Pension age

[lynneroy]

Well they are going to try and raise the age we can retire, eventually to mid 70 s, I am so fed up of the moving goal posts, already got to wait another 6 years to receive the state pension, even though I have maximum credits. Our young people will never get good work, and a good proportion will not be lucky enough to live long enough to receive their pension, especially if they have a stressful or very manual job.

 

:$

[Tracker]

I really do sympathise with your predicament as the increase in pension age should have been brought in years ago and given a much slower rate of increase, but successive governments lacked the bottle to grasp that hot potato untill it was too late.

Depending on whose figures are correct, in the last thirty years life expectancy at 65 has gone up by about 5 years (6 for men and 4 for women) and had the pension age gone up by similar increments - that is about 2 months per year - we would have had a much more equitable situation now so personally I think it is quite reasonable to raise the retirement age as life expectancy increases.

I don't know what life expectancy is now compared to when the state pension first began but it must be a lot higher?

In a working lifetime pretty much everyone should have the opportunity to save for their retirement and to retire earlier than state age if they choose to and fund it themselves - as I did - and the state pension was a lovely bonus when it arrived.

The trouble with any state benefit is that it is unfunded so the cost of today's pensions comes out of todays taxation and with a growing older population the cost to today's taxpayer is already high and will get much worse if nothing changes.

Is that sustainable? The government thinks not.

Way back in 1980 best advice was to save around 15% of your income for retirement and it seems that still applies but how many do?

Much easier of course for the employed whose employer can also contribute on their behalf with both parties gaining tax relief on the contributions.

Not quite so easy for the self employed who have to entirely fund their own pension but by no means impossible.

Having said all that I do fully appreciate that I was born at just the right time to get the best out of pensions and house price inflation and I do sympathise with the younger generations for whom it will not be anything like as easy as it was for my generation.

Even so many of my generation managed to go through their working life without building a personal or occupational pension, many through no fault of their own, and at least now there is enough information out there for an informed decision to be made whether to plan ahead or take a leap of faith.

No easy answers I'm afraid.

[RogerC]

Whilst it is generally accepted that one can expect to live longer what I can not understand, and this is relative to the ever increasing push back of the age when one will receive the state pension, is this:

Life expectancy is greater than years/decades ago but .....and here's the big question....one's body is still getting older, things 'wear out', mobility suffers, mental acuity drops off etc etc.  So yes life expectancy may well be on the increase but what does one do when one has to work until age 70 (or more) and one finds one's physical and/or mental abilities are on the wane?  Indeed will those affected by the ever receding into the distance pension due date be physically or indeed mentally fit enough to remain in employment for those extra years?....or is this a government drive towards 'work 'till you drop'?

Not everyone is or will be fortunate enough to have the fitness of Ranulph Finnes (71).

[laimeduck]

RogerC - 2016-03-02 11:07 PMWhilst it is generally accepted that one can expect to live longer what I can not understand, and this is relative to the ever increasing push back of the age when one will receive the state pension, is this:

Life expectancy is greater than years/decades ago but .....and here's the big question....one's body is still getting older, things 'wear out', mobility suffers, mental acuity drops off etc etc.  So yes life expectancy may well be on the increase but what does one do when one has to work until age 70 (or more) and one finds one's physical and/or mental abilities are on the wane?  Indeed will those affected by the ever receding into the distance pension due date be physically or indeed mentally fit enough to remain in employment for those extra years?....or is this a government drive towards 'work 'till you drop'?

Not everyone is or will be fortunate enough to have the fitness of Ranulph Finnes (71).

In 1973-6 I was working with Prof Danielli at New York State University & The University of Massachusetts Medical Center and one of our goals was to find the mechanism behind cell senescence - ie why we age. 

It was not to find out how make us live longer - it was to improve the quality of our lives as we live longer.

I believe that has come to pass - not necessarily through anything we did or found, but simply because living standards have improved. Living longer, in better health will be exploited by governments and probably should be in my opinion, hence the increased pension age.

