Caravan Club (Groundhog) Day.

[Brian Kirby]

RupertGS - 2008-12-04 12:59 PM

michele - 2008-12-04 12:05 AM Take a chill Pill Brians entitled to say what he likes ,he never said you have to do what he say's .

This is a curious statement. Brian is allowed to say what he likes, which he is, but apparently I'm not? Is that your position, because if it is it's an odd one?

It's true that he never said that I have to do what he says and I don't think that he ever would, but what he did say, and this is certainly how I read it, is that people like me and many others, who book a site a long time in advance in order to make sure of getting a place exactly where we want to be, are conducting our motorhoming in a nonsensical way.

That is what I objected to and tried to explain why we occasionally wish to book a site well in advance.

I'm sorry that you were unable to see this.

Please don't start a quarrel on my account.  I'm sorry Rupert has personalised my comment in the way he has, it was not intended to slight him.  It was intended, as stated above, as a generalised and personal comment on what I still see as the nonsense of the annual booking frenzy, and on some aspects of the way the clubs manage (or fail to manage) it.  No more, no less. 

Given the interpretation Rupert applied, I can see that it would have seemed arrogant.  However, read from a less personally contextualised standpoint, I hope it does not strike others in that way.

There is always a risk, in expressing a personal view, that one may offend.  However, might it not be worth pausing to ask one's self, from time to time, whether a total stranger, with no knowledge of one's personal circumstances, can really be singling one out for attack, or whether the sense of being ridiculed may not arise merely because the view expressed happens to conflict with one's cherished ideals.  An exchange of views is welcome, and constructive, but name calling is seldom so.

[Guest Tracker]

RupertGS - 2008-12-04 12:59 PM

michele - 2008-12-04 12:05 AM Take a chill Pill Brians entitled to say what he likes ,he never said you have to do what he say's .

Just ignore him Michele and he will go away again - hopefully for longer next time! He only comes on here to provoke others as he has nothing constructive to offer and has never offered anybody any sound advice based on his own experiences - if he has any that is!And now, predictably, he can have another pop at me if he likes!

[flicka]

all the members boking blocks orf weekends are the big problem. I think it's time to split the booking regime. Only open for weekly bookings for say the 1st 2/3 months, then open it up for weekenders.

How many members have fixed holidays, but are left with midweek availability during peak period. It would do away with a lot of midweeks not being booked and therefore lost revenue.

There should also be the ability to book a weeks pitches but on seperate site to enable mobile members to not be restricted to booking at a single site.

Not difficult software is available, but is the WILL.

 

[Guest peter]

Tracker - 2008-12-03 11:10 AM

 

My solution although no help to you good folk is to never book anywhere and to always holiday abroad where a fortnight in France will cost less in total than a fortnight on a UK club site!

 

Apologies - couldn't resist it!

Agreed. Why spennd all that dosh only to end up with crap weather. When you can do it just as cheap abroad and also get a lot of sun.

[RupertGS]

Tracker - 2008-12-04 7:48 PM

RupertGS - 2008-12-04 12:59 PM

michele - 2008-12-04 12:05 AM Take a chill Pill Brians entitled to say what he likes ,he never said you have to do what he say's .

Just ignore him Michele and he will go away again - hopefully for longer next time! He only comes on here to provoke others as he has nothing constructive to offer and has never offered anybody any sound advice based on his own experiences - if he has any that is! And now, predictably, he can have another pop at me if he likes!

Mmmmm, that's curious! I thought that I'd just offered some advice based on my own experiences when I tried to explain why some of us like to book the odd site well in advance. Perhaps you haven't understood, which doesn't surprise me.

Anyway Tracker, we're all still waiting with baited  breath for you to explain how you have all of these sly little insights about the behaviour of those of us who use sites, when you've freely admitted that you haven't used one for years. I suggested earlier that you may have simply been telling porkies.

Now if someone had accused me of lying, I'd be rushing to defend myself - you're curiously silent, which is odd for you.

Now to use your own closing argument, I've no doubt that you'll attack me (as you've no defence) and divert attention from the question - again!

[michele]

Hey Rupert thats slightly like the pot calling the kettle black isnt it .

 

What is it ,Rich has no defence so will talk about anything to divert attention away from it .

 

Seeing as I and other have not seen an apology from you to Brian even after Brian gave a full run down on what he meant by his statement .

Thats real diverting attention either that or sorry seems to be the hardest word. Umh . 8-) Notice you ignored that one didnt you ?

