Malky8105 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Yesterday I had a very interesting conversation with my local Fiat Professional dealer regarding a safety recall for non-conforming EGR pipe on my Fiat Ducato. According to the letter from Fiat the check takes an hour to complete and the dealer states that of those vans who have received the safety recall letter 99% require the part to be replaced. Then the problem started - On a motorhome this apparently takes 10 hours of work but Fiat will only pay the dealer for 6 hours as that is what it would take if some daft company like Chausson hadn't chucked a caravan on the chassis to make it a motorhome. How stupid of them! As you can imagine I was shocked by this and even more so when I asked what the hourly rate for the additional 4 hours I was apparently liable for. - £66+vat. A total of £315 for me to replace a non conforming part that Fiat installed erroneously. Then came the next bit, I had been given the bad news but here's the even worse news, we will check the van after the new pipe has been installed and there is a 50% chance that it will also require a new oil cooler. Apparently there have been so many recalls that this item is on a minimum of 3 week back order from Fiat and because it impinges on safety they effectively ground the vehicle and won't let it out off the garage!! So £315 worse off and looking forward to a minimum of 3 weeks off the road in the spring I called my Chausson dealer who I bought the new van from less than a year ago. Knowepark in Livingstone were unaware of this issue (apparently!) and the person I spoke to said they would speak to the manager and call me back. I am still waiting! While waiting for the Chausson dealer to call back (I'll have plenty of time I think) I decided to call other Fiat dealers to see what their view on the matter is. I have now booked the van into another dealer, 60 mile round trip compared to 14 but whats another couple of gallons of diesel, additional time, needless excess miles on the clock when one is as laid back as me!!!!! The original dealer could not even look at the van till mid April whereas the second dealer is apparently doing the work next week and there was no mention of additional, potential unpaid hours. This is a shocking state of affairs and one which may necessitate me taking legal advice from my solicitor or Trading Standards as I cannot see how Fiat can rid themselves of their responsibility no matter what kind of vehicle the coach builder has turned the original Ducato into. I advise of this matter for your information fellow Ducato owners and wonder about others experiences in this regard. I will keep you updated and warn you that failure to undertake the safety recall will obviously have a detrimental effect on the warranty provided for Fiat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinM50 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Does anyone know if this EGR pipe recall also applies to Peugeot Boxer m/h's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 malky dont bother with the dealer go straight to another fiat professional garage and let them deal with it . i had mine done in nov it took them 8 hrs in total i was not asked to pay anything nor would have. In your position i would ring fiat camper assistance they are usually very helpful be lucky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Malky8105 The recall you refer to is shown on the DVSA’s website (Recall Number R/2017/283 - Launch date 30/11/2017 - Build startt-date 17/02/2016 - Build end-date 12/09/2017). https://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/apps/recalls/searches/search.asp Consequently - as Fiat has acknowledged this problem and that it has safety implications - it is Fiat’s responsibility to deal with it. There’s no good reason to think that the required remedial work would take longer than the 6 hours Fiat has allocated merely because the Ducato happens to be a motorhome. However, there may well be instances where a motorhome manufacturer has produced a design that complicates the task, increasing the time the task takes to complete. Most Chausson models retain the standard cab and the EGR recall work should take no longer to carry out on those vehicles than on a Ducato ‘white van’. But Chausson also markets A-Class models and (if that’s what you’ve got) it would not be too surprising if a Fiat Professional agent estimated that carrying out the EGR recall work on your motorhome would take 10 hours not 6. Who would stump up for a supplementary 4 hours labour-charge is another matter, but it really ought not to be you. (The DVSA wbsite has no similar entry for Peugeot Boxers or Citroen Relays. As none of the engines fitted to Euro 6 Ducatos are fitted to Euro 6 Boxers/Relays, it’s most unlikely that the identical Ducato EGR problem would occur on the Boxer/Relay powerplants.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monique.hubrechtsgm Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 I made some study on the euro6 of fiat which do not use any Ad- Blue to reach euro 6. There is a high and a low egr pipe system regarding pressure. Have a look at the diagram of it, and where was the leak location high or low. And at which engine regarding to the turbo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinM50 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Derek Uzzell - 2018-02-22 2:30 PM (The DVSA wbsite has no similar entry for Peugeot Boxers or Citroen Relays. As none of the engines fitted to Euro 6 Ducatos are fitted to Euro 6 Boxers/Relays, it’s most unlikely that the identical Ducato EGR problem would occur on the Boxer/Relay powerplants.) Thanks for that, puts my mind at rest. 8-) 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dicksob Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Malky, I’m from Edinburgh, so should be quite near you? I had the recall carried out at AM Phillip at Trucktech in Broxburn. Ask for Alan, the Fiat Service Manager, nice guy and very helpful. There will be no charge, Fiat clear it’s a recall and at their expense! Have you got the Fiat Ducato Camper mobile app, all updates and recalls appear here, will also connect you to their help desk who are very helpful. Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky8105 Posted February 22, 2018 Author Share Posted February 22, 2018 Thanks to you all for the quick responses. As I said in original post I have booked the van into a second garage who made no mention of additional hours. I will advise on how I get on next week but I cannot recommend AM Phillip in Dundee at this stage as they were most unhelpful and insisted that the additional 4 hours work must be paid by me. I don't think so!