aston Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 Hi all again, I am still looking for a classic motorhome, Classic as that is all I can afford (Max £5k) I was looking at LESharo's but have now realised I don't like them so the next choice was Hobby 600's but someone pointed out that Talbot's are more or less past thier sell by dates so basically I am back to square one. So should I be looking for an Engine from a certain country or manufacturer for example Germany/Mercedes. Which coachbuilders are regardes as quality with Longevity in mind? The Hymers seem fairly cheap for A Class motors, Is the Fiat Hymer a dog generally. What marques are worth avoiding and which are worth seeking out? One thing I have found is that motorhomes are much much cheaper in France, LHD isn't a problem for me. Thank's all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 I would buy a tent and decent 4 season sleeping bag....and spend the rest on decent Polish Vodka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aston Posted July 2, 2012 Author Share Posted July 2, 2012 more of an evostick person, more late 80's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 At £5k you are always going to be chasing the demon rust bug I'm afraid and replacement panels can be hard to source these days. That said you do still see some quite tidy old Talbot Express, Transit, or Bedford CF based vans which were rustproofed by a loving owner many moons age and have survived well enough to worth owning. In my view only two converters vans have stood the test of time and I would look for either a Hymer or an Autosleepers monocoque bodied van as being the most durable and least prone to falling apart due to rain penetration. I don't know if Martin Watts (I think that is his name) still does the classic vans bit in MMM, but his articles and contact points are worth a read for classic vans. Just don't be rushed into buying a heap of junk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 Hi Aston The problem with the Talbot's is that the cabs body panels were prone to rust & spares are more & more difficult to source. Also many only fitted with the 1.9L normally aspirated diesel engine There was a company that specialised in Talbot spares - Delfin Designs, seems to have dissappeared. 01258 857474 enquiries@delfindesigns.co.uk http://www.delfindesigns.co.uk As the "A" class vehicles don't use the manufacturers' cab / body it comes down to the mechanical bits. Having said that ANY vehicle from the early 90's or earlier will be prone to the same body panels & mechanical spares availability problems. (maybe less so with the Transit) IMO importing a LHD vehicle from this era, from le continent, would be more hassle than it's worth trying to get VOSA compliance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Is it possible to go along the DIY route, a reasonably 2nd hand van, get a hightop and windows fitted, and do the inside yourself. There are self build web sites to help out with sourcing of materials, take your time planning the layout, and you could finnish up with a van to be proud of. Good Luck. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 flicka - 2012-07-02 11:04 PM Hi Aston The problem with the Talbot's is that the cabs body panels were prone to rust & spares are more & more difficult to source. Also many only fitted with the 1.9L normally aspirated diesel engine There was a company that specialised in Talbot spares - Delfin Designs, seems to have dissappeared. 01258 857474 enquiries@delfindesigns.co.uk http://www.delfindesigns.co.uk As the "A" class vehicles don't use the manufacturers' cab / body it comes down to the mechanical bits. Having said that ANY vehicle from the early 90's or earlier will be prone to the same body panels & mechanical spares availability problems. (maybe less so with the Transit) IMO importing a LHD vehicle from this era, from le continent, would be more hassle than it's worth trying to get VOSA compliance. My 1990 Tranny is having a face lift at the moment, as part of a on going refurbishment program I started when Horace hit 21 ;-).............new panels no problem, I bought my own via google, hopefully I'll collect Horace tomorrow :-D.............I gave them my camera to take pictures as they did the work, so I'll post some pic's soon ;-)...........but in general the chap I spoke to yesterday was well impressed with the general condition of our camper B-)..............so they are out there and for your 5k budget.......you might need to do a bit of leg work.......There was a one owner Travelhome like mine in MMM a few months back for about that sort of money ;-).......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Just put in 5K budget on ebay and there are vans on there. But! on www.mobile.de in Germany you get a much larger and better choice within your budget.... I think you need to get a short list of a few specific models. When down in Spain recently there was a Dutch couple opposite with a 33 year old large Merc based camper. the condition was amazing, and while you would not pick up something like this for 5K there are other well cared for vans around..