Dave225 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 lennyhb - 2012-08-10 5:37 PM Dave225 - 2012-08-10 4:50 PM Brian's comments are very pertinent. However, even EU manufaturers have gone to the wall, or being taken over. Eriba in France and Tirus come to mind. Eriba didn't go to the wall they are still alive and well they are and always have been part of Hymer, during the resession Hymer consolidated and brought the manufacturing back to their home country. I know that is why I said 'taken over'. The plant in France closed down so I am sure the French workers there were none too chuffed, even if the Germans smiled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave225 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Rayjsj - 2012-08-10 5:42 PM Just read the news about Bentley and am very dissapointed, I own a 6 year old Autocruise, and on looking for a replacement a Bentley was the only van that fitted our requirements. Much prefere British Vans, but have a very strong dislike for anything produced by Swift. Oh well ! guess we will keep the Autocruise until another 'Quality' British model comes along. I don't like habitation doors on the wrong side or Large immovable tables,like a workable kitchen with an oven at a 'Safe' height, with 4 grill burners, don't like climbing ladders or onto the roof of a garage to sleep. AND as we spend most of our holidays in the UK, we like a lounge where we can 'lounge', not sit upright around a fixed table. That list seems to have discounted most of the vans we have looked at over the last few months (except the Bentley !!). any Ideas ? Ray The issue is that there are 100 million potential customers in the EU but only how many in the UK? Now many EU makers make the models for the EU market but will add things like ovens for UK customers. I have not yet seen a UK maker do this the other way round. This specialising in a small market is not the best way forward methinks. By the way to answer your question, why not look at one of the bespoke makers who will do what ever you wish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuevoboy Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Genuinely sorry this has happened. Since entering the motorhome scene a couple of years ago, we've been fans of the Autocruise brand and similarly the Bentley one. We were really impressed with the reviews of the smaller range of Bentley's and called into a dealers on the way home from holiday last month to look at the possibility of purchasing the Amber model. As it happens it wasn't for us but while there we looked at the bigger versions too. All really good quality 'vans but surely they expanded far too fast. I can only hope someone takes on (or over) the company as they're obviously great designs and deserve to offer an alternative option to the mainstream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 For what it's worth, my view is that they we a bit too confident that people would buy their product in preference to anyone else's, I must say that I found them over-priced and over-equipped, too much bling and some of the equipment fitted was questionable ... I seem to recall that the Heki was a 'caravan one' in one motorhome? A lot of stuff is 'extra cost' with some having poor payloads - the Cerise is about 400kg before you account for a single passenger and although they are upgradable, this is a cost option. The price really starts to rise when you then look at what you are paying for just to get your basic needs covered ... compare this to a lot of the 'opposition' and the Bentley's look very poor value for money. It's really is a shame of course, but I think part of the problem is that they expanded too fast before building up a sustaining customer base and believed too much in their own 'value'. :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelly58 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Mel B - 2012-08-10 7:01 PMFor what it's worth, my view is that they we a bit too confident that people would buy their product in preference to anyone else's, I must say that I found them over-priced and over-equipped, too much bling and some of the equipment fitted was questionable ... I seem to recall that the Heki was a 'caravan one' in one motorhome? A lot of stuff is 'extra cost' with some having poor payloads - the Cerise is about 400kg before you account for a single passenger and although they are upgradable, this is a cost option. The price really starts to rise when you then look at what you are paying for just to get your basic needs covered ... compare this to a lot of the 'opposition' and the Bentley's look very poor value for money.It's really is a shame of course, but I think part of the problem is that they expanded too fast before building up a sustaining customer base and believed too much in their own 'value'. :-SExactly my view as well The one's I had a look were just as discribed by Mel and could not have put it better myself . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Rayjsj - 2012-08-10 5:42 PMJust read the news about Bentley and am very dissapointed, I own a 6 year old Autocruise, and on looking for a replacement a Bentley was the only van that fitted our requirements. Much prefere British Vans, but have a very strong dislike for anything produced by Swift.Oh well ! guess we will keep the Autocruise until another 'Quality' British model comes along. I don't like habitation doors on the wrong side or Large immovable tables,like a workable kitchen with an oven at a 'Safe' height, with 4 grill burners, don't like climbing ladders or onto the roof of a garage to sleep. AND as we spend most of our holidays in the UK, we like a lounge where we can 'lounge', not sit upright around a fixed table. That list seems to have discounted most of the vans we have looked at over the last few months (except the Bentley !!). any Ideas ? RayThere must be an Autotrail that fits most of those requirements. Would not want another British manufacture to go the same way as Bentley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Cliffy - 2012-08-10 8:44 PM There must be an Autotrail that fits most of those requirements. Would not want another British manufacture to go the same way as Bentley. Is Autotrail British?..............I thought they were owned by Trigano :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I couldn't care less that the owners went bust, that's business (or lack of it). I do feel for their employees though. I can't stand most british vans anyway, they are too much like caravans inside ie old fahioned and as one poster observed, like a granny flat. (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 peter - 2012-08-10 9:04 PM I couldn't care less that the owners went bust, that's business (or lack of it). I do feel for their employees though. I can't stand most british vans anyway, they are too much like caravans inside ie old fahioned and as one poster observed, like a granny flat. (lol) I like my granny flat 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Yep thought so ;-) Group websitesParis10/08/201221:59:22Share price (NYSE-Euronext) Trigano www.trigano-finance.com Motor caravans www.arcacamper.it www.autostar.fr www.auto-trail.co.uk www.benimar.com.es www.caravansinternational.it www.challenger.tm.fr www.chausson.tm.fr www.ci-motorhomes.co.uk www.eura-mobil.de www.font-vendome.fr www.karmann-mobil.de www.reisemobilforum.de www.rollerteam.it www.rollerteammotorhomes.co.uk www.tributemotorhomes.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliffy Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 pelmetman - 2012-08-10 9:18 PMYep thought so ;-)Group websitesParis10/08/201221:59:22Share price (NYSE-Euronext)Triganowww.trigano-finance.comMotor caravanswww.arcacamper.itwww.autostar.frwww.auto-trail.co.ukwww.benimar.com.eswww.caravansinternational.itwww.challenger.tm.frwww.chausson.tm.frwww.ci-motorhomes.co.ukwww.eura-mobil.dewww.font-vendome.frwww.karmann-mobil.dewww.reisemobilforum.dewww.rollerteam.itwww.rollerteammotorhomes.co.ukwww.tributemotorhomes.co.uk[/quote]That makes me even happier with mine.Made in Britain controlled by Europeans. I would be happier still if it was controlled by Japanese though. That may not be too far off, they appear to be under represented in the MH market Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Robinhood - 2012-08-10 11:25 AM It's always depressing to see such things happen, particularly because of the knock-on effect on customers, suppliers, and workforce. I'm not usually one to post in such a manner, or to decry entreprenuership, but given the proprietors' aggregate record in the industry (Holdsworth, Cockburn Holdsworth, Autocruise, and now Bentley), one might reflect on the circumstances and at least consider a different view. To quote Oscar Wilde, "To lose one parent may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose both (or more)looks like carelessness". Sad news indeed, especially for the employees many of which AFAIW, transfered to Bentley's after the Swift purchase of Autocruise. I have always liked the Autocruise range, a little off the mainstream but highly practical layouts & generally carried over to the Bentleys' range. (i.e. any other Coachbuilt with a rear entry door ?) Given the current financial situation, I fear they may not rise from the ashes so easily this time. The owners have consistently shown their design capability which has met a good proportion of the UK market requirement, but their "Management & Financial" skills, based on past performance, appear to be somewhat less than their Design & Build abilities. (unfortunately how true for so many British companies) It's the old saying "a good tradesman does not a good manager make" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Robinhood - 2012-08-10 11:25 AM It's always depressing to see such things happen, particularly because of the knock-on effect on customers, suppliers, and workforce. I'm not usually one to post in such a manner, or to decry entreprenuership, but given the proprietors' aggregate record in the industry (Holdsworth, Cockburn Holdsworth, Autocruise, and now Bentley), one might reflect on the circumstances and at least consider a different view. To quote Oscar Wilde, "To lose one parent may be regarded as a misfortune; to lose both (or more)looks like carelessness". Sad news indeed, especially for the employees many of which AFAIW, transfered to Bentley's after the Swift purchase of Autocruise. I have always liked the Autocruise range, a little off the mainstream but highly practical layouts & generally carried over to the Bentleys' range. (i.e. any other