Cattwg Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 This national speed limit change has since been reversed, but the French Government has said that it is up to local Mayors to decide whether or not to return to a 90km/h limit in their area. The fine for not carrying a breathalyser has been postponed indefinitely (an on the spot fine of €11 was due to be implemented on 1 March 2013). The above taken from the AA website. Is it me or could the above scenarios only happen in France? We really like France as a country and the French people that we have had contact with have all been pleasant and where necessary helpful. But to coin another Continental phrase. MAMMA MIA!!!!!!!! Cattwg :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 How about the UK’s speed limits that differ according to whether a vehicle’s maximum unladen weight is up to 3.05 tonnes or exceeds that weight? That’s pretty odd given that a vehicle’s maximum unladen weight is generally never specified. And then there’s the UK’s view of A-frame towing a car, where the car turns into a pumpkin. (No I’m wrong about - I was thinking of Cinderella and in the UK the car miraculously turns into a trailer). Ignoring basic differences like the UK and Ireland having 'left-hand traffic’ and the rest of Europe having ‘right-hand traffic’, It wouldn't surprise me if every European country’s motoriing regulations had some difference that might be considered unusual - for instance Portugal forbidding petrol in a jerry-can being carried in a vehicle. So, although the two things you’ve highlighted are specific to France, other European countries also have peculiar motoring regulations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-01-18 6:02 PM How about the UK’s speed limits that differ according to whether a vehicle’s maximum unladen weight is up to 3.05 tonnes or exceeds that weight? That’s pretty odd given that a vehicle’s maximum unladen weight is generally never specified. So, although the two things you’ve highlighted are specific to France, other European countries also have peculiar motoring regulations. Don't forget that if I plated my van at 4t+ even at max weight I could drive at higher speeds than the same van if it was an empty white van weighting less than half the weight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted January 18, 2020 Share Posted January 18, 2020 Making life more complicated employs more people Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 colin - 2020-01-18 6:58 PM Derek Uzzell - 2020-01-18 6:02 PM How about the UK’s speed limits that differ according to whether a vehicle’s maximum unladen weight is up to 3.05 tonnes or exceeds that weight? That’s pretty odd given that a vehicle’s maximum unladen weight is generally never specified. So, although the two things you’ve highlighted are specific to France, other European countries also have peculiar motoring regulations. Don't forget that if I plated my van at 4t+ even at max weight I could drive at higher speeds than the same van if it was an empty white van weighting less than half the weight! Perhaps you could clarify that statement, please? (UK speed limits listed below) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicepix Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 Cattwg - 2020-01-18 5:01 PM This national speed limit change has since been reversed, but the French Government has said that it is up to local Mayors to decide whether or not to return to a 90km/h limit in their area. The fine for not carrying a breathalyser has been postponed indefinitely (an on the spot fine of €11 was due to be implemented on 1 March 2013). The above taken from the AA website. Is it me or could the above scenarios only happen in France? We really like France as a country and the French people that we have had contact with have all been pleasant and where necessary helpful. But to coin another Continental phrase. MAMMA MIA!!!!!!!! Cattwg :-D The speed limit about turn is purely political. One person in Government has actively and noisily campaigned for years for a reduction from 90 to 80. He finally got his way causing a massive protest from almost everybody else. One of the things the 'Yellow Vests' added to their long list of grievances was the reduction in speed limits so Micron has tried to save face by giving the decision to the local authorities, effectively a complete about turn as that was where it rested before and they too had protested about the national change as they were getting it in the ear-hole from local voters. The problem now is that all local authorities were forced at their own expense to change the signs from 90 to 80 and now they face the decision of whether they can afford to replace some or all of the 80 signs with 90 signs and the looming prospect of somebody's widow laying the blame at their doorstep if a fatality occurs on a road they have increased the limit on. But if you think that the 80 or 90 is confusing try driving in rural Spain where speed limits can change every couple of hundred metres or so it seems, for no apparent reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breakaleg Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 I may be getting this wrong, (I often do) but, didn't they change the speed limits without changing the speed limit signs? If so, how will you know what the local dignitaries have decided on? You could be driving in a signed 90kph area where in fact it is still an 80kph area. Or have I got this wrong? Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 Perhaps you could clarify that statement, please? (UK speed limits listed below) My MH is under 3.05t unladen (even if I where to up plate the GVW) and speed limits are 30/60/70/70, the base vehicle is defined as a commercial vehicle and the limits are 30/50/60/70. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 breakaleg - 2020-01-19 10:14 AM I may be getting this wrong, (I often do) but, didn't they change the speed limits without changing the speed limit signs? Pete I drove several 1000's miles around France last year and think there was signage on most roads Heres a link to which depts have decided to raise the limits https://tinyurl.com/rbwlrox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matrix Meanderer Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 witzend - 2020-01-19 10:43 AM breakaleg - 2020-01-19 10:14 AM I may be getting this wrong, (I often do) but, didn't they change the speed limits without changing the speed limit signs? Pete I drove several 1000's miles around France last year and think there was signage on most roads Heres a link to which depts have decided to raise the limits https://tinyurl.com/rbwlrox Great! I just hope that the sat nav software companies are keeping up with all these non national changes :-D I'll be updating mine (again) before going through the Tunnel sous la Manche. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 breakaleg - 2020-01-19 10:14 AM I may be getting this wrong, (I often do) but, didn't they change the speed limits without changing the speed limit signs? If so, how will you know what the local dignitaries have decided on? You could be driving in a signed 90kph area where in fact it is still an 80kph area. Or have I got this wrong? Pete The arguments for reducing the French national speed-limit from 90km/h to 80km/h were that it should reduce road deaths and be ‘greener, and the reduction was to be a 2-year experiment. However, as has been highlighted here before, the reduction to 80km/h was further complicated where 3-lane roads were concerned. The general rule in France is that, when a speed-limit changes (upwards or downwards) a road-sign signals that change. Built-up areas are dealt with as mentioned here: Speed limits and other rules Here are the normal speed limits for driving in France: The normal speed limit on French motorways is 130 km/hr (just over 80 mph). - or 110 km/hr in rain. The normal speed limit on dual carriageways (divided highways) is 110 km/hr The normal speed limit on main roads is 80 km/hr (outside built-up areas). The normal speed limit in built-up areas is 50 km/hr – unless otherwise indicated. Note: there is not necessarily a specific speed-restriction sign at the entrance to a built-up area, particularly at the entrance to small villages. The name-board at the entrance to a village or town ( dark blue letters on an off-white background) automatically indicates a built-up area with a speed limit of 50 km/h, unless otherwise indicated. Police speed cameras are often set up in villages where traffic too often forgets to slow down. As Nicepix says, speed-limit signage was altered throughout France to reflect the 90km/h-to-80km/h reduction and - if a French departmental or local authority decided in future to alter the 80km/h limit on some or all of the roads it has control over - the existing signage would need revising appropriately. To be able to undo something requires that thing to be done beforehand, and the French do seem to have a problem historically regarding ‘undoing’ motoring regulations. Besides the breathalyser and speed-limit revisions mentioned by Cattwg, there was the proposed ban on speed-camera identification devices that would have prevented sat-navs being used in France and that, eventually, had to be sidestepped by the unique-to-France ‘danger zone’ sat-nav feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicepix Posted January 19, 2020 Share Posted January 19, 2020 Matrix Meanderer - 2020-01-19 2:53 PM witzend - 2020-01-19 10:43 AM breakaleg - 2020-01-19 10:14 AM I may be getting this wrong, (I often do) but, didn't they change the speed limits without changing the speed limit signs? Pete I drove several 1000's miles around France last year and think there was signage on most roads Heres a link to which depts have decided to raise the limits https://tinyurl.com/rbwlrox Great! I just hope that the sat nav software companies are keeping up with all these non national changes :-D I'll be updating mine (again) before going through the Tunnel sous la Manche. Let's just hope that the sat-nav software companies actually get informed of the changes by local authorities. Given how slow they are to submit details of new roads and roundabouts I won't hold my breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 20, 2020 Share Posted January 20, 2020 