When did Murvi go?

[Guest pelmetman]

malc d - 2012-11-14 9:43 PM

 

colin - 2012-11-14 8:14 PM

 

.

Golden White is not a difficult colour to sell, .

 

 

 

Being a one-off van built to the customers specification, I doubt if " Golden White " was the total unique specification.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong ;-)..............but I seem to recall that Murvi managed to sell the van...........so it doesn't sound like it was too unique to put a buyer off :D

[colin]

malc d - 2012-11-14 9:43 PM

 

colin - 2012-11-14 8:14 PM

 

.

Golden White is not a difficult colour to sell, .

 

 

 

Being a one-off van built to the customers specification, I doubt if " Golden White " was the total unique specification.

 

 

 

Maybe not but IIRC that was the quoted reason for it being difficult to shift.

[WildBill]

Problem_murvi - 2012-11-14 9:19 PM

 

P***r J**es talks a good game? :-D

 

Feel free to email me and I will slither out from my stone and show you the contract too!

 

S

 

Best kept to yourself, no one elses business and you don't have to prove your story to anyone else on here. Those already in the know are the ones who count.

 

Good luck B-)

[Brian Kirby]

JudgeMental - 2012-11-14 6:40 PM

 

I have seen the order and it clearly states,

 

order date: 21/10/2011

 

delivery date: July 2012

 

colour: Golden white (metallic gold) pretty common colour..............................

I don't want in any way to prolong all this (but of course, I'm now going to - so much for good intentions! :-)) but the order must say much more than the above. Cab aircon or not, engine size, manual or auto, just for a start. There would also have been upholstery fabric choice, floor covering choice, wall lining choice, if I remember more than one option on seating type, whether or not the vehicle would have a radio/CD whatever, possibly TV aerial and TV, etc, etc. Unless they have changed their build from when I spoke to them during my visit, everything has to be chosen (albeit from limited ranges that are known to work), and the build follows those choices. This is what concerns me. There is much from that order that is missing. It may be irrelevant to the delay, it may not, but a selected typescript copy of part of a document does not amount to any more than just that. There will also presumably have been letters or e-mails back and forth. They all become parts of the contract. One would need to see the whole of all of the documents to be able properly to judge.

 

However, notwithstanding all of the above, the delayed delivery of the van by Fiat, IMO, amounts to force majeure. If you buy a new car, the first thing the dealer does is access the manufacturer's database of cars already in the country to find a match - usually at their compound, sometimes at another dealer. It seems improbable to me that if a match was readily available for the selection made, a special order to Fiat would have been placed. My assumption, therefore, is that the specification as ordered was not a "stock item". Otherwise, why order? So, in that context, if Fiat couldn't supply, the converter had no option but to await delivery. I think that amounts to force majeure: a circumstance over which the contractor has no control, but which unavoidably affects his ability to perform.

 

That is not a ground for repudiation, under contract law, to my recollection, it in effect becomes the client's risk, and he must accept the delay. For his part, the contractor has only to demonstrate that he has used his best endeavours to mitigate the delay.

 

It is precisely that lack of complete transparency, together with the emphasis placed on the lady's circumstances, that made me wary at the outset. It was, to put it bluntly, a sob story, selectively told with vindictive intent, on a public forum, against a named company.

 

Freedom of speech has been mentioned. No-one has prevented the OP from exercising his right to free speech, he is still posting. Warners had to take down the original string because it was plainly libellous, and as "publisher" of the string they would have been in the firing line had the writs begun to fly. The OP should have known that would be the case: I find it surprising that he apparently did not.

 

I am more than a little inclined to align with Crinkly in suspecting that rather more passed behind the scenes than has been revealed. However, please don't bother! It is all history and there is nothing practical to be gained by further probing, or revelations.

 

I hope the OP's mother will be very happy with her eventual choice, which is the most important point. As they say - experience is the best school in life, but it charges the highest fees.

[malc d]

pelmetman - 2012-11-14 9:51 PM

 

malc d - 2012-11-14 9:43 PM

 

colin - 2012-11-14 8:14 PM

 

.

Golden White is not a difficult colour to sell, .

