Grey Funnel Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Fitted seat belts to two seats that face each other, have now been told that they are illegal for fitting child seats there. Can not find the relevant regulation. Anybody help!!!! *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Hi Try: http://www.thinkroadsafety.gov.uk/advice/childcarseats01.htm http://www.childcarseats.org.uk/choosing/fitting.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikey72 Posted June 11, 2007 Share Posted June 11, 2007 Hi, It also depends on the age of the child, any child under 3 MUST have a proper car seat, and seat belt, and any child up to 12 must have a proper car seat, if a belt is used, since July 2006. Car seats are only tested and approved for forward facing seats, hence they cannot be used in rear facing or sideways facing seats. The website is http://www.thinkroadsafety.gov.uk/advice/seatbelts.htm It states "Children 3 years and over can only travel in the back of a vehicle without seat belts (e.g. a classic car) and those under 3 years cannot be carried at all. "Child from 3rd birthday up to 135cms in height (approx 4'5") (or 12th birthday, whichever they reach first) - Correct child restraint must be used where seat belts fitted. Must use adult belt in rear seat if correct child restraint not available" Motor caravans are not exempt. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Funnel Posted June 16, 2007 Author Share Posted June 16, 2007 Have looked at the sites listed on the two replies above, not much help but having contacted contacted the RoSPA, one of the listed sites part of the reply from the Road Safety Officer is "I can find no law against seating children in rear facing seats". This was in reply to my query re fixed rear facing seats in a motorcaravan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 OK Grey, so who told you it was illegal in the first place? D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikey72 Posted June 16, 2007 Share Posted June 16, 2007 Hi I believe the problem is the issue with use of a car seat. Any child under 3 MUST have a proper car seat, and seat belt. As car seats are only approved for three point, forward facing seats, and in some cases, 2 point, forward facing seats, these seats cannot be used for children under three in a side or rear facing position. Hence children under three cannot be carried apart from forward facing in the cab, without an active airbag. No exceptions. Any child up to 12 must have a proper car seat, if a belt is used, since July 2006. (subject to a height limit) Again car seats are only tested and approved for forward facing positions, with three point belts, hence they cannot be used in rear facing or sideways facing positions. If you use a lap belt in a forward facing position, as some car seats are not approved for use with a two point belt, there is an exemption if all the other seats are full, to use the lap belt for a child, over three, without a car seat. Mainly in place for older cars, but should also cover the forward facing lap belts in motorcaravans. No exceptions for sideways or rear facing positions. Quote from the C&C C site “Q: Can I carry my children in the back of my old motorhome that has no rear passenger seat belts? A: New regulations governing the way in which children travel in vehicles have just been introduced. These require that under-threes must use an appropriate child restraint in all cases - there are no exemptions for vehicles without seat belts. From three, children under 12 and up to 135cm height must use an appropriate child restraint where seat belts are fitted, but are allowed to travel unrestrained in the rear of a vehicle if no seat belts are fitted. “ You will have to forgive the question, but did you ask RoSPA about the use of the seat belts, with the age of the children, and the use of car seats. I would be interested from a personal point of view, as my children travel in the back, (and the front), but in forward facing positions. Thanks Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Funnel Posted June 21, 2007 Author Share Posted June 21, 2007 The twins are 12 month old, the seats face each other either side of the sliding side door and are secured with three point mounting belts. Problem solved, my daughter has dumped the van and gone back to using a car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MandyAndy Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Just wanted to add that the height is the main issue apparently, 12 is the maximum, my daughter was 7 in March and is only 3cm short of the legal height limit and she is by no means the tallest in her class. We use a hard booster seat when on short trips around this country, but a softer thick cushion when going longer distances, the belt still cuts across the neck a bit otherwise. Mandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 A proper child seat fitted into a rear facing seat with a proper thyree-point seat belt is surely legal? If it isn't, will someone please point me to chapter and verse. It is important that the child seat supports the child's head, but I think they all do so. A rear-facing seat is MUCH safer in almost any crash than a forward facing one. Why else would RAF Transport Command fit rear-facing seats for the troops? Only when a stationary vehicle is pushed forward by being rear-ended does the child's head depart from the seat back, potentially causing whiplash. And most of these crashes are relatively low speed. But it does that in a forward-facing seat in any crash into a vehicle in front - much more common (for every rear-ending there's a frontal crash for the vehicle behind, and then there are all the other frontal crashes into oncoming vehicles, ditches, lampposts, etc.) Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Surely at 12 months old the children should be in apropritae seats, almost all of which for children of that age are rearwards facing but designed to be restrained by a conventional three point harness on a forward facing seat. My guess is that one of these seats would be on a rearwards facing seat and therefore the three point harness is not securing it in the manner intended by the child seat's designer. Or did I miss something? You still haven't told us who said it was illegal in the first place. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikey72 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Hi, the whole point is that where required a child who needs to be should be in a properly fitted, approved childseat. All type testing and approval of these seats are for use in a forward facing vehicle seat, usually with a three point, but sometimes two point belt. Any child seat you buy will specify this in the fitting. They cannot be used sideways, they cannot be used facing backwards. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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