Less than 3500 Kgs

[Spiritchaser]

Hi,

We are hoping to head to the UK from Australia early next year and hope to buy a Motorhome and travel full time in the UK. and Europe. We have finally sold our yacht we have been cruising on for the last 15 years!

Apart from all the normal hassles such as insurance etc. we are forced to buy a MH weighing less than 3.5t.

Would appreciate thoughts on a suitable MH for full timing, a difficult task I know but unfortunately that's how it's got to be for us "non residents". I've headed towards something like a Hymer B 544 or similar such as some early Swift Kontiki's. We will travel light with just the essentials and a couple of push bikes. There seems to be a myriad to choose from, unlike her in Oz where it's very limited. All biased opinions are welcome! Our budget is around UKP 24000.

Thanks in advance to all.

[Keithl]

hi Spiritchaser,

 

How about a nice AutoTrail Cheyenne with a large garage for £23,999? It might be plated at 3,800 kg but downplating to 3,500 kg would be avery easy exercise. Oh yes, and it's low mileage and on a Merc chassis to boot.

 

Link

 

Keith.

[Guest JudgeMental]

and chances of that having a usable and reasonable payload ...Nil?

 

things have moved on weight wise but chances of getting a practical in use, older van within 3500 difficult I think. Now there are loads of new lightweight vans with decent payloads coming out of germany, but they aint cheap! back in 2007 when I was looking for a family van and as diabetic restricted to 3500, I almost gave up hope but found a fully winterised euramobil profila 660 HB and it worked well although I hated the size.....

 

have you considered a caravan? probably more flexible if overwintering in Spain/Portugal etc...

[Keithl]

JudgeMental - 2013-11-08 6:56 AM

 

and chances of that having a usable and reasonable payload ...Nil?

 

The AT brochure for 2006 quotes the unladen mass (including driver at 75 kg and 90% fuel) as 3,200 kg (and GVW as 3,800 kg) so if downplated to 3,500 kg would have circa 300 kg usable payload. If Spiritchaser plans on 'travelling light' then it could be done.

And I have certainly heard of other MH's (and even PVC's) being far worse off for payload than 300 kg.

 

Keith.

 

PS And if desperate for additional payload there is always the option of a trailer (as Pelmetman has had to do).

[Guest JudgeMental]

awnings, extra batteries etc..etc..all eat into payload. I doubt at 3500 it even has a 300 kg payload, with water gas and all the acquirement of full time living.....and 300 a joke anyway. There is a big difference between traveling light and travelling legally and comfortably

 

visit a weighbridge on any van you are considering and get it damp checked.... make these a condition of purchase. want to see how heavy an autotral can be? check the autotrail website they have a configurator on there for latest vans...

[Poppy]

I would not accept a van with a 300 kg payload.To me this is inadequate.

[Derek Uzzell]

I would have thought choosing/purchasing a vehicle will be complicated enough without considering 'down-plating' or towing a trailer.

 

A fair-sized overcab design (even if the overcab bed were not used for sleeping in) should provide lots of storage space and can be reasonably light.

 

I'd be looking to buy a fairly recent vehicle and, in order to obtain a warranty, from a trader rather than from a private individual.

 

The autotrader website

 

http://motorhomes.autotrader.co.uk/

 

allows selection of motorhome adverts using various criteria, including setting price and year ranges.

 

This is a 2008 Ford Transit-based example in the £20k-£26k price range http://tinyurl.com/odnukmx

 

(Obviously, when weight data are not provided in an advert, it would be essential to confirm that the vehicle's weight does not exceed 3500kg. It might well be that the Geist motorhome in the above advert is >3500kg.))

 

 

 

[lennyhb]

The Hymer B544 would be a better choice as far as payload, but they are a bit limited on storage space and for sleeping it would using the drop down bed they are OK but no where near as solid as the beds in the newer vans.

As Eddie says forget the Autotrail by the time you have added water, gas a passenger and any extras fitted you would be lucky to have 50kg spare.

 

For your budget I would look to the budget range vans as they have a lot more payload something like a Carado or Sunlight made in the same factory by the Hymer group should get a 4/5 year old one for that money.

 

Edit:

Another one that comes to mind is the Hymer Van compact comfortable huge payload and large garage, old enough now to be getting towards your budget.

[johnnerontheroad]

Hi,

Have a look at this site in Holland they will find you a M/H for your budget and spec, they will also arrange insurance http://www.dutchcampervans.com/

 

Personally I would not buy a British van, just my opinion, do a search on this and other forums and you will see the problems you could be buying.

 

You can do research on www.mobile.de

 

Good luck

 

Dave

 

[alanedwin]

Hi,

Try Ikonickampers.co.uk.

They specialize in supplying to people like you and offer a buy back service.

