Sapper520 Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 I have hit the search button and things just get a bit technical. We are very close to closing a deal on a new Campervan. It will come pre-wired for a solar panel, from the factory, as part of the deal the dealer will fit a 130w panel and regulator/controller etc. It will also have two 95Ah / 18A leisure batteries. I know it depends on what accessories you intend to run, and since I don’t have the van to experiment, I was hoping someone on here could say if this would be a good off-grid set up? I know it depends on what we’ll be running and for how long, but with the order needing to be done soon l need to see if anyone else runs a similar system. Thanks in advance. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
insider Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Not an expert by any matter and sorry for not answering what you specifically asked but as you say individual use will make an enormous impact - so generically I would look at Regulator: Is it a known make such as Victron and is it MPPT(should be better than PWM)? Can it's charging profile be set to the type of batteries you will have fitted? Batteries: What type and make. What the DoD & no . cycles etc. Very very important. Placement: Just as BHP sells cars but torque wins races...how well does the 130w panel fit on your roof - is it shadowed by the aerial etc. Perhaps a 100w won't be. Have a look and place a piece of cardboard cut out to size up there to check for shadows -tv aerial, satellite dome etc Wiring: Perhaps the cheapest component but the most overlooked. Frequently wiring is not of sufficient quality and perhaps go for upgrade here if possible, esp from regulator to battery. Sorry not specific to your exact request. Relative newbie. Bought a van and doing research and starting to see that the solar panel is actually the cheapest part of the equation! Brilliant but equally head-wreaking resource is http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/ Apologies in arrears :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spirou Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Like you said, the answer is depends on maaaaany things. If you tend to drive each day for a few hours then a solar panel won't matter much as most charging will be via alternator. If you want to park somewhere for a week in winter then 130W won't be enough, but neither is 300+. Like mentioned above, there are a few details to check and get the most out of solar energy. Those are rarely done right by manufacturers. But a little bit of not much, especially in winter, won't change things significantly. Summer is a different game and 130W should keep up with light or normal consumption with a little bit of help from alternator every few days. If the seller is going to do all the work then read up on tips in the link provided above and try to make them do it correctly. In my experience it's not going to be easy if they have their own standard way of doing it. I chose to do it myself and only had them make a hole in the roof and pull the cables through. At the very least insist on regulator placement close to the battery and to use biggest cross section cable they can fit in the regulator terminals. Apart from shading you likely can't do a whole lot about, that will make the biggest difference. PWM vs MPPT regulator on a single small panel is largely not that important. Certainly not the famed 30%. But being able to set a charge profile to match battery type is. In summary, it's better than no solar panel and single battery :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapper520 Posted January 18, 2020 Author Share Posted January 18, 2020 Thanks for the replies. I’ve read a lot about this subject and would love the chance to experiment, but it’s a new factory order van, with the Dealer fitting the panel and regulator / charge controller. One of the questions , I have on my list to ask, is MPPT or PWM. We won’t be stationary for more than a couple of days before moving on. So I know all the if’s but’s and maybes about usage, but having no direct experience with this power source l was just looking for general experiences. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weldted Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Good luck with your new van, this may give you some idea, Mppt can make more use of available sunlight, a regulator with split charge to keep engine battery topped up, remember when van not in use and alarmed without charge engine battery will run down. Our current van new Sept 2019 came with one 100w solar panel 10 amp regulator and one 95 amp AGM battery, I fitted a second identical battery. Van is parked on our drive just south of Limoges with a clear view of sky if not used for a few days leisure battery slowly loses charge. This van has a high tec tracker and alarm so a drain on batteries. Out previous van had 300 watts of solar 2 Yuasa 100 EFB batteries from May till September would keep all three batteries full even if parked up for a few days with three or four hours of tv. In winter would maintain batteries fine and when south of Spain Portugal would allow three to fours days depending on weather. I would ask the dealer to fit cabling and regulator that would cope with 200 or 300 watts of Solar in case you want to add panels, even if you had to pay a small charge to do so. Our van wiring and regulator is not up to increasing the panels without upgrading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ocsid Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 If you really want to best exploit the investment in a quality MPPT solar controller the 300Watt panel needs to be one designed for that role. That is, it will need a higher voltage output than those aimed at PWM based 12 V system controllers, so the MPPT controller gets a reasonably high input voltage in the critical low light conditions. IMO improving the bright light performance is all a bit pointless as then even smaller panels can be adequate, in our case improving the poorer lighting performance is the more valuable goal. If the panel is the typical lower voltage type approaching 20 V output, then having the 300 Watts as two panels instead and wiring them in series so the MPPT controller sees twice that voltage it would from a single panel, is where I would go. If a single panel then it ought to be one with an output voltage around the 36 V figure. The specifics