Guest JudgeMental Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 when we had the CB parking in Spain in high summer was a nightmare. last year in Italy, the lakes Tuscany and Umbria parking in fortified hill top towns no problem..if a car can get in, so can a van. We came of the ferry from Italy to Croatia (Split) and parked right on the seafront in a small car park..it was tight but we were allowed in and parked, right out side the main palace. this would have been unthinkable in a CB unless a van size one. This was the flavor of the whole 6 week trip..no hassle. one of the main reasons we prefer panel vans... I know Hugh, and while he thinks a stretched panel van may will suit their style of travel, he is unsure about the other half...Coming from a monster 8 metre + triple axle A class I have my doubts as well. But at least at the German dealer I and others use there is a massive choice of all types of campers from monster Concorde's to vans and 100's to choose from stock. I hope what ever they decide after weighing up the pros and cons the important thing is they get a good deal..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 ....interesting really, because if you feed Hymer (or Dethleffs, or Burstner, or.......) and "Feucht" or "Feuchtiigkeit" into Google, then, despite any expectations to the contrary, page after page of hits appear. Now I happen to prefer Continental 'vans, because my experience is that they fit my requirements better, but I'm certainly not blind to their "issues" either. You know from experience, Eddie, that German 'vans are not immune to water ingress. :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Robinhood - 2013-04-02 3:39 PM You know from experience, Eddie, that German 'vans are not immune to water ingress. :-S Obviously... but in our case it was covered at nearly 5 years old into a 6 year water ingress warranty, and PX deal went ahead at same price, so no loss = no big deal. Not quite the situation some poor people end up in, with some examples at less then a year old and some without cover after only 3 years. With many vans needing new floors and complete new walls for heavens sake...well documented in the few examples I posted. Like I said earlier in this thread, they can all leak, just some a lot more then others*-) Only way to remove the risk is a panel van, a compromise many of us prepared to make....this not the primary reason we prefer a secure metal box as there are many advantages, if you can live with the smaller space. If you cant, knock yourselves out:-D Hugh like us started with a pop top VW camper and I for one glad to be back to a similar style of travel.....Hugh has damp issues with current van and a bad experience with it at a dealer here, had a much better response from our German dealer, so he is now considering either a panel van or a smaller CB...what exactly is the big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-04-02 3:22 PM JudgeMental - 2013-04-01 12:59 PM Well up to your usual standards H...More nasty invective from a pig ignorant misery who lives in wettest most desolate part of this country, and it shows!lol. Yet another thread ruined.....and I thought you where a swift salesman, you know about as much about campers as one so well qualified.... http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-115917-damp-in-a-swift-bessacar-floor.html http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/swift-motorhomes/46343-rotten-swift-dont-trust-damp-checks.html http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-124837-swift-floor-problems.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-559836/Couple-stage-protest-outside-cardealership-sold-faulty-motor-home.html http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/swift-motorhomes/52118-swift-any-good-any-other-suggestions-3.html http://www.caravantalk.co.uk/community/topic/62338-swift-motorhome-630g/ http://www.practicalmotorhome.com/forum/talk/swift-damp-problems http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/community/discussions/technical/motorhomes/Damp-in-an-Autocruise-Stardream/rt/26698/ http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/tech-mech-general/48289-damp-side-wall.html http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/motorhome-chat/10980-motorhome-damp.html just a taster there are 100's of threads re crap UK vans....Oh and dont post damp queries on SWIFT forum as they get pulled :D yeah best of British... Come off it Eddie. If you pick any vehicle of any make and look on the forum for that vehicle you will find shed loads of problems with it. most sensible people take all this 'with a pinch of salt'. Sure you get more complaints in the UK about Uk built vans, because they outsell euro vans by a lot in the UK. Look on any euro country forum about vans and you will find hardly any complaints about UK built vans, the reasons are pretty obvious. You have taken a bit of trouble to look this lot up but i took about five minutes to do the same and came up with loads, these are just a couple of examples. http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-137655-water-ingress.html http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-137813-adria-matrix-680sp-12v-electrical-issues-please-help.html http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-137565-burstner-slow-service-is-this-typical.html