Alan

[Tracker]

Older Kon Tikis were often referred to as Kon Leaky or Leaky Tiki - and for good reason so be sure to check for damp before parting with your cash. This applies equally to all vans - new and used!

 

It might be a good idea to invest in a damp meter before looking especially if buying an older van or one from a private owner, as although damp ingress might well not be a problem for you depending on how long you want it, it might well affect the value when you come to sell as well as when you buy it.

 

I have one of these and it tends to annoy dealers when you tell them you will do your own damp checks, although they always insist on testing any van they buy from you!

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Digital-Tester-Detector-Timber-Moisture/dp/B003UUFT2Q/ref=sr_1_8/280-0243051-7474208?ie=UTF8&qid=1383911990&sr=8-8&keywords=damp+meter

[Brian Kirby]

Give us an idea of how long you would expect to stay in Europe at a time, what time of year if less than 12 months, and where you would think of going.

 

"Full timing" tends to be interpreted differently by different folk. To me it means just that, spending the whole of the year using the van as home, and for that you would need a true, fully winterised, four seasons van.

 

On the other hand, if you merely mean travelling for, say, six months at a time, and then returning to Oz and so on, I would think a three season van would probably suffice - so long as your six months avoided the winter!

 

Where is relevant, because it gets very cold in central Europe in winter, as well as up in the mountains, so even in early spring/late autumn you should anticipate low temperatures and the possibility of snow in these regions. That implies heavy gas use and adequate warm clothing and bedding, which have implications for "travelling light".

 

You will be well advised to get re-fillable gas cylinders installed as exchange cylinders cannot be axchanged across borders. That is to say a French cylinder cannot be exchanged in Germany, and vice versa, and so on across Europe. Make sure whatever you get has a locker that will accommodate two 13kg cylinders, to be sure you have adequate reserves. Autogas is not universally available, but with a bit of planning, and two cylinders brimmed as/when possible, you should be OK for most of the year.

 

You will probably need a 100 litre fresh water tank, ideally a bit more, and as one litre weighs 1kg, that will take 100kg + from your payload. Make sure any van you consider is weighed empty, the claimed payloads can be very misleading.

 

Our last van was fairly light, and had an unladen weight of 2,680kg with just a full tank of fuel and me on board. Adding gas cylinders (2 x 13kg), 100l water, spare wheel, and passenger, added 245kg. Food, clothing, camping clutter, etc added a further 300kg - and we did not carry heavy items. No big sun-loungers etc, no tele, no sat dish, no second battery. So, we ended up around 3,250 - 2,300 kg. That van was a 3,500kg MAM, so enough spare for comfort. If you still have the opportunity, weigh everything you have/had in your boat. It may surprise you! :-) I think you should look for vans with around 500kg spare, implying an unladen weight of 3,000kg. Much less, and you'll be flirting with your MAM. It may not bother you, but driving with one eye on one's weight limit seems to me an irritant I should prefer to avoid. Good luck with your search.

[Brian Kirby]

Admirably brief, Eddie, if I may say. :-D

[Guest JudgeMental]

Brian Kirby - 2013-11-08 6:34 PM

 

Admirably brief, Eddie, if I may say. :-D

 

2 days: one 12 hr and one 10 hr stint driving back from Spain, with an ancient sat nag suffering from senile dementia has taken its toll on moi............post haste and more gin Caruthers!:D

[Brian Kirby]

Chin, chin. :-D

[jonmar]

A Hymer B584 if you can get one with a good service history. I have to say that ours is definitey not 'as new' looks-wise, but with one owner and a complete paperwork history it has proved reliable so far. Weight is 3500 and even with fuel, moderate amount of water, chairs, tables etc plus a 45kg mobility scooter we still had a bit to spare when fully loaded. It is also winterised with the A class double floors and tanks between floors. The only drawback is that the heating is only gas, but as we use campsites - ACSI or Camping Cheques mainly - we simply use the retro fitted low amperage heater and carry a fan heater if travelling in really cold weather.

 

Good luck with your search.

[Spiritchaser]

Thanks one and all, seems like a bit of a battle! We will struggle on regardless. Everyone has been very helpful. PM's to follow.

Thanks again.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Here is link to dealer a few of us use in Germany...very knowledgeable, professional and good prices!

 

http://www.duemo-duelmen.de/fahrzeuge/fahrzeuge-im-angebot.html

 

remember its winter..Now the time for a deal. make silly offers to get things going. I picked up a 3000€ Haibike e bike on german ebay yesterday for 1700€...was surprised my offer was accepted

 

Lenny sugested the sunlight range and I agree. these look OK, just examples, loads more... I would think you could get one for 20K'ish the last one has twin single beds and is euro 4 emissions. all modern vans!

