Possl Vans 2014

[Guest JudgeMental]

For anyone interested in German Possl vans (Globecar identical, no site upgrade as yet) they have upgraded the website...not particularly any better info. but a better website for sure.

 

http://www.poessl-mobile.de/

 

I'm thinking of changing van, but one thing that concerns, is all these new bigger better models may well end up as compromised as Coachbuilts in terms of payloads, so you need to think carefully and do the math..... ;-)

 

Video of "soft lock" sliding door in action. standard fitting on some models now...

 

 

edit: agree Robin, much prefer the more sympathetic? Possl decals :-D

 

I doubt if true to be honest as most dealers stock both models

[Robinhood]

....though the 2014 Globecar Brochure is downloadable from their site (in English).

 

As an amusing aside, I was talking to one of their dealers on Monday, and commented that I really didn't like the Globecar decals, and that the considerably more discrete Pössl "decoration" was much preferable.

 

I was then told that the 'vans arrived from Germany with Pössl decals, and they remove them and apply the Globecar ones locally! *-)

 

(Whether true or not, I don't know, but that was what I was told)

 

 

[bolero boy]

Robin, might be worth checking this one out and getting a few quid off for reduced labour charges. ;-)

So the interiors are the same?

[Guest JudgeMental]

bolero boy - 2013-11-13 8:37 AM

 

So the interiors are the same?

 

Not quite, but almost...different fabrics and decals but interiors identical more or less. Possl tend to be a bit cheaper I think

[Robinhood]

bolero boy - 2013-11-13 8:37 AM

 

Robin, might be worth checking this one out and getting a few quid off for reduced labour charges. ;-)

So the interiors are the same?

 

....I was actually introducing an ex-work colleague to the joys of motorcaravanning (at his request), by doing a tour of local dealers to demonstrate types, layouts and the associated compromises.

 

As he was leaning towards a PVC, we went to look at Globecar 'vans, which ticked some of his boxes.

 

The Campscout (XLWB) went up a bit in my estimation as the dealer had very neatly fitted an oven (I know it's a marmite thing - but we like one).

 

If I were considering purchasing one, I'd certainly try to get it delivered with the original Pössl decals, I believe the 'vans are virtually, if not entirely identical internally (and I'm not averse to haggling over such things). ;-)

[hughman]

AFAIK, they're identical in layout across the range - just fabrics and colours of 'woodwork' that differ.

 

We've done 9000 miles in our Possl in 6 months - only problem was very early on with boiler cutting out - resolved by Truma and paid for by Possl via German dealer. We're very pleased with it and have had none of the other quality issues that have been reported recently.

[Derek Uzzell]

Robinhood - 2013-11-13 8:11 AM

 

....though the 2014 Globecar Brochure is downloadable from their site (in English).

 

As an amusing aside, I was talking to one of their dealers on Monday, and commented that I really didn't like the Globecar decals, and that the considerably more discrete Pössl "decoration" was much preferable.

 

I was then told that the 'vans arrived from Germany with Pössl decals, and they remove them and apply the Globecar ones locally! *-)

 

(Whether true or not, I don't know, but that was what I was told)

 

 

If the 2014 English-language Possl and Globecar brochures are compared, it's evident that - on some models at least - the decals of a Possl and the equivalent Globecar differ significantly. For example, the "Roadcruiser" on page 28 of the Possl brochure and the equivalent "Campscout" on Page 26 of the Globecar brochure.

 

Even if swapping decals allowed a Possl model to have the external appearance of the equivalent Globecar, there would still be the interior to consider. Although (as hughman says) equivalent models share layout, a Possl has 3 interior trim options (Maroc, Monastir or Spirit), while a Globecar has 3 different options (Silver, Cottage or Beach). There are also significant Possl/Globecar differences relating to furniture/flooring colour and design. If a Globecar model differs noticably from a Possl inside, it's hard to understand why it should be built with Possl decals on the outside.