The following link is to a longish December 2019 piece about the 80km/h-back-to-90km/h issue and GPS mapping is mentioned https://www.lepoint.fr/automobile/securite/retour-au-90-km-h-ou-pas-les-elus-manipules-par-matignon-21-12-2019-2354375_657.php Even those French departments that are keen to raise the present 80km/h limit will have constraints placed on them regarding which roads they can justify ‘uprating’ the present speed limit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFrenchConnection Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 It's not just the roads... When we came to sell a property which we'd renovated the ancient 'fosse' (septic tank} failed to conform, as we had expected. The official survey said 'you will have to replace it' So we started to replace it - large hole dug, big plastic tank lowered in. 'Stop, stop !' said the local Mairie 'you need permission to have a fosse'. "But we already had a fosse, and you told us to replace it'. 'Yes, we know that. But you still have to have a survey done and fill in all the forms to get permission to have a fosse' 'But... but we already had one and you... oh never mind. where are all the forms' . And that was just the beginning. Everything you have heard about French bureaucracy is true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-01-19 2:06 PM...………………………………........................Here are the normal speed limits for driving in France: 1 The normal speed limit on French motorways is 130 km/hr (just over 80 mph). - or 110 km/hr in rain. 2 The normal speed limit on dual carriageways (divided highways) is 110 km/hr ...................................... I'm sure most will already know this, but just in case! 1 There are some stretches of toll-free autoroute where the speed limit is 110 km/hr. 2 Note the caveat regarding "divided highways". I'm pretty certain that there are still a few sections of 4 lane "dual carriageway" where there is no physical central barrier (i.e. just road paint marking/separating the lanes), and this will not automatically authorise a 110 km/hr speed limit. If no higher limit is indicated, it will be safest to assume that the national 80 km/hr speed limit applies - whatever speed the local traffic is adopting! 3 Three lane roads (i.e. roads with no central reservation, and with an overtaking lane denoted by road paint only). These usually switch after a few kilometres to favour overtaking in the opposite direction, and so on. In either direction (i.e. with or without the overtaking lane) the national 80 km/hr limit should be assumed unless otherwise indicated (a few do have a 90 km/hr limit indicated - most commonly, but not exclusively, for the direction with the overtaking lane). There seems to be quite widespread confusion among French drivers as to the applicable limit in the direction with the overtaking lane, with many assuming that the overtaking lane indicates a limit of 90 km/hr. The only safe (legal) assumption outside built-up areas is that the national 80 km/hr limit will apply unless otherwise indicated. Since these changes are ongoing, don't rely on sat-nav mapping to be fully up to date: the sat-nav maps invariably lag the situation on the ground. It is absolutely essential to rely on the Mk 1 eyeball at all times! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicepix Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 TheFrenchConnection - 2020-01-21 10:08 PM It's not just the roads... When we came to sell a property which we'd renovated the ancient 'fosse' (septic tank} failed to conform, as we had expected. The official survey said 'you will have to replace it' So we started to replace it - large hole dug, big plastic tank lowered in. 'Stop, stop !' said the local Mairie 'you need permission to have a fosse'. "But we already had a fosse, and you told us to replace it'. 'Yes, we know that. But you still have to have a survey done and fill in all the forms to get permission to have a fosse' 'But... but we already had one and you... oh never mind. where are all the forms' . And that was just the beginning. Everything you have heard about French bureaucracy is true! I have heard that some people have been told to replace their fosse which as you say, these days needs planning permission and enhanced costs. But there is a loophole where they can pay the nominal fine annually, I think it is less than €50, and not change the fosse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFrenchConnection Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 Absolutely true, and much the cheaper option. Unfortunately we were selling on as a restoration project and the Notaire wouldn't complete the sale until the fosse complied. Believe me, we tried every argument! The word 'fosse' is used as an expletive in our house now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted January 23, 2020 Share Posted January 23, 2020 Same in the UK, our cess pit has worked for about 200 years, but to install a proper, more efficient septic tank will need an environmental survey, water tests and so far, a year's discussions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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