peedee Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 I have just been reading about the new regulations for the Trossachs National Park which came into effect on the 1st March this year. Surely, whilst placing restrictions on wild campers these have to be be for the good of the majority and the environment and far better than banning the practice altogether? I for one welcome their introduction and hope it will form a model for other tourist areas to follow. peedee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barcobird Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 You've got it summed up! Don't bother with anywhere south of the Scottish border because you won't be welcome unless a "clubbie" paying crazy fees to sit staring at rows of other motorhomes......a bit like being on the forecourt of a dealership but some folk seem to relish this weird fetish.. Scotland is dreamland country for motorhoming where England is just a complete nightmare which treats motorhomers like social pariahs. It's the place to quickly become a manic depressive! The only other place is anywhere Europe where it's not uncommon to pull in for fuel......and find facilities such as fresh water fill, grey waste dump and sometimes chemical disposal points. And of course a decent cafe serving meals, snacks and quality espresso all at sensible prices. I didn't check in Scotland but I noticed in English petrol stations, if you need to put air in your tyres or water in your windscreen bottle it's pay pay. I have been away from England for a long time and now back here find this country very money orientated. Surprised there's not a tax on breathing!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 snowie - 2017-03-22 5:51 PM I think the distinction between caravans and mh's/campers is spurious, onboard water is just a matter of plumbing, and my next bespoke camper will have caravan clean and grey water systems. The difference is in the number of vehicles in my opinion, so tow a Smart car and you're a tugger as far as I'm concerned. Wild camping involves a short handled spade, not a 3.5 Ton vehicle, call it free- camping, that's what it is. Crucial to whatever definition you choose is "the Camper" male or female, and attitude is all. Miserable? Some are , some aren't Regards Alanb wise words, I have difficulty understanding the logic of towing a car, especially with the smaller coach built vans I see doing it. The larger van's I sort of get it but hey, everyone's different. What I can not agree with is digging up the ground to bury waste I presume. That might be OK in the deserts of Africa because you have no choice. Just a point on caravans, I would guess the 99% of caravans have no water tanks and logic would say that they are not designed to carry water when on the road but to have water available at their destination. I was guessing this would probably be a camp site of some sort as I don't think they are really suitable, ie for the above reasons and the length including the towing vehicle, plus you don't see many caravans in car parks or high streets or sea fronts for that matter. Indeed, over the years councils have tried desperately to keep caravans out of car parks & fields etc. having no built in water tank in a Motorhome or campervan doesn't make it a caravan so I'm not sure why you mentioned it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Barcobird - 2017-03-23 7:41 AM You've got it summed up! Don't bother with anywhere south of the Scottish border because you won't be welcome unless a "clubbie" paying crazy fees to sit staring at rows of other motorhomes......a bit like being on the forecourt of a dealership but some folk seem to relish this weird fetish.. Scotland is dreamland country for motorhoming where England is just a complete nightmare which treats motorhomers like social pariahs. It's the place to quickly become a manic depressive! The only other place is anywhere Europe where it's not uncommon to pull in for fuel......and find facilities such as fresh water fill, grey waste dump and sometimes chemical disposal points. And of course a decent cafe serving meals, snacks and quality espresso all at sensible prices. I didn't check in Scotland but I noticed in English petrol stations, if you need to put air in your tyres or water in your windscreen bottle it's pay pay. I have been away from England for a long time and now back here find this country very money orientated. Surprised there's not a tax on breathing!! there is..... You mean to say your not paying it? ... Bl##*~ outrageous ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matrix Meanderer Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Barcobird - 2017-03-23 7:41 AM "You've got it summed up! Don't bother with anywhere south of the Scottish border because you won't be welcome unless a "clubbie" paying crazy fees to sit staring at rows of other motorhomes......a bit like being on the forecourt of a dealership but some folk seem to relish this weird fetish." I agree that the "crazy prices" are eye watering but look what you get for that price, it's usually