 

So bit unfair on Rich really Pot & kettle.

[Guest Tracker]

RupertGS - 2008-12-04 11:06 PM

Tracker - 2008-12-04 7:48 PM

RupertGS - 2008-12-04 12:59 PM

michele - 2008-12-04 12:05 AM Take a chill Pill Brians entitled to say what he likes ,he never said you have to do what he say's .

Just ignore him Michele and he will go away again - hopefully for longer next time! He only comes on here to provoke others as he has nothing constructive to offer and has never offered anybody any sound advice based on his own experiences - if he has any that is! And now, predictably, he can have another pop at me if he likes!

Mmmmm, that's curious! I thought that I'd just offered some advice based on my own experiences when I tried to explain why some of us like to book the odd site well in advance. Perhaps you haven't understood, which doesn't surprise me.

Anyway Tracker, we're all still waiting with baited  breath for you to explain how you have all of these sly little insights about the behaviour of those of us who use sites, when you've freely admitted that you haven't used one for years. I suggested earlier that you may have simply been telling porkies.

Now if someone had accused me of lying, I'd be rushing to defend myself - you're curiously silent, which is odd for you.

Now to use your own closing argument, I've no doubt that you'll attack me (as you've no defence) and divert attention from the question - again!

I do not feel the need to defend myself after all this is not an arguing contest it's a forum for the free and friendly exchange of views.Some of us manage this without being antagonistic towards other members when we disagree and if you care to check back you will find two things.Never have I attacked anyone without them first having had a go at me or an unjustified go at someone else.You are as entitled to your views as anyone else and we were all rather hoping that you would learn to put them in a non antagonistic fashion.As for the point regarding camp sites - you will find that was clarified if you care to check to the relevant thread.I've said it before and I'll say it again - there is no right or wrong way to enjoy a motorhome - just different.Thank you

[spospe]

Can I suggest that everyone takes a deep breath, counts to ten and lets the matter drop?

 

We seem to have lost sight of the original post here, which basicly was that the Caravan Club have shot themselves in the foot (again) over the matter of advance booking.

 

Please folks, like Tracker says, lets have some toterance here and lets move on to another subject before it becomes too personal.

 

Michael

[jonimac]

Hear hear, let us move on and I appreciate all of the comments and hope that the Caravan Club take note. In the meantime, travelling abroad is becoming more attractive. When my wife retires this year we will try it but being novices in foreign fields we are slightly apprehensive.

I would love to be pointed in the right direction (publications). Obviously it wouldn't be appropriate to absorb a massive shopping list of do's and don'ts here but a little advice would be most welcome.

Thanks for the response to my whinge about the CC.

 

John

[spospe]

jonimac

 

We use the Caravan Clubm publications "Caravan Europe Vol 1" (France, Spain, Portugal and Andorra) and Vol 2 (the rest of Europe).

 

Apart from the lists of sites, there is a wealth of data about the different countries and advice on law, what to take etc.

 

Anyone can buy them, but they are slightly cheaper if you are a member.

[RupertGS]

Tracker wrote:

I do not feel the need to defend myself after all this is not an arguing contest it's a forum for the free and friendly exchange of views. Some of us manage this without being antagonistic towards other members when we disagree and if you care to check back you will find two things. Never have I attacked anyone without them first having had a go at me or an unjustified go at someone else. You are as entitled to your views as anyone else and we were all rather hoping that you would learn to put them in a non antagonistic fashion. As for the point regarding camp sites - you will find that was clarified if you care to check to the relevant thread. I've said it before and I'll say it again - there is no right or wrong way to enjoy a motorhome - just different. Thank you

Once again you are telling porkies because you simply have no defence against the accusation made against you, which is, that you simply denigrate the actions of people on camp sites by claiming to witness certain things, but on the other hand, you claim never to stay on sites.

Malc D asked this:

I seem to recall that Tracker often tells us that he never uses sites, so I just wonder where he gets his insights from.

From his description it sounds like one or two sites that I stayed on back in the sixties, so maybe that's the last time he visited one.

I have revisited the thread and read every post and cannot, as you claim, find any post from you which does, as you claim, clarify your comments.

I still await your explanation - do you stay on sites, or are these incidents which occur on sites, just a figment of your anti-campsite fevered imagination?

I'm not really expecting an honest reply though, as you'll simply squirm a bit more and try, in your usual desperate way, to deflect the discussion.

