Derek Uzzell Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 MMM test reports on recent Autocruise motorhomes have mentioned them being fitted with a trailer-caravan-style fresh-water tank filling-point designed to take water from a container (Aquaroll or equivalent) via an external 12V submersible pump. Personally, I'd find this type of 'fill by wire' arrangement an absolute bugbear (though I can fully appreciate it may be perfect for other people) and I'd be interested to learn how Autocruise owners get on with the standard system and if anyone has converted it to 'fill by garden hose'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 Morning Derek, You will find external filling via the supplied tube with a submersible motor (as with the aqua roll caravan system), is an additional method of transferring water from an outside water container into the MH main tank. A feature of this is the internal mode switch, is allowing you to choose either the external or internal pump from within the MH, which of course means it is a two handed operation to fill from an external container. The normal method is with the 10 0r 12 metre hose supplied with the system. This hose has a governor fitted to the MH end of the hose and a tap connector at the other end. The governor is fitted because they now use a half inch hose in the MH from the wall mounted entry point to the fresh water tank instead of the usual 2 plus inch tubing, if the governor was not fitted reducing the water pressure, then problems may occur with jointing coming apart inside the MH. There is a further method of filling which we have used from time to time, the tank is situated under the floor, centre lounge, access is via a large screw top, filling via this method is both quick and easy. Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 Although we do not have the Autocruise, our van has the water point about 4ft from the ground and filling by container can be a real chore, Hose pipe seems like the ideal answer, but many sites seem to put them in very difficult places to drive the van up to. On continental sites some taps have large weird ends and the hose can slip off very easily. It is for this reason I have now found it in most cases particulary when not wanting to move the van, to use a 5gal water container and submersible pump. Fetching the water is no problem on the trolly used also for the toilet cassette, and the 5gal is emptied in under 4mins, just time to chat with your neihbours, and getting some exercise oneself after a lazy day. chas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tina Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 Our old Compass Avantgarde had a power point near to the water fill point so that a submersable pump could be used to fill the tank if there was no hose filling available. Also handy if you want to fill up the tanks without moving the van while on site. The water filling point was high so tricky to use anything else to tip water into the tank as some people do. We still use this pump arrangement to fill the tank on our auto trail cheyenne as we don't always camp in places where there is hose filling. It does mean carrying an aquaroll. Or does the Autocruise not have on board tanks like a caravan/trailer? I have seen replacement water fill caps with the little tube going in so that you dont have to remove the cap to fill the tank although it would be a long slow process. Tina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 We too prefer the 'old fashioned' 2" wide hole into which you shove your hose. However without some sort of device (shop bought or home made in my case) to hold the hose in place it can fly out and shower everyone within a 10' radius with cold water - fun in summer warmth but not in winter chill! With the Autocruise system the hose does at least stay in place enabling you to do another job whilst the tank slowly fills, however it is a pain in the bum to fit and is very fiddly to clip in place. To overcome this I cut the hose very close to the regulator and fitted a hozelock snap on connector to each bit which makes the short connector bit much easier to wiggle about as you wrestle with the poorly designed fittings to get it to stay in place and then just clip the hose on to use. I guess the fitting is designed to be used by a caravan on site with a submersible pump and outside container and not to be disconnected too often? The remaining Autocruise hose is about 60' so I cut it into a 15' and a 45' length each one fitted with snap on connectors so that I only clip on the shortest length needed, as I can usually get quite close to most taps - unless the ground is soggy and not worth the risk. It works for me - but out of choice I would prefer the 2" filler. If it ain't broke don't fixit seems to apply here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breakaleg Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 best thing i ever bought from the nec, was a cap, which fits where the water filler cap goes, and the hose pipe is fitted to the the cap, when the hose is fitted to the tap, you dont need to hold either end, takes seconds to put together. and any tank thats sealed (no breather holes) there is a in line valve, that cuts the water off, when the tank is full. cost £10.00 pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 starspirit - 2007-02-09 10:17 AM We too prefer the 'old fashioned' 2" wide hole into which you shove your hose. However without some sort of device (shop bought or home made in my case) to hold the hose in place it can fly out and shower everyone within a 10' radius with cold water - fun in summer warmth but not in winter chill! .................... Don't you just love it when that happens? Also, have you noticed that it doesn't matter whether you make a dash for the end of the hose on the ground, or for the tap, the jet of water always follows you as you go? Memory of water? