JonMac46 Posted May 17, 2017 Share Posted May 17, 2017 My trusty 1999 Fiat idTD is showing signs of clutch slip. The problem started when I reversed up a slope at home, manually slipping the clutch, and it squealed the whole time. Then when I was driving up the hill to the house the other day, in 2nd gear, the clutch started to slip. I de-clutched, re-clutched, and it bit and we got home. It is a cable operated clutch. Is there any chance it just needs adjusting, or is it a new clutch? The take up point is the pedal about an inch from the floor. It has only done 74K kilometres, but I have had a Guidosimplex Duck Clutch installed which is harder on the clutch than using the foot. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted May 17, 2017 Share Posted May 17, 2017 A 'low bite point' on this clutch is normal so not indicative of the usual worn disc. Suggest adjustment might help so a good place to start? Maybe get the Electronics checked as well? "The 'Guidosimplex Duck' semi-automatic clutch completely removes the requirement for left leg operation in a manual vehicle. A small lever on the gear knob controls the clutch pedal allowing complete operation of the clutch with the driver's hands". It is, internally, computer-controlled and performs a 'fly-by-wire' control of the clutch. For instance, the device knows where the 'bite point' of the clutch is and will automatically find it on slight release of the lever". The Clutch components remain the same, just the Release/Engage mechanism that is changed. https://www.ride-away.com/research/mobility-products/driving-controls/guidosimplex-duck-clutch/ . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted May 17, 2017 Share Posted May 17, 2017 Impossible to judge wear by mileage alone because it depends so much on the driver. Heat finishes them off faster than anything, so if you have to nurse it home change down to a lower gear to avoid heat build up from clutch slip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonMac46 Posted May 17, 2017 Author Share Posted May 17, 2017 There isn't much in the way of electronics on this vehicle! The clutch problem is there whether I use my left foot or the auto-clutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted May 18, 2017 Share Posted May 18, 2017 You are absolutely right, there is not much in the way of electronics on a 1999 Fiat 2500 TD but some of the larger motorhomes with 3 axles had a basic ECU with an air flow meter and fly by wire throttle which increased the HP by a whisker like my old '99 700E Hymer which is a as quick a an asmatic ant with a heavy load of shopping. But it gets there.....eventually. As you say the clutch is cable operated and is adjustable. It sounds like it wants letting off a bit just enough for a small amount of free play at the pedal. Did mine last year. Just follow the cable under the bonnet from the bulk head to where it is attached to clutch fork lever. You will see two nuts on the inner end of the cable. One for adjustment and one is a lock nut. Slacken the adjusting nut off (anti-clockwise) a couple of turns and tighten the lock nut up. If it won't go into gear you have let it off too much. Hope that helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted May 18, 2017 Share Posted May 18, 2017 JonMac46 - 2017-05-17 12:35 PM There isn't much in the way of electronics on this vehicle! The clutch problem is there whether I use my left foot or the auto-clutch. I didn't mean the vehicle electronics but the Clutch electronics. The Guidosimplex Duck semi-automatic clutch manufacturers blurb states it has an electronic 'Computer' which senses the bite point. It quotes - "It is, internally, computer-controlled and performs a 'fly-by-wire' control of the clutch. For instance, the device knows where the 'bite point' of the clutch is and will automatically find it on slight release of the lever". If the 'Computer' has got the bite point wrong it may be part of the problem? If it has been calculating the bight point incorrectly for a while, it might cause premature wear of the clutch?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 I don't think you will find much in the way of electronics on a 1999 Fiat Ducato, 2500cc TD engine, gearbox, clutch or diff. Allen. This is old school mechanics with a simple manual 5 speed gear box and cable operated clutch that can be manually adjusted to take up the centre plate wear. By adjusting the cable free play this allows a small gap between the thrust bearing and cover plate diaphragm. If after doing such an adjustment the clutch is still slipping them the clutch will need replacing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted May 19, 2017 Share Posted May 19, 2017 Keninpalamos, the OP states he has had an aftermarket gizmo fitted that turns the standard vehicle mechanicals into a kind of clutchless change unit. At least that is how I interpret his comment, " I have had a Guidosimplex Duck Clutch installed". You can see from the photo it does look a bit like a Duck. The Duck Clutch install adds a tiny 'trigger' type lever to the gear stick. You pull the trigger, which disengages the Clutch, then you move the Gear stick. Once in gear you release the trigger and the electronics/servo engage the clutch 'smoothly'. The device is of particular interest because I once had a couple of NSU Ro80's which had a micro switch between the gear knob and the stick, so as you touched the gear lever, the micro switch disengaged the Clutch and as you released pressure on the switch the clutch re-engaged. But the NSU was slightly different in that it additionally had a Torque converter to absorb the 'shock' of the Clutch working. I am guessing the Duck Clutch has the same problem with 'shock' engagement that the NSU engineers encountered, but Guidosimplex get around it, possibly, by a 'slow' clutch reengagement causing it to slip more than normal? I assume that, from the OP's comments, "which is harder on the clutch", which I take to mean Clutch Disk wear? However, because the OP also responded there were no electronics in the Duck unit, I may have completely misunderstood!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonMac46 Posted May 20, 2017 Author Share Posted May 20, 2017 There is electronics in the Duck Clutch box, I was joking about the 1999 Fiat electronics. The clutch disengages when my foot comes off the accelerator or when I put my hand on the gear lever [the photo is of an older version, there is now an IR sensor inside the gear knob]. When I said "harder on the clutch" there are 2 things: one is the more frequent disengagement, the other is that it is hard to match the revs as one does when driving "manually." There is usually a slight lurch as the revs match which must be stressing the clutch plates more. AFAIK the system does not adjust the revs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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