I'm just very glad not to be part of it!

I am also glad not to have lived in the mid 1800's when life expectancy was about 55 and then the poor house.

[Guest pelmetman]

There's a world of difference between living longer and existing longer ;-) ........My parents worked until they were 70 8-) ...........

 

By then they were in no condition to enjoy retirement, my mum was a bag of bones from a life time of smoking and only lasted a couple of years.......the Old man was obese diabetic yet managed to survive 14 years to reach 84.............I cant say he enjoyed his retirement :-| ........

 

I've no intention of following their example ;-) ...........

 

 

[Tracker]

As a nation it is perfectly feasible to have a very generous state pension but whether the coming generations that will have to fund it will be quite so enthusistic when they get the bill is another matter.

 

What is wrong with people taking some responsibility for their own futures and making the effort and sacrifice to save now and spend later, after all a well managed pension fund is still a pretty good investment for many people?

 

 

 

[pepe63xnotuse]

Tracker - 2016-03-03 9:47 AM

 

As a nation it is perfectly feasible to have a very generous state pension but whether the coming generations that will have to fund it will be quite so enthusistic when they get the bill is another matter.

 

What is wrong with people taking some responsibility for their own futures and making the effort and sacrifice to save now and spend later, after all a well managed pension fund is still a pretty good investment for many people?

 

 

Hmm...I see that the sentiments in your first post -

 

"I really do sympathise with your predicament ..... I do fully appreciate that I was born at just the right time to get the best out of pensions and house price inflation and I do sympathise with the younger generations for whom it will not be anything like as easy as it was for my generation."

 

...didn't last long then.

[Tracker]

The trouble with selective quoting is that you can make it seem to say whatever you want it to say but if you read the whole posting you will probably notice that my sentiments have not changed at all.

 

I do sympathise with the current generation of upcoming retirees as successive governments have been disgracefully inept at dealing with the pension situation over many years. It takes time to build a decent pension fund and many people have not been given that transitional time and that is grossly unfair.

 

The point is we are where we are and grumbling aside the important thing is for people to decide now where they want to be financially in 'X' years time and how best to achieve it.

 

 

[PJay]

When I Left school,(1952) I earned £130.oo (old money) I traveled on the tube into London every day, and paid for my keep, and had money for other things

My grandchildren are leaving school/uni , and starting at £20, 000 to £30, 000 pa.

The problem with modern youth, is the have to have every thing NOW. We saved for things.

It's the same with Pensions, they should be earned, not given as a right, along with all the "other" handouts

Maybe if people to-day worked for a living, then we would not have all the immigrants coming into the country. and taking the lower paid jobs

 

I will now jump of my soap box

 

PJay

[malc d]

PJay - 2016-03-03 10:44 AM

 

 

Maybe if people to-day worked for a living, then we would not have all the immigrants coming into the country. and taking the lower paid jobs

 

I will now jump of my soap box

 

PJay

 

 

Bit harsh Pauline.

 

Sounds like your grandchildren have been lucky - a lot of graduates end up working in coffee bars or stacking shelves in supermarkets.

... and now people are being advised to put 15% of their earnings into a pension fund.

Try telling that to those on zero hours contracts.

 

Not just the EU, but globalisation is affecting employment prospects everywhere.

 

Todays situation can not be compared to " our time " - I'm just glad I'm not just starting out.

 

 

:-|

[colin]

There are a couple of issues here.

Firstly the age at when you get a state pension. My father started work at 14 he was eligible for a state pension at 65, I started work at 17 and will be eligible for a state pension at 66. So I will have worked two years less than my father before getting a state pension.

Secondly you can retire at any age you want. At 59 I could retire right now, but I enjoy my work and have cut the hours to suit me, I will probably work until I get fed up of it.

