htrevor Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 Fiat Ducato Westfalia 600d Hi Just crossing the border into Spain. Telling someone I met that I am getting more and more confident with wild camping. What can they do to my solid vehicle I confidently say, if I hear anything in the night I drive away. Not as easy as that they say, now old fears have returned and not quite so confident. The one that really got me thinking they said was of gangs pumping gas into my vehicle whilst I am asleep (or dead) and taking all my possessions. What can I do to prevent this. I have now shut the vents on the dashboard before retiring, I have a draught excluder at the foot of the sliding door, but is that good enough and at what stage do I seal the vehicle enough to thwart the bastards but ending up suffocating myself. Would very much appreciate any advise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weldted Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 This subject comes up from time to time. Many stories abound. But no one has died, no vans have exploded. To administer the correct amount of gas to render the occupants of a camper unconscious would require a large amount of gas, some means of monitoring the level and not blowing themselves up in the process. It would seem that the stories are always someone who heard someone had been gassed. Whilst there are theories about it I would be inclined to think. Some travellers have either driven a long way and are very tired, or relaxed with a glass or three before going to bed. Given vans have ventilation points near the fridge and oven I would not be too concerned. But there are those who know better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 htrevor - 2020-03-11 9:48 PM Fiat Ducato Westfalia 600d Hi Would very much appreciate any advise. I've a feeling you've started some thing with that question never mention Gassing. We.ve been wildcamping for 12 yrs now all over Europe and in the hot weather very often leave windows open with the fly screens up forgot to lock the doors on dozens of occasions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumpstart Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 If it really worries you it will spoil your trip so go to a campsite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicepix Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 I notice with these reports that the incident usually happens towards the end of their holiday so leave your dates open and it shouldn't happen. As a precaution if you do decide to head for home just leave your £2,000 Rolex watch and £600 in cash on the picinic table outside overnight and they won't come in and bother you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solwaybuggier Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 Htrevor, the initial response that this comes up from time to time is slightly understated I know we’re not supposed to trust experts these days (!) but this may reassure you: “The Royal College of Anaesthetists said in a statement that despite the increasing numbers of reports of people being gassed in motor-homes or commercial trucks in France, and the warning put out by the Foreign Office for travellers to be aware of the danger, the College considered it a myth. "It is the view of the College that it would not be possible to render someone unconscious by blowing ether, chloroform or any of the currently used volatile anaesthetic agents, through the window of a motor-home without their knowledge, even if they were sleeping at the time. Ether is an extremely pungent agent and a relatively weak anaesthetic by modern standards and has a very irritant affect on the air passages, causing coughing and sometimes vomiting. It takes some time to reach unconsciousness, even if given by direct application to the face on a cloth, and the concentration needed by some sort of spray administered directly into a room would be enormous. "The smell hangs around for days and would be obvious to anyone the next day. Even the more powerful modern volatile agents would need to be delivered in tankerloads of carrier gas by a large compressor. Potential agents, such as the one used by the Russians in the Moscow siege are few in number and difficult to obtain. Moreover, these drugs would be too expensive for the average thief to use." On the other hand, as well as exercising caution when wildcamping, be aware of the risk of crooks either signalling you have a problem with van ( or actually creating one by puncturing a tyre eg when you’re stopped at a slow puncture ), then robbing you on the hard shoulder. This has been reported in the Barcelona area, and on the AP7 south. Members on various forums have reported this, but keep it in perspective- problems can happen, but mostly they don’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 The following 4 forum threads (there are others!) discussed the ‘gassing’ issue, with the 3rd thread extending from 2014 to 2016 and having 522 postings. https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Animals-and-gassing/52743/ https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/The-gasing-season-has-started-on-the-French-motoways/49371/ https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Maybe-its-not-a-myth-/35425/ https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Robbery-by-being-gased/45662/ There’s no doubt that motorhomes and caravans are broken into at night abroad while people are sleeping in them, with this tending to happen at motorway ‘rest areas’ despite it generally being warned that overnighting at such places should be avoided. Regarding htrevor’s enquiry if (and personally I think it’s b******s) a criminal decides to pump soporific gas into his motorhome in sufficient quantity to induce deep drowsiness, it’s unlikely that ‘safety gas-drops’ (which I think a Westfalia 600D probably does not have) would be adequate to rapidly purge that gas from inside the vehicle. Also, legend has it that thieves may inject the gas through small holes drilled in plastic windows, or through safety gas-drops, or through fridge vents (etc.) so shutting dashboard vents or having a draught excluder on the door would hardly be effective. Counter measures that might be considered 1: Fit gas detecting equipment. There are plenty of soporific gas detectors advertised on-line https://tinyurl.com/v8hqffe and, as they are usually intended to detect LPG gasses as well soporific gasses, they should have some value even if ‘gassing’ never happens. Better fit a carbon monoxide gas detector as well, as claims have been made that thieves use that gas too. 2: Fit supplementary locks to cab and habitation doors and extra locks to habitation windows. Then, if the (mythical) thieves fill the motorhome with gas and it kills you, they still won’t be able to pinch your stuff. 3: Fit an ear-shattering alarm that covers all doors and windows and make sure the alarm is on before going to bed. 4: USE COMMON SENSE. Don’t stay overnight on foreign motorway service area or in places where you think you might be targeted by thieves. This may mean being very selective if you are into ‘wild camping’, but that’s just too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 I see Pelmetman is looking in again. He will be frothing at the mouth because he cannot reply on one of his pet subjects. (lol) Brian B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 I'm not sure if it's reassuring or not but the only time we had our camper broken into was at a campsite - first night after crossing channel - fortunately, it was at a time when we were undecided about having either a camper or caravan so we're using the La Strada Avanti to tow the caravan (hence staying on a site rather than an aire) but the camper was empty. The drivers door lock was forced, all the cupboards had been raided but nothing taken - although they overlooked what could have been a high value prize. Both vehicles had a file containing copies of all our documents and that wasn't taken either. The campsite is a well known and used one close to Calais - La Bien Assise - never been back there since. We too have stayed on Aires and left windows open in very hot weather but never had another problem. So, I suppose if it's going to happen it's going to happen and all you can do is try to use measures to avoid it happening to you wherever you stay. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 thebishbus - 2020-03-12 8:24 AM I see Pelmetman is looking in again.... Brian B How do you know that, please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 Derek. He shows up sometimes on Online Registered users. Brian B. Ps he did this morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spospe Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 Last logon 2020-03-12 8:14 AM to be exact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 jumpstart - 2020-03-12 7:45 AM If it really worries you it will spoil your trip so go to a campsite. This, or if you are really intent on 'wilding' fit a gas alarm if it helps your confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 To the OP, dont worry about it, its a myth. What kind of criminal is seriously going to turn up with a load of massive heavy gas cylinders presumably to an Aire or wild camp spot in a truck and start man handling them about and somehow pump them into a motorhome? Firstly that would likely wake up anyone within a hundred yards, secondly criminals are not usually that clever and will generally take the path of least resistance and thirdly I would imagine it would be a costly exercise and for what? All they would get in our van would be a couple of aging laptops worth next to nothing and maybe a handful of Euros. Whats the point? If you were going to do something so elaborate you would be better focused on robbing a wealthy looking mansion or house not some bloke parked up in a camper van for the night. Vans get broken into from time to time but this is just usually opportunists in dodgy areas ripping a window off while you are out, in and out quick but what exactly are they going to nick? They would be disappointed in our van for sure. Few tins of beans maybe, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conrad Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 Looking at other forum threads on this previously, it is pretty obvious that this gassing would be very difficult to actually do. My suspicion is that it's concocted by insurance scammers, wanting to recoup the cost of their holiday. A bigger risk of traveling at present is catching Covid-19 and there's another thread going with a myriad of views on