing to stress about unless there is more info to come... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Bolly1965 - 2012-09-29 8:11 AM I've used the heater in our Bessacarr E765 for the first time today. On electric only operation, the fan runs slowly and little heat is produced. The water heating only on electricity works fine. When using gas operation the fan runs fast and it gets good and hot. There is also a little water coming from the external vent on start up. While I suppose one should feel complmented that you assume someone will immediately be aware of exactly what heating system is fitted to your (2006) Bessacarr, it does make it tough trying to answer this type of question based on crystal-ball gazing. I suspect your motorhome has a Truma C-6002EH combination air/water heater that can provide up to 6kW of blown-air output on gas only, up to 1.8kW of blown-air output on 230V only, and (in principle) up to 7.8kW on gas + 230V. As the maximum heat output on 230V is relatively low, the speed of the blown-air fan also stays fairly low. There's no point blasting huge amounts of air over the 230V heating elements, as the elements' heat would be unable to transfer to the air travelling over them. Operating on gas, the fan speed is matched to the gas-burner's output capability but, as this is far higher than that of the 230V elements, the fan can run much faster. Not certain which "external vent" you mean but, if it's the combined air-intake/gas-flue (in the body-side to the rear of the entrance door of an E765 I think) then, in cool weather, water will condense from the flue and run down the motorhome's body-side. If what I've assumed above is correct, then (as crinklySF advises) what's happening is normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolly1965 Posted September 29, 2012 Author Share Posted September 29, 2012 Thanks for that - I have no idea what model it is but your assumptions sound correct. My last van has a 2 kw electric element, which worked just as well as the gas. The hand book has generic info on a variety of different units so I had no idea what I was dealing with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGD Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 Bolly1965 - 2012-09-29 12:35 PM Thanks for that - I have no idea what model it is but your assumptions sound correct. My last van has a 2 kw electric element, which worked just as well as the gas. The hand book has generic info on a variety of different units so I had no idea what I was dealing with. Maybe just go and have a look at the actual unit in your MH....it's brand name and model type/serial number will be on it somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Unfortunately (certainly for Truma 'combination' heaters) it's often the case that the label that identifies the model of appliance cannot be read once the heater has been installed. However, in Bolly1965's case it should be straightforward to identify the heater model because the information is written on the heater's operating controls. A 2006 Truma C-Series combination air/water heater has a control-panel with "truma Trumatic C" written on it. A C-Series C-6002EH appliance, that can heat air and water via 230V as well as via gas, has a second operating control (referred to by Truma as a "Power selector switch") and this carries the words "truma Trumatic C EH". Truma C-6002EH heaters are more complex than the basic models, and previous forum discussions prove that quite a few motorcaravanners have difficulty understanding how they operate. For example: http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=28220&posts=12 Consequently, if a motorhome manufacturer's handbook is sketchy or generic (or both!), it should be helpful to obtain Truma's own documentation. This webpage lists Truma products that have downloadable information files: http://dealer.truma.com/_anweisungen/Truma-Katalog/index_gb.html?&language=en_gb&dataLanguage=en_gb The files containing Operating and Installation Instructions for a Trumatic C-6002EH appliance are these: http://dealer.truma.com/_anweisungen/Truma-Katalog/pdf_verzeichnis/30_000/34010_03500.pdf http://dealer.truma.com/_anweisungen/Truma-Katalog/pdf_verzeichnis/30_000/34010_03700.pdf Earlier forum threads that include a reference to "6002EH" are listed here: http://tinyurl.com/8tcn6k3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolly1965 Posted September 30, 2012 Author Share Posted September 30, 2012 You see! I knew i was write to assume that someone here would know! Thanks Derek! