change from Caravan to a Motorhome

[VIP]

:-S Hi folks - I am considering moving over to a motorhome after having caravanned for years. I would like to hear the good points and particularly the bad points of having a Motorhome Thanks in anticipation of replies. regards FKG 8-)

[Geoff Bell]

No more tugging, isn't that a good enough reason?

[Geoff Bell]

No more queues of car behind you, thats another one.

[michele]

Pull In anywhere and make Tea /Coffee as well as alway's having your own toilet . *-)

[Clive]

The debate has many facets and we have tried both on and off since 1970. But since 1972 we have had motorhomes for all but 3 years. If you have a panel van conversion then you can park this as easy as a car, sometimes even easier as the drivers viewpoint is higher and generaly better and more commanding. When travelling you are driving a vehicle designed for commercial duties but giving it an easy life. The view is so much better than that of a car. You look OVER hedgerows and discover a new world not seen before. When you fancy a cuppa just pull into a layby. Don,t even get out, just put the kettle on. Even the loo is handy and the TV for the kids if necessary. Motorhomes tend to travel with the fresh water tank full. Something I tried once with a caravan and broke the towing coupling up a French mountain! If you go for something bigger like a coachbuilt then you will need to hone skills in finding parking places when visiting towns. But still a lot easier than a car with caravan. Its when motorhomes get BIG that some thought needs to be given to how you plan to get about once you have parked up on site or wherever. Those of us who are fit carry pedal cycles (as do many caravanners) some of us carry a scooter or two either behind or in a garage. Some of us are plain greedy and tow a car behind. It is at this point you ask the question "If you have a car then why not tow a caravan". Well the answer is back to the beginning of this waffle plus at this stage you have a significant piece of engineering with a magnificant view, rear view camera, cruise control, all home comforts and a chassis beneath of some substance. Personally I like all my "clutter" and with the motorhome I have found places for all of it. When we were tuggers we needed two sets of "clutter", one for the van and one for the 4X4 to tow it. I still have a 4X4 though and would never go back to towing a caravan, its toytown compared with motorhomes. And finally the recent cost of re-taxing the 4X4 was more than that for the motorhome. (£195 & £175) Can,t see the logic in this! P.S. We were once stuck in a traffic hold up on a motorway, it was so easy to put the kettle on for a cuppa at the time as were were stood still for 30 minutes or so. One would not have been so confident in doing this with a caravan. Nearly last thought, a motorhome (up to 3.5 tonne) has the same speed limitation applied to it as a car. A car towing a caravan is limited to lower speeds. Having said that What's the hurry? Final Final thought, when we got our current motorhome we discovered the beauty of the wind out awning and sectional Safari room. I can put this lot together by myself without any sweat. When we had a caravan the awning erection requuired both of us, a box to stand on and rules we adhered to in case of threats of divorce.

[peterjl]

Hi I would endorse Clives reply. We converted from caravan 3 years ago after spending 3 months in a hired MH crossing New Zealand & Oz - it converted us. The key for us it is so easy to move on; a few nights in one place maybe; with a caravan you tend to tour from a base but with a MH we drive to a different area, maybe not that far away, and stay their instead. We have a small vehicle 3500kg so parking not a problem. No downside for us. Peter

[Guest peter]

We had a caravan for years, but really wanted a motorhome after a couple of yrs. Well we did it this year and it's wonderfull. No more poncing about hitching up, and when you get on site you just walk into the back and make a cup of tea. You can wind in the awning and be ready for the off in a couple of minutes. You can wild camp as you have everything on board so are self sufficient. you will tend to use it more as all you have to do is get in and go. you can also cover more ground as it's easier to up sticks and move on. Theres probably loads of other reasons this is just a few off the top of my head. Go for it, you know you want to. :-> :D We have a Rapido 710F which we find is ideal at 5.75 Mtrs, so it's fairly easy to park in a normal space and easy to manouvre, the 2.8 Ltre engine makes it pretty rapid and also economical. Also its a 4 berth with the pull down bunk and single bed under as well as the made up double at the back. There are so many tunes you can play with this 'van it's brilliant and we are extatic with it. (lol)

[Mel E]

