Winter Heater While on the Drive

[aandncaravan]

Some Dealers have MH's on the forecourt all winter without EHU, yet don't have an issue with damp. Nor do they remove the cushions.

Never been inside one and seen any condensation.

 

But then again, I have never seen a MH on a forecourt in Winter with the Blinds drawn, which remember if drawn over the roof skylights, will effectively 'seal' most types stopping ventilation.

The Blinds are the key, IMO, to reducing condensation.

 

If you let in the Sun during the Winter days to warm up the Interior, the Warm air will then absorb all the moisture in the van, rise up and go out through roof vents.

Dry cold air will be drawn in ready for the next sunny day. You only need a few sunny days through a Winter to ventilate and dry a van.

Especially effective if it is a really cold sunny day, like today was. Even on a really Cold Sunny day the temperature rise inside a MH is quite noticeable compared to the outside.

 

We have seen several vans brought to us for work in the past few weeks with all the blinds drawn, because, 'That is how we store it'.

If you heat a van with no ventilation because of drawn blinds, I think that might be the worst combination?

 

 

Different story when we get to March as the Bleaching effect of the Sun is stronger so you need to shield the cushions from the Sun until October.

We leave our cushions in the van all year, just turn them upside down and move them forward to allow air movement at the backs.

 

 

This July we had an issue with Bluebottle flys in the van when we collected it from the Farm where it is stored. At first we thought we had left some food, etc. inside the vehicle from the trip at the end of May. Then we found out everyone on site had the same issue, following an incident at the Farm the month before (don't ask).

So now we draw across the Flyscreen (but blind open) on the Heiki which we had never done before.

No further issues the rest of the year, even though it was clear there was still an issue at the Farm!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[AndyDakota]

Dear All, Thanks once again for all your time, experiences and advice.

It would appear we all have different opinions, and I can see that they all have their merits.

While some remove all fabrics i.e. mattress, cushions, etc, some leave them in, some believe in providing some minimal heat (as stated if you have a garage or storage area, too much heat can cure some problems but can cause other problems with condensation) and some believe in leaving it cold as long as the vents are left open.

Our MH is only two years old this year, and our only experience in this area is from having a caravan (please excuse my bad language). We had it from new, and selling at five years old it had a damp issue, which thankfully was covered by the warranty. A side panel had to be changed due to a badly fitted awning rail on the far side which was letting in water. Although we hardly ever used them we had mildew dots on every fly net (which were cream in colour), of course this didn't look very nice and would have put me off buying a five year old van.

Obviously we want to avoid this happening again in our pride and joy, hence my query in the first place.

I hope this has been useful to others as it has been for us, and we will seek advice off you again.

Happy travels and remember "Keep Calm and Wave to other Motorhomers but Only if its SAFE".

[Guest machra]

Anyone had any luck using something like this solar air heater. http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/david-dodge/solar-air-heater_b_6249742.html

 

I know it won't heat the van at night but during a sunny winter day would maybe heat the van up enough to get rid of any damp.

[aandncaravan]

machra - 2017-01-22 12:10 AM

 

Anyone had any luck using something like this solar air heater. http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/david-dodge/solar-air-heater_b_6249742.html

 

I know it won't heat the van at night but during a sunny winter day would maybe heat the van up enough to get rid of any damp.

 

 

Machra, that is genius using end to end Coke cans with the bottoms cut out to create 'tubes' for the heat exchanger The Aluminium they are made of is very thermally efficient.

When painted black they would really pick up the heat from the Sun in that Glass box.

 

 

I can see the value when mounted firmly against a wall of the garage, but how would you fix it securely near/to a MH?

Also how would you duct the heat into the vehicle? Surely you wouldn't want to cut big holes for the Air to be blown in?

 

If the windscreen faced the Sun, you could free stand the box inside the vehicle on the Dash using 'Tumble Dryer' style ducting feeding the air to the habitation area via a 6" Computer fan driven by a small Solar panel?

 

 

 

Andy, If a Caravan or Motorhome has Water Ingress it will raise the humidity level inside the vehicle causing significant mould issues, even if condensation wasn't a problem.

Even a dehumidifier is going to be working hard in those circumstances.

 

Isn't the best option to address the cause, not the symptom?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Rayjsj]

aandncaravan - 2017-01-21 9:20 PM

 

Some Dealers have MH's on the forecourt all winter without EHU, yet don't have an issue with damp. Nor do they remove the cushions.

Never been inside one and seen any condensation.