[pepe63xnotuse]

PJay - 2016-03-03 10:44 AM

 

When I Left school,(1952) I earned £130.oo (old money) I traveled on the tube into London every day, and paid for my keep, and had money for other things

My grandchildren are leaving school/uni , and starting at £20, 000 to £30, 000 pa.

The problem with modern youth, is the have to have every thing NOW. We saved for things.

It's the same with Pensions, they should be earned, not given as a right, along with all the "other" handouts

Maybe if people to-day worked for a living, then we would not have all the immigrants coming into the country. and taking the lower paid jobs

 

I will now jump of my soap box

 

PJay

 

Not only "harsh" Malc but also way out of touch...

 

PJay...What were house prices like back in 1952 ?...most graduates will be leaving uni' with debts already many many times more than a mortgage of that era would've been...

 

I guess I'm a bit younger than the average on here but even since buying my first house(early 80s), the "value"(cost) of similar "properties" in the area has gone up 12x-15x..Now I was able start "buying " mine aged 19-20 and solely on my workshop/fitters' wage ( of approx. £2:50-3:00 an hour?).

..and I know for a fact, that the lads working their now will NOT be on £36-45 per hour! (they'll be lucky to be much above minimum wage)

 

As for pensions needing to be "earned", well of cause they need to be paid for and the system paid into ...but it'll be the "modern youth" of today who will need to be paying into it longest....

..and I can't see many of them retiring in their 50s on final salary pensions either.. ;-)

 

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/more-people-70s-higher-tax-000138911.html

 

(as for "other handouts", does the like of the Winter fuel allowance or the free bus pass, need to be "earned" ? or do they just get handed out based on some arbitrary D.O.B basis?... ;-) )

 

 

 

[Guest pelmetman]

colin - 2016-03-03 12:03 PM

 

Secondly you can retire at any age you want. At 59 I could retire right now, but I enjoy my work and have cut the hours to suit me, I will probably work until I get fed up of it.

 

Ditto........I joined the semi idle classes at 46 B-) ........Retirement is a skill that needs plenty of practice :D .....

 

But doesn't need a huge pension pot either ;-) .......

 

 

[Brock]

I'm with Pauline on the graduate issue.

 

My youngest son spent his late teenage years working part time in a newsagent. He said that was enough for him to realise that was where he would end up if he didn't get his finger out. He subsequently declined my offer to pay his University course fees because he wanted to invest in his education himself. He saw his degree as a stepping stone to work, not as an end to itself. He studied hard, got a first class degree, having already been offered a job on leaving Uni, and now 5 years later, as an engineer, is earning over £50k pa. Too many children are pushed into Uni by the education system and possibly parents whereas they should be thinking about what job do I want to do and work back from that. There is an art to getting the right degree and the right job after Uni that is not taught by the schools or parents - or the children do not want to listen. It has nothing to do with luck.

 

It is annoying when the Government change the goalposts. It's even more annoying when your employer changes your pension scheme. Nevertheless, we all have to own our future and plan accordingly. The only advice I can remember my Dad giving me was to get a job with a good end pension! It's hard to work out nowadays what is a good pension.

[lynneroy]

Interesting comments, a lot of jobs are not suitable for the latter years, manual or stressful and driving jobs.

 

My husband was self employed for a lot of his working life, paid all his contributions but with 5 children we did not have sufficient funds to have large pension pots.

 

Making people work into their latter years will cause health problems for a lot, half the work force will end up on sickness benefit, the rest will not be as productive as a young workforce. Sheer madness in my mind.

 

I do not believe State pension to be a benefit, we have paid in for 40years and have to wait longer for the return. This week my council tax bill will land, in excess of £2,000 for the year for just 2 of us. All these people trying to get into Britain, I wish I was young enough to leave and start again in a fairer country.

 

How the future generation will cope I have no idea. it should be compulsory to retire at a reasonable age and give the younger generation the opportunity of good employment prospects

 

My rant over, and no I will not work that long, I think I will downsize my house, purchase a small property here in the uk and rent it out for a small income, and purchase a small home in France or Spain and enjoy my motorhome for as long as I can.