 

 

 

Being a one-off van built to the customers specification, I doubt if " Golden White " was the total unique specification.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong ;-)..............but I seem to recall that Murvi managed to sell the van...........so it doesn't sound like it was too unique to put a buyer off :D

 

 

 

That may well be so but - - correct me if I'm wrong - - but ( as I understand it ) the customer signed an agreement that if she cancelled she would lose the deposit, and that is what the dispute was about.

 

 

 

(?)

[Brian Kirby]

JudgeMental - 2012-11-14 6:40 PM

 

I have seen the order and it clearly states,

 

order date: 21/10/2011

 

delivery date: July 2012

 

colour: Golden white (metallic gold) pretty common colour..............................

I don't want in any way to prolong all this (but of course, I'm now going to - so much for good intentions! :-)) but the order must say much more than the above. Cab aircon or not, engine size, manual or auto, just for a start. There would also have been upholstery fabric choice, floor covering choice, wall lining choice, if I remember more than one option on seating type, whether or not the vehicle would have a radio/CD whatever, possibly TV aerial and TV, etc, etc. Unless they have changed their build from when I spoke to them during my visit, everything has to be chosen (albeit from limited ranges that are known to work), and the build follows those choices. This is what concerns me. There is much from that order that is missing. It may be irrelevant to the delay, it may not, but a selected typescript copy of part of a document does not amount to any more than just that. There will also presumably have been letters or e-mails back and forth. They all become parts of the contract. One would need to see the whole of all of the documents to be able properly to judge.

 

However, notwithstanding all of the above, the delayed delivery of the van by Fiat, IMO, amounts to force majeure. If you buy a new car, the first thing the dealer does is access the manufacturer's database of cars already in the country to find a match - usually at their compound, sometimes at other dealers. It seems improbable to me that if a match was readily available for the selection made a special order to Fiat would have been placed. My assumption, therefore, is that the specification as ordered was not a "stock item". Otherwise, why order? So, in that context, if Fiat couldn't supply, the converter had no option but to await delivery. I think that amounts to force majeure: a circumstance over which the contractor has no control, but which unavoidably affects his ability to perform.

 

That is not a ground for repudiation, under contract law, to my recollection, it in effect becomes the client's risk, and he must accept the delay. For his part, the contractor has only to demonstrate that he has used his best endeavours to mitigate the delay.

 

It is precisely that lack of complete transparency, together with the emphasis placed on the lady's circumstances, that made me wary at the outset. It was, to put it bluntly, a sob story, selectively told with vindictive intent, on a public forum, against a named company.

 

Freedom of speech has been mentioned. No-one has prevented the OP from exercising his right to free speech, he is still posting. Warners had to take down the original string because it was plainly libellous, and as "publisher" of the string they would have been in the firing line had the writs begun to fly. The OP should have known that would be the case: it is surprising he appears not to have had that knowledge.

 

I am more than a little inclined to align with Crinkly in suspecting that rather more passed behind the scenes than has been revealed. However, please don't bother! It is all history and there is nothing practical to be gained by further probing, or revelations.

 

I hope the OP's mother will be very happy with her eventual choice, which is the most important point. As they say - experience is the best school in life, but it charges the highest fees.

[Guest peter]

Problem_murvi - 2012-11-14 9:19 PM

 

P***r J**es talks a good game? :-D

 

Feel free to email me and I will slither out from my stone and show you the contract too!

 

S

Don't bother, she's got her van. Let that be the end of it. Put it down to experience.

[Guest pelmetman]

malc d - 2012-11-14 10:06 PM

 

pelmetman - 2012-11-14 9:51 PM

 

malc d - 2012-11-14 9:43 PM

 

colin - 2012-11-14 8:14 PM

 

.

Golden White is not a difficult colour to sell, .

 

 

 

Being a one-off van built to the customers specification, I doubt if " Golden White " was the total unique specification.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Correct me if I'm wrong ;-)..............but I seem to recall that Murvi managed to sell the van...........so it doesn't sound like it was too unique to put a buyer off :D

 

 

 

That may well be so but - - correct me if I'm wrong - - but ( as I understand it ) the customer signed an agreement that if she cancelled she would lose the deposit, and that is what the dispute was about.

 

 

 

(?)