 

But then again, I have never seen a MH on a forecourt in Winter with the Blinds drawn, which remember if drawn over the roof skylights, will effectively 'seal' most types stopping ventilation.

The Blinds are the key, IMO, to reducing condensation.

 

If you let in the Sun during the Winter days to warm up the Interior, the Warm air will then absorb all the moisture in the van, rise up and go out through roof vents.

Dry cold air will be drawn in ready for the next sunny day. You only need a few sunny days through a Winter to ventilate and dry a van.

Especially effective if it is a really cold sunny day, like today was. Even on a really Cold Sunny day the temperature rise inside a MH is quite noticeable compared to the outside.

 

We have seen several vans brought to us for work in the past few weeks with all the blinds drawn, because, 'That is how we store it'.

If you heat a van with no ventilation because of drawn blinds, I think that might be the worst combination?

 

 

Different story when we get to March as the Bleaching effect of the Sun is stronger so you need to shield the cushions from the Sun until October.

We leave our cushions in the van all year, just turn them upside down and move them forward to allow air movement at the backs.

 

 

This July we had an issue with Bluebottle flys in the van when we collected it from the Farm where it is stored. At first we thought we had left some food, etc. inside the vehicle from the trip at the end of May. Then we found out everyone on site had the same issue, following an incident at the Farm the month before (don't ask).

So now we draw across the Flyscreen (but blind open) on the Heiki which we had never done before.

No further issues the rest of the year, even though it was clear there was still an issue at the Farm!!!

 

 

 

 

 

I used to store a touring caravan unheated, no ehu, after 4 months storage whole of the interior had a coating of light mould, several cushions had heavier mould spore marks which never came out. Whatever the cause, i wouldnt chance it again, i always keep a background heat on in my motorhomes, the cost of electricity is less than replacing interior furnishings.

[AndyDakota]

aandncaravan,

I totally agree regarding addressing the cause but we weren't aware of the problem until we had the annual service done. They picked up damp with their meter inside in the middle of the caravan at ground level under a seat. On further investigation they discovered that there was hardly any sealant behind the awning rail and the water had been seeping in over time which eventually was detected during the service. Totally clear of any damp the year before. I actually thought the service people were trying to con my as we had towels, pillows and other fabric items stored under the seat where the reading was found. There was no damp or mildew on anything, so it was a total shock to us. Just glad it was found while the warranty was still valid.

 

On the subject of the home made solar panel, this may work for us as the MH is facing South on the drive, so a custom made solar panel to fit on the dashboard maybe a solution to the problem.

Problem is I don't know if we will ever have a problem, we don't have a problem at the moment but after the experience with the caravan we would prefer to avoid it rather than solving it should it happen, if you know what I mean. Just trying to keep one step ahead I suppose.

[Guest machra]

I also don’t seem to have a problem at the moment as like a few of you on this thread I have never heated up the van over winter. I prefer to remove the soft furnishings into the spare bedroom in the house. The rest can look after itself. I have had a few rusting screws on things like the oven before but nothing serious.

I did try a dehumidifier once (refrigerant model I was given by a friend) but they cease to work at low temperatures, unless you get one of the desiccant types. This draws moist air over a slowly revolving wheel which holds desiccant material. There is another bonus as well as working in cold conditions and that is that a heater heats up a portion of the wheel not being used to dry the air and so the whole unit also acts a heater. Downside is that they consume more power. I did some research on the whole thing of keeping a vehicle dry in winter as I used to have a Harley Davidson in the garage over winter. In the end I covered the bike loosely under a frame and put an 80w tube heater under it, BUT then we were only taking about a bike under a small frame. As a result I didn’t get any further on the desiccant dehumidifier front.

However, when we do use the van after a 'lay up', which in winter can run into several weeks, we do get a lot of condensation in the van the first couple of nights as everything 'dries out' when in use.

Therefore I have a renewed interest in something and specifically in the solar solution just to see if it keeps the interior a bit warmer (on average) and hence a little 'dryer'. I have seen these solar heating solutions for sale (mainly on boating sites) but have wondered how to get one 'connected' to the van. But maybe I have just found the answer and that is - I don’t, I create one inside the van across the windscreen, or on the front seats area. It would mean turning the van round as it faces north currently but I think it may be worth a go.