 

If I ordered a Globecar motorhome, whether or not I liked its exterior decoration, I would expect that decoration to have been applied in the converter's factory and not to have been retro-fitted. I'd also expect the vehicle's internal appearance to match the photos in the Globecar brochure, not those in the Possl brochure. If what turned up proved to be a thinly-disguised Possl, I'd reject it.

 

I've spoken to a local Globecar dealership about this and he told me there's no way he would be prepared to swap decals on a new vehicle. He felt that, if 'decal-swapping' is occurring, it won't be carried out by UK Globecar dealers (There are no official UK Possl dealerships.) At present, he seems to be having difficulty getting hold of new Globecars for forecourt display (three due in, but he's not holding his breath about when they'll arrive), but I doubt that's relevant to the decal-swapping.

 

(Nothing to do with Possl/Globecar, but I notice that Carthago "Malibu" PVCs can be specified without exterior decals. It's a no-cost option - they don't apply the decals and they don't charge you for not applying them!)

[Muswell]

I'd go decal-free, except maybe one tiny one.

[Robinhood]

Derek Uzzell - 2013-11-13 10:00 AM

 

Robinhood - 2013-11-13 8:11 AM

 

....though the 2014 Globecar Brochure is downloadable from their site (in English).

 

As an amusing aside, I was talking to one of their dealers on Monday, and commented that I really didn't like the Globecar decals, and that the considerably more discrete Pössl "decoration" was much preferable.

 

I was then told that the 'vans arrived from Germany with Pössl decals, and they remove them and apply the Globecar ones locally! *-)

 

(Whether true or not, I don't know, but that was what I was told)

 

 

If the 2014 English-language Possl and Globecar brochures are compared, it's evident that - on some models at least - the decals of a Possl and the equivalent Globecar differ significantly. For example, the "Roadcruiser" on page 28 of the Possl brochure and the equivalent "Campscout" on Page 26 of the Globecar brochure.

 

Even if swapping decals allowed a Possl model to have the external appearance of the equivalent Globecar, there would still be the interior to consider. Although (as hughman says) equivalent models share layout, a Possl has 3 interior trim options (Maroc, Monastir or Spirit), while a Globecar has 3 different options (Silver, Cottage or Beach). There are also significant Possl/Globecar differences relating to furniture/flooring colour and design. If a Globecar model differs noticably from a Possl inside, it's hard to understand why it should be built with Possl decals on the outside.

 

If I ordered a Globecar motorhome, whether or not I liked its exterior decoration, I would expect that decoration to have been applied in the converter's factory and not to have been retro-fitted. I'd also expect the vehicle's internal appearance to match the photos in the Globecar brochure, not those in the Possl brochure. If what turned up proved to be a thinly-disguised Possl, I'd reject it.

 

I've spoken to a local Globecar dealership about this and he told me there's no way he would be prepared to swap decals on a new vehicle. He felt that, if 'decal-swapping' is occurring, it won't be carried out by UK Globecar dealers (There are no official UK Possl dealerships.) At present, he seems to be having difficulty getting hold of new Globecars for forecourt display (three due in, but he's not holding his breath about when they'll arrive), but I doubt that's relevant to the decal-swapping.

 

(Nothing to do with Possl/Globecar, but I notice that Carthago "Malibu" PVCs can be specified without exterior decals. It's a no-cost option - they don't apply the decals and they don't charge you for not applying them!)

 

 

....well there's always one, isn't there? ;-)

 

(I thought my scepticism was fairly apparent in my original post *-) )

 

This was, however, from a long-term Globecar dealer, and if I'd chosen to fully believe him, I don't think I would necessarily have made the leap to rebadging (differently specified) Pössl conversions and passing them off as Globecar. I stopped at simply imagining a change of decals.

 

I like to keep an open mind on most things, but not so open my brains fall out!

 

 

[colin]

When we ordered our Globecar gf commented she didn´t like graphics (on a white van) I said we would just peel them off, but when we say our golden white van the graphics seemed to be ok so left them. The oven under the fridge I don´t like idea of, much prefer a grill(or oven) next to the door

[Derek Uzzell]

Robinhood - 2013-11-13 11:39 AM

 

...(I thought my scepticism was fairly apparent in my original post *-) ) ...