The truth is that I am sick to death of people like you who say things such as, "There is no right or wrong way to enjoy a motorhome - just different." You appear to be trying to convince us what a nice reasonable man you are but this doesn't square with the constant sly remarks that you continually insert into your posts where you have used such phrases as 'herd instinct' to classify those of us who use sites.

What is pathetic about all this is, that the only reason that you don't use sites is financial. You've already admitted to using aires, where you have a motorhome a few feet on either side of you - talk about 'herd instinct'!

But of course aires are cheap!

Answer the question - do you stay on sites and if not where have you witnessed all the actions that cause you so much superior amusement?

[RupertGS]

michele - 2008-12-05 12:00 AM Hey Rupert thats slightly like the pot calling the kettle black isnt it . What is it ,Rich has no defence so will talk about anything to divert attention away from it . Seeing as I and other have not seen an apology from you to Brian even after Brian gave a full run down on what he meant by his statement . Thats real diverting attention either that or sorry seems to be the hardest word. Umh . 8-) Notice you ignored that one didnt you ? So bit unfair on Rich really Pot & kettle.

I accused Brian of having an arrogant attitude to those of us who book sites in advance because he used the phrase "What nonsense it all is".

In his reply he admitted that, from certain viewpoints, it could seem arrogant. That for me was the end of it as I find him to be reasonable most of the time, unlike some.

I fail to see why I should say 'sorry' to a man who has admitted that what I criticised him about, was in fact correct.

I'm beginning to work out now what your role is on this forum. Your sole purpose seems to be to leap to the defence of any of the regulars who have had the misfortune to be criticised by any other person.

I wouldn't mind this if your posts actually made any sense and were in any way an accurate reflection of the debate, but they never are. I feel that you may be a little out of your depth in these discussions but I don't suppose that we can hope that you'll stop!

[Guest Tracker]

In deference to other users I am not going to take part any further in Rupert's game.

[BGD]

Rupert - come on mate; for pities sake mate, give it a rest.

 

There's really nothing to be gained by repeatedly dragging up old stuff from weeks/months ago just to continue what appears to be becoming some sort of all-consuming personal bitchfest.

 

I am NOT having a pop at you in this post; simply genuinely trying to offer some personal advice, which you of course are completely free to accept or reject.

 

Let's have a bash at enjoying the banter and the info sharing here positively.

 

 

 

Yes, some of us (and I accept that I'm more guilty of that than most*-)) enjoy a good joust and a wind-up a bit from time to time.

 

But a positive attempt to forgive, forget, move on, re-build, or even simply ignore are I think constructive behaviours after any such virtual-world playground spats.

 

Cheers,

 

Bruce. :-D

[jonimac]

Oh dear, I thought we'd moved on but obviously not. I should have started a new thread for my request. Thanks for the answer so far. I will obtain the publications mentioned. Should I start a new thread or will any more experienced foreign travellers give some welcome advice.

I am by nature an inveterate planner and wish I was a free spirit like some of you but can't help that. So come on, let's for get my original whinge and move on. You were brilliant when I bought my first motorhome 18 months ago and I know you won't let me down. Thanks friends.

 

John

[RupertGS]

Tracker - 2008-12-05 4:44 PM In deference to other users I am not going to take part any further in Rupert's game.

Which roughly translated means: "I have absolutely no defence to the claims made about me, that I have deliberately lied about witnessing behaviour on sites that I consider amusing - because, as I also state that I never stay on sites, my claims cannot possibly be true. I shall therefore seek to remove myself from this thread before it becomes very embarrassing for me."

Having proved once and for all that Tracker is a total stirrer who simply makes up all of his sly little digs about those of us who like sites, I shall, as BGD requests, give it a rest.

But it has been fun!

[Brian Kirby]

RupertGS - 2008-12-05 4:36 PM

...............I accused Brian of having an arrogant attitude to those of us who book sites in advance because he used the phrase "What nonsense it all is".

In his reply he admitted that, from certain viewpoints, it could seem arrogant. ..................

Rupert

You really are being trying.  I took a very deep breath indeed before I replied to your post as I did. 

I did so because what you actually said was, and I quote "I really do object to the arrogance of people like this who assume that only their method of motorhoming is sensible."

Now, in truth, that is not calling my attitude arrogant, it is calling me arrogant.

That, is a public judgement on my character, not on my opinion.

And that, I submit, is true arrogance. 

Are you really surprised that you offend so many, so easily?

Remember, the cock who crows loudest often sits atop the biggest dung hill.