Coachbuilt with a rear entry door ?) Given the current financial situation, I fear they may not rise from the ashes so easily this time. The owners have consistently shown their design capability which has met a good proportion of the UK market requirement, but their "Management & Financial" skills, based on past performance, appear to be somewhat less than their Design & Build abilities. (unfortunately how true for so many British companies) It's the old saying "a good tradesman does not a good manager make" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 The thing about a niche market its a small market ;-).............keep it small and easy to manage has always been my motto :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolly1965 Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 I have to say, that if there was such a demand for low spec basic motorhomes in this country then there would be a manufacturer prepared to meet those needs, th truth is that the generation that the manufacturers are aiming at are the same generations that have to upgrade their phone every time a new model comes out. We're upgrade driven. Also, not everyone wants to travel on the continent. I'm quite happy with good old blighty and want a cosy cocoon in which to while away those drizzly days. It's true that no-one builds for the export market, but with established brands already in europe it would be a major gamble. The sad fact is that the government and the banks got us into this recession and they're not doing anything to get us out of it. The Olympics are just for show and their positive effect on the economy will be negligable. We need cheaper fuel to get this country moving. Real incentives for people to start new businesses and help to expand existing companies. I am an employer and we are taxed to almost breaking point and have no help from the government nor the banks. Try telling HMRC that cash flow is tight, there's no leeway from them. That's one reason why british compamies' prices are so high. I for one believe in helping ourselves and make a positive effort to buy british wherever possible. Sadly as we have no british motor industry, my car is american and the motorhome base vehilce is italian. Though i did have a Rover 75, before they were sold down the swanee and a Jaguar, before the indians took over. At the end of the day, we're the only ones who can get us out of this mess, not the government, nor the banks, and I feel for everyone involved in Bentley Motorhomes - At least they gave it a shot, in difficult times, and kept many people in jobs, that they otherwide wouldn't have had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poppy Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Bolly1965 - 2012-08-10 11:50 PM I have to say, that if there was such a demand for low spec basic motorhomes in this country then there would be a manufacturer prepared to meet those needs, th truth is that the generation that the manufacturers are aiming at are the same generations that have to upgrade their phone every time a new model comes out. We're upgrade driven. Also, not everyone wants to travel on the continent. I'm quite happy with good old blighty and want a cosy cocoon in which to while away those drizzly days. It's true that no-one builds for the export market, but with established brands already in europe it would be a major gamble. Well said. The sad fact is that the government and the banks got us into this recession and they're not doing anything to get us out of it. The Olympics are just for show and their positive effect on the economy will be negligable. We need cheaper fuel to get this country moving. Real incentives for people to start new businesses and help to expand existing companies. I am an employer and we are taxed to almost breaking point and have no help from the government nor the banks. Try telling HMRC that cash flow is tight, there's no leeway from them. That's one reason why british compamies' prices are so high. I for one believe in helping ourselves and make a positive effort to buy british wherever possible. Sadly as we have no british motor industry, my car is american and the motorhome base vehilce is italian. Though i did have a Rover 75, before they were sold down the swanee and a Jaguar, before the indians took over. At the end of the day, we're the only ones who can get us out of this mess, not the government, nor the banks, and I feel for everyone involved in Bentley Motorhomes - At least they gave it a shot, in difficult times, and kept many people in jobs, that they otherwide wouldn't have had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Dave225 - 2012-08-10 5:44 PM lennyhb - 2012-08-10 5:37 PM Dave225 - 2012-08-10 4:50 PM Brian's comments are very pertinent. However, even EU manufaturers have gone to the wall, or being taken over. Eriba in France and Tirus come to mind. Eriba didn't go to the wall they are still alive and well they are and always have been part of Hymer, during the resession Hymer consolidated and brought the manufacturing back to their home country. I know that is why I said 'taken over'. The plant in France closed down so I am sure the French workers there were none too chuffed, even if the Germans smiled. when we changed to a panel van last year the Hymer Car was under consideration but there where simply none around, and as you rightly say the factory in France had shut down and production was moved to Germany with no availability in the meantime.