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 On one very cold morning I ran ours on the combination of electric and gas giving an output of nearly 8kw. Fan sounded like concord taking off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryW Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Like others above I am not sure what system you have but if it's like the one i have the space heating and water heating is accomplished with seperate units. The space heating comes from a stand alone fire with both gas and electric heating with a fan attached to provide hot air through the ducts if required. On electric heating the fire will have 3 options on the control panel 800, 1000 and 2000W. After choosing the required power setting then the centre dial sets the temperature. If you choose higher than 7 the fire will be hot enogh to burn you so for higher settings you will need to switch on the fan this is situated on the top of the fire and may have a manual setting and an auto setting for speed control. With the fan on no heat should come out the fire. If I'm on the right lines and you need more let me know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Colin Leake - 2012-09-30 8:01 PM On one very cold morning I ran ours on the combination of electric and gas giving an output of nearly 8kw. Fan sounded like concord taking off! I believe you have a 2011 motorhome, in which case your Truma 'combination' gas/230V air/water heater will be a "Combi 6E" model, rather than a C-6002EH appliance like mine. Although a C-6002EH is technically capable of producing a heat output of 7.8kW (6kW via gas + 1.8k via 230V) a Combi-6E is not. A Combi 6E has 3 gas-burner settings - 2kW, 4kW or 6kW - and the heater's maximum heat output is obtained when operating on gas-only using the 6kW burner-setting. When a Combi 6E is operated in 'mixed-mode' (gas + 230V) the 6kW gas-burner setting is disabled, meaning that its maximum mixed-mode heat output is 5.8kW (4kW via gas + 1.8kW via 230V). This mixed-mode heat output restriction is indicated in the "Rated thermal output" data provided in the Technical Data section of the Combi 4E/Combi 6E Operating Instructions document (page 18 of this file) http://dealer.truma.com/_anweisungen/Truma-Katalog/pdf_verzeichnis/30_000/34020_29300.pdf A similar mixed-mode heat output limit applies to the Combi 4E. This has 2 gas-burner settings - 2kW or 4kW - and the heater's maximum heat output is obtained when operating on gas-only using the 4kW burner-setting. When a Combi 4E is operated in 'mixed-mode' (gas + 230V) the 4kW gas-burner setting is disabled, meaning that its maximum mixed-mode heat output is 3.8kW (2kW via gas + 1.8kW via 230V). Combi models are (supposedly) quieter than their C-Series predecessors but, at maximum heat output, their blown-air fan will inevitably make plenty of noise. The quoted maximum 12V demand for a Combi 4E/6E is 5.6A, the same as for a C-6002EH. When the latter is operating at its maximum 6kW gas-only output, the fan-noise does (as Colin says) resemble that of a jet engine. At this point the fan-motor is flat out and, even if maximum mixed-mode output (7.8kW) were attained the fan won't run any faster. I don't know if operating C-6002EH heaters at 7.8kW output caused problems but, if so, this could explain why there's a restriction on Combis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted October 1, 2012 Share Posted October 1, 2012 Derek Uzzell - 2012-10-01 9:19 AM Colin Leake - 2012-09-30 8:01 PM On one very cold morning I ran ours on the combination of electric and gas giving an output of nearly 8kw. Fan sounded like concord taking off! I believe you have a 2011 motorhome, in which case your Truma 'combination' gas/230V air/water heater will be a "Combi 6E" model, rather than a C-6002EH appliance like mine. Although a C-6002EH is technically capable of producing a heat output of 7.8kW (6kW via gas + 1.8k via 230V) a Combi-6E is not. A Combi 6E has 3 gas-burner settings - 2kW, 4kW or 6kW - and the heater's maximum heat output is obtained when operating on gas-only using the 6kW burner-setting. When a Combi 6E is operated in 'mixed-mode' (gas + 230V) the 6kW gas-burner setting is disabled, meaning that its maximum mixed-mode heat output is 5.8kW (4kW via gas + 1.8kW via 230V). This mixed-mode heat output restriction is indicated in the "Rated thermal output" data provided in the Technical Data section of the Combi 4E/Combi 6E Operating Instructions document (page 18 of this file) http://dealer.truma.com/_anweisungen/Truma-Katalog/pdf_verzeichnis/30_000/34020_29300.pdf A similar mixed-mode heat output limit applies to the Combi 4E. This has 2 gas-burner settings - 2kW or 4kW - and the heater's maximum heat output is obtained when operating on gas-only using the 4kW burner-setting. When a Combi 4E is operated in 'mixed-mode' (gas + 230V) the 4kW gas-burner setting is disabled, meaning that its maximum mixed-mode heat output is 3.8kW (2kW via gas + 1.8kW via 230V). Combi models are (supposedly) quieter than their C-Series predecessors but, at maximum heat output, their blown-air fan will inevitably make plenty of noise. The quoted maximum 12V demand for a Combi 4E/6E is 5.6A, the same as for a C-6002EH. When the latter is operating at its maximum 6kW gas-only output, the fan-noise does (as Colin says) resemble that of a jet engine. At this point the fan-motor is flat out and, even if maximum mixed-mode output (7.8kW) were attained the fan won't run any faster. I don't know if operating C-6002EH heaters at 7.8kW output caused problems but, if so, this could explain why there's a restriction on Combis. It was the c-6002EH on our old Rapido. Sure heated the motorhome up quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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