Trenige Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Reading the article in the July MMM magazine., Technical section It is saying how important it is to fit the metal tyre valves. We already knew this, but when one of the seals in ours was leaking we realised how difficult they are to obtain. One Tyre delaer insisted that a rubber valve would suffice, but we refused to let him fit it. We have the original Fiat Alloy Wheels, we can easily obtain the metal valves for the steel wheels, but these are too short. The valves for the alloy wheels have a longer thread to accomodate the extra thickness of the alloy. We have been unable to source any so far. We have had to open up a case with fiat, as this is a safety issue, they are a Fiat part as they come fitted on the original alloy wheels. Every where we go they come back with the shorter version for the steel wheel, this will not lock on properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 There are a number of threads on this, and the metal cored rubber valves used for Transits fit the alloys. These will comfortably hold the 80psi maximum for camper tyres. I have seen a number of after market alloys fitted with car valves, and most tyre fitters don't know the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 At a push just change the valve core, they are the same, otherwise plenty on Ebay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Welcome to the Out&AboutLive forums, Trenige. I’m guessing that the valves fitted to your Fiat alloy wheels were manufactured by Schrader. A Schrader catalogue can be downloaded from here http://tinyurl.com/nwmjyhg and metal ‘clamp-in’ valves are listed on Pages 13-14. The diameter of the valve-hole in the rim is usually a nominal 11.3mm-11.5mm, but (assuming that your valves are Schrader-made) you might well need to remove one of your valves to compare it with those shown in the catalogue. An alternative suppllier is “Alligator” that markets various designs of clamp-in valve (in various lengths) as shown here http://www.alligator-ventilfabrik.de/index.php?Passenger_car_metal_valves_for_valve_hole_diameter2 As you need a valve to accommodate the extra thickness of an alloy wheel’s rim compared to a steel one, the Alligator 51303 valve looks like it could be suitable. If your existing valves prove to be Schrader-made and you are able to identify them from the Schrader catalogue and want exactly matching replacements, I suggest you try Auto4 http://www.auto4.co.uk/ who (based on Brambles’ comments here) http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Michelin-Agilis-Camping-not-tyres-again-/34767/ may be able to specially order some for you. Alternatively, the 235000 valve advertised by Auto4 http://www.auto4.co.uk/Valves-and-Valve-Hardware/Clamp-In-Valves/235000--High-Performance-Clamp-In-Tubeless-Valve-37mm-113mm-Rim-Hol--235000 may be suitable for your wheels. This has a 37mm length and a long threaded stem, and may well be an Alligator product. (As rupert123 says, this design of valve is advertised on ebay http://tinyurl.com/p6ootxu ) It is important that clamp-in valves are correctly fitted and that they are neither under- nor over-tightened when bolted in. The MMM article is a mite simplistic. Although received wisdom is that metal clamp-in valves should be fitted to motorhomes where the tyre inflation-pressures used are high, there are ‘snap-in’ valves that are specifically designed to cope with such pressures. You’ll see that Schrader offers the 65752/3/4 valve (foot of catalogue-page 11) that can tolerate up to 14bar/203psi and has been used by Ford for Transits from the Mk 7-onwards, while Alligator offers the CVV valve http://www.alligator-ventilfabrik.de/index.php?492a5c5857814 that is pressure-rated to 7bar/101psi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Time I think to update my story on tyre valves. I have fiat 14 inch steel rims ( 2003 Ducato) and originally fitted with the Schrader 65765 (-68) bolt in valves specifically for Motorhomes. These are not easy to come by and I ordered a set of 10, minimum order) via Auto4 from Schrader UK. These valves have an O ring seal. My belief I was doing the right thing ordering identical to originally fitted could hardly be flawless. How wrong I was! One leaked at the rim. When check by tyre centre and a rep form a tyre fitting Supply Company it was found the rim is slightly curved around the hole. They DO NOT seal properly and may be fine for a new wheel but clearly not right, a slightly corroded valve hole you have little chance of a proper seal. My argument with tyre fitter originally they were the correct parts is now an embarrassing