Truma water dump valve

[marksrv6]

At the risk of sparking up whole new argument (pardon the pun), and this has strayed quite a bit from my original question, if you are laying up your motorhome for the winter, why not just disconnect the battery!

 

I use my motorhome all winter so this does not apply to me, but if I was going to put it in storage all winter I would take the leisure battery home and put it somewhere at room temperature for the winter.

[aandncaravan]

Yes just saw the 'survey' post, which should be interesting.

My point above about closing drain valves was all types across the industry, not just Truma, including Caravan practise. But if that practise was applied to the Truma, etc. Hence my referring to the 'general practice'.

 

Putting the Drain valve back to it's pre drain position is what we have always done with our Caravans since the very first Carver boiler with it's 'screw plug'. Always put it back in after drain down. Don't know any one who left it out over Winter.

Carried on this practise when the 'yellow lever' drain became standard, for the reasons stated.

 

 

 

[pepe63xnotuse]

We only had ours "dump" on-route on one occasion.

I never had much success using a peg, nor with "tying" our valve up/closed..it always still seemed to weep , which would cause the pump to re-pressurize the system, when pitched/parked up...and I wasn't one for running the heater(ing), just to keep water in the system.

 

(.. I wouldn't expect to have to heat up my sink and/or it's plug, just to keep water in it! (lol) )

 

Luckily I had some "R" clips that fit around the stem/plunger (as per Derek's "jammed" photo)...and it made for a neat and "precise" way of retaining it.

 

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=R+clip&qpvt=R+clip&qpvt=R+clip&qpvt=R+clip&FORM=IGRE

[aandncaravan]

Never seen an R Clip used before, what a brilliant simple idea. Do you know what size you use?

 

 

 

 

 

[marksrv6]

Not sure about the picture above with the white plastic device or an R clip, I would think they would both damage the rubber seal that is in the slot used for both methods! (!)

[pepe63xnotuse]

aandncaravan - 2016-12-06 2:29 PM

 

Never seen an R Clip used before, what a brilliant simple idea. Do you know what size you use?

 

 

Hi.. Sorry Alan, not off hand (and the clip would've probably gone with the last van).

 

Hi Mark- I don't recall there being any rubber seal in the groove on the valve our van had? :-S

 

On ours, as the groove aligned exactly with the top of the valve body, I had always just assumed that latching the valve in such a way(R clip/circlip/wire tie etc) was it's intended use ?....

 

 

[marksrv6]

pepe63 - 2016-12-06 4:29 PM

 

 

 

Hi Mark- I don't recall there being any rubber seal in the groove on the valve our van had? :-S

 

On ours, as the groove aligned exactly with the top of the valve body, I had always just assumed that latching the valve in such a way(R clip/circlip/wire tie etc) was it's intended use ?....

 

 

Mine has a rubber seal in the groove, that as you say would be ideal for the R clip, not sure what the seal is for because the seal is exposed (not doing anything) when full of water, and in its sealed position when there is no water in the system. the only thing I can think it might be doing is stoping water coming up through the switch plunger thing when the heater is draining down. I am sure someone will know.

[pepe63xnotuse]

marksrv6 - 2016-12-06 4:55 PM

 

pepe63 - 2016-12-06 4:29 PM

 

 

 

Hi Mark- I don't recall there being any rubber seal in the groove on the valve our van had? :-S

 

On ours, as the groove aligned exactly with the top of the valve body, I had always just assumed that latching the valve in such a way(R clip/circlip/wire tie etc) was it's intended use ?....

 

 

Mine has a rubber seal in the groove, that as you say would be ideal for the R clip, not sure what the seal is for because the seal is exposed (not doing anything) when full of water, and in its sealed position when there is no water in the system. the only thing I can think it might be doing is stoping water coming up through the switch plunger thing when the heater is draining down. I am sure someone will know.

 

Oh...so maybe mine was missing a seal/O ring then? :-S

( ...maybe some meddlin' previous owner had ripped it out with an R clip? (lol) )

..either that or I just didn't notice it?.....

[Derek Uzzell]

On a Truma Elasi safety/drain valve there will normally be no rubber ‘seal’ of any sort between the bottom of the red knob and the top of the valve’s body. (Think about it - the valve’s water seals are inside its body, so what useful purpose would an exterior seal on the ‘plunger-shaft’ have?)

 

I suspect that, on Mark’s Rapido, someone has slid a rubber O-ring over the plunger-shaft in order to hold the valve in its closed position and/or to minimise the likelihood of a piece of slotted ‘jamming’ material (eg. the white plastic thingie in the photo) coming loose. (When I used to use a piece of slotted aluminium to hold the valve closed, I stuck a bit of double-sided tap on the underside of the aluminium to prevent it moving.)

[pepe63xnotuse]

Derek Uzzell - 2016-12-06 6:45 PM

 

(Think about it - the valve’s water seals are inside its body, so what useful purpose would an exterior seal on the ‘plunger-shaft’ have?)

 

Yes, I agree

(but I was just trying to be "diplomatic" as to the existence, or not, of said seal (lol) )

[marksrv6]

Here is a picture of the seal, why its there I don't know, if its not meant to be there what would be the point of the groove around the switch? but I accept the seal is probably not an original part of the switch because I can't see a function for it.

[Derek Uzzell]

Mark

 

I can’t offer a credible explanation why the red knob on a Truma Elasi safety/drain valve has a groove below its base. The groove definitely will not be there to permit something to be slid into it to hold the valve closed and it may well have no ‘operational’ purpose whatsoever.