 

 

Yes it was, but the idea of re-decalling a Possl with Globecar 'badging' is so weird that I thought it just might have some truth in it.

 

I didn't contact the local Globecar dealership merely to explore the re-decalling issue; I mainly wanted to check if he knew when his Globecars might turn up. If we decide to dispose of our Hobby, I think we might be able to live with a Campscout, but we really need to have a good long look at one first (especially the central shower arrangement). If there had been no self-interest I wouldn't have bothered pursuing the matter.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Just had a quote for the top of the range new Roadcruiser "R"evolution model. Its the hightop with massive electric bed and garage underneath. my main concern was payload as these vans getting bigger and heavier. this was my answer

 

"the catalog says roadweight of 3035KG with driver, Fuel and water, + 20kg for 150PS + All-In packet 52Kg, 2 Fog lights, SOG, soft closing door, extra battery 27kg, Awning 40kg + Gas ( 2x11) 40kg = 3176 Kg"

 

Leaving a user payload of 324kg..not a lot is it.. :-S

 

Have asked for quote on twin single bed Roadcruiser, with busbiker rack..as payload probably better...but bikes outside..dilema.....dilema...Have been down to see Hugh's today and the rack (and van) a smashing bit of kit. :-D

[Mike88]

Is a payload of 324kgs that bad? After all panel vanners tend to take rather less than the kitchen sink than our coachbuilt counterparts simply because we have less room. As for bikes is it a real problem to leave them secured to a rack? After all you have to leave them when you use them to go shopping or to cafe etc.

 

Will the bikes be insured if secured to a rack? If so then perhaps it isn't so much of an issue.

[lennyhb]

JudgeMental - 2013-11-13 4:45 PM

 

"the catalog says roadweight of 3035KG with driver, Fuel and water, + 20kg for 150PS + All-In packet 52Kg, 2 Fog lights, SOG, soft closing door, extra battery 27kg, Awning 40kg + Gas ( 2x11) 40kg = 3176 Kg"

 

Leaving a user payload of 324kg..not a lot is it.. :-S

 

 

Does not sound right the 150PS engine is only 0.5kg heaver than the 130, it's only the turbo that's different. Also check the water in running order German specs., usually only allow for 20 Lt of water whilst driving.

[Guest JudgeMental]

dum de de de dum de de.....

[Guest JudgeMental]

There are a few Roadcruiser owners on here...wonder if they have ever weighed them in holiday mode.....come on then spill! :-D

 

Mike, yes insured....and after seeing the busbiker swing out rack, I have change my mind slightly to be honest. it will be easy enough to secure bikes it is a strong rack....

[pepe63xnotuse]

So you're leaning towards this one again then Eddie?

http://www.buscamper.nl/nieuws/2_busbiker-assortiment-uitgebreid

(..it does look impressive..)

 

But I thought it was either, a) A new van(to take the bikes) OR b) A new bike rack(but keeping existing van). Not both!??.... (lol)

 

I just wonder if you'd be able to specify the "uprated/HD" rear springs that Nick(euroserve) mentioned in a thread some time back?

(I recall he said it was really cheap to opt for them at the time of build..)

 

I know they wouldn't raise the "capacity"..but they may improve the "capability"...

 

Although they probably wouldn't be an option if buying from existing stock...?

[Robinhood]

lennyhb - 2013-11-13 6:20 PM

 

JudgeMental - 2013-11-13 4:45 PM

 

"the catalog says roadweight of 3035KG with driver, Fuel and water, + 20kg for 150PS + All-In packet 52Kg, 2 Fog lights, SOG, soft closing door, extra battery 27kg, Awning 40kg + Gas ( 2x11) 40kg = 3176 Kg"

 

Leaving a user payload of 324kg..not a lot is it.. :-S

 

 

Does not sound right the 150PS engine is only 0.5kg heaver than the 130, it's only the turbo that's different. Also check the water in running order German specs., usually only allow for 20 Lt of water whilst driving.

 

 

....yes, a bit odd, this.