http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-129933-byrstner-nexxo-roof-leak-at-cab-joint.html http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-134186-water-ingress-on-euramobil-integra.html . So what does this prove, nothing at all, except all makes can give trouble. The big differance would seem to be that with a UK built van you have a chance of getting it fixed, with a euro van the latest importer will probably have gone bust, again, so no chance without making several trips to whereever in europe your van was built. Before you say it you do not seem to have had much trouble but neither have i and my last three vans have all been Uk ones so no reason at all not to buy another. How you can think having less equipment for the money is good however is beyond me, just because you can do without, why should you have to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolero boy Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Eddie, is your Adria Twin a LHD model? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 bolero boy - 2013-04-02 5:36 PM Eddie, is your Adria Twin a LHD model? Hi Chris, yes all our campers have been LHD.... Pourquoi? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 hughman - 2013-03-29 12:54 PM Hi All, we're hoping to downsize shortly and are looking at vans in Germany. It's a toss-up between Possl/Globecar (well built, neat design, no damp issues as it's a van, easy drive) and probably a Sunlight low profile (bigger inside, bit more kit, but, bulkier and trickier in small villages etc). I'd really appreciate pros and cons to help us swing decision one way or the other :-S Merry Easter to all. Back to the question, then! FWIW, Hugh, I'll give you my take. :-) I think the first question to be answered is why you want to downsize. The implication is that there is something about your present van that you find inconvenient - length, width, height or weight: possibly more than one of those. Losing height or length is straightforward enough, though not without obvious consequences. Losing width is more challenging, but the Sunlight range will not achieve this as they are all the more or less standard 2.3 metres wide which, at a guess, is the same as your present van. Losing weight is again fairly straightforward, but unless you are prepared for a severe loss in payload, you will need to go radically small (not much above 6.5M) to maintain a headache free margin. As you will have gathered, PVCs and small coachbuilts are not really interchangeable: in effect, this is to compare apples with pears. You have captured the advantages of the PVC above. The generally contentious issues are the large sliding door, which many find delightful and others find disagreeable, and the two rear doors. Add to this frequently smaller gas cylinder accommodation, generally smaller fridges, frequently 2 burner hobs, possibly - for those who value an oven - no oven, "short" transverse beds - a problem if you are tall, and reduced high level locker capacity due to the "tumble home" of the bodywork. The largest storage area is usually under a transverse bed, which can require the rear doors to be opened for access, possibly exposing the bed to bad weather. However, there are many, many, variations on each layout theme, so it is possible to evade most of the above drawbacks if you research for long enough. Equally, however, I don't think it is possible to find a single PVC that evades them all, which simply reinforces the point that seems to escape many, that all motorhomes are a compromise, and the only people who can evaluate whether the compromises inherent in a particular van are acceptable, are its owners. I think the main point is that PVCs are "campervans", rather than "motor caravans". I don't mean this in any derogatory way, just that they imply a more "camping" style, outdoor, less private, approach whereas motor caravans generally are, as the name suggests, more akin to caravans, and are more enclosing, more private, and more room-like in character. Ultimately, they are just two different ways of doing much the same thing. But, quite obviously, what suits those who prefer the one, doesn't suit those who prefer the other. This palpably obvious difference of opinion serves well to illustrate, IMO, that the physical differences are more than cosmetic, and that a campervan is not just a coachbuilt shoved into a panel van body, so deciding between the two requires careful evaluation. Rather than the Sunlight range, therefore, I would suggest you might find it instructive to look at the more PVC sized offerings from the likes of Hymer (Van/Exsis), Dethleffs (Globebus T or I ranges), Knaus (Van TI), or Burstner (Travelvan), which are all, to slightly varying degrees, nearer to the width and length of PVCs. This should serve to illustrate what each type can offer within (broadly) the same footprint. I would add the two small coachbuilt clones from Hymer and Burstner with large tailgates, which may appeal, though I have to confess, having seen the Burstner version, they seem to me to be a solution looking for the problem! I think this line of enquiry might better help to sharpen focus, and inform opinion, on which variant of smaller motorhome might best suit your needs. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 With his budget he was showing me some sorry looking UK vans he was considering, and he was delighted at least in principal to see what he could get in Germany for same money... I agree I'm not impressed with the sunlight range, interiors look cheap from pictures, but I have never seen them in the flesh. I have already told him to make sure if he goes for a CB, that they will allow warranty issues to be addressed here. The dealer is very experienced and a big business with a bewildering choice from stock, I dont think he would stock a brand that gave him repeated grief so the sunlight may well fit the bill. Plus it is like your new van a Hymer group product :D re the panel van debate. mine has 100/80 litre tanks 2 x 11 kg gas and 100 litre fridge freezer. and I totally agree with 1 foot below.. dont feel like we are missing out on anything..quite the contrary.. You wait till your driving your new allloy sided pride and joy down a narrow country lane scraping brambles along both sides because you cant turn back or reverse....happy days :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 I have seen many a coach-built with only a two ring hob, our IH has four I have seen many a coach-built with no gas oven, ours has one fitted as standard. I have seen many a coach-built without a draining board, we have a dedicated SS one I have seen many a coach-built that will only take some small gas bottles, ours takes two 6kg ones just the same as some CB's or a single large refillable. We have ample worktop space We have a full size shower, just the same as a CB We have duel electric and gas water heating We have blow air heating We have a total of 12 light units, 16 if you count the four in the Heki roof light. We do not have rear doors, but a very useful under floor boot storage area We have half leather upholstery We have onboard 110 litre fresh water, and 90 litre grey tanks Ample room for storage for extended trips 32/35 mpg Cruise control Four 240 volt outlets 1500 watt inverter Twin 85 amp leisure batteries Just as much privacy in our rear lounge the same as a CB. I don't care about the play on words, camper van ? Motor home ? who cares ? So I'm not sure what exactly anyone thinks we are missing, granted we do not have Dogs or Bicycles to accommodate, and as for the large sliding door, how many folk have patio doors at home, well we have one on the van, just the thing on a hot day with the awning rolled out, why we even have a built in drop down picnic table to use under it, so second best to many CB.s of a similar footprint, sorry I don't think so . ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughman Posted April 2, 2013 Author Share Posted April 2, 2013 Well I certainly got a response :-) It's a toss-up between 'roughing it PVC style, or the 'luxury' of a CB. I'm still leaning towards a PVC for its manifest virtues, especially one with 2 fixed single beds.. SWMBO is seeing the advantages as well as the drawbacks, on the basis that we are (very relatively !!!) young and fit now, so want to carry on travelling around without too many hitches. It seems to be that CB might suit when we are a bit less agile and stuff, whilst the PVC's ability to get around easily is currently in its favour. Plus, there still remains all the damp business, and however possible it is to have minor problems with a PVC, they're never going to be as structural as on a CB. Watch this space :-) :-) :-) and many thanks for opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughman Posted April 2, 2013 Author Share Posted April 2, 2013 Well I certainly got a response :-) It's a toss-up between 'roughing it PVC style, or the 'luxury' of a CB. I'm still leaning towards a PVC for its manifest virtues, especially one with 2 fixed single beds.. SWMBO is seeing the advantages as well as the drawbacks, on the basis that we are (very relatively !!!) young and fit now, so want to carry on travelling around without too many hitches. It seems to be that CB might suit when we are a bit less agile and stuff, whilst the PVC's ability to get around easily is currently in its favour. Plus, there still remains all the damp business, and however possible it is to have minor problems with a PVC, they're never going to be as structural as on a CB. Watch this space :-) :-) :-) and many thanks for opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Again.......My work is done......common sense rules the day, and the pub calls :D Hugh my new e bike, due July, full carbon MPF centre drive, 12Ah battery 18kg.....look and weep :-D http://i49.tinypic.com/j8i3rt.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 Eddie - have you got money to burn? :D How many e-bikes have you had now in the last few years (plus your Mrs of course) ... if I didn't know better I'd swear that you change them every time the battery needs charging up!!! (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Mel B - 2013-04-02 11:34 PM Eddie - have you got money to burn? :D How many e-bikes have you had now in the last few years (plus your Mrs of course) ... if I didn't know better I'd swear that you change them every time the battery needs charging up!!! (lol) And there was me thinking bicycles were all about getting some exercise, batteries indeed. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Mel B - 2013-04-02 11:34 PM Eddie - have you got money to burn? :D How many e-bikes have you had now in the last few years (plus your Mrs of course) ... if I didn't know better I'd swear that you change them every time the battery needs charging up!!! (lol) We'll....it was my 60th recently and still owed a prezzie! :-S. Only ever have 2 e bikes at a time, swap one out now and again when something new comes along. It's a hobby and interest I take seriously is all....first day out yesterday in months ( cyclist not masochist) and it was lovely, so much faster then public transport even if it is free. 1 foot you still have to cycle they are electric assist bikes not mopeds. They just flatten those hills and make cycling enjoyable again, I bought one initially for the van and now use all the time weather permitting. Hugh has a very nice twin suspension and expensive MTB Haibike..many sporty types use e bikes in Germany and they are increasingly popular with commuters as well.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-04-02 10:12 PM Again.......My work is done......common sense rules the day, and the pub calls :D Hugh my new e bike, due July, full carbon MPF centre drive, 12Ah battery 18kg.....look and weep :-D http://i49.tinypic.com/j8i3rt.jpg Eddie even I have to admit that looks pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Whatever happened to mudguards, how is it your back and arse don't get soaking wet if the road is not bone dry 8-) Or are they an optional extra. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muswell Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 1footinthegrave - 2013-04-03 10:31 AM Whatever happened to mudguards, how is it your back and arse don't get soaking wet if the road is not bone dry 8-) Or are they an optional extra. :-) Real men don't have mudguards.....just fixed wheel, no brakes and narrow bars :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 Muswell - 2013-04-03 11:30 AM 1footinthegrave - 2013-04-03 10:31 AM Whatever happened to mudguards, how is it your back and arse don't get soaking wet if the road is not bone dry 8-) Or are they an optional extra. :-) Real men don't have mudguards.....just fixed wheel, no brakes and narrow bars :-D Bring back Cow horns that's what I say. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughman Posted April 3, 2013 Author Share Posted April 3, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-04-02 10:12 PM Again.......My work is done......common sense rules the day, and the pub calls :D Hugh my new e bike, due July, full carbon MPF centre drive, 12Ah battery 18kg.....look and weep :-D http://i49.tinypic.com/j8i3rt.jpg Flash git :D :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 error :$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 malc d - 2013-04-03 1:41 PM 1footinthegrave - 2013-04-03 10:31 AM Whatever happened to mudguards, how is it your back and arse don't get soaking wet if the road is not bone dry 8-) Or are they an optional extra. :-) As with ordinary mountain bikes it looks like ' mudguards ' are extra. Mind you, they are not always called ' mudguards ' these days - in some shops they are they are ' crud - catchers ' A much more trendy name innit. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolero boy Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-04-02 5:41 PM bolero boy - 2013-04-02 5:36 PM Eddie, is your Adria Twin a LHD model? Hi Chris, yes all our campers have been LHD.... Pourquoi? :D Hi Eddie, I only asked because I seem to remember that you bought in Belgium (?) and then part-exchanged there next time around. I therefore assumed that it had to be a LHD for the dealer to take it back. Nice looking bike, which model is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted April 3, 2013 Share Posted April 3, 2013 bolero boy - 2013-04-03 2:37 PM JudgeMental - 2013-04-02 5:41 PM bolero boy - 2013-04-02 5:36 PM Eddie, is your Adria Twin a LHD model? Hi Chris, yes all our campers have been LHD.... Pourquoi? :D Hi Eddie, I only asked because I seem to remember that you bought in Belgium (?) and then part-exchanged there next time around. I therefore assumed that it had to be a LHD for the dealer to take it back. Nice looking bike, which model is it? Yes I bought it in Belgium, nearly part exchanged it at same dealer but he only had the Karmann panel vans and did not like spec, so got the deal I wanted in Germany. Although nearly PX'ed again recently in Belgium at another dealer but have decided to stick with van we have. Chris: there are about 4 dealers in Belgium and 3 I have been to and have had prices from are very competitive and just as good deals as in Germany. plus a lot more convenient especially if you have warranty issues.....need any help let me know ;-) The bike is real high end and expensive at over £5000 *-). Madness really but I am besotted!lol...but I am working on a cunning plan to get it cheaper :D http://www.e-lom.com/product_info.php?info=p3_e-lom-carbon-29er.html If that dont work...trying this in a few weeks when it arrives here....getting great reviews in Germany http://www.fusionelectricbikes.co.uk/ktm-erace-p650-electric-hardtail-mtb-650b.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesFrance Posted April 4, 2013 Share Posted April 4, 2013 Crazy prices, in France you can buy a new 50cc scooter for 628€. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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