as good as many sites "sur le continent" - without the bar, swimming pool and shop of course. But the pitches are good and well separated and the showers are always well maintained. As for "rows of other motorhomes" - I've seen several wild camping sites in Europe and Aires where the motorhomes are packed in serried rows with inches between vans - Honfleur, Sagres and others. Where's the solitude and enjoyment in that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 These "eye watering prices" are because people are willing to pay for what ever reason. Just like Premier league football, F1 motor racing (& I use that term very loosely to describe F1) & so on. As for me, I began to find it difficult to get a pitch at a campsite as a single man in the UK. So I was forced into free parking, wild camping or parking and paying. When I'm in the uk I use a small pop top camper as I find it's better suited for the above. In Europe I use a big camper because there is more room to park and I stay for 5 months or three, well, longer anyway. I'm not well off. I chose two older vans and bought them up to scratch myself instead of buying a shiny new one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Brian Kirby - 2017-03-22 7:24 PM Barcobird - 2017-03-22 1:01 PM....................So we headed off to Scotland and what a difference, the people were so warm and friendly towards us. They made places accessible for Motorhomes and realise when there, you are going to spend money, make sense to me. I was just wondering what other Motorhomers opinions and attitudes to this subject was, I guess it is more a question for the wild campers than the lovers of campsites. England has an average population density of 406 people per sq km, whereas Scotland has just 67. That pressure on land means that land prices are much higher in England, and also that demand on the available space is higher. So, rationing in England is by price: you can find spaces, but you have to pay. This applies equally to car parking after all. In other countries, with lower population densities, parking is often free, even in towns. Welcome to your homeland, it is as it is! I guess the unsympathetic response is pay, or go elsewhere. It isn't going to change anytime soon, and seems likely to get worse as the population increases. so, where do these 67 live :D sorry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 I'll get your coat :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Barcobird - 2017-03-23 7:41 AM You've got it summed up! Don't bother with anywhere south of the Scottish border because you won't be welcome unless a "clubbie" paying crazy fees to sit staring at rows of other motorhomes......a bit like being on the forecourt of a dealership but some folk seem to relish this weird fetish.. Scotland is dreamland country for motorhoming where England is just a complete nightmare which treats motorhomers like social pariahs. It's the place to quickly become a manic depressive! The only other place is anywhere Europe where it's not uncommon to pull in for fuel......and find facilities such as fresh water fill, grey waste dump and sometimes chemical disposal points. And of course a decent cafe serving meals, snacks and quality espresso all at sensible prices. I didn't check in Scotland but I noticed in English petrol stations, if you need to put air in your tyres or water in your windscreen bottle it's pay pay. I have been away from England for a long time and now back here find this country very money orientated. Surprised there's not a tax on breathing!! That's certainly the "rule" at my local Morrisons supermarket. I put air in my tyres there only last week so can confirm they have a minimum £10 fuel spend before dishing out a "free" ticket for air. As for water, they have a tap at the side of the forecourt reception so you are parked up away from the pumps and not blocking anyone. One year i decided to "tank up" my water there.....bearing in mind i'd also just fueled up spending around £60+ on diesel. I'd barely got more than a gallon of water in when one of the staff came out and told me motorhomes and campers are not allowed to use the water! The Managers "rules" i was told! :-( Ok i just had to return home and fill up, but i couldn't help but think on forecourt stations in Europe i'm made welcome to use all their facilities (one large station in Romania, the Manager even invited me to park up overnight and after having a meal there, gave me free espresso's!!). I spent good money there buying toys for my grand children and thoroughly enjoyed my stay! It's on the outskirts of Craiova for anyone going to Romania......and comes with my recommendation! When tanking up with diesel, my tank was low and taking some time on the pump and an irate local got a bit shirty....but the Manager spotted him, came out and gave him a few choice words in Romanian and told him to stop being such a prat and go to one of the other pumps (words to that effect!). (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 So, could you translate exactly what he said as it may come in