Pipkim Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 It seems that compressor fridges are becoming more popular these days. Consideration is being given to a bespoke PVC that would incorporate a largish compressor fridge/freezer and a Combi diesel heater. This would do away with the requirement for large gas cylinders or tanks. However, a small canister/cylinder type gas hob would also be included along with an induction hob. Our main way of heating up food would be by microwave [when on hook up obviously]. We tend to normally use hook up but, for the odd days of wild camping [two nights at most], we are concerned that two leisure batteries might not be enough to power the fridge & heater [+ lighting & TV] without a solar power option included. Having only had absorption fridge/freezers on our motorhomes, we are seeking peoples experience of the above scenario. Thanks in advance, Pilgrim Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 The "green" technology package of the future for campervans and motorhomes has yet to emerge and currently I don't see how compressor fridges are viable without relying on a hook up (i.e. using a campsite) each night, which wouldn't suit lots of touring patterns. We tour almost exclusively abroad and rely of stopping mostly at Aires and mostly withot EHU. With an adsorption fridge running of gas and a solar panel to top up a single leisure battery, which is enough for lights and TV with power to spare, we can tour independently indefinitely if we want to, refuelling with diesel and LPG as necessary - we can even use the laundrettes at Intermarche supermarkets at the same time! These refueling options won't last forever of course but I think it's too early to choose an alternative system yet, even if buying a brand new MH which you want to keep for 10 years plus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Hi Phil, RP Motorhomes near Harrogate specialise in van conversions but as standard include a Lithium battery system (including Victron solar charger, DC-DC charger, Battery Monitoring System, Battery protect and, usually, a large inverter) with a diesel/240v water space heater and 12v fridge/freezer. Not sure but I think it is also possible to have a halogen hob as an option but certainly a microwave to run off the inverter. An underslung gas tank is standard for the hob/oven only. The key to all of that is the Lithium system which, of course, can be charged using solar power or an inboard charger when on hookup but more especially by running the engine which, even at tickover, can put 30 amps an hour back into the batteries. But, its not as simple or as cheap as standard leisure battery system and does require all the above component parts to give truly off grid camping. Although we also have a standard 3 way fridge I recently had RP install a 220ah lithium system in our Bourton and am presently using it to good effect whilst locked down at a marina in France with no hookup and some (but not a lot of) sun. So far it is a revelation. So much so that I would consider replacing the fridge with a 12v version as I have no doubts the 12v system could handle it even though we are not presently driving between destinations. Regards David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pipkim Posted November 10, 2020 Author Share Posted November 10, 2020 Thanks David & Pam, I will e-mail you directly. P & K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 A ‘gasless’ motorhome has been a practical proposition for quite some time, provided that the vehicle’s owner does not insist on cooking a Xmas dinner for 12 people. Webasto has marketed a diesel-fuelled hob for several years https://pbautoelectrics.co.uk/shop/webasto-diesel-cooker-x100-wa90000b/ and the diesel-fuelled WALLAS XC Duo combines a hob and heater https://www.kuranda.co.uk/product/wallas-xc-duo-combined-hob-heater/ The WALLAS product is probably more suitable for a smallish campervan and is discussed on the VW T6 forum https://www.t6forum.com/threads/diesel-hob-vs-gas-hob.13552/ Autonomy-wise, there are at least two systems to recycle a motorhome’s grey water - NOMAD’O and Ezawater https://www.wikicampers.fr/blog/recycler-ses-eaux-usees-avec-nomado/ https://www.camping-car.com/video-actualites/24857-test-exclusif-ezawater-le-filtre-a-eaux-grises-pour-camping-car but I don’t think any company has (yet) offered a product to recycle ‘black' waste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeco Posted November 11, 2020 Share Posted November 11, 2020 There is a Sydney based campervan converter/ motorhome builder called Trakka https://trakka.com.au/ that has had gasless conversions for several years. Using A Webasto hob, they call it "diesel cooking". They have a good reputation and often take a different way to achieve an outcome. Not sure about using "diesel cooking" to market a product , reminds me of hydrocarbon flavoured chicken tikka!! Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peejay Posted November 11, 2020 Share Posted November 11, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-11-10 6:33 PM snipped ....but I don’t think any company has (yet) offered a product to recycle ‘black' waste. Several years ago the German converter HRZ Reisemobile produced a system called the 'Aqualizer' which claimed to do just that... "The HRZ Aqualizer biologically decomposes feces, urine and toilet paper and converts them completely into gray water." There is still some information out there, mainly in German on their website, but for whatever reason it doesn't seem to have taken off since it was first announced... https://www.hrz-reisemobile.de/pages/startseite/aqualizer.php There are a few links to German motohome magazine reviews of the product (in German obviously) in the link above Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsrider Posted November 11, 2020 Share Posted November 11, 2020 Pipkim - 2020-11-10 3:08 PM It seems that compressor fridges are becoming more popular these days. Consideration is being given to a bespoke PVC that would incorporate a largish compressor fridge/freezer and a Combi diesel heater. This would do away with the requirement for large gas cylinders or tanks. However, a small canister/cylinder type gas hob would also be included along with an induction hob. Our main way of heating up food would be by microwave [when on hook up obviously]. We tend to normally use hook up but, for the odd days of wild camping [two nights at most], we are concerned that two leisure batteries might not be enough to power the fridge & heater [+ lighting & TV] without a solar power option included. Having only had absorption fridge/freezers on our motorhomes, we are seeking peoples experience of the above scenario. Thanks in advance, Pilgrim Phil I've got a dometic crx 65 compressor fridge. You just learn how to be savvy with them in order to maximize battery life. Get the fridge cold before you leave home and then they are then very efficient. Two 100amp leisure batteries would easily power my fridge on setting 2 for three days. It has a setting range 1 to 4 with 4 being the coldest. When the engine is on we run the fridge on 4 then turn it down to 2 when we arrive at site if we are non hook up. On the notion of being gas less, I've just fitted a non gas 240v water heater in the van. Very effective for us as we are generally always on hook up. It is a webasto isotemp 20 litre heater. It can be heated by engine coolant water too if I choose to do so. That is a project for the winter. The blown air heater is also the propex hs2000e which is dual gas and electric. We always run it on electric. We carry a low wattage kettle and toaster to cut down on gas use. This year we have been away 30 nights in the van and have used about half a 7kg gas bottle. I think most of that consumption was the oven which we use a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pipkim Posted November 11, 2020 Author Share Posted November 11, 2020 Thanks for all those constructive responses. Food for thought......... PilgrimPhil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 11, 2020 Share Posted November 11, 2020 peejay - 2020-11-11 10:49 AM Derek Uzzell - 2020-11-10 6:33 PM snipped ....but I don’t think any company has (yet) offered a product to recycle ‘black' waste. Several years ago the German converter HRZ Reisemobile produced a system called the 'Aqualizer' which claimed to do just that... Thanks for that information - I wasn’t aware of the HRZ Aqualizer product and I had more in mind recycling ‘black waste’ into fresh water (which the NOMAD’O and Ezawater systems do with ‘grey water’) rather than storing processed black waste in a motorhome’s grey water tank. I notice that the suggested cost of Aqualizer was around €2000, which may have been off-putting. Thetford recently launched a system to reduce a motorhome toilet's water usage https://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/motorhomes/news/thetford-revolutionises-motorhome-sanitation-with-smart-toilet-system and the U-Klean system retro-fitted a macerating pump to a toilet cassette to facilitate emptying. http://www.camping-car-webzine.fr/fiche-u-klean.html (Coincidentally, there’s a 4-page article in the latest issue of MMM Magazine (December 2020, Pages 132-135) that discusses the merits/demerits of diesel, gas or electricity as a motorhome ‘habitation fuel’) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 11, 2020 Share Posted November 11, 2020 trialsrider - 2020-11-11 11:25 AM ...On the notion of being gas less, I've just fitted a non gas 240v water heater in the van. Very effective for us as we are generally always on hook up. It is a webasto isotemp 20 litre heater. It can be heated by engine coolant water too if I choose to do so. That is a project for the winter... I had gained the impression from an earlier forum thread https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Truma-14-litre-boiler-installation/56487/ that you had actually committed to buying a Truma 14litre 230V-only