 

[monique.hubrechtsgm]

I just returned from a cold weekend at minus six deg c. during a dog festival . It was my first time standing over nights in freezing temperatures. I had 80 ltr water whit me and the toilet box 3ltr green tablets. I have no options like floor heating or heated tanks.Waste tank valve must be closed on this location. I set my alde system to 20 ambient and the pump is on most of the time and stops whit a click being the non -return valve.Then i closed inside all window screens and on front outside the hindermann winter blanket . The garage space where the alde boiler sits and some of my dogs is warmer than the house but the dogs can walk to the interior if i open their gate. To open your waste gate tank valve is no option because it is frozen. Be sure you have gas reserve and when changing a bottle do a gas leak test because the rubber seal ring gets harder at low temp. Returning home at freezing temp do this on your water system.Put out your toilet box. Take a 3000 watt hair dryer to heat up gently your waste pvc grey pipe from tank to the drain cock and try to open it at a slope you are familiar whit that all water drops are gone or make some moves whit the vehicle. Open all drain valves on the boiler and hot- cold pressure lines, be sure that the tap valves are open in the mid cold- hot position during the draining process. Do not forget the valves in the kitchen. The boiler is the most critical and expensive item. Heat up your vehicle inside and ventilate. But there is not one simple solution.

[aandncaravan]

Went up to the van in storage at 11:00 today to install the battery and get it part ready for our half term break at Chirk.

Very cold, but sunny day. Car thermo gauge showed it was 2 degrees outside, yet inside the van it was 9 degrees thanks to the Sun streaming in through the windows, Heiki, etc.

No damp or condensation of even the slightest sort. Every thing feels dry and no mould at all. By the time I had installed the battery and checked everything it was up to 11 degrees and felt warm inside compared to how cold it was outside.

 

 

Noticed when walking away, almost every other van, bar one, has the blinds down or curtains closed.

I wonder if they will be free of damp?

 

The minus 4 degrees of the past few nights looks like it might of helped resolve the issue the Farm has been having with Flies, so the bitter cold of the last few days hasn't been all bad.

 

 

 

 

 

[aandncaravan]

A customer has asked us to recommend a cheap device to show how humid his vehicle is so he can assess what action to take re damp air/condensation.

 

I already had something which was bought to monitor the engine battery voltage on my Car, that also displays humidity, but I had not really taken any notice of anything other than the voltage values.

 

It cost £8.50 on ebay and might be useful for others to see how much moisture there is inside a vehicle to help work out when/if you might need to consider action?

 

I bought mine a while ago, just bought another similar unit :

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12V-Digital-Car-Voltage-Clock-Time-Date-Temperature-Thermometer-LCD-Blue-Display-/331911859569?hash=item4d477d0d71:g:CJEAAOSwZQRYV4fw

 

 

[Muswell]

But what do you do with the information you get? Humidity is only part of the equation, the other is surface temperature. I have experience of both lowering and raising humidity in my workshop, which I check with 2 meters because they are notoriously inaccurate, and it takes a lot of input to make a difference.... and that is a sealed space. My van lives in a very damp part of the country, I do nothing about damp and don't even remove the sleeping bags; but it is well ventilated and the curtains and blinds are not closed.

[AndyDakota]

Thanks very much for all the replies. It looks like we all do different things to winter our pride and joy's, whether they be in storage or on the drive. Out blinds and curtains are left open and roof vents and windows closed. I have some desiccant packs that were kindly donated from a BT friend but you never know if they are actually doing anything. A few years ago when we had a caravan I left a cardboard type salt container in a cupboard over winter and in the Spring when we stocked the van up it was standing in a puddle of water so maybe putting a cardboard Saxa Salt in a plastic container will do just as good a job as any dehumidifier?

In the end for the price and after looking at reviews I bought a "Lloytron F2404 Staywarm 450W Mini Convector Heater Free Standing Or Mountable" for under £15 on eBay.

I don't have space in the house to store all the soft furnishings between the mattress and seat cushions, and I thought at the end of the day I can't take the driver and passenger seats out so what's the point. We remove the bedding and if I choose to I can use this new heater on the odd occasion during the winter and if it does turn cold in March we will have a low wattage heater should the need arise.

Thanks again for all your opinions.

[aandncaravan]

Glad you have it sorted.

One point was made above that the first couple of nights use each season can lead to :

'lots of condensation while everything dries out".

 

The humidity gauge in the car, photo above, has made me more aware of the humidity level around me while driving the car.

 

If your first journey of the year in the MH is one where you have the Air conditioning on as you drive, it will dry out the Air throughout the whole Motorhome.

Additionally having the Cab heating on slightly higher than usual might also result in a 'dried out' Motorhome habitation area by the time you reach your first stop?

 

That may reduce the condensation you might normally see on those first few nights?