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 What model of Chausson motorhome do you own, please? It’s understandable that you would not recommend A M Phillip at Dundee, but it might be useful to know if there were a credible/predictable reason for them to have told you that the time needed to carry out the EGR-related recall work would be 10 hours not 6 hours. As I understand your original posting, it appears that A M Phillip have nevert seen your Chausson motorhome, but have just told you on the phone that the recall work takes 10 hours for ‘motorhomes’ rather than 6 hours. If that’s the situation, you might want to take the matter up with Fiat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Sounds like the first dealer was talking total BS, the Chausson is no different from a standard Ducato, mine is an A-Class so is a bit different and took my dealer 2 hours to do the check, no further work required. As for 99% need replacing again BS, there are 3 different versions of the pipe there is only a problem with one of them. If you look at the VOSA site it gives the serial numbers of vehicles affected by tye recall and it's not that many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky8105 Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Derek, my van is a Chausson 737GA which is a low profile van. AM Philip were not estimating the time at 10 hours, they said that is what it takes for motorhomes. I read on another site something about the fact that it is more awkward to drop the sub chassis (I think!!) one the base vehicle has been converted to a motorhome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky8105 Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Thanks Lenny, I will check out the VOSA site now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Malky8105 - 2018-02-23 9:18 AM Derek, my van is a Chausson 737GA which is a low profile van. AM Philip were not estimating the time at 10 hours, they said that is what it takes for motorhomes. I read on another site something about the fact that it is more awkward to drop the sub chassis (I think!!) one the base vehicle has been converted to a motorhome. hi malky when mine was done they dropped the front crossmember down to allow access Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arthur49 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Malky8105 - 2018-02-22 8:00 PM .......... I will advise on how I get on next week but I cannot recommend AM Phillip in Dundee at this stage as they were most unhelpful and insisted that the additional 4 hours work must be paid by me...... Ooh! Interesting. I've used them a lot in the past and found them very good. (Parking a bit difficult though) I'm booked in for intercooler pipe recall in 3 weeks time so I'll find out how it goes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazdog6007 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 So Fiats as well as Fords this environment thing is causing problems for everyone.Thing is,these are the only engines that will be allowed anywhere in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monique.hubrechtsgm Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Can anyone who had the recall fixed what part was the problem. A photo will be very helpfull. Is it just an italian girl in sevel who did not applied the right torque on a egr pipe clamp? Or was it the tube. High time to clarify for other worried users of this batch of ZFA vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisD Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Derek Thank you for the link to the VOSA site. I checked my serial number against the ranges shown and my Fiat is outside those ranges but my local Fiat proff insist the work must be done. Does anyone have any ideas about that? Also the oil cooler? this is news to me. not good news either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 will try to add photo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machra Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Had mine in for the check the other day and from what I was told the problem is with a bracket welded to the EGR pipe. In some cases the bracket itself is “substandard” and can sheer off from the pipe, causing a hole in the pipe. The bracket has been made stronger on the replacement pipe. They said while the bracket was not broken on mine it was one of the substandard types and therefore needed replacing. Job will take 4 to 6 hours as the pipe was located at the bulkhead side of the engine and they have to drop the subframe to carry out the repair. They said they had replaced loads hence they had got the time down to about 4 hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 ChrisD - 2018-02-23 4:57 PM I checked my serial number against the ranges shown and my Fiat is outside those ranges but my local Fiat proff insist the work must be done. Does anyone have any ideas about that? Also the oil cooler? this is news to me. not good news either Download the Fiat Camper Car app to your phone enter your VIN then any time you want to check for recalls just press on the "Chassis traffic light" icon it will then show you a red traffic light for a recall or Green is all well. Indicates problems weeks/months before any paperwork notification. You can also enter your VIN on the Fiat Camper website but the app is easier. I have seen a photo that was posted on the Fiat forum shows a broken bracket, if the pipe drops it burns through the alternator wiring. Not heard anything about an oil cooler problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 monique.hubrechts@gm - 2018-02-23 4:10 PM Can anyone who had the recall fixed what part was the problem. A photo will be very helpfull. Is it just an italian girl in sevel who did not applied the right torque on a egr pipe clamp? Or was it the tube. High time to clarify for other worried users of this batch of ZFA vehicles. hi you have email photo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monique.hubrechtsgm Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 If you weld a bracket to a thin egr pipe of whatever strenght you have to follow a WPS. welding procedure specification. And A PCR procedure qualify record. The most important i the hardness in brinell of the weld. Max 320 degrees. Above it is hard you can not file it off. In that case proned to heat effected zone craciking. You can use stress relieving to heat it to reduce hardness. But unlikeky of these mass produced products. The opposite of the egr pipe and welds is cold temperature in which case they are brittle and their Charpy values are very low. They can crack at starting your engine in cold temp. Charpy was a french military who invented the scale because his cannons explode during low winter time temp. His scale is still used in every metal such as bridges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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