 

As I said earlier there’s normally nothing in the groove - if there were it would not be practicable to slide a bit of slotted metal/plastic or an R-clip into it to hold the valve closed. As plenty of people use that ploy and nobody (before you) has mentioned there being anything obstructive in the groove, it’s reasonable to assume that at some stage somebody has added the rubber ring to your Rapido’s drain-valve.

 

There are plenty of on-line images of this valve and I’ve attached one that shows the red knob in its raised position. It should be apparent from this that the groove is ‘empty’.

 

Jus for the record, besides the ‘red knob’ Elasi drain valve and the latest FrostControl valve, there is a completely different type that was used with the original Trumatic C-3400 and C-6000 heaters. (Photo attached.)

[marksrv6]

Thanks for every bodies help on this subject.

 

Mark

[pepe63xnotuse]

Sorry to bump this back up..

 

But, having just read, and posted on, yet another dump valve thread, I just wondered out of interest, how often frozen/damaged boilers occur in "manual" drain valve equipped vans?

 

I assume it must happen..maybe?(because it can?) but it's just that I can't recall ever reading of anyone asking for advice about it... :-S

[Derek Uzzell]

You might be better asking on caravan forums as their water-boilers will have manual drain valves.

 

I remember Peter Leivers (then Truma(UK)’s Service and Training Manager) telling me that boiler freezing was far from rare, particularly with “Therme” heaters that were very vulnerable to frost-damage.

 

This may entertain

 

http://www.smallmotorhome.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?19129-How-to-defeat-the-Pesky-Truma-Frost-Control-JG-that-dumps-all-your-water

[OxfordMorgan]

I used to do this on my system, and it was in at Truma to have a modification and the engineer was horrified.

 

His reasoning seemed logical:

 

"" To replace the unit will cost £2000 just for the Unit, that doesn't include labour.

 

If you're in the Van and don't want it to dump, then leave the water (or heating) on Low. This will use only a tiny amount of Gas (Or electric)

 

If you're not in the Van, then best to drain it anyway..this only takes a couple of moments

 

It's simply not worth the risk ""

 

M

[aandncaravan]

OxfordMorgan, I would not argue with the engineers logic, but at the same time there are millions of Motorhome/Caravan owners who ONLY have the option of managing their Water Drain manually.

 

They have been doing this since the first Carver Water Boilers of many years ago. As far as I can tell, mostly successfully.

While we have seen Boilers corroded through, never heard of one damaged from Frost when managed correctly.

 

 

While fixing issues with a Superbrig Arsilicii Charging/power system today, we also fitted one of our new Cotter/Hair pins to replace the owners Bulldog clip which kept slipping off the Truma Frost Protection valve.

Our new pin works a treat as it locks itself in place holding the Truma Frost protection valve closed, unlike the Plastic U pieces which can slide out.

 

Locks the Drain valve up without any leaks and easy to use.

 

These are free to anyone who has any work done by us, just ask for one when we are doing any other work. Much better than the pegs we used to hand out before we cut the 12v power prior to working on the charger/Power distribution system.

 

Even if you rely on the valves automatic operation for most of the time and just lock it up occasionally, like when changing the batteries, the clip is so effective it is worth having.

 

 

 

 

[pepe63xnotuse]

You're welcome Allan... :-D

[aandncaravan]

You are right I should have given you the credit for the idea. I did say above I thought it was a good one though?

 

.

 

 

 

[marksrv6]

aandncaravan - 2016-12-21 10:47 PM

 

 

 

 

While fixing issues with a Superbrig Arsilicii Charging/power system today, we also fitted one of our new Cotter/Hair pins to replace the owners Bulldog clip which kept slipping off the Truma Frost Protection valve.

Our new pin works a treat as it locks itself in place holding the Truma Frost protection valve closed, unlike the Plastic U pieces which can slide out.

 

 

Do you know the size you are using?

[aandncaravan]

We use a 55mm x 2mm thick R clip.

 

3mm thick is ok, but has a very strong 'spring' effect so harder to slide into place.

 

Smaller lengths also work, but more fiddly to fit.

Longer lengths are easier to handle but quite bulky. Tend to have a larger than ideal 'round' section that goes around the shaft.

 

48 - 60 length by 2mm thick is easiest to handle without taking up too much space.

 

Because the environment is quite 'dry' galvanised finish is adequate without the need for Stainless.

 

Try :

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/R-Clips-Bright-Zinc-Plated-Retaining-Pins-/251636487572?var=&hash=item3a96b41594:m:mGPsjVYOyoPKiznYCi5o_Jw

£1.18 for 2.

 

A piece of Cord cable tied tightly around one end and looped around one of the Water Pipes should stop it going astray?

 

The Hymer owner today having a new EBL 99 fitted, looked at the R Clip, then asked if I had any shrink fit Insulation. When I gave him some, he slid a 2" tube of it onto the R clip then disappeared.

4 mins later he brought the R Clip back with the R clip in a more 'grippy' Red with the shrunk fit (presumably over the Hob?) insulation where it grips the Truma valve. I thought it made it harder to fit, but he was pleased. He thought it added 'bulk' to the clip and would be more visible.

 

[pepe63xnotuse]

aandncaravan - 2016-12-22 4:48 PM

 

We use a 55mm x 2mm thick R clip.

 

3mm thick is ok, but has a very strong 'spring' effect so harder to slide into place.

 

 

A piece of Cord cable tied tightly around one end and looped around one of the Water Pipes should stop it going astray?

 

.

 

Yes, I think the one I used would've been 3mm but as you say Allan, it was a bit on the strong side initially...but I did take a bit of the "umph" off by tweaking it open a little in the vice..

 

Same as you with the cord, looping it around a suitable pipe stopped it from disappearing. :-D