[michele]

You said it better than I ever could say or write Brian,

 

Rupert you really are an arrogant man the whole point of my writing to you was to defend anyone not just the older forum users. Before you misunderstand again I dont mean old as in age . Defend what is right and decent . there is no need to speak to anyone in that tone and jump straight in with two feet .

 

You are not only arrogant but just because you can spell write have good grammar la de da it does not make you a better person. At least I have decency and an understanding for others ,empathy .

 

If you can not understand me I suggest you step down off your high horse and sink to my level but once again you show how really rude and arrogant you are . To point out to someone that you hope they dont write againis just darn right rude .

 

Finally all your comments have been taken on board how very nice of you to point it out to me that I am below average intellegence . I sincerely hope you feel proud of yourself . You make the world a better place .

 

Your arrogance alone tell me why you are blinded into thinking you were right in what you said to Brian

How silly of me to of expected from you some common sense & decency to anyone on the forum .

 

I will await with baited breath your reply to this unreadable submission .

 

Funny how when you want to you can . Maybe you were pushed from the horse (just the once)of course

 

I apologise to the person who started the thread ,with a name like Groundhog day I suppose it was never going to happen on this forum .

But I could not let Rupert GS comments go by . Sorry If I personally have spoilt your thread .

 

 

[RupertGS]

Brian Kirby - 2008-12-05 6:40 PM

RupertGS - 2008-12-05 4:36 PM

...............I accused Brian of having an arrogant attitude to those of us who book sites in advance because he used the phrase "What nonsense it all is".

In his reply he admitted that, from certain viewpoints, it could seem arrogant. ..................

Rupert

You really are being trying.  I took a very deep breath indeed before I replied to your post as I did. 

I did so because what you actually said was, and I quote "I really do object to the arrogance of people like this who assume that only their method of motorhoming is sensible."

Now, in truth, that is not calling my attitude arrogant, it is calling me arrogant.

That, is a public judgement on my character, not on my opinion.

And that, I submit, is true arrogance. 

Are you really surprised that you offend so many, so easily?

Remember, the cock who crows loudest often sits atop the biggest dung hill.

I'm sorry if you find me trying but if you really want to know..........

This is the final part of your post:

"I bought a motorhome to be free to wander, not to be tethered to pre-booked sites for a year in advance.  What nonsense it all is!"

That is arrogance! Like so many of the 'free to roam brigade' you seem to view those who wish to book a site, and particularly those who feel the need to book it well in advance, as some kind of lesser mortals.

Quite frankly I'm sick to death of this attitude that real motorhomers don't book sites and have this wonderful free and easy existence. It comes across so many times from various people.

"What nonsense it all is." What does this mean then? If it is only supposed to refer to the booking frenzy, as you call it, it certainly doesn't read like that and there's no doubt that you are very capable of writing exactly what you want to say, without any lack of clarity.

So just to be clear - I believe that your post shows an arrogance, which, by definition, means that you can be arrogant and I certainly think that you were on this occasion.

[RupertGS]

michele - 2008-12-05 7:04 PM You said it better than I ever could say or write Brian, Rupert you really are an arrogant man the whole point of my writing to you was to defend anyone not just the older forum users. Before you misunderstand again I dont mean old as in age . Defend what is right and decent . there is no need to speak to anyone in that tone and jump straight in with two feet . You are not only arrogant but just because you can spell write have good grammar la de da it does not make you a better person. At least I have decency and an understanding for others ,empathy . If you can not understand me I suggest you step down off your high horse and sink to my level but once again you show how really rude and arrogant you are . To point out to someone that you hope they dont write againis just darn right rude . Finally all your comments have been taken on board how very nice of you to point it out to me that I am below average intellegence . I sincerely hope you feel proud of yourself . You make the world a better place . Your arrogance alone tell me why you are blinded into thinking you were right in what you said to Brian How silly of me to of expected from you some common sense & decency to anyone on the forum . I will await with baited breath your reply to this unreadable submission . Funny how when you want to you can . Maybe you were pushed from the horse (just the once)of course I apologise to the person who started the thread ,with a name like Groundhog day I suppose it was never going to happen on this forum . But I could not let Rupert GS comments go by . Sorry If I personally have spoilt your thread .

:-D :-D :-D 

[malc d]

jonimac - 2008-12-05 3:50 PM

 

Hear hear, let us move on and I appreciate all of the comments and hope that the Caravan Club take note. In the meantime, travelling abroad is becoming more attractive. When my wife retires this year we will try it but being novices in foreign fields we are slightly apprehensive.