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 A guy down the road from us has a 'W' reg Transit Autohomes for sale for £2k with full mot. I have not looked at it other than in driving past but it looks nothing special, a bit tired and average for the species of that era. These were very popular in their day (I had one many moons ago and it worked well and took us many thousands of trouble free(ish) miles) but they were never the best made of conversions! However if the chassis is sound it could be worth doing up at that price - or probably less after a good haggle and the waving of used £20 notes! If you are interested pm me and I'll have a look at it for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 I'd be inclined to look at A class vans, because they were re-bodied in production, so much of the "visible" rust problem is eliminated. However, that just leaves in "invisible" rust, inside hollow members, around the inner wings (often retained), front suspension mounts, and chassis members generally. You must be prepared for some welding work and re-sealing. If you're lucky, none will be required, but at around 20 years old, failures and problems must be expected. My reaction is that you need a barn/garage in which you can keep, and work on, the van, in the dry, as and when necessary. Older A class Hymers seem very long lived, so may well be worth targeting, but also command a bit of cachet despite their age. I'd do as judgemental suggests, and try trawling mobile.de for vans at that age to see what emerges, and then switch your attention to the UK market to see if anything similar is available. You'll get a far greater choice in Germany/France, but whether at that age it is worth the hassle of importing one back to UK seems a bit debatable, if you also take into account the probable travel time and cost of visiting to view, plus arranging documentation etc. You'll need to make some changes to the vehicle to register it in UK, such as headlamps, speedometer, and rear fog light, and your problem is likely to be finding appropriate spares for such parts on a vehicle of that age. I think these vehicles are mainly a hobby activity, with a lot of the use being in taking them to rallies to compare with others. If you get copies of MMM and look at Martin Watts articles, you'll see the scale of re-building involved in refurbishing at least some of the examples he features. If you want a "proper" holiday van that will be reliable in use, I'm afraid I think you need to consider a larger budget. Not to say never, but you'll need to get lucky! If it were me, I think I'd be more inclined to get a decent second hand van and start a DIY conversion, or simply buy a trailer tent and keep the balance in the best interest bearing account (very little helps :-D) I could find! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Like I said some decent vans on mobile.de some with NEW TUV which I understand is a more difficult test to pass then out MOT . so a MOT when you return should not be to much trouble with one of these a nice rapido A class 137,000 km £4400 My pick of the bunch a Westphalia james cook (body work needs a bit of attention and does not say if it has TUV). for around the same money. Why? because the Westphalia interior dont age..a van from 1990 looks relatively as good as a modern equivalent.. Plus they are bomb proof you look at all these other old CB with horrible wood, even worse upholstery, drap and grey. Also the Westphalia on a large panel van has none of the worries asssociated with damp on a CB/A class *-) I would seriously rather sleep in a tent then some these old things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 With out wishing to upset Eddie (again) perhaps those who have bought an old and potentially troublesome van abroad (LHD?) could explain to those of us who have not exactly what the legal requirements and obstacles to be overcome are for someone resident this side of the water before the idea can be properly suggested as viable to others? That is quite apart from the distance, language, currency, ferry and not least the vehicle specifications - both mechanical and conversion? Are the gas, heating, fridge, water, electronics etc systems compatible with long term UK use and can you get bits when things fail? I'm not against the idea in principle but it does seem more fraught with hurdles than buying local? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ips Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 If it was me I would get the best LWB van for 3k and spend 1.5k on doing a DIY conversion. and the remainder on a good drive away awning. job done. Seems to me that a MH for 5k at the age could end up costing and costing and costing in repairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Plenty of 80's & 90's campers still giving good service, there was one today at Fleet services a 1990 Autohomes Bedouin no rust and obviously in full touring mode B-)............ Plus old campers are cheaper to service..........no need to get ripped off by main dealers :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Tracker - 2012-07-03 1:29 PM With out wishing to upset Eddie (again) perhaps those who have bought an old and potentially troublesome van abroad (LHD?) could explain to those of us who have not exactly what the legal requirements and obstacles to be overcome are for someone resident this side of the water before the idea can be properly suggested as viable to others? That is quite apart from the distance, language, currency, ferry and not least the vehicle specifications - both mechanical and conversion? Are the gas, heating, fridge, water, electronics etc systems compatible with long term UK use and can you get bits when things fail? I'm not against the idea in principle but it does seem more fraught with hurdles than buying local? Look, the OP said he was considering a German van. if you used your own fingers and eyes instead of spurting your jaded ill-informed prejudice, you would see that much better value available over the water. what is the difference between a faulty UK van and a faulty