 

In that case then the contract seems unfair in so much....... that the firm can demand recompense for a cancelled order, yet the customer is expected to put up with a protracted delay without recompense *-)....................................Not a very level playing field is it ;-)

 

 

[malc d]

pelmetman - 2012-11-15 8:11 AM

 

 

 

In that case then the contract seems unfair in so much....... that the firm can demand recompense for a cancelled order, yet the customer is expected to put up with a protracted delay without recompense *-)....................................Not a very level playing field is it ;-)

 

 

 

No - it's not.

 

 

But I can't see the van supplier - who caused the delay - paying up.

 

Can you ?

 

 

:-|

[crinklystarfish]

WildBill - 2012-11-14 9:54 PM...Those already in the know are the ones who count.Good luck B-)

 

Though your deductive powers are clearly superior to most, I think there were a few typos in your statement. Should it have read: "Those who feel they are in the know are the ones who will count in the event of civil proceedings"?

It's the only way I can make sense of it.

[Tracker]

Perhaps it's time that this thread was pulled too?

 

All the protagonists need to take a long hard look at what they have said in the context of both a public open forum and of seeking an amicable resolution because, to me at least, this type of discussion is hardly the way to make friends and win support.

 

Forums can be a good way to gain publicity both good and bad but nobody seems to be coming out of this smelling of roses so come on people try taking the insults and emotions out and do try to be factual.

 

Meanwhile - I'm off back to get me head below the parapet!!

 

 

[Guest Peter James]

Problem_murvi - 2012-11-14 8:51 PM

Believe it or not Im trying to help people here.

 

Not. I believe you are waging a smear campaign against Murvi, in an attempt to bully them into paying back the rest of the deposit, leaving them even more out of pocket for the contract you have reneged on.

As for showing me the contract why can't you post it on here like everything else?

Others have pointed out you have only quoted selected parts that suit you.

I have never seen a full contract from Murvi but others have. If you post it they could see whats missing, wheras I could not.

 

I say again, Why not post the full contract on here?

[pepe63xnotuse]

Tracker - 2012-11-15 9:34 AM

 

Perhaps it's time that this thread was pulled too?

 

All the protagonists need to take a long hard look at what they have said in the context of both a public open forum and of seeking an amicable resolution because, to me at least, this type of discussion is hardly the way to make friends and win support......

 

 

I would certainly agree with your there Rich..

 

..but I bet it still wouldn't be long before somethone sparked up a

"When did the "When did Murvi go?" thread go?"... (lol) *-)

 

Anyhooo.....Glad to hear that the OP's mum is now enjoying her van.

[vindiboy]

When I read the first post I had sympathy for the poor  Pensioner Mum, you know the one buying the £50,000 van, then I read Murvis reply and I thought  WOW Murvi have acted very well, even to the point of offering the disputed £2,000 to the Lady if she  dealt with them again, two sides to every story of course.

[malc d]

pepe63 - 2012-11-15 10:36 AM

 

Tracker - 2012-11-15 9:34 AM

 

Perhaps it's time that this thread was pulled too?

 

All the protagonists need to take a long hard look at what they have said in the context of both a public open forum and of seeking an amicable resolution because, to me at least, this type of discussion is hardly the way to make friends and win support......

 

 

I would certainly agree with your there Rich..

 

..but I bet it still wouldn't be long before somethone sparked up a

"When did the "When did Murvi go?" thread go?"... (lol) *-)

 

Anyhooo.....Glad to hear that the OP's mum is now enjoying her van.

 

 

 

It may well be time for the thread to end, or be ' pulled ' as it has just become a talking match between two camps: the rational responses, and the emotional responses.

 

...and reading through you can easily distinguish between the two.

 

I wouldn't be surprised however if it is finally pulled by Warners because of the OPs' user name.

 

 

 

 

[Guest Peter James]

For those who missed it, here it is, (PS: copied and pasted from the thread I saved - please note I am not Stephen Sullivan!!);

 

Posted: 12 November 2012 4:31 PM

Subject: RE: Murvi Nightmare - WARNING

New User

 

Posts: 1

 

My name is Stephen Sullivan. I am the Financial Director of Murvi Motorcaravans Ltd. I am writing on behalf of Murvi Motorcaravans as we have recently been alerted to this discussion and feel it would be useful if we explained our position as frankly we are amazed that so much has been said without any knowledge of the facts. As the instigator of this discussion has revealed his mothers identity I can only assume that he is happy for me to use her name.