I would love to be pointed in the right direction (publications). Obviously it wouldn't be appropriate to absorb a massive shopping list of do's and don'ts here but a little advice would be most welcome.

Thanks for the response to my whinge about the CC.

 

John

 

 

I would agree with Spospe that the Caravan Club Europe site books contain a wealth of information - in fact probably as much as you need.

 

Some people are apprehensive about driving on the other side of the channel, but if you just take it easy and follow everyone else in the 'inside' lane for a while, you soon get used to it.

 

It is also generally much easier to find campsites ( and / or aires ) as I believe that they are much more camping friendly than over here.

 

It also helps if you know a few phrases of the language as I have found that the staff on sites generally appreciate your efforts.

 

Good luck with your travels.

 

 

 

:-)

[jonimac]

Thanks for your kind words. I will buy the CC publication with a view to going to France later on this year or perhaps next. By the way readers, I promise not to unwittingly stir up a hornets nest again, well not this week anyway (he says chortlingly).

 

John.

[howie]

jonimac - 2008-12-05 3:50 PM

 

In the meantime, travelling abroad is becoming more attractive. When my wife retires this year we will try it but being novices in foreign fields we are slightly apprehensive.

 

 

John

Won,t go far wrong if you signed up for one of the organised trips abroad that both main clubs provide John. Bit like 'wagon train' if you,ll pardon the phrase, but with experienced hands to guide and advise sounds just the thing for those a little apprehensive on going it alone, and while there is a set journey plan still plenty of scope to go off and do your own thing.

[Mel B]

Hi John

 

Just go for it! You'll love France, such freedom, lovely places to visit, nice weather (hopefully!) and great food (and wine I suppose! *-) ).

 

On our first trip to France in 2005 we just booked the ferry, got the dogs' passports sorted out, bought a good large scale map and had a rough idea of where we wanted to go. We also got an AA tourist book on things to do and see in France and it has proved to be really good. It doesn't cover everything, but it does give you a good base and covers the most popular things. I'd also suggest you get one of the Aires books, they can be got from Vacarious Books' website, there's an English version as well as the traditional French language one.

 

We also prepared by taking some French classes - we did 2 years at night school but that was because we were considering living there at the time - you don't have to be THAT dedicated for a holiday! :D But, it does help a lot if you know some of the lingo and the locals really do appreciate your efforts. Just remember it's not like 'Ello, Ello'!!!! :$

 

For your first trip, you might find that going round Normandy/Brittany is a good starting point as there are lots of aires and Brits are well catered for, with some absolutely beautiful scenery to boot.

 

Enjoy!

[michele]

RupertGS - 2008-12-05 7:38 PM

Brian Kirby - 2008-12-05 6:40 PM

RupertGS - 2008-12-05 4:36 PM

...............I accused Brian of having an arrogant attitude to those of us who book sites in advance because he used the phrase "What nonsense it all is".

In his reply he admitted that, from certain viewpoints, it could seem arrogant. ..................

Rupert

You really are being trying.  I took a very deep breath indeed before I replied to your post as I did. 

I did so because what you actually said was, and I quote "I really do object to the arrogance of people like this who assume that only their method of motorhoming is sensible."

Now, in truth, that is not calling my attitude arrogant, it is calling me arrogant.

That, is a public judgement on my character, not on my opinion.

And that, I submit, is true arrogance. 

Are you really surprised that you offend so many, so easily?

Remember, the cock who crows loudest often sits atop the biggest dung hill.

I'm sorry if you find me trying but if you really want to know..........

This is the final part of your post:

"I bought a motorhome to be free to wander, not to be tethered to pre-booked sites for a year in advance.  What nonsense it all is!"

That is arrogance! Like so many of the 'free to roam brigade' you seem to view those who wish to book a site, and particularly those who feel the need to book it well in advance, as some kind of lesser mortals.

Quite frankly I'm sick to death of this attitude that real motorhomers don't book sites and have this wonderful free and easy existence. It comes across so many times from various people.

"What nonsense it all is." What does this mean then? If it is only supposed to refer to the booking frenzy, as you call it, it certainly doesn't read like that and there's no doubt that you are very capable of writing exactly what you want to say, without any lack of clarity.

So just to be clear - I believe that your post shows an arrogance, which, by definition, means that you can be arrogant and I certainly think that you were on this occasion.

You Pompus Dip stick Rodney :D quite frankly I,m sick to death ...i wished you were Keep taking the pills :DOh nearly forgot Peace and goodwill to all men ,have a nice Xmas .