One GREAT thing about motorhomes versus caravans: I arrive on site and within 5 minutes, I'm pitched and drinking a glass of vino or beer. Two hours later the caravanner who arrived at the same time is still putting up his (apparantly mandatory) awning room. We motorhomers generally do without such add-ons. So motorhomes are much better for touring. Clive, I'm afraid I must correct one error in your posting - a very commonly held one at that. The speed limits that apply to motorhomes of up to 3500 Kgs Maximum Authorised Mass are indeed the same as cars throughout the rest of Europe. But NOT in the UK. In the UK, the law says that any motorhome with an unladen weight exceeding 3050 Kgs is subject to the reduced speeds that apply to LCVS - 60 mph on dual carriageways and 50 mph on single carriageways. (The 3050 is a throw back to 3 imperial tons (= 3048 KGs, rounded up to 3050), the law is that old. Many 3500 Kg motorhomes have very limited load capacity and certainly exceed 3050. However, PC Plod is unlikely to know this as the unladen weight is not posted anywhere on the vehicle. Having helped a couple of motorhomers get convictions for speeding quashed (for exceeding 60 mph on dual carriageways), I have been lobbying to get the law changed to the same 3500 division that applies in the rest of the EU - so far without success.

[howie]

Clive has covered most of the points re. the plus points of motor homes, but I would like to go back to the main two problems. First up is towing which I know from personal experience to be a real pain with every aspect from grease over your clothes to levelling up on a pitch better suited to absailing testing your patience. The other, with a motorhome, is lack of transport once on site. But we have never found this a problem as with a little organization we can get everything stowed away and ready for the road within five or ten minutes. All that is needed then is something to mark your pitch. Another consideration is payload. Our van conversion gives us around 700kg, a distant dream for caravans. Finally, I have yet to meet anyone who like ourselves have moved from caravans to motorhomes with any regrets. Howard.

[howie]

Have to disagree with you over the awning Mel. We have a van conversion so you will appreciate what a boon it is to have a Safari room. All that extra room is a real luxury even if its only for a overnight stay. Howard.

[Guest peter]

I'll agree with that.

[david lloyd]

[QUOTE]VIP - 2006-08-31 7:52 PM :-S Hi folks - I am considering moving over to a motorhome after having caravanned for years. I would like to hear the good points and particularly the bad points of having a Motorhome Thanks in anticipation of replies. regards FKG 8-)[/QUOTE] Any lingering doubts VIP? Regards, david

[Mel E]

I accept that many motorhomers do like awning rooms. But the vast majority don't bother - look at any camp site and at best you'll see 1 in 5 motorhomes with awning rooms erected. We had one with our first motorhome and we used it once! And you can't really use them when wild camping or on Aires. And we do also have a van conversion, but one with plenty of room inside. My experience of awning rooms (and I admit to having visited a few) is that they're not wind and rain proof when the weather is inclement (there is no J-rail to give a waterproof seal like caravans have) and you don't really need one when the weather is good! I know it's possible to buy awning rooms that overcome these problems, but their cost is enormous!

[howie]

Hiya Mel. Lets say we have a floor plan of 6ft x 10ft. Now put in provisions for a double bed, toilet/shower room, wardrobe, sink, fridge and cooking facilities plus all the other so called essentials the wife insists on taking with us. On paper this sounds like mission impossible, but in practise it works really well even on extended trips as i,m sure you have found as well. When you consider that our elec. awning cost less than £350 fitted , then I agree that the price for three extra panels is nothing more than daylight robbery. The price quoted at a recent show was £530 for the panels with all the bits and bobs included. This is why I have one of the very few self build Safari rooms in excistence. ( don,t ask ). The beauty of these rooms is that they can be erected to suit your needs. Just the roof, roof with front wall or either side panel as you want, and the whole thing taking less than 15 mins. to erect and take down. One other benifit is that they make exellent conversation pieces with the ability to always pull in unwary passerbys so I can indulge in my favorite pastime of talking to all and sundrie. Howard.

[Don Madge]

[QUOTE]Mel E - 2006-09-01 12:37 PM I accept that many motorhomes do like awning rooms. But the vast majority don't bother - look at any camp site and at best you'll see 1 in 5 motorhomes with awning rooms erected. We had one with our first motorhome and we used it once! And you can't really use them when wild camping or on Aires. And we do also have a van conversion, but one with plenty of room inside. My experience of awning rooms (and I admit to having visited a few) is that they're not wind and rain proof when the weather is inclement (there is no J-rail to give a waterproof seal like caravans have) and you don't really need one when the weather is good! I know it's possible to buy awning rooms that overcome these problems, but their cost is enormous![/QUOTE] Mel, Like you we have a van conversion, with that big sliding door open it's like sitting on a patio. many people ask why we don't sit out very much, we invite them in and show them the view. They have there uses of course, Like when I have not got my back box on the van, Clive's awning comes in very handy to store my chairs at the MMM meets, thanks Clive. :-D :-D Don

[Brian Kirby]

Right, I'll add a few downsides, just in the interests of balance!