 

Mrs Hutchby ordered a new Murvi Pimento Motorcaravan in November 2011 and paid our standard 10% deposit. She was given an estimated delivery date of July 2012 and signed our very simple order form which has just two clauses – the customer signs and agrees that if they cancel or fail to complete the order, they will forfeit their deposit. They also agree that if there is an increase in the cost of the base vehicle from Fiat prior to delivery, they will pay that increase. We have building Murvis for over 30 years and we have never and never will give “promised” delivery dates. We give our best estimate of a completion date and we do our utmost to achieve those dates and by and large we usually achieve them.

 

The base vehicle for Mrs Hutchby to her exact specification was ordered from Fiat with a request for delivery in May. Once an order has been placed with Fiat it cannot be cancelled or delayed or amended and we must take delivery once it lands in the UK and we then have a limited number of weeks to complete our conversion and then it must be paid for in full at the current price whether or not we have completed our work. This is why we, along with all our major competitors, require a deposit from customers.

 

In early 2012 we became aware of delays with the arrival of Fiat base vehicles. We were given precious little official information by Fiat UK as to the cause or the length of the delay but off the record we were told that the there was a shortage of new Euro 5 engines and that priority was being given to LHD vehicles. We usually have about 30 vehicles on order at any one time and there is normally a weekly computer print out from Fiat showing the progress of all our orders with anticipated build weeks and delivery dates. For over 2 months this report was suspended by Fiat and no reliable information was forthcoming. When eventually this report was updated, whilst it listed all ordered vehicles, it gave no indication as to what order the vehicles were going to be built – it was certainly not going to be in the order in which they were ordered – but it appeared that the simpler the specification, the quicker the vehicle was likely to be built. Whilst the specification of Mrs Hutchby’s base vehicle was unique, it was not too complex – a manual gearbox and standard engine – we had to assume that this would not be too badly delayed and that, as we usually build in a little slack with our estimated delivery dates, we should be able to achieve the estimated delivery date of July.

 

It was not until April/May time that the normal scheduled deliveries returned but by this time we were running about 6 weeks late with our completion dates. Mrs. Hutchby was advised on April 3rd that we would be unable to complete her vehicle until the first week of September, some 5 weeks late. Mrs. Hutchby sent us an email, a month later, on 2nd May saying that this delay was unacceptable and that she wished to cancel her order. We wrote and advised Mrs. Hutchby that she would forfeit her deposit if she cancelled – we repeated our offer of delivery in the first week of September and also agreed that if she wanted she could delay delivery and payment until March 2013. We explained that we were contracted to take delivery of this vehicle which had been built to her exact specification and that we would have to pay for it in full.

 

The next communication we had from Mrs Hutchby was notice of a claim being made in the Small Claims Court for the return of her deposit. This was passed to our solicitors for their advice and we were advised that this short delay in delivery was not sufficient grounds for her to breach the contract and end the agreement and therefore she should either continue with the purchase or she would forfeit her deposit. We passed on this advice to Mrs Hutchby and again asked her to accept the new delivery date or some other agreed later date. Failing that we would retain her deposit and seek another buyer for her base vehicle. Mrs Hutchby declined and continued with her Small Claims Court case and we advised the court that we would be defending the claim in full. We then set about finding another customer who would be prepared to accept the base vehicle specification and colours chosen by Mrs Hutchby and who would want to take delivery in September. We did eventually find another customer who would take on this base vehicle but to secure the sale we had to agree to pass on the Fiat options chosen by Mrs Hutchby at no charge as they were items he did not particularly want. This amounted to a discount of £2,032. This customer would not take delivery until late November so we would have to pay Fiat for the base vehicle before we received the sale proceeds.

 

We wrote to Mrs Hutchby on June 21st and advised her we had found a buyer for “her” base vehicle and that we would now have to withdraw our offer of a September or later delivery date. We advised her that to mitigate our losses we had had to give away this discount. Whilst we had been advised by our solicitors that we were still entitled to retain her deposit, we said that we would, as a goodwill gesture, return her deposit less the discount we had to give away. We asked her to confirm this in writing and to withdraw her claim in the Small Claims Court.

