ChasB Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 At present we have Continental Vanco Camper 225/75R 16CP (Speed R Load 116/114) tyres fitted to our Burstner Solano. The plated weight is 4 ton so the quality of the tyres is important to us. The tyres were all manufactured in 2007 although the Burstner was first registered in 2008; so the time has come for the tyres to be replaced. I have been quoted £160 for Continental Vanco Camper tyres and £167 for Miichelin Agilis Camper tyres. Both of these are 8 ply Camper tyres; the other alternative I was offered was Hankook Vantra RA18. This is not a camper tyre but has a better speed and load rating at 121/120 Q; and this is a 10 ply tyre. The cost fitted is £114. At a saving of nearly £200 the Hankook tyres look an interesting proposition. The tyre suppliers I have spoken too are not going to change the bolt in valves they all say its best not to disturb them, but if I wish they will replace at £14 a valve. Has anyone any experience with Hankook tyres to assist me to make an informed decision and what are your thoughts at not replacing the valves after six years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 In 2013 the German motorhome magazine “pro mobil” tested the performance of six tyre-patterns (in 215/70 R15C size) using a selection of Ducato panel vans. http://www.promobil.de/test/vergleichstest-sommerreifen-gummistiefelbande-6463569.html Hankook’s Vantra LT RA18 scored highest and, being M+S (Mud + Snow) marked, should be a good choice for motorhome usage. There are quite a few forum threads containing references to Hankook tyres (use the forum’s Search facility to retrieve them), but I’m pretty sure none are negative. I can’t think of any convincing reason why you should opt for Continental or Michelin ‘camping-car’ tyres when Hankook RA18s are some £50-each cheaper. As far as metal clamp-in valves are concerned, it’s common practice not to replace the complete valve when a tyre is routinely replaced and just to replace the valve’s interior ‘core’. Having said that, it might be sensible to replace your valves now given their age. Although a degree of care is needed to fit clamp-in valves (as they need to be tightened down enough but not too much), a £14-per-valve charge seems very high to me. This company sells various good-quality clamp-in valves http://www.auto4.co.uk/Valves-and-Valve-Hardware/Clamp-In-Valves and you’ll note that the prices are not extortionate. Unless your Burstner has unusual wheels that demand unusual valves, you may be better off obtaining the valves yourself and telling whoever will be fitting your tyres to install them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChasB Posted January 21, 2014 Author Share Posted January 21, 2014 Thanks Derek One tyre supplier said that they do not replace bolt in valves as a routine but check them and if replacement is required then it is done; but how do they check the valve, other than a quick glance? The same supplier said that he thought a harder ride may be experienced with the 10 ply Hankook tyre as the Camping tyre 8 ply tyre was designed for a smoother ride in motorhomes; at this point I was starting to smell BULL! Since my last post I have phoned friends who also own motorhomes and one had Hankook Vantra LT RA18 215/75R 16C tyres fitted. They experienced no change in ride and they inflated the tyre to 75psi. My Burstner handbook shows tyre pressures as 80 psi for Michelin and 69 psi for other makes. I inflate the Continental Vanco Camper tyres to 70 psi. I suppose it all a matter of “you pay’s your money”, but I hate being ripped off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 ChasB - 2014-01-21 5:54 PM The tyres were all manufactured in 2007 ... so the time has come for the tyres to be replaced. Sorry to question your statement Chas, but WHY? Info from Continental tyres website states... "Tyre service life recommendation. Continental is unaware of any technical data that supports a specific tyre age for removal from service. However, as with other members of the tyre and automotive industries, Continental recommends that all tyres (including spare tyres) that were manufactured more than ten (10) years previous) be replaced with new tyres, even when tyres appear to be usable from their external appearance and if the tread depth may have not reached the minimum wear out depth." So by my reckoning you probably have another 3 years life left in them (unless they are low on tread, but you specifically say age in your OP). The link I had to this info doesn't appear to work for me tonight but it came from here... Link. Keith. PS I replaced my Conti Vanco 8PR at 9 years of age and then sold them as part worn (clearly stating age) which paid for 2 of my new tyres :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Derek Uzzell - 2014-01-21 6:49 PM In 2013 the German motorhome magazine “pro mobil” tested the performance of six tyre-patterns (in 215/70 R15C size) using a selection of Ducato panel vans. http://www.promobil.de/test/vergleichstest-sommerreifen-gummistiefelbande-6463569.html Hankook’s Vantra LT RA18 scored highest and, being M+S (Mud + Snow) marked, should be a good choice for motorhome usage. There are quite a few forum threads containing references to Hankook tyres (use the forum’s Search facility to retrieve them), but I’m pretty sure none are negative. I can’t think of any convincing reason why you should opt for Continental or Michelin ‘camping-car’ tyres when Hankook RA18s are some £50-each cheaper. The official labeling also shows the Hankook's as being better Hankooks are B,B,70 Continetal C,B,72 Michelin C,B,70 As Derek says doesn't seem to be any reason to buy other than the Hankook's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 ChasB - 2014-01-21 7:19 PM The same supplier said that he thought a harder ride may be experienced with the 10 ply Hankook tyre as the Camping tyre 8 ply tyre was designed for a smoother ride in motorhomes; at this point I was starting to smell BULL! Replaced my 10 year old Hankooks for a new set of the same a couple of years ago ;-)..............and the ride was softer.........which I put down to the rubber getting stiff with age :-S......