of what the installer offers, as others have said, tells you a lot about their competence in this field. In addition to the panel voltage what brand controller and where it is located are important aspects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spirou Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 To give you an idea... Our previous van had a 120W panel + MPPT regulator charging a 120Ah gel battery. Loads were Truma CP 6e, 3way fridge and standard LED lights, pump, etc. Also 12V TV was used for 1-2h on occasion but rarely. Standard use in winter had us down 20-30Ah per night. In summer it was more like 10-20Ah per night. As we rarely stay in one place for long our main problem was gas for heating, battery mostly got recharged well enough from alternator. If we were staying in one place (in winter) then we did 2, sometimes 3 days off EHU but had to plug in or drive afterwards. Yes, battery could probably take 1 more day but why make it work that hard. April to October, there was mostly enough charge from solar to keep electrics going indefinitely. New van has webasto diesel heating and compressor fridge which are bigger loads than before (rest about the same) which we counteract with 2x90Ah batteries and 320W (2x160 in series) of solar on the roof. This setup burns through roughly 10Ah more per night. How much of a difference the increased solar power makes? Right now hardly any. On a good sunny day at central european lattitudes (Alps) it might replace the consumed Ah. South of Spain probably wouldn't be an issue but north of the Alps it just doesn't stand a chance. We got 15W max in full sun in southern Finland around new year. The usual yield was 0-5Wh per day (overcast as usual) a bit further south in the baltics we got to 70Wh on a sunny day. In south of Poland and Slovakia we got to 150-250Wh per day. That had us at a deficit of 10-15Ah per day when staying in one place. So, maybe 4 days of not looking for a cable if weather cooperates. Will see how numbers change when fridge starts working harder but there won't be any heating load although I don't expect to be plugging in very often if ever. So for our very mobile use, we are essentially off grid all year and the only issues are liquids in/out. For others it's not going to be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete-B Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Hi, From one Sapper to another, previous 71 Fld Sqd. I've got two 80w panels linked together on my van but have to admit when we're away we mainly stay on sites with hook-up. But, do find they're invaluable during winter storage. We've got two 100amp leisure batteries and the engine battery so, the dual controller monitors both and It's also got the ability for me to choose what percentage goes to each. But, even then, with the sun so low during winter months and also a distinct lack of it they can sometimes struggle to maintain full charge on all three batteries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapper520 Posted January 18, 2020 Author Share Posted January 18, 2020 A big thanks for all the information. I think we may be okay with the 130w panel as I will be using the vehicle all year round, not only for holidays but a fair bit of day to day running about as well. Holidays will be on the move after 2 or 3 days. The van will be a new Sunlight Cliff 600, 2.3l 6 speed manual with engine upgraded to 140bhp. 2 x 95Ah / 18A AGM leisure batteries, led lighting, 90l compressor fridge, Combi 4 gas heater and 2 x 11kgs Gaslow refillable bottles (with filler externally mounted in the rear bumper, tidy looking as I inspected one today). I think for what we're looking to do, we should be happy with the set up. ;-) (Pete-B...….Once a Sapper...…. :-D ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceM Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 As you’ve identified, it absolutely depends on your usage profile. We have two 100W panels (200W total), a Votronic MPPT Duo controller and two 90Ah habitation batteries. First point, whatever is being fitted ensure that it also trickle charges the starter battery. Second point, our power usage is low, ie LED lighting and no interest in having a TV or inverter so our main power usage is the odd bit of laptop or mob charging or in the cool weather, running the heating which in a well insulated van does not have to run on full power for long (we’re not hot house flowers so about 17C). Also, the whole point of us having the van is to go places, not to sit in it so we’re out most of the day and when we are everything is turned off. Last October whilst in France it was cold. By midday each day the batteries registered as fully charged with AES available. Approaching the winter solstice it would have been a different matter of course, then I would guess, we'd have managed 4 to 6 days before needing to go for a drive. It’s also worth note that rain will reduce the solar harvest. Incidentally most of our usage is in continental Europe and we avoid campsites so no EHU. Third point, if it’s your thing to manually change charging profiles to suit different conditions that’s fine. However, what I like about the Votronic controller is that I can just fit it and forget it and then get on and enjoy the tour. This approach may or may not maximise the solar harvest, but frankly, for me there are more interesting things to be getting on with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceM Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Sapper520 - 2020-01-18 6:41 PM . . . 90l compressor fridge, Combi 4 . . . ;-) (Pete-B...….Once a Sapper...…. :-D ) Any reason you didn't opt for a (three way) gas fridge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 We manage easily with 150w panel, 80ah gel battery and Votronic duo controller, even in winter. If you find the battery is getting low after a day of black clouds, just leave the TV off for the night. A bright white cloudy day starts a 2 or 3 amps charge and all is well again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapper520 Posted January 19, 2020 Author Share Posted January 19, 2020 BruceM - 2020-01-18 7:09 PM Sapper520 - 2020-01-18 6:41 PM . . . 90l compressor fridge, Combi 4 . . . ;-) (Pete-B...….Once a Sapper...…. :-D ) Any reason you didn't opt for a (three way) gas fridge? Not an option on this vehicle I’m afraid. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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