 

Mrs Hutchby wrote to us on July 18th saying that she accepted our offer. We thanked her for her acceptance and said that as soon as we had confirmation from court that she had withdrawn her claim, we would send her our cheque. We wrote to her again on August 29th saying that we had still not had any confirmation from the Court that the claim had been withdrawn. We also wrote to the Court asking if they could confirm the withdrawal of claim. We wrote again to Mrs Hutchby on September 19th saying that we were still awaiting confirmation that she had withdrawn her claim. Mrs Hutchby replied saying that she had written twice to the Court and had even sat in their telephone queuing system but had never got through. We tried phoning Northampton County Court and after 25 minutes in the queue we also gave up! We wrote to Mrs Hutchby on September 20th and explained that we likewise had failed to get any response but had come to the conclusion that as we had not received any official court hearing dates we could only assume that the case had been dropped. We asked Mrs Hutchby for her bank details and we refunded her deposit less the loss we had incurred, i.e. the discount we had had to give away, on September 21st. As a further measure of goodwill we have told Mrs Hutchby that if she could put her disappointment behind her, we would discount the cost a new Murvi by the financial loss she has incurred by cancelling the original sale.

 

Those are the facts of this “discussion” for anyone that cares to read through all this.

 

Murvi Motorcaravans have made no financial gain whatsoever in retaining part of Mrs Hutchby’s deposit as we have had give this away to secure the prompt disposal of her base vehicle. As a company we have lost money as we have had to pay the exorbitant fees for company legal advice which in this case exceed £1,000. We believe we have acted fairly, reasonably and sympathetically with Mrs Hutchby and, whilst we do sincerely regret that we were unable to achieve our estimated delivery date, the delay was way beyond our control and was a delay suffered by all UK Fiat converters many of whom were having to extend their delivery dates by 3 months. Mrs Hutchby was advised as to the extent of the delay as soon as we had reliable information from Fiat UK. In hindsight we could have told Mrs Hutchby earlier that we were experiencing supply problems but we could not have quantified this and we felt that it was better to contact her only when we had a confirmed “built” date from Fiat. Either way, under the simple terms of our order form, we were entitled to retain all of her deposit if she cancelled her order. We have done what most of our competitors would not have done – we have returned her deposit less our costs.

 

As a footnote I wonder what your contributors would do with a very similar problem that has very recently arisen. We have a vehicle here, ordered in April, which we have very nearly finished. We have a £4,900 deposit. The customer rang in last week and has advised that he can no longer continue with the order. He will not explain why but we suspect that there has been some major change in their circumstances – possibly redundancy. As in the Mrs Hutchby case we are entitled to keep his deposit and try and find another very quickly. What some of your readers may not appreciate is that legally we can pursue our customer for the full price of the vehicle ordered. This was an option with Mrs Hutchby but was obviously not pursued but in this latest incident we do find ourselves screaming that someone can ring up just a week or so before collection and cancel an order and even have the audacity to call back a few days later to try and negotiate about how much deposit we might retain! Perhaps you can now understand why we and all our competitors require a deposit. You simply cannot offer a built-to-order vehicle and allow you customers to cancel when you have all but finished it. There has to be a sufficient financial penalty to prevent this and that is called a 10% deposit!! There are some competitors that require stage payments – we do not. The deposit we take isn’t particularly to fund the purchases of raw materials required. It is there to protect us from exactly this situation and perhaps it will make some our your contributors think twice before they condemn what is a perfectly reasonable and financially sound industry practice – a deposit is there to ensure the sale is completed and will normally be forfeited if a customer cancels or fails to complete. It applies to all sales – even ones made to pensioners!

[Tracker]

Personally I would never order anything yet to be built in advance and I really struggle to comprehend why people are so driven to pay a large forfeitable deposit up front without even a promise of a delivery date let alone help with alternative transport should the vehicle not be available when they plan to use it?

 

This is no reflection on Murvi or any other maker whose timetable and price scale is so often dictated by others such as Fiat (other base vehicles are available!) or component suppliers?

