Scooter racks

[Baz]

I was wondering if anyone out there has got any experience with a motor home fitted with a scooter rack?

I am intending to fit one and carry a Honda Innova 125cc scooter.

 

I have weighed my van, weighed the rack and have got the weight of the bike out of the Honda manual. More than enough carrying capacity in the van to take the bike, rack, plus associated equipment (jackets, helmets, boots, etc).

 

So at the moment cannot see a downside to it !

 

Any views would be appreciated.

 

Baz (lol)

[Clive]

The weight of the bike, rack etc will be significantly behind the rear axle so will have a cantilever effect causing much more weight on the rear axle than the additional weight you are carrying. Many coach builts have rear overhangs of 60% of the wheel base to start with. In these situations you should either do the "force multiplied by distance calculations" or use the rule of thumb and double the weight of the bike and rack when working out the increased rear axle loading.

Don't believe the published weight figures. Put your normal clutter in the motorhome including the extra gas bottle, tins of food, fill up the tanks and visit a weigh bridge first. Weigh the axles individually. Then you know where your starting point is.

 

Weigh twice and swear once.

 

Calculate first - then look at a small trailer may be?

 

 

 

 

[Brian Kirby]

Barry

In addition to Clive's advice, and although it seems you may already have the rack, have you checked that you can actually mount it?  There are a few 'vans for which, due to the configuration of the rear chassis extension, the manufacturers state that scooter/motorbike racks must not be mounted.  Check before you buy?

[Clive]

Totally agree,

I also did things in the wrong order. We had the chassis extended before the motorhome body was fitted, no problems there. Rack was perfect. But the weighbridge bit was some 7 years later. No problem though but we now tow a trailer for the motorbikes as it was pushing our luck being nearly half a tonne over on the back!.

The Handling of the Merc was always good as we had additional springs on the back from new.

 

 

 

 

[Baz]

Thanks guys, thats some really helpful stuff.

 

Although I have already been to a weighbridge and weighed the total van I think the next step will be to weigh it an axle at a time.

 

If everything is still ok with the rough calculations then I think I will have to bite the bullet and fit the rack, push the bike on and weigh it all again.

I would rather be safe than sorry.

 

If it is just on the limit then I will take your advice and think about a trailer. This is something I didn't really want to do as having been a "tugger" for more years than I want to think about, I wanted to get away from the inconvenience of having something following on behind all the time.

 

On the other side of the coin though, has anybody got any positive thoughts on the idea of the convenience of having a scooter whilst on site.

I thought that it might be handy for the occassional jaunt to the shops or even sightseeing, providing of course the weather is fine. My days of riding motorbikes in bad weather have long gone as has my hair and a few other things beside.

 

Baz (lol)

[Clive]

Hi Barry,

We too were bikers in a previous existance doing mostly trials with a chair. I was banned by her indoors many years ago because I would have killed myself. But since our pedestrian mobility has decreased with the passing of time the attractions of powered bikes has grown. The lightest steeds (we always have one each, she won,t ride pillion behind me any more!) we ever had were Yamaha QT50 mopeds. Very light, shaft drive two strokes, but with limited gradient performance. No good for mountains. Everytime we came to a hill we had to think carefully "will it come back up again". But they never failed.

We have graduated now to some Monkey bikes and have had a few, three were stollen from our locked shed in July so now we have new ones again.

These have gears, hers 4 and mine 5. Hers also has an electric start as she cannot kick with any gusto with her bionic hip. I have a Honda APE which is much tuned up and she has something nearly as powerfull.

Both keep up well with traffic, not that there is much of this in the mountains of France.

Our next motorhome will have a large rear garage and a lot of spare weight capacity as we both have sufficient licenses to cover this.

All we need to do now is sell the house and down size to raise the cash!

If I were allowed it would be a 500cc trail bike.

 

Bikes are freedom and fun - but not when its cold and wet.

 

Dont dream the ride, ride the dream!

 

C.

 

http://www.motts.dsl.pipex.com/Motorcycles.htm

 

 

 

[tonyishuk]

Many not seem as silly as it sounds, but if you already have a towbar on the M/home. Fully load it up with EVERTHING. Take a couple of heavy friends to stand on the towbar on the back when you are on the weighbridge. 90kg is approx 14 stone. So 2 heavy friends = Scooter and rack ?

 

Cheap way to get an answer ( Might cost a couple of pints of beer, and they could dine out on the story fr a few weeks)

 

Rgds

 

 

 

 

 

*-) *-) *-) *-)

[RonB]

Clive

 

I noted your yearning for a large rear garage model next time round.

 

Should your thoughts stray towards a Burstner 747/748, which has loads of garage and storage space, and apparent loads of spare payload, do check out the front, yes front, axle weight. Our previous 747 came with little payload left on the front end, even though we were only two-up and the rear garage was overloaded. Strange, but at the same time we had close on 400kg spare TOTAL payload available? With the front end near the limit and the garage overloaded (not the axle I hasten to add) how we were supposed to use this spare payload is anyones guess.

 

To reinforce the point it should be noted that Burstner fit special heavy duty springs, not Fiat, to the front end, or on ours they did. I believe that this also extends to other models in their range.

 

AS you know, you can never be too careful over payload.

[Baz]

Hi Clive

Thanks for the thoughts, I must admit that I have never thought about anything as small as a monkey bike. I have always had large gutsy bikes but, like you, her indoors reckoned that I was getting a bit too old for such things and that the probability of death from such antics was getting a bit too close for comfort.

