veletron Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Hi So, this being my local park (I live a few miles away in Stirling), today is a very sad day! The 1st of March marks the start of an almost blanket ban on overnight 'wild camping' in either a motorhome or tent in Loch Lomond and the Trossachs National Park. Look at the pdf: http://www.lochlomond-trossachs.org/rr-content/uploads/2017/02/Camping-Management-Byelaws-2017.pdf It shows the area's now out of bounds, and these basically encompass all of the spots that you might have wanted to stop in your van and enjoy a view. Parking overnight at any of these locations from today could land you with a criminal record. As folks move elsewhere and those new area's become busy, we can expect the ban to be extended both within and outwith the park, as well as into other parks and AONB's, and forestry area's. They have opened pandora's box. Very very little additional capacity on campsites has been created and as usual, those that do exist are overpriced and overcrowded. There are 20 'permits' available each night for £3 each that allow you to 'wild camp' at designated spots. With the sheer number of Motorhomes using the park in the summer now forced onto campsites, we can be assured that it will be choca-bloc, and very unpleasant. Goes without saying that we Motorhomers should continue to leave wild camping spots as clean, or cleaner than we find them. Thankfully, most of the rest of Scotland still (currently) welcome's Motorhomer's so I would suggest that folks just forget about Loch Lomond and the Trossachs and head somewhere that actually wants them there instead! I used the park on those weekends where I did not fancy driving too far to be amongst the hills and loch's for a weekend's hill walking. RIP Loch Lomond and The Trossachs National Park - it was good while it lasted! Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldi Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen, I suspect this has been caused by the boondockers and tenters who pitch for a piss up at weekends. We have seen the debri and the remains of camping fires as we have travelled through Scotland on many occasions. We allways use the very welcoming campsites and almost without exception the excellent facilities. norm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocs Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 I'm not sure it will be a criminal offence as opposed to a mere fine like a parking offence. Interested in how they'll police it. The words say: "It shall be an offence for any person to sleep overnight in a stationary vehicle within a Management Zone". "Sleeping, officer? Moi? I was simply reading my book with the blinds closed." Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Is that a technical term :-D (•#"@ up) As someone on here as said before "see Andy Strangway" on sleeping in a vehicle as "what do they know" freedom of information act by Mr D Bukhari. a good read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 goldi - 2017-03-01 2:41 PM Good afternoon ladies and gentlemen, I suspect this has been caused by the boondockers and tenters who pitch for a piss up at weekends. We have seen the debri and the remains of camping fires as we have travelled through Scotland on many occasions. We allways use the very welcoming campsites and almost without exception the excellent facilities. norm I agree Loch Lomond is too close to Glasgow to allow Lochside overnight Camping, and i too have seen the chaos and rubbish left behind, disgusting, Fishing/drinking weekend parties. Just a shame that wildcamping motorhomers get tarred with the same brush. Just go further North and more remote , still beautiful up there stay away from the towns and Cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veletron Posted March 1, 2017 Author Share Posted March 1, 2017 The NEDs (Non Educated Delinquents) were a problem engaging in anti-social behaviour the same NEDs cause trouble in suburbia. We don't ban alcohol cause a few eejits abuse it so why ban wild camping on similar grounds. Little effort was made to tackle the issue using existing legislation - leaving a ruddy mess and being anti-social is a CRIME punishable in law afterall! The real reason they have done this is Money, oh and rich folks with big posh houses on the lochside (look at where some of the parks board and former board live). Campsite owners will like folks being forced onto over crowded sites, the £3/night parking permits might turn in a few quid too, and those with the big houses won't have to deal with pesky outsiders spoiling 'their' view, and existing in 'their' Park. As soon as one peeks under the covers, the real reason for this becomes obvious. As a local (eg 15 mins drive from the parks boundary) I am ashamed of the actions of my nearest national park. Oh, and NO, I will not be paying to stay on a site with facilities I do not require - I am only heading away for a weekend! Rather I will just go elsewhere instead. Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordonaldson Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Yes it was on the Scottish news showing the rubbish being left, messy camp fires and remnants of Barbeques. Tent fraternity of course. I don't know how they can stand the Midges as that's the worse place I've been that's had them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 Hi, I have visited the Trossachs on many occasions since 2012, using the Camping in the Forest site near Aberfoyle almost exclusively, as a base. The area has become busier, and last year we went further afield, to revist places that we had not been to for many years. I think that the problem with the Trossachs originates with the rubbish left by those inconsiderate wild campers who are also litter louts. I cannot recall which website I saw it on (Trossachs NP perhaps?), but I remember a picture depicting large amounts of rubbish that had to be removed by park rangers. The rubbish included abandonned tents, and large quantities of empty beer cans etc. The suggestion seemed to be that the primary aim of the "campers" was not to access to the outdoors, but to have a booze up. I think that this littering behaviour led to a ban on wild camping on the eastern shore of Loch Lomond, that was imposed a few years ago. More recently I have made meal halts at laybys on the western shore of Loch Lomond (A82), and on the northern shore of Loch Earn (A85). There were disgusting amounts of rubbish at both locations, and Loch Earn is not in The Trossachs NP!!!!!!! Leave nothing but footprints. Take nothing but photos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 veletron - 2017-03-01 9:37 PM The NEDs (Non Educated Delinquents) were a problem engaging in anti-social behaviour the same NEDs cause trouble in suburbia. We don't ban alcohol cause a few eejits abuse it so why ban wild camping on similar grounds. Little effort was made to tackle the issue using existing legislation - leaving a ruddy mess and being anti-social is a CRIME punishable in law afterall! The real reason they have done this is Money, oh and rich folks with big posh houses on the lochside (look at where some of the parks board and former board live). Campsite owners will like folks being forced onto over crowded sites, the £3/night parking permits might turn in a few quid too, and those with the big houses won't have to deal with pesky outsiders spoiling 'their' view, and existing in 'their' Park. As soon as one peeks under the covers, the real reason for this becomes obvious. As a local (eg 15 mins drive from the parks boundary) I am ashamed of the actions of my nearest national park. Oh, and NO, I will not be paying to stay on a site with facilities I do not require - I am only heading away for a weekend! Rather I will just go elsewhere instead. Nigel Wise words. This has happened in Dorset, Devon and Cornwall. Weymouth is a prime example where motorhomes were not welcome but if you had a yacht in the council owned marina it was ok to live on it as many did in the summer, one or two B&B and hotel owning councillors did. Motorhome owners are usually responsible people and most know the difference to this term "wild camping" and parking. I don't know why it's so difficult to understand. We live on a crowded Island and it is no longer possible to just pull up anywhere we fancy and set up camp with tables and chairs, windbreaks, awnings and cooking outside etc. that's not really on anymore. There are to many of us. Parking is a different matter. What you do inside your vehicle is your own business has nothing to do with the road traffic act so how sleeping is considered to be an offence is beyond me. There would be an awful lot of p*!!#+ off lorry drivers out there if sleeping in vehicles was an offence. It's very simple, just try to be a little more diplomatic. Tents and caravans should really be on campsites. That's why unlike caravans and tents all campervans and motorhomes have all the facilities built in. ie water tanks etc so they are designed to be used off site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 Alanb - 2017-03-01 9:55 PM Hi, I have visited the Trossachs on many occasions since 2012, using the Camping in the Forest site near Aberfoyle almost exclusively, as a base. The area has become busier, and last year we went further afield, to revist places that we had not been to for many years. I think that the problem with the Trossachs originates with the rubbish left by those inconsiderate wild campers who are also litter louts. I cannot recall which website I saw it on (Trossachs NP perhaps?), but I remember a picture depicting large amounts of rubbish that had to be removed by park rangers. The rubbish included abandonned tents, and large quantities of empty beer cans etc. The suggestion seemed to be that the primary aim of the "campers" was not to access to the outdoors, but to have a booze up. I think that this littering behaviour led to a ban on wild camping on the eastern shore of Loch Lomond, that was imposed a few years ago. More recently I have made meal halts at laybys on the western shore of Loch Lomond (A82), and on the northern shore of Loch Earn (A85). There were disgusting amounts of rubbish at both locations, and Loch Earn is not in The Trossachs NP!!!!!!! Leave nothing but footprints. Take nothing but photos. Agree, a good Scottish sign stated .......DUNNA CHUK BRUK ! Translation not needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veletron Posted March 2, 2017 Author Share Posted March 2, 2017 More info on the conviction and fine process here: http://www.ramblers.org.uk/policy/scotland/access/camping-and-access-rights/llttnp-a-responsible-camping-guide.aspx There is a proper criminal conviction on offer here folks, and a fine of £500 (which is more than you can ger for the far more serious offence of using a mobile phone while driving!) Any conviction is in a court of law, there are no fixed penalties, said conviction will get you a criminal record which will show up on certain searches by employers (public sector searches I would guess), it is also something that would need to be declared on insurance forms to avoid voiding any insurance - dont know if there is an expiry on a criminal record?! Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nimod Posted March 2, 2017 Share Posted March 2, 2017 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-tayside-central-39117802 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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