German van? Erm....nothing that I can think of. I am more then happy to help sort out the details if and when, including cost etc....and more then enough recent threads re importing. its nothing to be worried about as long as van roadworthy with new TUV certificate *-) I can assure you, you are much more likely to buy something with a dodgy MOT in this country :-S So lets agree to disagree and leave it at that (one can live in hope) And if he finds a nice van here all the better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 It's a shame that you choose to take that abrasive attitude Eddie. The OP did indeed say that would consider a German van - consider - not limit himself to. Now, unlike some, I don't want to put words in his mouth but to me consider has always meant optional?? A LHD continental spec van may well be acceptable but it will need to have the correct headlights and speedo to be viable in the UK? I do agree about dodgy MOTs because so much is just down to one man's opinion but I have no knowledge of how the German version differs - if indeed it does? 'Jaded ill informed prejudice' are not words I would choose to use on a discussion topic such as this - especially when they can so readily be used to describe their original writer's attitudes!! The whole point of a discussion is to explore all the alternatives which could possibly include some that the OP had not yet considered after which he will make his own choice based on his own intuition with some insight and maybe unknown angles provided by all of us. Meanwhile - lets keep it courteous and objective shall we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Tracker - 2012-07-03 1:29 PM........................ perhaps those who have bought an old and potentially troublesome van abroad (LHD?) could explain to those of us who have not exactly what the legal requirements and obstacles to be overcome are for someone resident this side of the water before the idea can be properly suggested as viable to others?....................... To answer the question. You must have means to pay in Euros, and verify whether the dealer will accept payment on a debit, or credit, card. If not, you'll need to take cash. Arranging for a electronic transfer seems a bit OTT for the relatively small sum involved, but is equally possible. You would be wise to inspect before buying, as with any used vehicle. If buying in Germany, the vehicle will have no numberplate, as German numberplates belong to the driver and not the vehicle. You will, therefore, need to arrange with the seller to supply temporary export plates, which come with compulsory third party insurance. This is reportedly valid EU wide. It is reportedly valid for one month, though some have said two weeks. There may be an option. This needs to be carefully checked. Whether this is acceptable depends on the individual's attitude to risk. However, at this price band the potential financial loss is a lot less than for someone buying new. UK insurance is available from a few firms on chassis number only, but it will not come into effect until the van enters UK. So, having paid for the van and taken whichever insurance route suits, you drive it home. If buying in France the vehicle will come with numberplates. Can't answer for Belgium or Netherlands. It should be possible, according the the MIB, to insure the vehicle f/c on its foreign registration on a temporary basis until re-registered in UK. Again, the buyer will need to check this with insurers. In this case, having insured and paid for the vehicle, all that will be required is to drive it home. AFAIK, temporary insurance for vehicle export is not available in France. This may become the main stumbling block to buying there, if UK insurers will not oblige. Having got the van back home, it will need a UK MoT, and must have its speedometer modified to read in MPH, its headlamps must dip to the left (masks etc are not permissible), and it must have a high intensity rear fog lamp on the UK offside, or in the rear centre. DVLA produce an excellent information pack on the procedure, including all necessary application forms. It is highly likely under new instructions issued to DVLA that the vehicle must be presented to a VOSA test station to verify the required modifications have been carried out. Once VOSA give the all clear DVLA will assign a registration number and an authority to have the plates made up. Notify the insurer of the reg no, and one trip to Haulfrauds later you will be street legal. It really is not difficult. My reservation in getting a vehicle of this age is availability of spares. The base vehicles are commercial vehicles that generally have a short and brutal life. Manufacturers do not support them over such long timescales as they do with cars, for the simple reason most are totally knackered in under 10 years. Items such a replacement headlamps and speedometers (or overlays) may be difficult, or impossible, to source. So careful checking of the necessary parts is essential before buying. This will apply even more to elderly A class vehicles if the original base vehicle headlamps were replaced. If the conversion was never imported into UK, it is probable that left dipping lamps would never have been made. It may be possible to source alternatives, but there is the risk this may not be possible, or that it will take more time than the insurer will grant. So, confirming before purchase that all parts will be available seems to me essential. So, too, does that nice roomy barn. :-) Buy in Germany as near to the Channel coast as possible, take the third party export insurance, drive carefully to that