 

If I interpret their option/pricelist correctly, Globecar quote the same weight for all engines bar the 180. (It would be easy, but wrong, I think, to interpret the 20kg figure quoted for an uplift from a standard 3.3t chassis (where that is the 'base' spec - not in Eddies case) to a 3.5t chassis as being for an engine upgrade).

 

I suspect the water will be 90% of the full tank, since they don't quote a 100/20 figure, which is quite common when the lower value is used for MIRO. (but this is, of course, only a guess, and clarification would be good).

 

I would also expect the initial MIRO to have an allowance for 90% gas, but this seems to have been added (40kg) at the end. Whilst it would be sensible to make an addition for heavier UK (non-refillable) bottles if they are to be used (and not in Eddies case), this looks somewhat wrong.

 

Depending on the awning type and size, that may be 10kg or so over as well.

 

The rest of the stuff looks about correct from the Globecar options list and weights.

 

All in all, for Eddie's use, the above calculation might be some 60-70kg overestimated (giving a bit more payload).

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest JudgeMental]

If your correct Robin, that is 400 kg, ,and with less water I could live with that.

 

Pepe , to be honest the rack is a quality bit of kit, so much happier about it. And yes it's either stick with adria and get the rack, buy the 636 FR and get the rack..or go for the Revolution model, then no need for rack :D

 

It will be a factory order so will ask about springs.....thing is existing stock not of much interest....so March next year. If I go for the rack will get it shipped here and fitted by my friend who is a mechanic, two handed job anyway....

[Derek Uzzell]

Robinhood - 2013-11-13 7:13 PM

 

...If I interpret their option/pricelist correctly, Globecar quote the same weight for all engines bar the 180. (It would be easy, but wrong, I think, to interpret the 20kg figure quoted for an uplift from a standard 3.3t chassis (where that is the 'base' spec - not in Eddies case) to a 3.5t chassis as being for an engine upgrade)...

 

The Globecar and Possl price-list/technical specification documents have a similar format.

 

Although the documents don't say so, I believe the weight increases relate to the motor fitted. Possl/Globecar models can be obtained on Citroen and Fiat bases, with 2.2litre and 3.0litre motors, while Fiat versions can have a 2.0litre motor (not available on RHD Ducatos as it obstructs the steering-column), a 2.3litre or a 3.0litre.

 

The 2.0litre motor in the Ducato is the lightest and the +KG figures in the price-list reflect the extra weight if a different motor is chosen. So all 2.2litre and 2.3litre motors would add 20kg to the MIRO (Mass In Running Order) of a model that, in its basic specification, comes with the 2.0litre motor, and specifying a 3.0litre motor would add 50kg. If a model comes as standard with a 2.2litre (Citroen) or 2.3litre (Fiat) motor, specifying a 3.0litre motor would add 30kg to the MIRO.

 

As you say, in the case of a Possl Roadcruiser Revolution, the standard specification comprises a Maxi chassis and a 2.2litre or 2.3litre motor, so opting for the 150bhp 2.3litre powerplant won't affect the standard 3035kg MIRO.

 

There are anomalies in the price-lists. For example, the 'weight penalty' for opting for electric mirrors is quoted as 0.2kg (which sounds right) in the options list, but 2kg (which sounds heavy) in the "All-in Pack" list.

 

I also note that the "Doppelblattfeder Hinterachse" (double-leaf rear springs) option becomes 'heavy duty rear shock absorbers' in the French price-list. The 17kg weight penalty makes it pretty clear that the option involves springs not shock absorbers, but it makes one wonder how much trust can be placed in the rest of the nformation.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Derek..have you a link to where're you compared the weight info from please.

 

So when they say 3035kg, that is the MIRO, as they don't make this very clear. The roadcruisers all have online brochure MIRO of 2995kg. Find it hard to believe the maxi hight top R evoloution model only 40 kg more....

