david lloyd Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Had my IH Tio serviced at the knottingley factory yesterday and got a sneak preview of the new line up of vans that will be launched at the NEC show - and boy are they different! IH were the first converters to replace standard glass in rear doors of their conversions with a specially commissioned double glazed unit. They followed that with their unique rear panel replacing the rear doors altogether and making it a much more useable space inside. Now they have done it again and made a coachbuilt out of a panel van. Some brilliant design and engineering work that looks set to redefine what is possible with a panel van conversion. Can't get to the NEC show myself but anyone looking to change or downsize to a van conversion should really try to get there to see these. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 And a few more details of their new design are here... Link. Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dicksob Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Ian Hartley is one of the most innovative designers in the uk Motorhome industry. For a small privately owned company with limited resources to develop, manufacture and launch such a vehicle is just fantastic. Whether you like it or not, you have to admire the drive and ambition to create it. More power to his elbow and I hope it's a great success! Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 That look interesting...I bet the price is,too..... ;-) Mind you, it is about time someone produced something a little bit different...instead of the usual "fan faring", of a new range of soft furnishings... or coloured LEDs...etc *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 I sincerely hope IH's slide-out design gets more buyer take-up than the Manhattan Tardis marketed about 13 years ago. I'm wary of of replacing large chunks of factory-painted metal with GRP equivalents. GRP is a less stable material than steel and, while colour matching the GRP bits with the rest of the vehicle should be achievable at the build stage, whether the colours continue to match several years down the line remains to be seen. Some of the attractions of a PVC are surely its 'tough' all-metal body and the ready availability of replacement bodywork parts if the vehicle is damaged. Replacing steel body-panels wth GRP ones conflicts with those attributes. I wish IH well, but I do remember the company having a rocky time financially not long ago and having to contract (dropping their coachbuilt models). Presumably things are OK now http://www.ihmotorhomes.com/news.php but, while I know that the motorcaravanning press adores innovation, I'm less sure that motorhome buyers seek it or are prepared to pay for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the general Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 You are right Derek , I work in a boatyard and it can be a night mare matching colours on grp if it's not broken why change it ! Also do coach builds suffer from crazing (grp) like yachts ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Although it's probably for reasons of weight,I'm a bit surprised they've ditched the whole door assembly..I would've thought that they'd be some way of reducing the weight of the doors, whilst still retaining the original structure and skin... It will be interesting to see how the grp manages to match up against the original panels,in terms of the surface finish, the way it takes paint...and the way it retains both.... :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Far from a new idea...... plus I dont like it for reasons given by Derek and Pepe...the German company La Strada have been doing it for years..The various Nova models are on Merc vans. they are very impressive ....100,000€ though! :-S http://www.lastrada-mobile.de/?app=configurator&category=1&itemid=10&menuid=3&languageid=1 If you want a luxury van conversion there are quite a lot of German Merc based vans available.. with no GRP extensions to worry about*-) EDIT: I'm down in Spain on an awful wifi connection..just managed to open link...sorry I have no interest in slide outs, seem a bit silly to be honest....29 deg here and beach packed...left Monday was swimming in pool after lunch yesterday.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muswell Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-10-10 4:16 PM If you want a luxury van conversion there are quite a lot of German Merc based vans available.. with no GRP extensions to worry about*-) No, just the dreaded Sprinter rust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 IH motorhomes, whether van conversions or coachbuilt have always been at the leading edge of innovation and design. Then Ian goes and spoils it all by putting his initials on everything such as cabinets and soft furnishings. Whilst I admire Ian's immense achievements, I could never bring myself to drive around in his ego. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-10-10 4:16 PM Far from a new idea...... plus I dont like it for reasons given by Derek and Pepe...the German company La Strada have been doing it for years..The various Nova models are on Merc vans. they are very impressive ....100,000€ though! :-S The IH vehicle is a panel van with GRP door/slide-out modifications, whereas La Strada's 'coachbuilt' Nova starts life as a chassis-cab on to which a monocoque GRP body is grafted. Historically (and quite possibly currently) the moulded GRP body for the Nova was made in the UK by the same company that supplied GRP bodies to Auto-Sleepers. In fact, if you look at Cheltenham Laminating's website home-page, you'll see a photo of an inverted Nova bodyshell. http://www.cheltenham-laminating.co.uk/ I note that a major investor in IH Motorhomes is Ian Birdsall, who is also involved with boat building. This might explain why GRP has been chosen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted October 10, 2013 Author Share Posted October 10, 2013 Brock - 2013-10-10 6:49 PM IH motorhomes, whether van conversions or coachbuilt have always been at the leading edge of innovation and design. Then Ian goes and spoils it all by putting his initials on everything such as cabinets and soft furnishings. Whilst I admire Ian's immense achievements, I could never bring myself to drive around in his ego. I have always advised people who are really interested in buying a new IH and did not like the logos to simply ask Ian or Nicola to leave them - they are much more accommodating than some of the high volume manufacturers! However, you'll be pleased to know Brock that nearly all the interior logos have been left off the new designs. Derek, IH have been using the GRP rear panel for many years now and there are many older vans out there that show no discernible colour differences between the GRP paintwork and that on the steel panels. I believe one of the major reasons for choosing that material on the slide out was, in fact, to eliminate the usual problems associated with heavy slide out sections leading to leaks when in the open position due to the sheer weight on the mechanism. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted October 10, 2013 Share Posted October 10, 2013 Sounds interesting, look forward to seeing one. But as Derek points out, here's one built down the road from me earlier. http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/userfiles/file/MMM%20historic%20road%20tests/lores%20Manhattan%20Tardis%20on%20Fiat%20Ducato%202.8JTD%20.pdf And of cause the replacement 'caravan' type door has been discussed on this forum several times. Usually look at the IH vans at shows as they are quite a spectacle, but we've never seen one that meets our needs, wonder if this one could tempt me to part with the Campscout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamw Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-10-10 4:16 PM ...sorry I have no interest in slide outs, seem a bit silly to be honest.... If this is the case why not simply resist the temptation to contribute and leave it to those who are interested? David, thanks for the posting it's always interesting to hear of new developments. Probably of more value is how the additional space has been used inside. The slide out it appears extends only a short distance and judging from the roof lights in the picture it probably extends the lounge area a short distance. In a van conversion a small area can make a vast difference. Look forward very much to seeing it at the NEC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crinklystarfish Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 Good on them for giving it a go, though, as has been said, it's not a new idea. I'm most interested in what real-world usable space it actually liberates inside. Replacing the sliding door with a 'proper' caravan door is the biggest improvement for me (though again, not a new idea). What with that and the 'standard' rear panel replacement, there is the potential to be very refined. Definitely more motorhome than white van man. If this guy was called Franz Friedrich and made his stuff in Germany I dare say the British van buying public would be falling over itself to buy from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 If I was thinking of buying one,I'd really need to see the "bare bones" of it,before everything got covered up... Also: How durable/reliable is all the sliding gear mechanism?... Does it need periodic adjustment?(..has it got any?).... What are the "wear" items(slipper blocks/rollers/bearings etc?),are they serviceable?..and will I be able to source them a few years down the line?.... Will it rattle'n'squeak ?... Will the panel lines continue to line up?....... Will it leak?? :-S I do like the concept and I wish them well with it(..and firms/models that do little more than showcase a new range have scatter cushions, have never really done it for me... (lol) ) ... but if I was going to be parting with the sorts of cash this'll probably go for, then I'd need some reassurances... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolero boy Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 crinklystarfish - 2013-10-11 9:14 AM If this guy was called Franz Friedrich and made his stuff in Germany I dare say the British van buying public would be falling over itself to buy from him. ........and all the Anti British brigade on here would be having a field day ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted October 11, 2013 Author Share Posted October 11, 2013 Pepe, crinkly and graham, How the new design changes the available space is beyond description in mere words but is immediately apparent on inspection so seeing them in the flesh, so to speak, is the only real way of assessing how the changes would work for each individual. Even publicity and magazine photographs would not give a true picture or feel for the living space. What I can say is that having spoken to Ian Hartley about the very points you raise it is clear he started from a position of "why didn't other attempts work well and how can I design it to ensure it will work" ? I know he is a time served pattern maker by trade so the fit of the new panels and slide out section are impeccably blended in. He seems to have gone to great lengths to source a well engineered hydraulic and electrical system for the slide out and has also designed a triple sealing system to eliminate the risk of water ingress one of the major weak points of slide outs, particularly on big RV's I understand. If you get to the show and want any more detailed information about the design and build then grab a word with Ian - he designed them from scratch and I'm sure would be happy to answer any questions you may have. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazdog6007 Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 very brave idea and wish it well.camper door in place of a slider.thats for me.this being the only thing i would change on my a/s warwick.slide out? to pay more for the price of a couple of square feet than a flat in chelsea,cant see it. :-S 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muswell Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 I met someone with Manhattan Tardis a couple of years ago and while it may only have been a few extra square feet it transformed the lounge area. During our stay he sold it to someone else on the site who was equally impressed, he himself was buying a fiftth wheeler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted October 11, 2013 Share Posted October 11, 2013 grahamw - 2013-10-11 9:05 AM JudgeMental - 2013-10-10 4:16 PM ...sorry I have no interest in slide outs, seem a bit silly to be honest.... If this is the case why not simply resist the temptation to contribute and leave it to those who are interested? instead of attempting to tell me what to do, why dont you read what I said properly...and stop trying to engineer discussion/debate.... nowhere in David's opening post, does it mention slide out...so I wrongly assumed from the description, as I could not open link that it was a GRP body extension.....Sorry if my attitude falls short of fawning adulation...but still think far better designs of panel vans around if you care to expand your vision. I was genuinely disappointed when I actually saw it after the description. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crinklystarfish Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Well, I had a look at the latest 'caravan door' style IH offerings and in quality terms I would say they are unsurpassed. Probably as good as it's possible to expect from any 'mainstream' converter who still has to keep the price realistic, and still make profit. Whether prices are considered reasonable is one for any potential customer, not tyre kickers. I think the caravan door panel makes a huge difference to the overall 'feel' of the product. The slideout does open up the space really effectively. I did see one or two bits and bobs that I'd personally have built a bit tidier and I would really have liked the opportunity to have a look in the darkest recesses. Not possible at the show though, that would be one for the factory. On the face of it, top drawer stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rolandrat Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 I was at the show yesterday and looked at the IH offerings. I was impressed with the side door on the "N" class range but not the slide out "Tardis". I thought they were supposed to be camper vans but they are taking them to a higher level. The stand location will be a plus as AutoTrail are opposite and their Van conversion offering leaves much to be desired. For a company part of the Trigano Group you would have thought they could have done far better. I don't think their panoramic fronted roof does them any favours, they seem trouble ahead to me once the seals denature with age. Vantage and Wildex looked good as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolero boy Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Went to the IH stand today and, although not really PVC advocates, the wife and I were impressed with the slide out model.....really good lounge (fixing the main PVC lounging issue of lack of width) and a great kitchen and bathroom with generous shower. Well, what's not to like we thought..........hang on, wait for the punch line........all sitting down..........gulp £75,000!!!!! Shame, as it is a great van, but I could have a Cathargo or a bevy of Hymers for that. However, the attempt to create a decent lounge in a PVC was almost matched by Adria with their Twin 640 SPX where the lounge had been stretched lengthways with the longer chassis rather than widthways using a slide out. Main difference was price with the Adria some £30+ cheaper. PS biggest disappointment, the Dethleffs E-Van......I did so want to love this small and colourful A Class but a loo actually in the shower tray was just too wacky for me...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 bolero boy - 2013-10-17 6:45 PM Went to the IH stand today and, although not really PVC advocates, the wife and I were impressed with the slide out model.....really good lounge (fixing the main PVC lounging issue of lack of width) The thing is a front lounge PVC (usualy) has a big lounge, so what have they fixed? Also can some one explain someting to me, I've had a look at the layout of the new van on the website, it quotes a bed width of 4ft 10in, and it shows it fitting the width of the slide out, but the SLD opening is only 4ft wide, this doesn't add up, or are we looking at a stepped bed and loads of infill cusions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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