useful at some point :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breakaleg Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 there are some Aires in Britain, the one at Lytham St Anns is well used, from 6pm until 10 am is £5.00 or £21.00 for three consecutive nights and days. Blackpool are supposed to be creating 6 Aires ? Canterbury ? Have tried to get the councilors in Stirchley Birmingham to set up an Aires as it is only three miles from the city centre with a railway station, buses every 15 minutes, at least 20 Indian restaurants and 3 Chinese takeaways, Cadbury world within walking distance. Problem is, we have had travelers invading any open space they can find and are fitting railings around the most invaded park as I type (twenty thousand pounds the city hasn't got spare) but after 8 clean ups over two years will probably work out cheaper in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barcobird Posted March 24, 2017 Author Share Posted March 24, 2017 breakaleg - 2017-03-24 12:38 PM there are some Aires in Britain, the one at Lytham St Anns is well used, from 6pm until 10 am is £5.00 or £21.00 for three consecutive nights and days. Blackpool are supposed to be creating 6 Aires ? Canterbury ? Have tried to get the councilors in Stirchley Birmingham to set up an Aires as it is only three miles from the city centre with a railway station, buses every 15 minutes, at least 20 Indian restaurants and 3 Chinese takeaways, Cadbury world within walking distance. Problem is, we have had travelers invading any open space they can find and are fitting railings around the most invaded park as I type (twenty thousand pounds the city hasn't got spare) but after 8 clean ups over two years will probably work out cheaper in the long run. Gipsy's turned up at Tesco in Redditch about three weeks ago (after they were turfed out of a local schools playground!!!) They had vans and caravans etc. Didn't park in the corner just plonked themselves in the middle, got their stuff out and here we are ! It took three days and a court order to get rid of them. If I park for more than three hours £70 fine and I would HAVE to pay it. They make me sick, get away with everything and cause all the problems for Motorhome abiding citizens. You can't really blame land owners for putting barriers up. >:-) >:-( >:-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breakaleg Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 Yes this is the problem, went to Burnham on Sea last year and they were all over the sea front car park, people drove on and straight off again. I chair the local neighbourhood forum and put securing the park on the Agena and one of the residends called me a fascist. Can't win, can you? Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 keninpalamos - 2017-03-23 4:26 PM So, could you translate exactly what he said as it may come in useful at some point :D I didn't ask but the tone of his voice and gesticulations was enough.......probably the equivalent of "stop being such a stupid prat and go on one of the vacant pumps"!! (lol) He told me that's all the local guy was moaning about.......no different to "forecourt rage" here! There's always some loon who wants to be awkward. breakaleg - 2017-03-24 12:38 PM Problem is, we have had travelers invading any open space they can find and are fitting railings around the most invaded park as I type (twenty thousand pounds the city hasn't got spare) but after 8 clean ups over two years will probably work out cheaper in the long run. Yet on the outskirts of the nearest town in my locality there are two Supermarkets with massive car parks, one of which has been open the past 25 years.....and not once have they ever had any Gypsy problems. They've never had any height barriers and you just drive straight in off a main road. Bags of room!! http://oi67.tinypic.com/5n0ho8.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barcobird Posted March 24, 2017 Author Share Posted March 24, 2017 Bulletguy - 2017-03-24 3:02 PM keninpalamos - 2017-03-23 4:26 PM So, could you translate exactly what he said as it may come in useful at some point :D I didn't ask but the tone of his voice and gesticulations was enough.......probably the equivalent of "stop being such a stupid prat and go on one of the vacant pumps"!! (lol) He told me that's all the local guy was moaning about.......no different to "forecourt rage" here! There's always some loon who wants to be awkward. breakaleg - 2017-03-24 12:38 PM Problem is, we have had travelers invading any open space they can find and are fitting railings around the most invaded park as I type (twenty thousand pounds the city hasn't got spare) but after 8 clean ups over two years will probably work out cheaper in the long run. Yet on the outskirts of the nearest town in my locality there are two Supermarkets with massive car parks, one of which has been open the past 25 years.....and not once have they ever had any Gypsy problems. They've never had any height barriers and you just drive straight in off a main road. Bags of room!! http://oi67.tinypic.com/5n0ho8.jpg