[nowtelse2do]

PJay - 2016-03-03 10:44 AM

 

When I Left school,(1952) I earned £130.oo (old money) I traveled on the tube into London every day, and paid for my keep, and had money for other things

.

The problem with modern youth, is the have to have every thing NOW. We saved for things.

 

PJay

 

Pauline, am I reading this correctly. Did you earn £130-0s-0d per week in 1952 or year? If that was per week then that was an astounding salary to start on. I started in 1960 as an apprentice mechanical fitter and my wage was £2-7s-6d per week. I remember getting a rise 4 month later of 6d an hour which bumped my wage up another £1 a week, I was over the moon.

 

I'm with you when you say they expect everything now, Yes we had to save just to get the deposit on HP when starting out..

 

Dave

 

 

[pepe63xnotuse]

nowtelse2do - 2016-03-03 5:38 PM

 

I'm with you when you say they expect everything now...

 

Dave

 

 

Well if the do, then they must've learnt that behaviour from somewhere?..so maybe we should blame the parents? (or Grand parents?) (lol)

[nowtelse2do]

Maybe pepe, but it's dead easy with a credit card now, and I sure never had one and niether did my parent. ;-) :-D

 

Dave

[PJay]

nowtelse2do - 2016-03-03 5:38 PM

 

PJay - 2016-03-03 10:44 AM

 

When I Left school,(1952) I earned £130.oo (old money) I traveled on the tube into London every day, and paid for my keep, and had money for other things

.

The problem with modern youth, is the have to have every thing NOW. We saved for things.

 

PJay

 

Pauline, am I reading this correctly. Did you earn £130-0s-0d per week in 1952 or year? If that was per week then that was an astounding salary to start on. I started in 1960 as an apprentice mechanical fitter and my wage was £2-7s-6d per week. I remember getting a rise 4 month later of 6d an hour which bumped my wage up another £1 a week, I was over the moon.

 

I'm with you when you say they expect everything now, Yes we had to save just to get the deposit on HP when starting out..

 

Dave

 

 

Dave, I meant per year !!

When we bought our first house,(1959) my Oh was earning £14.00 per week, and the mortgage was £14.00 per month, that was in north london. Those where the days!! Had to sell our Norton Dominator motor bike for the deposit, and sat on deck chairs to start with. Now they have 50 inch TV's.and all mod cons. Think we where better off really, as we did not expect to much Our goal was to earn £500 PA, then £1000.00 ,

PJay

[RogerC]

Tracker - 2016-03-03 9:47 AMAs a nation it is perfectly feasible to have a very generous state pension but whether the coming generations that will have to fund it will be quite so enthusistic when they get the bill is another matter.What is wrong with people taking some responsibility for their own futures and making the effort and sacrifice to save now and spend later, after all a well managed pension fund is still a pretty good investment for many people?

Good investment?  Sorry to burst your bubble tracker.  Good old Gordon Brown, when Chancellor, ruined the private pension schemes with his £5 Billion raid on funds back in 1997 which over the years has morphed into £10 Billion each and every year to date.  My good lady retired last year from a position delivering the 'national average wage'.  She was fortunate enough to be in line to make use of the 'draw down' rules recently introduced.  Had she not been her pension pot built up over approximately 25 years and comprising employee/employer and additional opt out contributions would have delivered such a small pension it was laughable.  So as my good lady meets the 'national average' in terms of lifetime salaries we can see that for the 'majority' there really is nothing out there which would impact in any noticeable way on their retirement income.

[starvin marvin]

pelmetman - 2016-03-03 7:57 AM

 

There's a world of difference between living longer and existing longer ;-) ........My parents worked until they were 70 8-) ...........