water boiler. Did there turn out to be a problem with that, or did you eventually conclude that 14 litres would be inadeqate for your needs, or did you decide that a ‘calorifier’ (which the Webasto Isotemp product is, but the Truma water heater is not) would be a better choice as you could exploit engine heat while travelling and 230V when parked up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trialsrider Posted November 11, 2020 Share Posted November 11, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-11-11 2:13 PM trialsrider - 2020-11-11 11:25 AM ...On the notion of being gas less, I've just fitted a non gas 240v water heater in the van. Very effective for us as we are generally always on hook up. It is a webasto isotemp 20 litre heater. It can be heated by engine coolant water too if I choose to do so. That is a project for the winter... I had gained the impression from an earlier forum thread https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Truma-14-litre-boiler-installation/56487/ that you had actually committed to buying a Truma 14litre 230V-only water boiler. Did there turn out to be a problem with that, or did you eventually conclude that 14 litres would be inadeqate for your needs, or did you decide that a ‘calorifier’ (which the Webasto Isotemp product is, but the Truma water heater is not) would be a better choice as you could exploit engine heat while travelling and 230V when parked up? Hi Derek. Yes the supplier let me down. It is annoying when suppliers take payment yet don't have the stock to supply. It prompted me to rethink and I am glad I did. It has excellent insulation properties, bigger volume and an easier shape to install. It also came with a thermostatic mixer valve with built in pressure valve and drain facility. I am tempted to do the engine coolant idea but that will be a later project. Retrofitting the hot water system has been good fun but hard work. I've kept all the piping inside the van as we often go away in sub zero weather. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 Wouldn't be without my 4 burner hob, under grill and oven. End of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 chas https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/IDENTIFYING-YOUR-MOTORHOME/54713/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsilvergs Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 We have up to from 100 to 450 Watts of solar panels which charge a 95Ah AGM battery (soon to be swapped for X2 LiFePO4). What is good with so much solar is that in sunny weather there is enough power to run our Thetford 3-way fridge freezer on 220 VAC from a 12/500 Victron Phoenix inverter. We can go for weeks on a single 11Kg LPG bottle in the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spirou Posted November 12, 2020 Share Posted November 12, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-11-10 7:33 PM but I don’t think any company has (yet) offered a product to recycle ‘black' waste. Scandinavians market a bunch of "dry" toilets that incinerate your waste so you only need to dispose of ash every now and then. They either run on gas or electricity. Mostly these are designed for off grid cabins but I seem to remember seeing one that was aimed at MH market. Ridiculously expensive to be "green" though. Still, better than dealing with poop in some remote cabin. MH definitely have it easier when it comes to that. Back to original post...outside of Scandinavian lattitudes mid winter I have no problem going gas less. 11kg gas tank we have for cooking lasts a whole year so we might switch to a smaller one at some point. We use diesel for heating and a compressor fridge. 320W of solar panels are useless then anyway so alternator charging takes most of the load to recharge 180Ah of lead batteries. This obviously means you need to drive around quite a bit but that mostly suits me just fine. Skiing in the Alps is much easier though, unless I'm stuck in place and there's several days of clouds and snow. But April/March to November there are no limits with electricity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteH Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 Treatment of "Black" (sewage) has been around for many years. the issue is scaling it down to a level which can be incorporated into a Motorhome, at a price that is "affordable". The systems used in the Earth Space Station cost (literally) Thousands to build. As Scouts, we where shown how to properly dig, and restore our latrines. on annual Scout Camp. A week after leaving, you would have been hard put to find the location. Marine "seaway" systems as far back as the 60`s, produced water which was actually stated to be Potable. I assumed it is, but declined to try it when offered!. I suspect that LPG will be around as long as I need to access it. And for my needs is adequate. We even had Gas lights in my first caravan!. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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