BUT do they allow overnight stops ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 Barcobird - 2017-03-24 8:06 PM Bulletguy - 2017-03-24 3:02 PM keninpalamos - 2017-03-23 4:26 PM So, could you translate exactly what he said as it may come in useful at some point :D I didn't ask but the tone of his voice and gesticulations was enough.......probably the equivalent of "stop being such a stupid prat and go on one of the vacant pumps"!! (lol) He told me that's all the local guy was moaning about.......no different to "forecourt rage" here! There's always some loon who wants to be awkward. breakaleg - 2017-03-24 12:38 PM Problem is, we have had travelers invading any open space they can find and are fitting railings around the most invaded park as I type (twenty thousand pounds the city hasn't got spare) but after 8 clean ups over two years will probably work out cheaper in the long run. Yet on the outskirts of the nearest town in my locality there are two Supermarkets with massive car parks, one of which has been open the past 25 years.....and not once have they ever had any Gypsy problems. They've never had any height barriers and you just drive straight in off a main road. Bags of room!! http://oi67.tinypic.com/5n0ho8.jpg BUT do they allow overnight stops ? I think that one, which is a Morrisons, wouldn't object to a MH staying overnight............but they wouldn't let you tank up with water! You'd need to wait until the forecourt has closed down and all the staff gone home! (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barcobird Posted March 24, 2017 Author Share Posted March 24, 2017 Bulletguy - 2017-03-24 8:11 PM Barcobird - 2017-03-24 8:06 PM Bulletguy - 2017-03-24 3:02 PM keninpalamos - 2017-03-23 4:26 PM So, could you translate exactly what he said as it may come in useful at some point :D I didn't ask but the tone of his voice and gesticulations was enough.......probably the equivalent of "stop being such a stupid prat and go on one of the vacant pumps"!! (lol) He told me that's all the local guy was moaning about.......no different to "forecourt rage" here! There's always some loon who wants to be awkward. breakaleg - 2017-03-24 12:38 PM Problem is, we have had travelers invading any open space they can find and are fitting railings around the most invaded park as I type (twenty thousand pounds the city hasn't got spare) but after 8 clean ups over two years will probably work out cheaper in the long run. Yet on the outskirts of the nearest town in my locality there are two Supermarkets with massive car parks, one of which has been open the past 25 years.....and not once have they ever had any Gypsy problems. They've never had any height barriers and you just drive straight in off a main road. Bags of room!! http://oi67.tinypic.com/5n0ho8.jpg BUT do they allow overnight stops ? I think that one, which is a Morrisons, wouldn't object to a MH staying overnight............but they wouldn't let you tank up with water! You'd need to wait until the forecourt has closed down and all the staff gone home! (lol) I will post that one on the wild camping sites then (lol) (lol) (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 Barcobird - 2017-03-24 8:17 PM Bulletguy - 2017-03-24 8:11 PM Barcobird - 2017-03-24 8:06 PM Bulletguy - 2017-03-24 3:02 PM keninpalamos - 2017-03-23 4:26 PM So, could you translate exactly what he said as it may come in useful at some point :D I didn't ask but the tone of his voice and gesticulations was enough.......probably the equivalent of "stop being such a stupid prat and go on one of the vacant pumps"!! (lol) He told me that's all the local guy was moaning about.......no different to "forecourt rage" here! There's always some loon who wants to be awkward. breakaleg - 2017-03-24 12:38 PM Problem is, we have had travelers invading any open space they can find and are fitting railings around the most invaded park as I type (twenty thousand pounds the city hasn't got spare) but after 8 clean ups over two years will probably work out cheaper in the long run. Yet on the outskirts of the nearest town in my locality there are two Supermarkets with massive car parks, one of which has been open the past 25 years.....and not once have they ever had any Gypsy problems. They've never had any height barriers and you just drive straight in off a main road. Bags of room!! http://oi67.tinypic.com/5n0ho8.jpg BUT do they allow overnight stops ? I think that one, which is a Morrisons, wouldn't object to a MH staying overnight............but they wouldn't let you tank up with water! You'd need to wait until the forecourt has closed down and all the staff gone home! (lol) I will post that one on the wild camping sites then (lol) (lol) (lol) The All Day Breakfast isn't bad either! Saves firing up the cooker! (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trickydicky Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 Hi, last year we came across the deer park near Ledbury.what a find, very scenic and very quiet, you can virtually park where you want, it is £8.50 a night and there are fresh water and