First, admittedly, the towed caravan is a bit of a pain to tow (or so I always found), to park while en route, and to pitch/set up/strike.  It therefore tends to encourage use whereby one goes fairly directly to a destination, sets up, and then tours the surrounding area in the towcar.  Provided you like this existence, and are content to adopt this pattern of use, it works well.  My comments are on this assumption.

The motorhome (this is a bit speculative, in view of the sheer range of types and sizes of vehicle this word encompasses), on the other hand, is much better where you arrive somewhere, have a look round for a day or so, and then move on.

In summary, in the caravan you tour around when you arrive, in the motorhome you do your touring as you go.

This is where the Achilles heel of the motorhome can arise.  To get good internal space, you need a largish motorhome.  Larger motorhomes can't go everywhere a car can go.  They are barred from many supermarkets by height barriers, and also from many municipal car parks by byelaws or height barriers.  Because of their width and length, they can also be difficult to park at tourist attractions, restaurants, etc, even the supermarket when you can get in.  The larger ones are the size of buses, but they are not buses, so are banned from many bus parks.  The location of motorhome friendly parking is often at some distance from what you want to see.  Thus, the touring as you go becomes restricted by the need for alternative transport.  That alternative transport can be public transport - rare and generally expensive in UK, better abroad, cycle, moped/scooter or, final irony, towed car.

The alternative is a smaller motorhome, of classic "camper" type, or a small coachbuilt, but you loose out on space.

Alternatively, you don't tour as you go, you just head for a final destination campsite or whatever, park the van, and travel around from there on the alternative transport.  The real advantage then is that the motorhome makes the overnight stops en route much easier, but not much else.

What we all seek, in reality, is Dr Who's Tardis!  Small outside, yet cavernous inside.  Problem is, it don't exist: but the search for it is akin to that for the Holy Grail.

The biggest difference, in reality, seems to me to be that the motorhome is both the accommodation and the transport in one handy package, whereas the caravan is always a separate entity somewhere behind.  We went to Southern Italy this spring and, I have to say, for all the above disadvantages of the motorhome, which came more sharply into focus in Italy, it is not a trip I would ever have contemplated with a caravan.

Final minus point is fuel consumption.  At least with a caravan you get to use the towcar, with its generally better fuel economy, for the touring around.  (However, you may add significant mileage with this touring, so negate the advantage)  Most 'vans seem to do only around 25mpg, which becomes quite a cost even at European fuel prices.

It is achieving the best balance between internal space - what you can live comfortably in, and external bulk - what you can live comfortably with, that is the trick.

Go to the website www.go-motorhoming.co.uk and have a look for the book "Go Motorhoming Europe", which you can buy via the site.  It is a fund of useful information and deals with many of the above issues at some length.  I've no connection with the authors, or the site, but I have a copy of the book and would recommend it.

Hope this helps.

[Don Madge]

Brian, As always a very well written piece. If I had not been involved in an RTA in 1980 I might still have been towing a van today. 8-) Don

[Basil]

Having camped for over 45 years starting from a tent, through the caravan to motorhome back to caravan then back to motorhome, I would agree with the comments made by Brian that the main difference is, as he said the way you use them i.e. to go to somewhere to tour or to tour on the way to somewhere. We have successfully travelled to Italy and further with a large twin axle caravan in tow as well as our motorhomes, obviously on different occasions! Its 'horses for courses' and depends on how you like to see the world. However the one down side I see that I have not seen mentioned previously on this thread. There is less storage space to be had in a motorhome, that was the single most difficult problem converting to one for us we had to be ruthless at ditching that just in case thing. Never mind the motorhome payload being one for a caravanner to envy, because motorhomers tend to forget that you also have a car payload on top of the caravan one, and those two added together would really be the motorhomers envy!! Our last change was from a similar size, six metre twin axle five berth caravan to a 6.75 six berth motorhome, only two of us use it most of the time but we like our space, and we definately had more useable space in the caravan car combination. The touring around bit if you decide to stay on a site is no problem particularly if you are a Caravan Club member as you can hire a car for a very competative rate (from £23/ day, less than you spend on public transport in most cases and certainly less than tax, insurance and depreciation on a towed car) and the car hire company will pick up and deliver you to the site (not all sites in the scheme but most big ones), this is a very good option we have used more than once its just like having your own car with you. In general we like both lifestyles but as you get older it is easier to handle a motorhome despite its downsides and I doubt we would change back again. Bas

[howie]

I stand to be corrected on this Basil, but transferring exess payload from caravan to car does nothing to aleviate the 85% rule. Howard.