thought. He was proved right. I now have Jaguar high performance valves from Pang fitted. see http://www.panguk.com/jaguar-valve-p-61.html?osCsid=rioqat61mbu281p63rkom8uts1 . These valves have a rubber shoulder type seal and is much more effective at sealing. However main point to maybe make is the comments from the Pang rep who had his van of goodies to hand fortunately at the time. He commented all wheel rims are different and have different requirements, you can establish what fits one wheel but it does not mean it will fit all wheels from the same source as rims constantly change in production and are made by different suppliers for car makers. It is very much a case of checking every rim individually when replacing the valve. Maybe the original suppliers of Fiat rims pressed a flat area on the rim for the valve but the next supply of wheels did not. What is clear is my rims should never have had the Schrader valve type fitted in the 1st place. As it did not seal properly water has penetrated the hole and caused corrosion. Clearly my comments above are not relevant to the alloy wheels in question, but shows when one thinks buying original is best then they can clearly be wrong as in my case. I was going to offer my 5 spare Schrader valves to anyone who needs to replace the same, but cannot do that knowing they do not fit right in the 1st place as I would not be doing anyone a favour at all it turns out. (any typos - blame my spelling and grammer checker!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill8888 Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 I have bought a new rim have you one valve i could purchas. regards Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted October 14, 2015 Share Posted October 14, 2015 bill8888 - 2015-10-14 4:41 PM I have bought a new rim have you one valve i could purchase. regards Bill As per ,my last post I would not be happy to sell you one as if it does not seal properly I would feel bad if you got a flat and ruined the tyre or indeed worse. I would seriously look for one like the Pang mentioned in last post as with the shoulder of rubber rather than and O ring you will get less corrosion problems around the hole over time and a better seal. If your local tyre place has a pang rep visiting then they should be able to obtain one for you. Sorry!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 When I wanted to fit a spare wheel to my 2015 Rapido I contacted Jon (Brambles) and asked if he still had any of the Schrader 65765-68 valves left and he very kindly gave me two. The situation is as I described in my 6 October 2015 9.17 AM on this Hints & Tips thread http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Hints-and-Tips/Spare-Wheel/39615/ The Schrader valves Jon bought are the correct type for X250/X290 Ducato/Boxer/Relay 15” and 16” steel rims and are normally fitted as original equipment (OE) to motorhomes with ‘camping-car’ tyres. Evidently they were also fitted as OE to Jon’s 2003 Ducato’s 14” rims. The Schrader valve uses an O-ring seal that (as Jon pointed out above) needs a flattened area around the rim’s valve-hole to seal properly. That area also needs – on its underside – to be in perfect condition. If the area is not flat (as was the case with Jon’s rim) or corroded/damaged, there’s a good chance that a leak will occur at the seal. It’s also worth noting that Schrader advises that the clamping-nut of a 65765-68 valve be torqued to 12-15Nm, whereas the nut of a valve with a stepped-shoulder type of base-seal (like the Pang valves Jon swapped to or Schrader’s TR 416-S) is normally tightened to a much lower torque setting (say 3-6Nm). It’s very likely that your average tyre-fitter will not have a torque wrench able to measure accurately settings in the 3Nm to 15Nm range, so there’s the potential that a fitter will overtighten a ‘stepped-shoulder’ valve or undertighten an O-ring valve. Significant overtightened is likely to damage the seal and undertightening is likely to result in an air-leak. One other (slightly odd) thing – the Schrader 65765-68 valve is nickel-coated and shiny, but the OE valves on my Ducato’s rims are not. During a conversation with a Schrader technician I asked about this difference and it was suggested that the SEVEL factory had deliberately chosen a cheaper finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alloywheels Posted October 19, 2015 Share Posted October 19, 2015 Hello Bill, Did you get the new valves we sent to you? Are they OK? regards, Duncan, TYRESAVE, www.tyresave.co.uk 01244 813030 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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