 

http://www.duemo-duelmen.de/fahrzeuge/angebot/172818693/index.html

 

http://www.duemo-duelmen.de/fahrzeuge/angebot/173919270/index.html

 

http://www.duemo-duelmen.de/fahrzeuge/angebot/186128859/index.html

 

[Brian Kirby]

Since you're proposing to spend 12 months at a time in the van, I think one of the A class vans would, probably, be your best bet (much better insulation around the cab area, so less prone to cold spots than coachbuilt vans).

 

Not sure how you'd arrange buying in Germany as, without a UK address, I think you would find it difficult to re-register back in UK, and I don't think you could get registration in Germany, as their registration numbers go with the driver, not the vehicle. I assume you have to be a German resident to obtain vehicle registration. Someone may know. Vehicles in Germany are sold minus registration plates - you fix on your own when you collect.

 

However, if you're prepared to take on a LHD vehicle, you will find you get more van for your money, even buying in UK. Could also have some driving advantages when out of the UK (and almost no disadvantage in UK), but not everyone finds the change from RHD to LHD that easy.

 

You may like to have a look at this guy's stock http://tinyurl.com/lntc7eq. He imports from Germany and is very conversant with Hymer vehicles. He brings over LHD vans, mainly A Class, second hand as well as new and will, I think, source you a van if you know what you want. The price difference compared to UK RHD dealership prices is very good. The vans are then UK registered, and the necessary lighting and speedometer changes are done before sale. That isn't as cheap as buying direct from Germany, but is substantially below UK RHD prices, so you get a better van for your money. Haven't dealt direct with him, but have visited his place and spend some time with him and he seemed to me a straight dealing reliable guy who knows his vans. Another importer who generally imports to order, but who registers the van in your name meaning you need a UK address, is here: http://tinyurl.com/le9sbju. However, he has a number of pre-registered used (generally LHD) vans for sale for his clients, usually of good, known, pedigree as he tends to have supplied them himself. Another straight dealing individual who I have twice used, and regard as totally reliable.

 

However, these are not the only UK dealer who sell LHD vans, so you will find others on offer. You will not find many UK made A class vans for sale. Swift marketed an A Class some years back, called a Mirage, but I think it may have been a joint venture and was possibly made elsewhere. Someone will know!

 

So, in pracitcal terms, your choice will be German or French made vans, plus possibly an odd Italian. Hymer, Dethleffs (Hymer group), Burstner (Hymer group), Niesmann & Bishoff (Hymer group), Eura Mobil, and Frankia all produce potentially suitable vans in Germany that have some representation in UK. Of the French, Pilote, Le Voyageur (Pilote group) and Rapido are well reputed and have UK dealerships. Of the Italians, I think Laika (Hymer group) probably the only one worthwhile pursuing. There are others, as I'm sure someone will point out, but not all have a UK presence, so spares and dealer support may not be so easy to obtain.

 

However, if you can't find a smallish 3,500kg MAM / 3,000kg unladen A class from among that lot, I'll be somewhat surprised. I think you'll need to stick close to 6,0 metres long, as length inevitably adds to unladen weight, so the longer the van the lower your usable payload will be. Hope that helps: others will doubtless argue/add! :-)

[Guest JudgeMental]

why would they need to register in the UK if travelling around europe including england....German TUV (MOT) every two years. it will work out a lot cheaper all things considered if feasible, but I dont know if it is yet as was waiting for a nod before making enquires. Cant see the A class working at 3500kg in the price range to be honest..... plenty of 2007-2008 modern vans around within price, offering garages and enough storage.

[Brian Kirby]

Because the OP is Austrailan with no UK address, and I assume, no German address. To obtain registation plates in Germany, which go with the driver and not the vehicle, I assume one must need a German address/residency. If anyone knows if this is correct, I'd be interested to hear.

[Guest JudgeMental]

but they deal with visitors buying vans all the time...I'm sure a dealer could maybe arrange a proxy address

 

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/thorntree/thread.jspa?threadID=1250751

 

http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/how-do-you-buy-a-camper-van-in-europe-help-me.cfm

 

 

[johnnerontheroad]

The address is a problem that is why I gave this link http://www.dutchcampervans.com/ they will sort all registration and insurance.

 

Dave

[Brian Kirby]

So, seemingly possible, but at a price. I assume it will be a matter of economics: whether it is cheaper to buy LHD in UK, which is relatively straightforward, and insure with good old (but expensive) Downunder Insurance, or buy somewhat cheaper in Germany (or possibly Holland, though I think prices are higher in Holland), with the dealer registering and insuring it in their own name.

 

However, one further possible advantage to the latter method, is that the German insurance (and possibly more so the Dutch) may well be less restrictive than is obtainable fully comp in UK. The Dutch in particular seem to gain access as standard to more of the European states (for example the Balkans) that lie outside the EU borders, than we can access under UK f/c insurance.

[Will86]

Regardless which M/H is decided upon the obvious purchase and starting point should be on the continent with L/H drive. The 'continent' is like Australia large ... in comparison the UK is tiny.