 

If I buy a new car the only concession I will make is that as long as the car exists and is in the UK I will wait a few days for it to arrive, but no way am I ordering or buying anything I can't see, inspect, touch, feel, smell and most importantly drive first and I make that clear on any order form by writing ' this order is subject to buyer's inspection, driving and approval' - which does not always go down well!

 

Cynicism is the buyers best toolkit!

 

Caveat Emptor as the Romans would say - let the buyer beware - and it still holds true 2000 years later - in fact even more so.

 

I have no axe to grind with Murvi or anyone else and whilst there are without doubt rogues out there I doubt any would still be in business after many years if they were dishonest?

[Bulletguy]

Tracker - 2012-11-15 11:55 AM

 

Personally I would never order anything yet to be built in advance and I really struggle to comprehend why people are so driven to pay a large forfeitable deposit up front without even a promise of a delivery date let alone help with alternative transport should the vehicle not be available when they plan to use it?

 

This is no reflection on Murvi or any other maker whose timetable and price scale is so often dictated by others such as Fiat (other base vehicles are available!) or component suppliers?

 

If I buy a new car the only concession I will make is that as long as the car exists and is in the UK I will wait a few days for it to arrive, but no way am I ordering or buying anything I can't see, inspect, touch, feel, smell and most importantly drive first and I make that clear on any order form by writing ' this order is subject to buyer's inspection, driving and approval' - which does not always go down well!

 

Cynicism is the buyers best toolkit!

 

Caveat Emptor as the Romans would say - let the buyer beware - and it still holds true 2000 years later - in fact even more so.

 

I have no axe to grind with Murvi or anyone else and whilst there are without doubt rogues out there I doubt any would still be in business after many years if they were dishonest?

 

BIB Richard

 

But you most certainly would expect to pay a deposit on the car you wish to order but 'you cannot see', or would you expect the Garage to order it for you first and then decide the colour isn't right for you so refuse to buy it?

 

 

[Tracker]

Bulletguy - 2012-11-15 2:58 PM

 

Tracker - 2012-11-15 11:55 AM

 

Personally I would never order anything yet to be built in advance and I really struggle to comprehend why people are so driven to pay a large forfeitable deposit up front without even a promise of a delivery date let alone help with alternative transport should the vehicle not be available when they plan to use it?

 

This is no reflection on Murvi or any other maker whose timetable and price scale is so often dictated by others such as Fiat (other base vehicles are available!) or component suppliers?

 

If I buy a new car the only concession I will make is that as long as the car exists and is in the UK I will wait a few days for it to arrive, but no way am I ordering or buying anything I can't see, inspect, touch, feel, smell and most importantly drive first and I make that clear on any order form by writing ' this order is subject to buyer's inspection, driving and approval' - which does not always go down well!

 

Cynicism is the buyers best toolkit!

 

Caveat Emptor as the Romans would say - let the buyer beware - and it still holds true 2000 years later - in fact even more so.

 

I have no axe to grind with Murvi or anyone else and whilst there are without doubt rogues out there I doubt any would still be in business after many years if they were dishonest?

 

BIB Richard

 

But you most certainly would expect to pay a deposit on the car you wish to order but 'you cannot see', or would you expect the Garage to order it for you first and then decide the colour isn't right for you so refuse to buy it?

 

 

Of course I expect to pay a deposit - I should have said so shouldn't I given the main topic!

However generally only a nominal one - like under £1000 - which I make clear is made in good faith, paid by credit card, and refundable if we don't like the colour or anything else and I've never been refused yet - and we did change our minds once and go for a different colour car after seeing the gloomy dark grey that my wife fancied!

[malc d]

Tracker - 2012-11-15 3:18 PM

 

 

 

Of course I expect to pay a deposit - I should have said so shouldn't I given the main topic!

However generally only a nominal one - like under £1000 - which I make clear is made in good faith, paid by credit card, and refundable if we don't like the colour or anything else and I've never been refused yet - and we did change our minds once and go for a different colour car after seeing the gloomy dark grey that my wife fancied!

 

 

 

None of this can really be compared to ordering a 'unique ' spec motorhome, where you have chosen the upholstery, air-con, microwave, fridge, cooker, TV, wardrobe layout, bike rack,awning etc etc.

