RHD headlight change

[yoko8pups]

Thanks for the info, does this mean that we could look for Peugeot and Citroen headlights as a cheaper alternative to Fiat if we have to change the headlights for UK MOT? We only need them for the MOT and then would go back to European ones.

[yoko8pups]

euroserv - 2016-01-25 5:41 PM

 

Tony M - 2016-01-25 10:47 AM

 

Hi all,

I know this topic has been covered before but as far as I can tell, without a definite conclusion.

The problem is that I will be collecting my new lhd Globecar from Germany next week and would like to get the replacement rhd headlights ordered. The van has the led running lights incorporated and as I only want the new lights to get through the registration process I would prefer to buy the ones with the conventional bulb as a running light. So....... Does anyone know yet if the wiring harness is the same for the different lights? I would have thought so but it would be nice to have confirmation. Incidentally the van is a Citroen but I assume the Fiat and Peugeot variants all have the same harness.

Thanks,

Tony

 

Hello.

 

I can advise you that the wiring harness is the same on all Peugeot, Citroen and Fiat vehicles of similar ages and irrespective of the type of DRL fitted. However; be aware that the headlamps of Fiat vehicles have clear lenses and there is often a darkened lower edge to the Peugeot/Citroen lamps, so they won't look the same.

 

If you substitute one type of DRL for another, for example; if you swap some LED DRL lamps for some relatively cheaper non LED lamps you will get a warning on the dash stating that there is a problem and an amber warning lamp will be illuminated. The type of headlamp fitted from build is apparently 'burned' into the body computer and CANNOT be altered. The lamps will work perfectly well though and the orange warning light should not be a problem for an MOT tester that can see that it all works as it should. The same applies if you swap LED lamps for standard ones. They will work, but the warning light will be present.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Nick

 

Thanks for the info, does this mean that we could look for Peugeot and Citroen headlights as a cheaper alternative to Fiat if we have to change the headlights for UK MOT? We only need them for the MOT and then would go back to European one

[Tony M]

Yes, that appears to be the case. I have bought new lights for my Citroen using Fiat part numbers and made a considerable saving on the Citroen dealer price. This was on the ones with the LED DRLs.

[Derek Uzzell]

Tony M - 2016-01-29 9:20 AM

 

Does that mean that third party cover is in force in U K with the export plates?

 

Yes.

[Derek Uzzell]

Tony M - 2016-01-29 12:17 PM

 

Yes, that appears to be the case. I have bought new lights for my Citroen using Fiat part numbers and made a considerable saving on the Citroen dealer price. This was on the ones with the LED DRLs.

 

It’s perhaps worth mentioning that (unless things have changed during the last year) yoko8pup’s motorhome is a 2005 Hymer C-524.

 

It should be possible to directly swap the Hymer’s right-dipping headlamps for equivalent Peugeot Boxer/Citroen Relay left-dipping headlamps, but this should not be necessary merely to pass the UK MOT test.

 

This seems to have been well covered in this March 2015 thread:

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Hymer-headlights/37755/

 

 

[yoko8pups]

Derek Uzzell - 2016-01-29 1:58 PM

 

Tony M - 2016-01-29 12:17 PM

 

Yes, that appears to be the case. I have bought new lights for my Citroen using Fiat part numbers and made a considerable saving on the Citroen dealer price. This was on the ones with the LED DRLs.

 

It’s perhaps worth mentioning that (unless things have changed during the last year) yoko8pup’s motorhome is a 2005 Hymer C-524.

 

It should be possible to directly swap the Hymer’s right-dipping headlamps for equivalent Peugeot Boxer/Citroen Relay left-dipping headlamps, but this should not be necessary merely to pass the UK MOT test.

 

This seems to have been well covered in this March 2015 thread:

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Hymer-headlights/37755/

 

 

Derek, you are right and I completely forgot that that thread could be reversed for headlights going back to UK. I can only say that this process has been so difficult I have nearly lost my sanity.

[ninesheds]

Just for info:

 

Last year I looked into importing a Hobby Vantana (Ducato panel van) from Germany and changing the headlights and speedometer for UK registration. I got some very useful info from this forum when I was investigating the options. In the end I bought a LHD with 'UK spec' from ES Hartley as I got a good price for less aggro. When I collected, I was surprised to discover the speedometer is KM only. Not an issue for me but the dealer told me it wasn't necessary to change the speedo or even put a template over it for UK registration.