[michele]

We alway's think and feel that Holiday has begun as soon as we step into it. We never have in our heads we have to be there at such & such a time . Relax Chill have Tea and get there taking in all the scenery whilst getting to where ever you are going. We wouldn't change back never. But then for us with Disabled Children it has become a must. Don't have to jump out run to the caravan get inside to change a nappie. Just pull over brillliant..Same with food. Recently whilst booked onsite for two weeks we only ended up staying the week lost money but never mind. It was mind's made up let's go in the morning and on the way back stop at Hornfluer & Falaise & Ect . Much easier . speaking to the converted....

[Brian Kirby]

[QUOTE]howardtcz - 2006-09-01 4:45 PM I stand to be corrected on this Basil, but transferring exess payload from caravan to car does nothing to aleviate the 85% rule. Howard.[/QUOTE]

Correct!  Also, since many vehicles have a gross train weight below the weight of laden car + maximum caravan towable within the 85% rule, it won't help there either.  I'm also a bit surprised that Basil's combined car + caravan load allowance was, if fact, greater than for his motorhome.  Many caravans have quite restrictive payloads, as do many cars.  I think the clue here is the size of the van, which would have required a large, heavy, towcar, presumably having a large payload.

However, I think both unrealistically restrictive because they are just too big!  I wouldn't want either on the mountain roads in the Abruzzo!

[howie]

As stated before Brian, my camper has a 700kg payload. Lets be generous and say a caravan allows 300kg. So how do you fit the remaining 400 into the car. With great difficulty i,d say. Howard.

[VIP]

Thanks Brian for your very good assessment of motorhome life. I have looked at motorhomes since the 70's and have always walked away mainly because of the space given in smaller units and the inability to park if you bought a larger vehicle. I appreciate that the stability problems associated with towing is to a large extent avoided with a MH but I cannot but think that there must be some problems when driving one. My wife is fairly adamant that she could'nt adjust to losing the comfort of her 18' caravan particularly after a tiring day walking and being a tourist. I keep reminding her that the old bones become very sore after the time it takes to pitch the caravan which increases as I get older. I was staying at the CC site at Cambridge and was beseiged by a lady and her husband and they pleaded with us to give up our home get a MH and travel the world. I after listening to the pluses of a motorhome asked what the minuses were. and to my surprise she answered that it obviated the need for housework and daily chores. I said in reply that she had sold their only appreciating asset and invested in one of the most depreciating assets around. and on the subject of the rest of their capital giving a return of no more than 5% Thanks for your replies and I will probably think about the change until it is to late to take the plunge.

[Mel E]

Brian, As you yourself sadi, just to give some balance: Our Renault Master van conversion has now done 11,500 miles; total fuel divided by total miles gives 29.97 mpg. Ignore the first 4,000 miles (loosening up the engine) and it's close to 31 mpg. While you may better that with a diesel tow car, I bet you don't get anywhere near it when towing a caravan. But as you rightly say, it's how you want to use it that decides the answer. On your trip to Italy you discovered why Italians have far more motorhomes than caravans: the latter are not good for the mountains that dominate the geography of Italy. And on our recent trip to Norway, we discovered another advantage of the (smaller) motorhome: we paid only the same as cars (up to 6 metres long) on the many, (unavoidable) ferries. Cars and caravans paid 2.5 times as much. However, an increasing problem with caravans is the need to take an extra test to tow anything bigger than a titch. Anyone qualifying to drive after 01.01.1997 is effectively restricted to a maximum MAM of 3500 Kgs for tow car and caravan (this is the sum of their maximum loaded weights and NOT their actual weights). Thus anyone currently aged up to 26 has a problem even if their tow car is only, say a BMW 5 series - a 3.0D can only tow a 'van with a max allowed weight of about 1350 Kgs. Tow with a larger SUV and you're stuck with a 'van below 1000 Kgs MAM. I've towed trailer for years and I hate it - you can never be sure what is actually happening back there. As you say, Brian, each to their own.

[Geoff Bell]

And if all that wasn't enough reason your also have accomodation you can drive to your friends for that evening meal and a few drinks, assuming they have a place you can park overnight, and don't forget a convenient extra guest room if you are returning the favour.