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Robinhood - 2012-08-10 3:27 PM ....but I didn't know Bentley had originally had a 10 year warranty. Bentley never offered a 10-year warranty. As stated in your link , Bailey initially offered that duration warranty 'free', but subsequently revised the terms and conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 peter - 2012-08-10 9:04 PM I couldn't care less that the owners went bust, that's business (or lack of it). I do feel for their employees though. I can't stand most british vans anyway, they are too much like caravans inside ie old fahioned and as one poster observed, like a granny flat. (lol) Each to their own, we ( me,wife and labrador) have just lived happily in our 'granny flat' on wheels (Autocruise Starlet 2/ aka Starburst) for 3 months, touring the Western isles, North of Scotland, lakes etc., quite comfortably, Even Christmas away in the UK the van was fine, with an Inboard water tank and diesel Heater we lived warmly and comfortably. Most of the 'Imported' vans we have looked at, we would not have had the same levels of comfort and space to 'Live in', a short weekend or mainly living outside and 'Eating out' perhaps ? but extended, mainly self-contained 'living' No. Autotrails do look a Good alternative, not too bothered where the 'Head office' is, as long as they maintain their 'British style' and fitments (and keep the door on the 'correct' side). perhaps a Tracker with and end Washroom, do they do one ? Ray As for European manufacturers making vans 'For the UK market', we think their attempts draw a ' Nil Point', Their 'Tek Tower' fitment is an 'accident waiting to happen' . And not everyone can afford to 'Eat out' every day. their kitchens are a 'bad joke' in space and fitments (unless you want an 'automatic coffee maker'). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 surely if you never venture outside the most God forsaken, motorhome unfriendly country in Europe, and you like grannys living room ambiance, you would be better served with a caravan :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 oop's *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 JudgeMental - 2012-08-12 10:48 AM surely if you never venture outside the most God forsaken, motorhome unfriendly country in Europe, and you like grannys living room ambiance, you would be better served with a caravan :D hardly ! have you ever tried towing a caravan around the Hebrides or in the Highlands ? and I have not found any hostility on the islands, far from it. Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 Ray, everyone is entitled to their opinion but it should be based on experience,we have a (horrible) burstner, This is after having British, we have a towertec, fridge freezer , fixed bed plus drop down in front,can sit 6 people in the lounge,on reclining seats, and to eat in comfort, good heating, large water tanks, We have a pullout work top. Extension which has been hardly used, infact we are at last happy with a m/home, had it 5years and are not even thinking about changing it to a super layout british machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted August 12, 2012 Share Posted August 12, 2012 Us too had our Hymer 4 years would only consider changing for another Hymer. Wouldn't touch a British built van, had British built caravans what a load of rubbish, last caravan was German much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 trooper - 2012-08-12 4:46 PM Ray, everyone is entitled to their opinion but it should be based on experience,we have a (horrible) burstner, This is after having British, we have a towertec, fridge freezer , fixed bed plus drop down in front,can sit 6 people in the lounge,on reclining seats, and to eat in comfort, good heating, large water tanks, We have a pullout work top. Extension which has been hardly used, infact we are at last happy with a m/home, had it 5years and are not even thinking about changing it to a super layout british machine. I quite agree with you, and if yours suits your lifestyle, very good. My comments are based on our search for a replacement for our 'much loved' Autocruise Coachbuilt, our 'Will buy it, when the time comes' replacement , 'Bentley Cobalt' looks like a 'non-starter'. Due to their entering administration. I don't like and buy British van's because I am patriotic (although i am), I buy them (Autosleeper, Autocruise) because we like the quality, the layouts and the innovation which suit us fine. My dissapointment is because my choice will now be limited , and less choice is bad for everyone. Even more of a shame because the Bentley 'Oulton, Mallory, Amber & Cerise' all won prizes in the Caravan Club 'Design and Drive' competition this year. I didn't intend to start a battle in the British versus Imported Motorhome debate, for me there is no debate it's British every time. (although my choice is diminishing rapidly !!) Ray My comment about the 'tektower' reflects the fact that we are both under 5' 8'', for anyone over that I suspect there isn't a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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