I know that a 125 is not the same as a Z1 or Fireblade, but after 18 months without, anything is better than nothing and I suppose one does have to make some concessions to old age!

I suppose another thought is that if I opt for a trailer then I could always go for something like a Heritage Softail or similar. Yes I know the handling is absolute rubbish, but they do sound nice and who minds about going slow around bends in the bright sunshine when you're admiring the scenery.

Who am I trying to kid!!

 

Baz (lol)

[Baz]

Tony

Thanks for the idea, I suppose it would be cheaper and quicker than putting a rack and bike on only to find that it was too much overweight.

I think I'll book it in for a weigh and grab a couple of guys out of the yard to stand on the back.

Let you know in due course what happens

 

Baz (lol)

[Clive]

Yes,

There is just something about a Harley! Old technology, crap handling but nostalgia a poseability by the bucket load. Just think of the wig one could wear to go with a Harley!

But far too heavy and cumbersome for our cross country expeditions.

 

One BIG down side with a trailer is that a 2 metre trailer costs nearly as much as a 6 metre MH on the ferry. Why?

 

We were looking at a MH based on the new 6 tonne 3 litre common rail chain cam twin rear wheel drive Iveco. Or of course the new Sprinter in high payload guise.

A trip to Dussledorf in 2007 is planned.

C.

 

 

[mtdloft]

Forgive me if this has been posted elsewhere, I haven't checked the whole thread.

 

Assuming the chassis IS strong enough for such a rack then calculate new axle loads thus:

 

In the equation below:

 

M = Mass of rack and bike together

Fn = New front axle weight

Fc = Current front axle weight

Rn = New rear axle weight

Fc = Current rear axle weight

Oh = Over hang (distance from rear axle to centre of bike)

Wb = Wheel base

 

Measurements in Kg and metres

 

Fn = Fc - [M x Oh / Wb]

Rn = Rc + [(Oh+Wb) / Wb x M]

 

Eg (taking roundish figures for a partially loaded 4.600kg van) with a bike and rack weighing 160kg mounted 2metres behind the axle & Wheelbase of 4m

 

New front axle load = 1,400kg - [160kg x 2 / 4] = 1,320kg

New rear axle load = 2,300kg + [(2 + 4)/4 x 160] = 2,540kg

 

I'm in the process of choosing my new van and will be interested to see if this formula is born out in practice after I've fitted the bike rack!

 

Happy Camping

 

[terry1956]

Hi there, you have not stated what motorhome you have. I have done all the sums for fitting a scooter rack on my hymer 544. I have a little air cooled 100cc think, thats an auto which is as powerful as a wet paper bag, anyway it weighs in at 100kg. I have taken the hymer to the weighbridge and did each axle, and the total weight with full tanks and dogs and herself and bits and bobs.

Anyway have lots of spare weigh to play with. I have the rack that fits to the towbar, which I was going to make, When I said to myself, why do I need a towbar, will never tow anything, so I made a scooter rack using box section alloy arms, using the pre drilled holes in the chassis as fixing points, and using the ramp from my motorbike trailer to carry the scooter. result nice and light, strong, uses the van chassis to take the weight and the chassis extension just to stop swing. the total all in weight off the motorhome just over 112kg, on the motorhome (only a small overhang on the hymer) 140kg in total. This is a dry weight.

This still leaves me better off by far then using the towbat type rack.

I towed a motorbike trailer behind on my 1st camper, the cost of ferrie crossings,etc soon added up, and I always had to plan where to stop, was a total pain after 4 weeks.

terry

[peterw]

Hi Baz

Read your question in last months mag:I have a hymer C494 and carry a honda 90 cub on the back, what a great way of solving the problem of shopping beach trips ect!

My van is based on a ducato 10 (1998)with a waste water tank across the back .what I did was to make a frame to attach to the spring hanger mtgs that dropped down to clear the water tank by 3/4"and come up clear of the bumper and go across to meet the other bracket at the top of the number plate . It looks like a towbar but it isn't classed as oneas it has no hitch . I then got a Dave Cooper( ads in MMM £75) junior motorbike rack welded some brackets to it to suit my own mountings and the honda lifts(back wheel first onto a plastic caravan step then into the rack) then front wheel (this is held at an angle of around 20 deg so the handlebars clear the van) the footrest drops on the top bar and is fastned down with a couple of ratchet straps!.If you would like any photos of the rack...ect just give me an e-mail .

ps the dave cooper racks do fit onto the standard tow ball mtg hole centers I prefer this rack as the PWS rack stands out too far from the back of the van and is also £600

Peterw :-) :-) :-)

[Baz]

In reply to Terry and Peterw I have done virtually something similar to what the pair of you have done.

Namely I have designed a scooter rack to take the place of a tow bar, rather than having a rack which fits to a tow bar.

I drew up some plans, put it together using odd bits of metal and wood, just to check that everything would work and fit and then got a local engineering firm to make it for me, as well as confirming with them that it would be strong and stable enough to do what I wanted.

The local firm in question do a lot of the metal work fittings (steps, racks, ramps etc) for all the Emergency Service vehicles in the County, so I reckon they know what it is all about.

At an extra cost of £100 I had the whole lot powder coated and ended up with a very nice, light scooter rack which bolts onto the main chassis at 8 different places.

I have had the bike on and off it a couple of times, just to check that side of things, with the big test at the weekend when I'm going to take it for its "maiden flight", with the wife watching it very closely out of the rear window.

Will let you know how that goes once it has happened.

Also hoping next week to be able to give you some facts and figures on weights and distribution.

(lol)