 

By then they were in no condition to enjoy retirement, my mum was a bag of bones from a life time of smoking and only lasted a couple of years.......the Old man was obese diabetic yet managed to survive 14 years to reach 84.............I cant say he enjoyed his retirement :-| ........

 

I've no intention of following their example ;-) ...........

 

 

If you really don't want to end the same way as your parents and I guess you don't smoke I suggest you keep off the pies and booze. Always easier said than done and I speak as so one who battles with their weight. Just about keeping it under control at the moment by running.

[Dave225]

I think one should look at this objectively. All that has happened is that the date you will get any miserable payout from HMG has moved. This has nothing to do with your retirement date. If anyone thinks that the State Pension alone will give them a comfortable retirement then they really need to wake up and smell the coffee. £159 a week is not going to do anything more than keep the lights on if you are lucky, certainly motorhoming will be out of reach. So, you need to plan your retirement date regardless of what the Government comes up with. How you do this is up to you but plan ahead and choose your occupation carefully. If you work the public sector you are, at least at the moment, guaranteed a final salary pension which in the private sector is impossble. 40 years and you retire on 2/3 rds of your final salary, which even if relatively small is still a good deal. Better still it is guranteed by the taxpayer so no worries about the Fund collapsing. If you are in the private sector then you really need to do homework and try to achieve enought o keep you in the style you hope for.

 

However, in either case this is all irrelevant to the State pension, so do not blame the Government, do your own thing. Your date of retirement is in your own hands.

[Pampam]

Hiya lynnroy i too have to wait another six years till i receive my state pension, its pretty galling but have decided im not working until 66 , because ive quite frankly had enough! So ive reduced my hours to two days a week and this summer ill quit altogether :) i shall just be poorer , but havent got the motorhome any more just an old caravan which doesnt cost as much to run , ive worked all my life and also brought up four children , i havent been well educated or had a salary , just the everyday run of the mill jobs : however i do have a tiny pension with bhs £14 per month , and when i have tried to cash it in for a lump sum i was told i cant because bhs pension is in deficit (so arent i thankfull i didnt put more into it)! So i suppose even company pensions are a minefield? I think they are trying to make me wait until may when the government will take over and they are supposed to pay out (believe it when i see it its apparently £2800) cheers a poor but more relaxed pampam :/ whose gonna give the old bunions a rest lol

[Guest pelmetman]

starvin marvin - 2016-03-10 7:34 PM

 

pelmetman - 2016-03-03 7:57 AM

 

There's a world of difference between living longer and existing longer ;-) ........My parents worked until they were 70 8-) ...........

 

By then they were in no condition to enjoy retirement, my mum was a bag of bones from a life time of smoking and only lasted a couple of years.......the Old man was obese diabetic yet managed to survive 14 years to reach 84.............I cant say he enjoyed his retirement :-| ........

 

I've no intention of following their example ;-) ...........

 

 

If you really don't want to end the same way as your parents and I guess you don't smoke I suggest you keep off the pies and booze. Always easier said than done and I speak as so one who battles with their weight. Just about keeping it under control at the moment by running.

 

I do a hundred yard dash every morning ;-) ........

 

Perks of having a pitch furthest from the entrance and a dog I dare not let dawdle or else I'll get a puddle on site :D .......Or worse 8-) .....

 

 

[Guest pelmetman]

Dave225 - 2016-03-16 10:01 PM

 

I think one should look at this objectively. All that has happened is that the date you will get any miserable payout from HMG has moved. This has nothing to do with your retirement date. If anyone thinks that the State Pension alone will give them a comfortable retirement then they really need to wake up and smell the coffee. £159 a week is not going to do anything more than keep the lights on if you are lucky, certainly motorhoming will be out of reach. .

 

Motorhoming is not expensive.......keeping up with the Jones's is expensive :D ...........

 

As running a camper need be no more expensive than a secondhand car ;-) .........

 

BUT if your motorhoming habits include changing to the latest whiz bang model every few years then yes it would be impossible on the state pension............