nowtelse2do Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 My cousin e-mailed me today from Spain. He was driving his car and was stopped by the Guardia Urbana on the Costa Del Crime, he was asked to produce all of his documents (meaning the original one's) registration, insurance, licence etc He could not produce them because they had been left at the hotel so had to pay on the spot fine of e300. His fault for not carrying them with him, but they would not let him go back to the hotel to get them. His wife said she would stop with them until he got back but they wouldn't have none of it. He said they were blitzing the area and setting up road blocks and pulling in only foreign registered vehicles. So make sure you have your docs with you when driving, not just in Spain but all over the rest of Europe because it is the law. Photo copies will not do by the way, must be original. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 If he'd shown the documents to them, they would probably not have known what they were looking at. Never mind what's written on them. >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted October 19, 2012 Author Share Posted October 19, 2012 peter - 2012-10-19 8:20 PM If he'd shown the documents to them, they would probably not have known what they were looking at. Never mind what's written on them. >:-) Possible Peter, but they were only stopping foreign registered vehicles (even trucks) so would think they would have thought of that. He addmited he was wrong but not a happy man at e300 fine. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 He should have shown them a couple of old electric bills and they wouldn't know the difference. :D But I take the point that you should always have you documents with you. Because if you have a prang, you will be in deep do do if you can't produce them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilmac Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 peter - 2012-10-19 9:20 PM If he'd shown the documents to them, they would probably not have known what they were looking at. Never mind what's written on them. >:-) I would think that with the many years of experience the Guardia Civil have of dealing with UK vehicles (legal and illegal) they probably know exactly what they are looking at. And, with communications as they are they'll check everything too. *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 It wont stop Spain asking for a bail out from the EU. Wonder what other ways they will dream up to get revenue >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverback Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 nowtelse2do - 2012-10-19 8:11 PM My cousin e-mailed me today from Spain. He was driving his car and was stopped by the Guardia Urbana on the Costa Del Crime, he was asked to produce all of his documents (meaning the original one's) registration, insurance, licence etc He could not produce them because they had been left at the hotel so had to pay on the spot fine of e300. His fault for not carrying them with him, but they would not let him go back to the hotel to get them. His wife said she would stop with them until he got back but they wouldn't have none of it. He said they were blitzing the area and setting up road blocks and pulling in only foreign registered vehicles. So make sure you have your docs with you when driving, not just in Spain but all over the rest of Europe because it is the law. Photo copies will not do by the way, must be original. Dave your cousin has been skammed the cops are on the take!! happenned to us in italy!! just play em.. tell them to take you to the cop shop and speak to the desk sargent... its still the same fine!! get there badge number.name etc.. can someone give a link to say that its law to have your original docs on you..i say what a load of tosh!! by the way i never paid in italy soon as i said cuff me and stuff me! they soon stammered a get on your way!! DO NOT PAY OWT to anybody *-) jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 silverback - 2012-10-20 9:52 PM............................can someone give a link to say that its law to have your original docs on you..i say what a load of tosh!! jonathan Don't think it is tosh, Jonathan. It is standard advice from all the motoring organisations that if you travel abroad you must have with you the original V5C and insurance certificate, and that copies are not acceptable. The vehicle must also have valid UK tax. Easily checked: no need to take my word for it. I can't quote you chapter and verse on all the legislation, but the requirement to carry the registration certificate is in the Vienna Convention on Road Traffic 1968. On the evidence I have seen, I have no doubt that it is a condition of taking a vehicle abroad that it must be properly registered, taxed, and insured in its country of origin, and that these documents are the only legally acceptable proof of that. Without that proof the vehicle is not legally entitled to travel outside its national boundaries. They must be available on demand if requested by any police officer in any country visited. So, you do have to have them in the vehicle. If your vehicle were involved in an accident while abroad (in some countries even a "fender bender"), and you could not provide the documents when asked for them, you could have the vehicle impounded, and also be fined. If injury were involved, in some countries, you would risk imprisonment at least until the documents were provided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverback Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 i take your point Brian but what i am saying is..if you get pulled up by the cops ere, you have a specified time to produce your docs... does that not apply in europe? why would you carry original docs with you ? your married? do you carry your marriage cert with you? all im saying is surely you must have time to produce docs? if in europe you have to produce everything down to the kitchen sink. thats unreasonable they are on the take..they even do it in the uk..i say call there bluff you have not done owt wrong jonathan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patricia Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Certainly no time allowed at all in France - on the spot fines. You even have to show the "Carte Grise" (V05) before they will carry out the "Controle Technique" (MOT equivalent). If stopped by police this and driving licence are the first things they ask for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 The other alternative would be to carry a 'Vehicle on hire' certificate. This is what you have to obtain if driving a hired vehicle as the vehicle owner in this case will not release the V5C from his care. Have a look at the RAC website... Link Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 With modern copying and printing, I would suspect that the policeman would not know if it was a copy or the original . Brian B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FRANKP60 Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Was talking to Pal who lives in Spain full time in house,he seems to think the problem is caused by people(NOT ALL) mainly on coast who go to Spain to live full time.They take there UK( or other countries )car over but don't register it in Spain or return to UK for mot .Then they don't have tax, mot, or of cause insurance,and just use car to run to supermarket etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crinklystarfish Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 silverback - 2012-10-20 11:46 PMi take your point Brianbut what i am saying is..if you get pulled up by the cops ere, you have a specified time to produce your docs... does that not apply in europe? It is an offence to fail to produce docs here in England too, it's just that there are several defences available, one of which is to produce them at a PS within the statutory time limit. If you have produced at a PS you have a defence - but the offence itself is still complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubberrat Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Certainly the case in Portugal now that original documents must be present in the vehicle for inspection. Our Portuguese friend also said that we must carry a passport too, although I haven't delved into the truths and legalities of that although I have started to keep it with me in case. Seems aimed mainly at 'foreign' registered cars and ones that are registered to hire companies. The car I use in Portugal is locally registered, but I see the police officers eyes bore into me when they are sitting at junctions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 rubberrat - 2012-10-21 9:47 AM The car I use in Portugal is locally registered, but I see the police officers eyes bore into me when they are sitting at junctions. That might be something to do with all the luggage on your roof rack. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Really a bit surprised that some travel without documents.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 silverback - 2012-10-20 11:46 PM i take your point Brian but what i am saying is..if you get pulled up by the cops ere, you have a specified time to produce your docs... does that not apply in europe? why would you carry original docs with you ? your married? do you carry your marriage cert with you? all im saying is surely you must have time to produce docs? if in europe you have to produce everything down to the kitchen sink. thats unreasonable they are on the take..they even do it in the uk..i say call there bluff you have not done owt wrong jonathan I'm afraid, Jonathan, that you are making the common mistake of thinking Europe is a country with rules and laws that mirror UK rules and laws. It is not: it is a collection of individual countries that have agreed to harmonise certain rules and laws, but not all rules and laws. What documents you must carry is pretty universal, when you have to produce them is a local law, and the penalty for failure will vary from country to country, and in the federal countries, possibly from federal area to federal area. Some homework indicated? :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxy Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 June this year - Benidorm, ran some people to beach in borrowed car, police noticed someone not wearing seat belt, yes stupid mistake. Asked for driving licence, had left in in motorhome on campsite.Then you will be arrested and taken to police station where you will be fined 200eur and not leave until driving licence produced, in the meantime car will be taken away on Grua transporter to compound where it will stay until compound fee paid. Now bearing in mind this cop has a gun! I would strongly advise at playing them along. So I politley said to him that senora would quickly vamos to campsite and get documents. she has diez minutos he ses. she made it back (a little over time) all documents produced and the fine became 100eur on the spot fine. Diplomacy sometimes works wonders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain Strachan Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 silverback - 2012-10-20 11:46 PM i take your point Brian but what i am saying is..if you get pulled up by the cops ere, you have a specified time to produce your docs... does that not apply in europe? why would you carry original docs with you ? your married? do you carry your marriage cert with you? all im saying is surely you must have time to produce docs? if in europe you have to produce everything down to the kitchen sink. thats unreasonable they are on the take..they even do it in the uk..i say call there bluff you have not done owt wrong jonathan Marriage certificate is not in this, you dont need one to drive in France/Spain. But you do need all your vehicle documents! Just stay in England where the police are not up for it so much. Not done owt is a double negative so must have done something! Cheers Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I obviously agree with all advice given above, altough I have previously travelled to France,Holland and Germany in a car and never ever carried the 'Log Book' with me, Indeed it was 'Drummed into me' to never have the 'Log Book' in the vehicle as it was (used to be) proof of ownership, so if your car got stolen they had proof of ownership as well. I note on the newer V5C logbooks it states 'Not proof of ownership' ?? when did that happen then ? and if it is NOT proof of ownership (a) what use is it ? (b) why are they so keen to see it ? PS. Coming from Wales my V5c's are mainly in Welsh, wonder what the ability of the average Gendarme or Guarda Civil is in speaking Welsh ?? Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patricia Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 I have also noticed this fact and tried to work out the difference between owner and registered keeper. Anyone know? However, Rayjsj, if you were in Brittany I think they might very well understand the documents or at least the gist of them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Patricia - 2012-10-21 6:59 PM I have also noticed this fact and tried to work out the difference between owner and registered keeper. Anyone know? If you have ever brought a car on HP you should know the finance company is the owner of the vehicle you are the registered keeper. I have been driving since the late sixty's as far I am aware it has always been the case. Some years ago had a car broken into in France (Lyon of course) went to the cops wouldn't do a thing until they had seen the registration doc which I had left in my case in my customer's office, once they had doc in hand processed the crime report I needed for insurance claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 It beats me why some people think they are being badly done to when they break the law. If the law in Europe states that you have to carry your documents, have a breathaliser, wear a high viz vest, etc etc then do it. You have 2 choices: 1) don't comply and risk a fine if you get caught 2) carry all they require and when asked for them show them The upshot is if you decide on 1 above don't complain if/when you get fined and quote it's different in UK-if you are in Europe mainland you are not in UK. If you don't agree with that then don't go abroad for your holidays -simple! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 One more thing-aren't all documents now 'Euro compliant' ie Drving licence, V5, Passport etc all have multi language sections and my insurance certificates all have translations on the back. Consequently why wouldn't Europlod know what he was reading??? Sand, head and ostrich come to mind here 8-) Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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