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 Derek Uzzell - 2007-02-09 9:35 AM MMM test reports on recent Autocruise motorhomes have mentioned them being fitted with a trailer-caravan-style fresh-water tank filling-point designed to take water from a container (Aquaroll or equivalent) via an external 12V submersible pump. Personally, I'd find this type of 'fill by wire' arrangement an absolute bugbear (though I can fully appreciate it may be perfect for other people) and I'd be interested to learn how Autocruise owners get on with the standard system and if anyone has converted it to 'fill by garden hose'. Hello DerekNo 1 drawback would seem to be that one now has to carry an empty Aquaroll, or similar, as well as a perfectly suitable on board tank (presumably also virtually empty), and the hose necessary to fill it. No wonder motorhomes just go on getting bigger and heavier. I think this is just a work creation scheme! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 A rather large German guy tripped over my hose in France last year and pulled it off the side of the van - no damage luckily. I was amazed by the high water pressure but fortunately the water magnet found him more attractive than me - probably because I had not showered for two weeks! The entente cordiale was maintained as it gave all within 100 yards a darned good laugh while we both did the hose dance - but not to water music. If you don't want to buy an adaptor for the 2" size filler a simple shaped wedge will work just as well and costs nowt made from scraps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonB Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 I could'nt agree with you more Derek, what a palaver. What can be simpler than putting a pipe in a hole and turning on a tap, and when needing a top-up using a 10ltr container, which takes us less than a minute. Submersible pumps (which fail), internal & external pump switching, restricted pipe sizes, filling from the lounge,agua rolls! It all seems nonsense to me. We have a provisional order in for a new Autocruise, subject to actually seeing the new model/chassis and discussions on changes we would like, accessories, etc. A change to the water filling system happens to be at the top of our list! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 We did consider an Autocruise before settling on our Rimor, one of the things that I just couldn't have lived with was the 'pumped water' filling, it would drive us nuts! Had we decided to buy one it would have been on the string understanding tha the ruddy thing was swapped for a normal filler. To keep your hoze in the hole, just jam in a small piece of hoze next to it, it still alows air in so no air lock and can be easily stored or replaced if it gets lost. We found, however, that by using one of the long spray nozzels (Hozelock) that you twist to use, the hoze sits nicely in the filler anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 9, 2007 Author Share Posted February 9, 2007 Thanks for the replies. I hadn't appreciated that it was possible to fill the water tank on Autocruise motorhomes via a hose & tap as well as from a container. Theoretically an excellent idea, but (based on the negative comments about ease of use and design) perhaps not so marvellous in practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 Hi Derek, I noticed from the posts that one of the problems with the 2" filler is keeping the hose connected to the MH when there is a high water pressure. With the Autocruise (Carver) method you don't have this problem. The supplied food grade hose with governor, simply clips into the wall mounted filling point, and will not drop out whatever the supply pressure is. As in common with other Autocruise owner posts, I too have cut the hose and inserted a hozelock universal connector, this allows me to attach a rollaway flat hose, as well as the rest of the hose supplied by Autocruise, should I be parked up to 30 metre's away from the supply. Coupled with the wired, switched and plug in, Aqua style caravan submersible pump, the ability to fill the fresh water tank through a large screw type hatch positioned centre lounge, gives a very comprehensive variety of filling methods. Perhaps it's not too late for those who have chosen a different type of MH because of bad information, to take their MH back and get an Autocruise? Regards Terry (Autocruise Stargazer - I hate that name...!) >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve OReilly Posted February 9, 2007 Share Posted February 9, 2007 My Autocruise has three ways of filling the water tank. Using the supplied hose and secure connector; using the supplied submersible pump; and filling via the large screwed inspection cap sited under a hatch in the floor. In five years of ownership I've never used the submersible pump. I cut the food-quality hose into two unequal lengths connected by a hoselock fixture as explained by others. After some years I realised that I never used the longer length so I no longer carry it. If I'm further from a tap than the hose will reach and don't wish to drive to the tap, I use a 5-gallon fresh water container and fill via the inspection cap under the floor. To make filling via the inspection cap easier I don't use the fitted carpets which press-stud to the floor. I've had off-cuts from the bedroom carpets bound along the edges and two of these cover almost all of the floor. Replacing the carpets was my wife's idea - easier to shake outside apparently. The 5-gallon water container we carry anyhow in case we wish to travel without water in the under-floor tank. Incidentally, using a shorter hose makes it easier to clean internally. The gunge that coats the inside looks disgusting. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 10, 2007 Author Share Posted February 10, 2007 The problem of high water-pressure blowing a hose out of the filler point can be avoided on most motorhomes by using an HEOS 'filler-cap' connector (see www.motorcaravanning.co.uk/shopuk/water_products.htm) as mentioned earlier in this thread. With my Hobby I can get the end of the water hose all the way down the connecting-tube between filler-inlet and the onboard water tank. As the hose outlet is then within the tank itself, refilling is very rapid (given sufficient water pressure) and the water hose stays put. On my Herald I wrapped a piece of hard foam rubber round the hose close to its end and then wrapped adhesive tape over the foam. This used to jam the hose in the filler inlet and (most of the time!) it cooperated by staying there. My original question was prompted by concern from a prospective Autocruise buyer that the filling system might be awkward to use for someone with manipulative difficulties. Starspirit's "as you wrestle with the poorly designed fittings" comment and Dave Hurrell's "It's fiddly to plug in the hose and twist the tiny tabs that hold it in place prior to turning on the water..." criticism in his 05/06 Starburst test-report suggest this may well be the case. For obvious reasons, filling the tank via its inspection cap is unlikely to be a practical option. This is clearly a 'design thing' and, while I can appreciate the merits of the system and the versatility it offers, I know I'd hate it. Presumably Autocruise see it as a selling-point, but it would be interesting to know whether Terry or Steve would have chosen it if there had been the normal 2" hole arrangement as an alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Hi Derek, I have never found the two water point retaining clips awkward to use, but I can see it would be awkward to use if you where less dexterous than is usual. I find connecting to the carver system can be accomplished with one hand, perhaps I am fortunate in not having rheumatism etc… Using the Autocruise method of connecting the main fresh water tank to the outside world with a fixed plumbed flexible half in hose, has permitted them to place the 90 ltr. tank in the best place on the vehicle, that is to say, below floor level centre of vehicle between the wheel base, by running the supply pipe unobtrusively under and around inside the lockers in a way a 2” pipe could never be fitted. Incidentally, the tank under the vehicle is fully insulated and hot air is blown from the central heating onto the top of the tank via ducting. The freshwater tanks previously fitted to the StarFire, Stargazer etc.. where generally about 60 ltrs and positioned either under a bed locker or wardrobe, so that direct access to the freshwater tank with a 2” filling tube was possible. This obviously took valuable space away from the user. Choosing between the two systems, I do much prefer the new system because of accessibility to the tank for cleaning is much easier, more user room available than the old Autocruise system layout, the vehicle is more stable and so many methods of filling. Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve OReilly Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Derek I wouldn't have chosen the Autocruise filling system if there had been a choice. I don't have a problem with connecting the hose as I'm fairly young, fit and healthy. In addition, it's exactly the same system fitted to my caravan so the 'Autocruise' submersible pump eventually found a use. The advantage with the fitted hose has been that when camped for any length of time on a pitch with a tap it can remain connected permanently (albeit only switched on when the tank needs filling). Winters in Spain come to mind. The disadvantage that I found was that the force exerted by the hose and operating the locking tabs eventually caused a small leak inside the van where the internal pipe was connected to the plastic filler. The plastic filler was screwed to the motorhome bodywork with self-tapping screws which ceased to hold it securely. I drilled right through the body and replaced the self-tapping screws with stainless steel nuts and bolts and sealant. I've had no further problems. If my cure hadn't solved the problem the next step would have been to significantly enlarge the hole in the bodywork and fit a 'normal' filler. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthony Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Having just purchased a Autocruise last December whilst on sites i have used both methods to fill water tank have no complaints at all in fact i think it is great as you don,t have to move to fill up whilst on site you fill up using a container and the pipe reaches to the ground i have filled by myself all you do is get eveything ready outside then select external pump when container empty you deselect pump job done a lot easier than taking down awning disconnectin power etc etc, great idea :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Hi Steve, Your third paragraph "The disadvantage", I think is a good valid point, I have always been aware at the back of my mind that it is a possible problem area, as a consequence always treated it with some favour whenever filling and especially if people are about nearby. On reflection, most appliances and fittings are not of a robust construction and have to be treated with more respect than similar fittings at home. I expect you have had non-caravanners/motorhome owners in the van, and you like me, keep one eye on them when they are about to open or close a window, locker, door etc... Our MH is some three years old, and lived in it for at least 4 months every year, so it has had the equivalent of one years continuous use, without anything breaking off, perhaps we are just lucky !! Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinners Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 It seems that great minds, do indeed, think alike. One of the first 'mods' on our Starblazer was to cut the supplied filling hose to about 6 feet and fit connectors. The external pump works well if on site for a few days. We use a metal entrance step (the Omnistep creaks and groans under excessive weight!!) placed under the offside window I can reach to operate the internal/external pump switch from outside. Water is fetched using the fire bucket. Step and bucket each with two uses, well worth carrying. To be honest I had my doubts about the Autocrise filling method until it was explained by the dealers (WCM). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve OReilly Posted February 10, 2007 Share Posted February 10, 2007 Terry Like you, I always keep an eye on non-camping visitors. It's true that equipment fitted to caravans and motorhomes is less robust than domestic equivalents. Also like you, we lived in the motorhome for an average of 4/5 months per year for the first three years of its life. For the last two years it has had an easier life because we bought a caravan which is permanently sited in the south of France. Visits to and from the caravan, a winter visit to Spain and trips within the UK have reduced the use to only 6/7 weeks per year. I don't think that my Autocruise is perfect but I have been impressed with its quality (particularly compared to the caravan). I'm also pleased with the fact that it's been designed and built for use rather than show. It would be perfect if it looked good as well!!!! I hope the new owners of Autocruise continue the policy of building functional motorhomes well. Regards Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizken Posted February 11, 2007 Share Posted February 11, 2007 Hi, We are Autoctuise owners, and to avoid using the long hose supplied, which usually stays at home, we carry a short length of flat hose, aoorox 15 feet on a cassette. This has been fitted with a hoselock tap fitting on one end, with 2 different size screw tap fittings and snap fitting, so that we can push or screw fit to most taps. The other end has been fitted with a carver fitting, similar to that fitted to the submersible pump hose, to clip into the van fitting, but without the electrical connection. It is now possible to connect tap to van, securely, and fill as required, without worrying about pumps or soaking from flying hoses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trigrem Posted February 11, 2007 Share Posted February 11, 2007 We have an Autocruise Starburst and find the alternative methods of filling to be convenient and helpfull. The time taken to fill by the resrtiction in pipe size has never proved a problem. On my previous motorhomes the first thing I fitted was an external 12 volt socket so that I could use a submersable pump to fill the tank. It is not always possible to use a hosepipe, and when I see owners trying to lift a water carrier above waist hight and pour it in via a funnel I know which method I prefer. If one always uses sites with accesable motorhome filling facilities then just using a hosepipe is o/k. We tend to use CL and CS sites together with Aires and Stellplatz when across the ditch. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted February 11, 2007 Share Posted February 11, 2007 Hi Ken, If you do not have the supplied pressure reducing valve on the carver end, you risk forcing the jubilee clips off of the internal plastic plumbing or encouraging seepage from the internal side of the wall fitting through to the tank connection, when your tap supply is at very high pressure. Some taps turned on with a push button, and don't give you the ability to regulate the delivery pressure. I think the flexible hose supplied with pressure reducing valve by Autocruise, is too rigid and could damage the carver wall plate, especially in the cold/freezing weather. I have just cut the supplied house leaving about 12" of the blue hose and put the hozelock universal connector on that, the hose which connects to the hozelock connector is a very flexible fabric covered rubber hose, which dosen't put a strain on the carver wallplate. Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted February 11, 2007 Share Posted February 11, 2007 The overflow in my Autocruise 90 ltr tank was about an inch below the top of the tank, and the pick up pipe was an inch above the floor of the tank and not even central. Correcting these two thingies with offcut bits of flexible plastic tube has extended our top up times by an extra day, and we now have a 90ltr usable capacity tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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