[Derek Uzzell]

ES Hartley’s advice to you is incorrect.

 

For a vehicle (imported or otherwise) to be first-registered in the UK, its technical specification is required to comply with UK standarsds.

 

In the past it was commonplace for motorhome importers (private or professional) to play fast-and-loose with this requirement, which is why there are many LHD motorhomes with right-dipping headlamps and kmh-only speedometers on UK roads.

 

To combat this, by the mid-2000s the DVLA was insisting that imported LHD motorhomes be checked for technical conformity prior to UK first registation and, more recently, the procedure became more formalised.

 

This link

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/607594/apply-commission-notice-motorhomes.pdf

 

is to the application form that needs to be submitted to the VCA for an imported motorhome that is to be UK registered.

 

The speedometer-related requirements are

 

" That a speedometer has been fitted which is capable of indicating speed in both miles per hour and kilometres per hour, either simultaneously, or by operation of a switch.

Note: We can not accept secondary devices, hand written changes or multiple stickers applied to the speedometer. We can only accept the changes detailed below.

The speedometer must be marked up to the maximum speed of the vehicle, with graduations at 1, 2, 5, or 10mph, and with values at intervals not exceeding 20mph. For this change we can accept the following options.

a) That the factory fitted speedometer is dual marked as standard

b) The existing (digital) speedometer is, permanently, re-programmed, through a standard feature of the vehicle, to display the vehicle speed in mph

c) A miles per hour speedometer is fitted in-place of the factory fitted unit

d) A professional, single, miles per hour, overlay is applied directly to the speedometer face plate, not the glass front plate (the overlay must be durable and accurate, with markings visible in both day and night driving conditions).

e) A dual marked dial / facia has been added as a replacement to the factory fitted one.”

 

Just leaving the original kmh-only speedometer-dial in place is clearly not acceptable to the DVLA/VCA and ES Hartley SHOULD be fully aware that’s so. If there’s any quibbling regarding general UK ‘legal’ requirements, refer to the following link

 

http://www.motordefenceteam.co.uk/offence-guide/faulty-speedo.htm

 

The usual approach with LHD Fiat Ducato-based motorhomes is to take the “e)” option and replace the original speedometer kmh-only ‘dial’ with the appropriate Lockwood dual-scale mph/kmh equivalent. The choices are shown here

 

http://www.lockwoodinternational.co.uk/dials/mph/fiat/a-l/ducato.html

 

Replacement of the original dial is relatively straightforward as described here

 

http://www.lockwoodinternational.co.uk/media/wysiwyg/instructions/Fiat/C120_C124_Etc_Fiat_Ducato.pdf

 

As I said earlier in this thread, I would have happily accepted my LHD Rapido (purchased through Highbridge Caravan Centre) with its original right-dipping headlamps and a kmh-only speedometer, but the dealership had followed correct procedure and replaced both prior to UK registration and handover to me. The vehicle’s instrument-cluster later became problematical (as so many have) and was replaced under warrranty, though the replacement (unsurprisingly) had a kmh-only speedometer dial. (I still have the dual-scale speedometer dial, but I have chosen not to fit it.)

 

Might be worth you checking whether your Hobby has UK-norm ‘left-dipping’ headlamps. If the ES Hartley staff beleves it’s unnecessary to provide an mph speedometer dial (a fairly cheap change) they may think headlamp replacement (much more expensive) is also not needed.

[ninesheds]

Interesting - thanks for your comprehensive reply. My understanding is a speedo in km only would not be an issue for getting through an MOT? I would prefer to have it in KM as most use will be on the continent.

 

Re the headlights - I assumed they were RHD so fitted deflectors for europe but I don't think I did any night driving. Is there an easy way to tell apart from checking the direction of the dipped beam? (the van is some distance away so I can't check immediately)

 

[Derek Uzzell]

A kmh-only speedometer will not result in a an MOT-test failure, but that’s irrelevant. Regarding UK legality, your (and my) preference for a kmh-only dial also does not change the fact that your (and my) UK-registered motorhome must legally have a speedometer with an mph dial.

 

To be certain about the headlamps, you really need to check the direction of the dipped-beam.