La Hobo Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Hi All! This is my first venture into forum posting so I hope someone can help, thank you! I have just purchased a 2007 well known, and widely respected motorhome conversion on a X250 3500kg Fiat Ducato van. When looking at my V5 registration document from the DVLA I was surprised that it was still registered as a van. It has been a motorhome ALL of life since being imported and has never been used as a van. My question is, (A) why did this well known conversion company not register it as a motorhome? (B) what are the advantages, and disadvantages, of either leaving it as a van or reregistering as a motorhome? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Hi La Hobo and welcome, The biggest advantage of being correctly register as a 'Motor Caravan' is that the speed limits imposed on vans is removed! (Assuming your unladen weight is below 3,050 kg). the biggest disadvantage of being registered as a van is you are restricted to lower speed limits than for a car or Motor Caravan! See this Gov.UK web page for details... https://www.gov.uk/speed-limits Line 3 is for Motor Caravans and Line 7 is for your Van as currently registered!. Keith. Edit to add: Assuming you mean 'Body Type' as not reading 'Motor Caravan'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 La Hobo - 2018-02-23 11:45 AM ...I have just purchased a 2007 well known, and widely respected motorhome conversion on a X250 3500kg Fiat Ducato van... ...My question is, (A) why did this well known conversion company not register it as a motorhome? (B) what are the advantages, and disadvantages, of either leaving it as a van or reregistering as a motorhome? Keith has covered the advantages of having your motorhome’s V5C record the vehicle’s “Body Type” as “Motor Caravan” (and for it to be registered in the Private/Light Goods taxation class). It could be helpful to know the make and model of motorhome you own, as there have been several instances reported here in the past where ‘widely respected’ UK manufacturers of panel-van-conversion (PVC) motorhomes have marketed their products as commercial vehicles rather than motor caravans, and with the vehicles being registered in the ‘wrong’ road-tax class. When this has happened it has normally been due to the manner in which the converter had sourced the panel-van prior to its conversion and - once the conversion into a motor caravan has been completed - not asking the DVLA to make the changes necessary to re-register the vehicle as the correct type and in the correct road-tax class. It has then tended to be the owner of the motor caravan who has needed to take up the issue with the DVLA and ask for the vehicle’s V5C to be appropriately amended. I note that you’ve said "It has been a motorhome ALL of life since being imported and has never been used as a van”, which suggests that the conversion might have been carried out abroad rather than in the UK. Either way, new motohomes have sometimes been assigned to the wrong road-tax class when first UK-registered and the error not noticed for years, with the vehicle having had several owners in the interim. There’s no knowing what happened in 2007: whether the information provided to the DVLA was wrong or whether the DVLA made an error when registering the motorhome. If you want the V5C altered, the DVLA will usually play ball if you ask them nicely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 hi also note the insurance will be more expensive as a van Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Hobo Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Thank you both for the impressive speed in your replies. As for my vehicle, is a Murvi Morello which is why I was most surprised. I thought that a company like Murvi would be on top of things like this and as they appear not to done anything, I thought there MUST be a compelling reason why it was still registered as a 'Panel Van' What makes it even more surprising is that there seems to be no downside (there must be), especially with more and more emission zones appearing, I can only see advantages in it being registered in the correct category. The real reason why I'm still questioning, is that, not only Murvi, but the previous two owners, who both appear to be clean, upstanding and very intelligent people, have done nothing to rectify the mistake. Are you sure we are not missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 It is actually a legal requirement to notify DVLA of any errors on the registration document or changes made to the vehicle after initial registration. eg. If you convert a van into a Motor caravan you must notify them, here is a quote from there website... "If you’ve converted a van into a motor caravan, you must return the V5C to DVLA for amendment." https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/registering-a-diy-caravan So now you know it is incorrect you must notify DVLA of the error. Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Hobo Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share Posted February 23, 2018 Hi Keith, I totally agree that I must, and will, inform the DVLA of the changes. So, why didn't Murvi (surely they have a duty of care not to let their customers drive illegally) do this and how, now that we have computerised MOT etc., has this error not been picked up in the passed 10 years? Thanks again for your interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 DVLA only go on the information as submitted. For example my motorhome was initially registered as only being 23cc, as the information they were given was 2.3 instead of 2300. You would think they would query how a 3500kg MAM motorhome with 4 seat belts could function at 23cc. No wonder it was slow . 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 La Hobo - 2018-02-23 4:27 PM ...As for my vehicle, is a Murvi Morello which is why I was most surprised... I was tempted to ask if your vehicle was a Murvi, but your comment that "It has been a motorhome ALL of life since being imported” seemed to suggest that could not be the case as Murvi is a UK firm. The only ‘PVC’ motor caravan that will not start life as a panel-van will be one that is built from scratch as a motorhome (eg. a Volkswagen “California”). All the rest are born as an ordinary commercial delivery van (or as a 'people-carrier’) that then mutates into a motor caravan. As I said above, sometimes when a small converter acquires a new vehicle it gets UK-registered as a panel-van prior to the conversion stage and is not re-registered as a motor caravan subsequently. And, when a panel-van is secondhand prior to conversion, the vehicle will already be UK-registered as a panel-van commecial vehicle. This 2008 forum thread http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/DVLA-Registration-for-Motorhomes/14075/ discusses motorhomes being incorrectly UK-registered and you’ll note CAB’s posting of 11 December 2008 8:00 PM that refers to a new Murvi Morello having “Panel Van” on its V5C document. Local DVLA offices existed in those days, so it might have been easier for someone who noticed that a motorhome’s V5C contained an inaccuracy to have it corrected. Nowadays vehicle-registration matters are dealt with centrally and, if you want your Murvi’s V5C corrected, you’ll need to contact DVLA Swansea to get it done. As I also mentioned above, when there’s a mistake at the registration stage the buyer of the motorhome may not spot it and the error may persist for years and through multiple periods of ownwership until someone like you notices it. After 10 years it’s far too late to involve Murvi and, as the current owner of the vehicle, it will be up to you to have the V5C corrected by the DVLA. Advice on doing this is here https://www.gov.uk/change-vehicle-details-registration-certificate and altering the ‘body type’ datum should be relatively straightforward. I’m not sure from your postings whether it’s only the ‘body type’ (Field D.5 on the V5C) that’s wrong on your Murvi’s V5C document, or whether the vehicle is also registered in the wrong road-tax class. As a motor caravan it should be registered in road-tax class TC11 and “PRIVATE/LIGHT GOODS (PLG)” should appear in the V5C Field (X) Taxation class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdf Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 I would suggest that you ring DVLA and explain and ask what to do. Our new Rapido V68 was initially registered with the wrong colour on the V5C - down to dealer error. getting it corrected was NOT as easy as the V5C says for colour change and has taken over 2 months to do involving paperwork from FIAT. In the end the dealer sorted it out. I would add that my Insurance Company said that the insurance could/would be void as the vehicle didn't match the DVLA records and only covered the vehicle because i was in contact with DVLA! Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Hobo Posted February 24, 2018 Author Share Posted February 24, 2018 Thankyou everyone for your help and input on this matter. This is my first venture into writing on a forum and to say that I have been impressed is a understatement. Perhaps I can give a little something back for what I have received. When I picked up my vehicle, the heater only worked on MAX. I read, on the internet, how this was probably due to failure of the thermal fuse on the heater control module and that could be replaced by one purchased from Maplins and the use of a couple of block connectors. After purchasing said fuse (99p) and a new pollen filter ( the one in situ was probably dirty if the others on this vehicle was anything to go by ) I proceeded to try and locate the heater control module which is supposed to be up near the fan motor on the passenger side. After removing cover panels from the footwell, I was presented with a number of wires and relays, non of which seemed to fit the description I had been given. After some time, I THINK I found it but after removing the single retaining screw it didn't want to move. I think I have a good brain but these days it runs slow (I'm in no hurry), so, to give myself some thinking time, I decided to do the easier task of