toilet emptying points but no electric, toilets or showers. You also get half price admission into eastnor castle which is adjacent to the deer park. Well worth a visit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted March 25, 2017 Share Posted March 25, 2017 Charles - 2017-03-23 10:43 AM I'll get your coat :) :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barcobird Posted March 25, 2017 Author Share Posted March 25, 2017 Matrix Meanderer - 2017-03-23 9:23 AM Barcobird - 2017-03-23 7:41 AM "You've got it summed up! Don't bother with anywhere south of the Scottish border because you won't be welcome unless a "clubbie" paying crazy fees to sit staring at rows of other motorhomes......a bit like being on the forecourt of a dealership but some folk seem to relish this weird fetish." I agree that the "crazy prices" are eye watering but look what you get for that price, it's usually as good as many sites "sur le continent" - without the bar, swimming pool and shop of course. But the pitches are good and well separated and the showers are always well maintained. As for "rows of other motorhomes" - I've seen several wild camping sites in Europe and Aires where the motorhomes are packed in serried rows with inches between vans - Honfleur, Sagres and others. Where's the solitude and enjoyment in that? For me there is no enjoyment in that, wild camping is to me secluded and off the beaten track. You will always get rows of Motorhomes in sites that have good views, facilities on site or nearby and of course cheap *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 25, 2017 Share Posted March 25, 2017 Barcobird - 2017-03-22 10:15 PM Brian Kirby - 2017-03-22 7:24 PM Barcobird - 2017-03-22 1:01 PM....................So we headed off to Scotland and what a difference, the people were so warm and friendly towards us. They made places accessible for Motorhomes and realise when there, you are going to spend money, make sense to me. I was just wondering what other Motorhomers opinions and attitudes to this subject was, I guess it is more a question for the wild campers than the lovers of campsites. England has an average population density of 406 people per sq km, whereas Scotland has just 67. That pressure on land means that land prices are much higher in England, and also that demand on the available space is higher. So, rationing in England is by price: you can find spaces, but you have to pay. This applies equally to car parking after all. In other countries, with lower population densities, parking is often free, even in towns. Welcome to your homeland, it is as it is! I guess the unsympathetic response is pay, or go elsewhere. It isn't going to change anytime soon, and seems likely to get worse as the population increases. Brian, I don't know what the population density of France but would think it similar to ours. They welcome Motorhomes with open arms and provide services (Aires) to encourage them as well. Therefore I guess it's Bon Voyage *-) Similar population, significantly larger land mass, so density is only about 120 people per sq km. QED? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barcobird Posted March 25, 2017 Author Share Posted March 25, 2017 I copied the following from another Motorhome Facebook page and found it rather relevant to this conversation. It amuses me they have signs before motorway services saying tiredness kills, pull in and take a break! "Be careful how long you stop in the services on M6 just got a £60 fine because I was in there for 3 hours had just been on road for 11 hours totally shattered so had a few hours sleep and it cost me £60 never will I do that again" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 25, 2017 Share Posted March 25, 2017 Barcobird - 2017-03-25 7:51 PM I copied the following from another Motorhome Facebook page and found it rather relevant to this conversation. It amuses me they have signs before motorway services saying tiredness kills, pull in and take a break! "Be careful how long you stop in the services on M6 just got a £60 fine because I was in there for 3 hours had just been on road for 11 hours totally shattered so had a few hours sleep and it cost me £60 never will I do that again" That's long been a beef of mine too. One year i'd driven from a friends house in Sulingen Germany and got as far as Oxford services on the M40 when i'd finally had enough. I'd kept seeing those electronic signs and thought, yes it makes sense. Only to then be met with large warning signs threatening fines if you overstay your 2 hours and "NO OVERNIGHT PARKING ALLOWED". Oh brother........"welcome" back to Blighty! :-( I was that knackered i couldn't drive any further so just took a chance on it and was lucky though did scarper early morning. I don't spend any money on UK service areas as a result of their prohibition notices. Everywhere in Europe you can stay on motorway service areas as long as you like and most are well fitted out with purpose built tables and benches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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