Mickydripin Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Hi I do not want to discuss the pro,s and con,s of A frames just to ask a question. If there is anyone there that can help. I have brought a secondhand Caratow A frame and I took it to my local Towtal depot and asked them to fit a new towbar to my motorhome and the a frame to my car a Toyota Aygo. They refused, first saying that they would could not insure the A frame as it was supplied by me also the boss then said they would not fit it because it was ileagal. The reason they say that it is ileagal is because when the A frame is removed it leaves two couplings sticking out beyond the front of the car and they are not easy to remove. There couplings are easy to remove so no danger to padestrians or other road users Towtal have said that they will fit one of there A frames to my car but not the Caratow they have also said that they could use the body of the Caratow and other parts from there stock to make it leagal and reduce the total cost by one hundred and fifty pounds. I am not saying towtal are wrong or trying to just sell me there product as I have had other work done by them in the past and have been very happy with them. I would like your thoughts on the subject. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Have you thought of contacting Caratow and asking them to fit it & towbar? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 In my OPINION (note that), the question of legality is debatable. If the mounting point was fitted by the car manufacturer then I believe it would be illegal, I don't think it would pass regs concerning pedestrian safety. On the otherhand fitting as an aftermarket item MIGHT be possible, it would depend if it can pass an MOT with it fitted. You would definatly need to inform your insurer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
takeaflight Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 IMO you need to go to a caratow fitter, I think whether its legal or not is immaterial, you are happy to have an A Frame and I don't believe that the Towtal one is any more legal than the one you have. However in this case its asking a lot to expect someone to install a product not engineered by them and to potentially carry the can if something should go wrong. best of luck Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 It may be of significance to note Caratow now fit removal towing eye fittings to the car so it meets what is deemed to be the latest European legal requirements. Presumambly you have bought an older system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 I've got a Towtal frame and the eyelets are removable when not in use, but how many people do is another matter. I would get the towbar fitted wherever you want, and the A frame attachments for your car fitted by the original maker. Unless it's for the same model of car that it came off, it's unlikely to fit straight onto your car. So will need modifying anyway or making from scratch. The A frame itself isn't the problem, it's the bit that's bolted to the front of the car that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 takeaflight - 2012-03-27 9:32 PM IMO you need to go to a caratow fitter, I think whether its legal or not is immaterial, you are happy to have an A Frame and I don't believe that the Towtal one is any more legal than the one you have. However in this case its asking a lot to expect someone to install a product not engineered by them and to potentially carry the can if something should go wrong. best of luck Roy I agree with Roy. There is no need to have both fitted at the same place Mick. If you like, and have confidence in, Towtal, get them to do the towbar and electrics. Then take the car to a Caratow fitter and ask them to prepare it, and to check, overhaul as necessary, and fit the A-frame. Otherwise, get the Caratow firm to do the lot. It is unrealistic, IMO, to expect Towtal to fit, and be responsible for, a product they have not designed or manufactured and have no knowledge of, or of its history. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickydripin Posted March 28, 2012 Author Share Posted March 28, 2012 Thanks everyone for your help I now have a few options to think over and will let you know what I decide Thanks again.... Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickydripin Posted March 28, 2012 Author Share Posted March 28, 2012 Hi all I have now made up my mind the Caratow that I brought is in fact an old model and are now made to a different spec. I got in touch with the Caratow agents in Warrington and they told me of the problems with it and the cost of fitting it and it was a lot of money to fit a secondhand aframe. The upshot of it is they said they needed an old type Caratow Aframe for somthing and offered me a good price for it and they will be fitting a new model aframe to my car next month for not too much more money. The thing is when you buy a secondhand Aframe make sure that you do not make the same mistake as I did do your homework like I should have done. I am still having the towbar from Towtal but even now I am getting rumours that they are not the best of people do you know any better? Give me a pm if you think that it is too sensitive for the forum or just tell everybody. Thanks for all the advice. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Hi Mike We had a Towtal towbar and bumper fitted to our current van...and although fabrication wise it's tidy enough,rust did start to come through in the first couple of weeks. After touching it up a couple of times with a spray can,I ended up rubbing it all down and brush painting the whole thing again..(..I've since noticed quite a few Towtal bumpers that are rusting "prematurely").. Also,they've spliced into the wiring by using those ScotchClips things,which I personally feel is a bit of a bodge(..although probably the "industry standard" *-) ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Hi Mike, Exactly the same story here as pepe. We had a towbar fitted by Towtal when we bought our MH 4 years ago and I still think it is very well designed and excellently manufactured and, in my opinion, probably one of the best styled full width towbars around. BUT the big problem was a very sub-standard paint finish :-( Within 2 years rust was appearing all over and the finish was badly 'crazed'. I believe they manufacture, paint and fit in a day so what can you expect? I have since resolved this by having the towbar shot-blasted and powder coated. I would strongly suggest you either ask for an upgraded finish or plan on having it powder coated within 2 years. Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 A towbar that rusted within a couple of weeks wouldn't be any good where I live, (within 1/2 mile of the Irish sea). Does anyone do a 'Galvanised' Towbar ?? if so , anyone know where they are ? Ray ;-) I had to have garden gates replaced with galvanised ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 "Hope" used to be widely acknowledged as producing the best engineered/finished towbars for motorhomes. However, I'm not sure if they still produce 'bespoke' towbars to suit coachbuilt motorcaravans. http://www.hope-tecdev.com/index.php/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Continuing off topic slightly...I'm not sure if Mike(OP)is looking at a full width bumper while he's at it but if anyone is,depending on how high(or low!)the rear of their van is,I would recommend looking at the type with the "cranked up" ends.. (..as shown in this link: http://www.pwsacc.co.uk/motorcaravan-towbar.htm ) ..the reason being,we found that,prior to fitting rear air assistors,our straight bar did occasionally "ground out" at the end(s) on steep drivesway/cambered junctions etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickydripin Posted March 29, 2012 Author Share Posted March 29, 2012 Hi Derek Contacted Hope-tecdev and they do not do towbars for Motorhomes now But thanks anyway. Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Mickydripin - 2012-03-29 4:51 PM Hi Derek Contacted Hope-tecdev and they do not do towbars for Motorhomes now But thanks anyway. Mike. Thanks for following that up - I couldn't see any sign of a bespoke service on the Hope website. (If a motorhome has European Whole Vehicle Type Approval (and many now do), does any towbar fitted to it also need to have Type Approval? I know that one can get Type Approved towbars - for example http://www.watling-towbars.co.uk/type_approved_motorhome_towbars.html but I'm not certain whether or not such products are mandatory for motorhomes with EWVTA, or whether all motorhomes (EWVTA or not) are still exempted from towbar Type Approval regulations.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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