 

Do you think this with full water or 20 kg as Robin suggested

 

Also are the springs worth ordering, or will they make ride hard...maybe air ride a better option, after living with van for a while......that for Nick as well if he looks in:-D

[pepe63xnotuse]

JudgeMental - 2013-11-14 8:51 AM

 

...Also are the springs worth ordering, or will they make ride hard...maybe air ride a better option, after living with van for a while......that for Nick as well if he looks in:-D

 

This is one thread, in which Nick mentions them(although he does use the word "bouncy" (lol) )

 

https://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Fiat-rear-springs/29041/

 

..I should imagine that a laden PVC, complete with a hefty bike rack would tame them though....

 

 

[Robinhood]

....I'm working from a 2013 (English) Globecar option/pricelist, and (though of course, it is still an amount of guesswork) it doesn't quite reflect Derek's post.

 

 

Derek Uzzell - 2013-11-14 8:31 AM

 

Robinhood - 2013-11-13 7:13 PM

 

...If I interpret their option/pricelist correctly, Globecar quote the same weight for all engines bar the 180. (It would be easy, but wrong, I think, to interpret the 20kg figure quoted for an uplift from a standard 3.3t chassis (where that is the 'base' spec - not in Eddies case) to a 3.5t chassis as being for an engine upgrade)...

 

The Globecar and Possl price-list/technical specification documents have a similar format.

 

Although the documents don't say so, I believe the weight increases relate to the motor fitted. Possl/Globecar models can be obtained on Citroen and Fiat bases, with 2.2litre and 3.0litre motors, while Fiat versions can have a 2.0litre motor (not available on RHD Ducatos as it obstructs the steering-column), a 2.3litre or a 3.0litre.

 

The 2.0litre motor in the Ducato is the lightest and the +KG figures in the price-list reflect the extra weight if a different motor is chosen. So all 2.2litre and 2.3litre motors would add 20kg to the MIRO (Mass In Running Order) of a model that, in its basic specification, comes with the 2.0litre motor, and specifying a 3.0litre motor would add 50kg. If a model comes as standard with a 2.2litre (Citroen) or 2.3litre (Fiat) motor, specifying a 3.0litre motor would add 30kg to the MIRO.

 

As you say, in the case of a Possl Roadcruiser Revolution, the standard specification comprises a Maxi chassis and a 2.2litre or 2.3litre motor, so opting for the 150bhp 2.3litre powerplant won't affect the standard 3035kg MIRO.

 

 

The price list I'm working from doesn't reflect any difference in weight between the lower three engine outputs regardless of the difference in the choice of 2.2 (Citroen) or 2.0/2.3 (Fiat). It shows zero increase above 'base' weight for any of these options. The only way I can interpret my pricelist (comparing various figures) is as a 20kg uplift for the upgrade to a 3.5t chassis (where this is an option - which it isn't on the vehicles in question).

 

Derek Uzzell - 2013-11-14 8:31 AM

 

There are anomalies in the price-lists. For example, the 'weight penalty' for opting for electric mirrors is quoted as 0.2kg (which sounds right) in the options list, but 2kg (which sounds heavy) in the "All-in Pack" list.

 

 

Mine shows 2kg and 1.5kg respectively (so consistent if you excuse rounding errors).

 

Derek Uzzell - 2013-11-14 8:31 AM

 

 

I also note that the "Doppelblattfeder Hinterachse" (double-leaf rear springs) option becomes 'heavy duty rear shock absorbers' in the French price-list. The 17kg weight penalty makes it pretty clear that the option involves springs not shock absorbers, but it makes one wonder how much trust can be placed in the rest of the information.

 

One thing worth noting is that the biggest extra weight contribution from the All-in Packet is 28kg from the 30l larger fuel tank. This is presumably mainly the extra contents, or at least 90% of them, so running with a "standard" (i.e. the equivalent of a 90l tank) fuel load would provide some margin if really on-the- edge at times.

 

I agree that I wouldn't want to base my purchase on the figure I can see (and interpret) if weight were a critical factor.

[derek pringle]

Hi Eddie,

Would Air Assist Suspension help with your payload and also comfy up the ride a little?

 

good spending

derek

[pepe63xnotuse]

Now I like what Derek U's brochure/Googling says.....

 

and I like what Robinh's brochure says....

 

But which is best...? :-S

 

 

There's only one way to find out.....