that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 witzend - 2020-03-11 10:27 PM I've a feeling you've started some thing with that question never mention Gassing. See what I mean The following 4 forum threads (there are others!) discussed the ‘gassing’ issue, with the 3rd thread extending from 2014 to 2016 and having 522 postings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Jones Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 It's not GAS that makes people sleep so soundly as not to hear the baddies - it's LIQUID, taken in Hollibobs Quantities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 thebishbus - 2020-03-12 9:07 AM Derek. He shows up sometimes on Online Registered users. Brian B. Ps he did this morning. That's interesting as there has normally been an Indication when a forum-member has been 'banned'. My understanding was that, if you could logon, you could post - so perhaps Pelmetman isn't banned... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
htrevor Posted March 12, 2020 Author Share Posted March 12, 2020 Many thanks everyone. I feel the gas issue is not an issue that I will be concerned with in the future. Would like to mention one other thing associated with the security worries after talking with this guy and I was reluctant to mention it because you might have though I was after another thread but he also said another method they used was to make/drill a small hole underneath the drivers lock and unset the central locking. Well believe it or not that night after shutting all the dashboard vents after my new gas worries I woke up at 4.30 am and there was a small noise outside the van. Then the central locking went “ clunk” indicating that it had been turned off. I opened the blinds but nobody there. I was parked in an motorway Aires with good lighting, another motorhome not far away and plenty of trucks. I was pretty shook up though and drove until daylight. I then looked at the door handle and there was signs of disturbance under the lock in comparison with the handle on the passenger side. I now know from reading the replies that the motorway Aires are now not a good option and another good practise I would assume is to leave the outside “porch” light on to indicate that I am home, maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 If you fit some external deadlocks they just move on to the next van. Visible deterrent B-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecal Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 Just enjoy and keep safe If they come and pump gas into mine I do hope it’s into the gas tank ?? I think it’s a safe bet that won’t happen You won’t be gassed But if you are nervous go to a campsite and relax and enjoy Life is to short for worrying Enjoy your trip . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 htrevor - 2020-03-12 10:28 PM ... he also said another method they used was to make/drill a small hole underneath the drivers lock and unset the central locking... Driving a screwdriver (or similar tool) through a door’s outer surface next to a lock has been a common way of gaining entry to a locked motorhome. Protecting against this practice was discussed here https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Fiat-deadlocks/48607/ Supplementary locks are marketed, as well as protective ‘plates’ that guard against the screwdriver insertion ploy. Both types of product, being visible to thieves, should deter attempts to force entry. (Examples here) https://vanlockstore.co.uk/our-products.html?models=159&filter=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-03-13 6:54 AM htrevor - 2020-03-12 10:28 PM ... he also said another method they used was to make/drill a small hole underneath the drivers lock and unset the central locking... Driving a screwdriver (or similar tool) through a door’s outer surface next to a lock has been a common way of gaining entry to a locked motorhome. Protecting against this practice was discussed here https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Fiat-deadlocks/48607/ Supplementary locks are marketed, as well as protective ‘plates’ that guard against the screwdriver insertion ploy. Both types of product, being visible to thieves, should deter attempts to force entry. (Examples here) https://vanlockstore.co.uk/our-products.html?models=159&filter=1 That's exactly how they got into the (Fiat based) La Strada I mention above while staying on a campsite. But the main thing you should take away from this conversation is to completely avoid staying on motorway Aires THEY ARE NOT SAFE. Safe travels David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 Derek Uzzell - 2020-03-12 1:18 PM thebishbus - 2020-03-12 9:07 AM Derek. He shows up sometimes on Online Registered users. Brian B. Ps he did this morning. That's interesting as there has normally been an Indication when a forum-member has been 'banned'. My understanding was that, if you could logon, you could post - so perhaps Pelmetman isn't banned... Says he is on the other channel. Says he likes to login to see the words "Your banned". He's probably forgotten his user name or is trying to login to Mumsnet or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 i will get the popcorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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