 

Not so easy for a motorhome converter to put those back on the shelf.

 

 

 

 

 

[Tracker]

malc d - 2012-11-15 3:31 PM

 

None of this can really be compared to ordering a 'unique ' spec motorhome, where you have chosen the upholstery, air-con, microwave, fridge, cooker, TV, wardrobe layout, bike rack,awning etc etc.

 

Not so easy for a motorhome converter to put those back on the shelf.

 

 

Of course - but that does not mean the rules of protecting ones self when buying change and unless the custom spec is highly unusual or an outrageous colour any converter would probably have little difficulty in selling it as there are always buyers looking for an immediate purchase - especially when a long and indeterminate wait is expected for a custom spec - and especially if it a from a sought after converter as the van in question appeared to be?

 

As I said - nobody is emerging from this fiasco smelling of roses.

[Bulletguy]

malc d - 2012-11-15 3:31 PM

 

None of this can really be compared to ordering a 'unique ' spec motorhome, where you have chosen the upholstery, air-con, microwave, fridge, cooker, TV, wardrobe layout, bike rack,awning etc etc.

 

Not so easy for a motorhome converter to put those back on the shelf.

 

 

I wonder just what the likes of McLaren, Lamborghini or Ferrari do with a 'unique spec' vehicle that has certainly cost a heck of a lot more than 99.9% of motorhomes?!!

 

 

[Tracker]

Bulletguy - 2012-11-15 5:10 PM

 

I wonder just what the likes of McLaren, Lamborghini or Ferrari do with a 'unique spec' vehicle that has certainly cost a heck of a lot more than 99.9% of motorhomes?!!

 

 

I don't think it is at all helpful comparing two totally different concepts here?

 

Given the waiting list for Ferrari or McLaren cars I doubt they would have any trouble at all in finding a buyer for any unsold new vehicle - unless it was an outrageous colour - and I don't recall that the Murvi in question was either an outrageous colour or an undesirable specification - and even if it did or didn't have features that a new buyer liked or didn't like because the Murvi is being sold by it's maker from their own premises who better to adjust the spec to suit at cost only than the makers?

[Guest peter]

Tracker - 2012-11-15 11:55 AM

 

Personally I would never order anything yet to be built in advance and I really struggle to comprehend why people are so driven to pay a large forfeitable deposit up front without even a promise of a delivery date let alone help with alternative transport should the vehicle not be available when they plan to use it?

 

This is no reflection on Murvi or any other maker whose timetable and price scale is so often dictated by others such as Fiat (other base vehicles are available!) or component suppliers?

 

If I buy a new car the only concession I will make is that as long as the car exists and is in the UK I will wait a few days for it to arrive, but no way am I ordering or buying anything I can't see, inspect, touch, feel, smell and most importantly drive first and I make that clear on any order form by writing ' this order is subject to buyer's inspection, driving and approval' - which does not always go down well!

 

Cynicism is the buyers best toolkit!

 

Caveat Emptor as the Romans would say - let the buyer beware - and it still holds true 2000 years later - in fact even more so.

 

I have no axe to grind with Murvi or anyone else and whilst there are without doubt rogues out there I doubt any would still be in business after many years if they were dishonest?

I quite agree Richard. That's why I always buy secondhand, For the same reasons you have given. No way would I trust anyone with a 10 percent deposit, ever. It's never worth the hassle and worry that you'll get shafted.

[Bulletguy]

Tracker - 2012-11-15 5:23 PM

 

Bulletguy - 2012-11-15 5:10 PM

 

I wonder just what the likes of McLaren, Lamborghini or Ferrari do with a 'unique spec' vehicle that has certainly cost a heck of a lot more than 99.9% of motorhomes?!!

 

 

I don't think it is at all helpful comparing two totally different concepts here?

 

 

Which is what malc d said in response to your post Richard!

 

I wasn't making a comparison......simply pondering a thought!

 

 

 

malc d - 2012-11-15 3:31 PM

 

None of this can really be compared to ordering a 'unique ' spec motorhome, where you have chosen the upholstery, air-con, microwave, fridge, cooker, TV, wardrobe layout, bike rack,awning etc etc.

 

Not so easy for a motorhome converter to put those back on the shelf.