barn, do all the necessary, obtain insurance on the chassis number, apply for registration, drive for MoT and VOSA inspection, and then wait for DVLA to deliver. There is no VAT issue as the vehicle will be well over the 6 months/6,000 miles margin. Whether it would be worthwhile financially I somewhat doubt. But, it would give a far greater choice of vehicles in either Germany or France, simply because their motorhome markets are, and have been for years, so much larger than ours. So, a correspondingly larger pool of used vehicles from which to choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aston Posted July 3, 2012 Author Share Posted July 3, 2012 Hi all, a few things what is a CB? The reason I am looking for a larger Motorhome is so we can spend a good while touring Europe to hopefully see some Blue skies. So if I were to buy a van in France or Spain and stayed in Europe surely there would be no problem until I bought the van to the uk. (If I was insured for any vehicle which I am) I am not so sure on the changing speedo for an MOT as my VW camper speedo reads KPH and has never failed it's MOT. The van I buy needs to be such a size/design that when little one goes to bed we can still be fairly noisy (At the moment in our VW Devon we are on top of each other. Again any suggestions for vans, I don't mind rust etc as I like tinkering with my vehicles. However which Base vehicles do you rate highly from this era and which should be avoided. Thank's all Here is a fantastic French site http://www.leboncoin.fr/caravaning/offres/basse_normandie/occasions/?f=a&th=1&ps=4&pe=11&q=camping+car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 CB = Coach Built Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 When you say you 'are insured to drive any vehicle' what do you mean? Vehicle insurance in the UK is generally vehicle specific with sometimes, but not always, the extra facility that allows you to drive any other vehicle as long as it is not owned by you and you are not it's keeper. There is also the grey area which sometimes requires the borrowed vehicle to be specifically insured by it's owner to be eligible to be included in the DOC (driving other cars) extension. Be very careful and if in doubt seek the advice of your own insurers. You have perhaps been lucky that the MOT tester has not spotted your speedo in KPH but it is a legal requirement for vehicles registered here to have MPH speedos and RHD headlamps. If you are involved in an accident the s##t will hit the fan and you might find yourself uninsured with fines, possible driving ban and possibly the vehicle being seized and crushed as Mr Plod quite rightly takes a dim view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aston Posted July 3, 2012 Author Share Posted July 3, 2012 JudgeMental - 2012-07-03 9:02 PM CB = Coach Built Yes I have to say I am not too keen on all that varnished wood the German vans have so much of but nothing that can't be covered and updated however the French vans seem to have a nicer finish more of a homey design like this for example http://suchen.mobile.de/wohnwagen-inserat/pilote-j5-heddesheim/164334367.html?lang=en&pageNumber=1&__lp=1&scopeId=MH&sortOption.sortBy=price.consumerGrossEuro&makeModelVariant1.makeId=20300&makeModelVariant1.searchInFreetext=false&makeModelVariant2.makeId=5500&makeModelVariant2.searchInFreetext=false&makeModelVariant3.makeId=19700&makeModelVariant3.searchInFreetext=false&vehicleCategory=Motorhome&segment=Motorhome&fuels=DIESEL&fuels=PETROL&maxPrice=6001&negativeFeatures=EXPORT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Hi Aston If you want to look at the continent for a Van, I would strongly advise you do not look at "Private" sellers. (as with your last link) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Or how about British? Here is a nice looking 1989 Auto-Trail on a Mercedes chassis still at a starting bid of £4,950 with only a day to go. Link. Surely worth a look? Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aston Posted July 3, 2012 Author Share Posted July 3, 2012 No doubt i'll buy here in Blighty, I have been looking since November and am in no rush. Out of curiosity, why should I avoid Private sellers abroad? Out of all the layouts I have seen I like the Hobby 600 layout the best (I like the fixed bed and almost seperate bedroom, Same with the yank C class motorhomes, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 4, 2012 Share Posted July 4, 2012 "Yes I have to say I am not too keen on all that varnished wood the German vans have so much of but nothing that can't be covered and updated however the French vans seem to have a nicer finish more of a homey design like this for example" you cant just post a LONG link without reducing the size first?lol "Tiny Url" does this for you. all you end up doing is making thread difficult to read. ask mods to remove link... You have probably picked what I consider the poorest camper imaginable in your link. I would really only consider panel vans at this age, rot and damp is then not an issue.and a steel body easier to repair and identify trouble spots lots of Mercs on mobile.de and you can get a decent looking solid Sprinter based camper around your budget, I would not go near an old A class... a windscreen would be near enough impossible to find and could cost nearly as much as the whole van And I really dont get Flicka's comments regards not buying privately.....I would think a far better chance of finding a loved van this way Keiths link looks pretty decent.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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