changing the pollen filter. After removing a few screws ( two of which are unseen up near the catch ) and removing the old filter I decided to blow out the space by putting the motor on full blast. Imagine my surprise when, turning it off, it appeared to resume working on the other, lower, settings. So, if you have a similar problem, try the pollen filter first. It probably needs changing anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darcywick Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 The best of luck getting the V5 amended, my Dealer registered with the wrong colour and it took over 4 months to get it rectified. I had to provide photos of the van and the VIN plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceM Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 darcywick - 2018-02-24 11:54 AM The best of luck getting the V5 amended, my Dealer registered with the wrong colour and it took over 4 months to get it rectified. I had to provide photos of the van and the VIN plate. That’s unfortunate. I had to change the V5 record of colour of my van a year ago, filled out the V5 amendment and the V5 came back changed within about two weeks. No proof of colour was requested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 La Hobo - 2018-02-24 10:51 AM ...I decided to do the easier task of changing the pollen filter. After removing a few screws ( two of which are unseen up near the catch ) and removing the old filter... When I replaced the pollen filter on my 2015 Ducato recently, the diagrams on the filter’s instruction leaflet indicated that just a few screws would need undoing. In fact 11 fasteners needed to be undone to permit access to be gained to the filter, and then I had a helluva job refitting the plastic flap on the ‘slot’ through which the filter is inserted. For anyone planning to carry out a pollen-filter changre on recent-ish Ducatos with the central hinge-down storage compartment, the method is described here https://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.ducatoschrauber.de/innenraumluftfilter-pollenfilter-wechseln-fiat-ducato-typ-250/&prev=search The procedure for changing the ‘body type’ description on a V5C is covered on the DVLA’s website, starting from this webpage: https://www.gov.uk/change-vehicle-details-registration-certificate and following the ‘Next’ arrow-prompts. If you want to get in touch with the DVLA, phone/email contact details are here: https://www.gov.uk/contact-the-dvla/y/something-else/something-else/vehicle My experience is that it’s best to use email (keep a copy of what you send them) and that it’s important to be very specific and be aware that the DVLA’s front-line troops won’t always provide the best advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 When we bought our current PVC it also was registered as a Panel Van. The convertor told us, though could well be BS but it is plausible if a converter is buying registered vans rather than unregistered ones, that when they take delivery it has to be registered as a panel van and as they are only holding the vehicle as a trader, that it can't be altered by them without having their name on the V5 so they ask the purchaser to send off the V5 when it is received to get it updated hence not adding an owner to the V5. In fact it was a simple procedure that, surprisingly, took less than ten days. It did necessitate sending photographs, I sent seven, of the interior that also showed the exterior and the registration plate and we were given a certificate of production from the convertor. The problem we did have though was with the insurance company, SAGA and it was!!, because they take the details direct off the DVSA database it was showing as a panel van and they couldn't (wouldn't) insure it, so we were mid term with our existing insurance and stood to lose a packet! Eventually after speaking to someone with higher authority after much, shall we say discussion, she conditionally authorised a one month stay of execution on provision we got the V5 and DVLA database changed, and that was only after sending scans of the same paperwork sent to DVLA and the convertor speaking with them direct in a three way conversation, it became quite ridiculous to say the least. Then, of course, there was the problem getting Dart Charge to recognise that it was a motorhome not a panel van and so in a lower rate, as they take their information off the DVLA database as well!!! But alls well that ends well and we are more than happy. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 28, 2018 Share Posted February 28, 2018 La Hobo In the latest (April 2018) issue of MMM magazine (Pages 197 and 198) is an article on re-registering a van conversion as a motor caravan. The article relates to a vehicle that was recently converted, rather than one (like your Murvi) that should have been re-registered years ago, but it might help with the re-registration procedure’s paperwork and avoid the possibility that the DVLA would want to inspect your vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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