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 pelmetman - 2014-01-21 7:51 PM ChasB - 2014-01-21 7:19 PM The same supplier said that he thought a harder ride may be experienced with the 10 ply Hankook tyre as the Camping tyre 8 ply tyre was designed for a smoother ride in motorhomes; at this point I was starting to smell BULL! Replaced my 10 year old Hankooks for a new set of the same a couple of years ago ;-)..............and the ride was softer.........which I put down to the rubber getting stiff with age :-S......... I read this stuff out to my OH. For some reason, all this talk of harder rides and getting stiff with age has her weeping on the sofa. Women, weird or what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 ChasB - 2014-01-21 7:19 PM Thanks Derek One tyre supplier said that they do not replace bolt in valves as a routine but check them and if replacement is required then it is done; but how do they check the valve, other than a quick glance? The same supplier said that he thought a harder ride may be experienced with the 10 ply Hankook tyre as the Camping tyre 8 ply tyre was designed for a smoother ride in motorhomes; at this point I was starting to smell BULL! Since my last post I have phoned friends who also own motorhomes and one had Hankook Vantra LT RA18 215/75R 16C tyres fitted. They experienced no change in ride and they inflated the tyre to 75psi. My Burstner handbook shows tyre pressures as 80 psi for Michelin and 69 psi for other makes. I inflate the Continental Vanco Camper tyres to 70 psi. I suppose it all a matter of “you pay’s your money”, but I hate being ripped off! I've not got easy access to a Hankook's tyre-pressure recommendation chart, but Continental's data for their Vanco-10 225/75 R16C 121/120R 10-ply-rated tyre give an 83psi inflation-pressure for an axle-loading of 2900kg (equating to the 121 Load Index). A 70psi pressure would be appropriate for a static axle-loading of around 2500kg, which may well be above your Burstner's maximum authorised rear-axle figure (2400kg?) So, if you've been happy with 70ps with your VancoCampers, you should be OK with 70psi for Hankook RA18s. VancoCamper (in 225/75 R16C size) is 8-ply-rated but 'ruggedised', while the RA18 is 10-ply-rated. Using the same inflation-pressures, it's most unlikely there'd be any noticeable difference in ride-quality. It's normal for replacement tyres to be quieter immediately after being fitted (and for the steering to feel lighter), but such 'improvements' may be temporary and disappear once the tyre-tread's 'shine' has been worn off. While it might be logical not to replace metal clamp-in tyre-valves every time tyres are replaced if a vehicle's tyres are being replaced frequently, this becomes queationable if the interval between tyre replacements is lengthy. If your motorhome's valve's are not replaced this time (at 6 years), when should they be replaced? If the valves look OK and haven't leaked, should they be replaced at 12 years, or 18 years, or 24 years or never? Tyre valves were discussed here http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Tyre-valve-failure/33688/ The "Alligator" website indicates that the tightening-torque figure for their metal clamp-in valves is 4-6 newton-metres (3-4.5 foot-pounds), but I'd be surprised if a tyre-fitter has a torque wrench accurate at those low settings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EJB Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 A quick internet search shows Michelin Agilis campers at £135 each fitted with a number of companies ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josie gibblebucket Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 We replaced the caravan tyres with Hankooks. Kwikfit reckoned they are fast becoming a premium brand. *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Hello Campers, We have been using Hankook tyres almost exclusively on our vans for over 10 years. The latest RA18 is their best tyre yet and represents excellent value. They are a little softer in compound and have about 1mm less tread depth from new than the Michelin or Continental tyres and seem to last for about 20% fewer miles. From our point of view; about a third of the tyres we use are damaged or have un repairable punctures long before they have worn out so have concluded that the more expensive tyres are simply not viable. From the motorhomer's point of view; you are going to hit an age limit before you wear them out anyway, so why bother? The additional strength of the casing will not result in a firmer ride that you would notice. You will probably notice an increase in stability though and that cannot be a bad thing. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike 202 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Hi, I sent an E-mail to Chris Baxter at ----- cbaxter@hankooktyres.co.uk. giving full details of original fitment from new Hankook RA08, weighbridge axels fully loaded, model both base and converter, year etc. I received the following very comprehensive reply. Will be fitting a new set of RA18 in March 2014. Hello Mr Blake Your e mail enquiry has been forwarded on to me from our European office. Concerning tyre fitment to your Ford Transit Mk 7 350M Motor home GVW 3500kgs. (Single Rear Wheel). Specification of the 215/75R16c 116/114R RA18 (which is designed for commercial vehicle application). Load index 116 (single wheel) = 1250kgs, Speed rating R = 106 MPH at Max air pressure 80psi For Motor home application, it is recommended to include a 10% load safety margin, therefore each tyre must not exceed 1125kgs this would allow max axle loading capacity of 2250kgs. From our technical information data (Tyre Pressures):For axle weights that you have stated and checked weighed. Front Axle 1500kgs, the air pressure = 45psi Rear Axle 1990kgs, the air pressure =65psi The tyre pressures are to be set and checked when cold and it is essential that they are maintained for the load imposed, for further advice please visit www.tyresafe.org –tyre safety information-Motor home. If a camping tyre has been specified by the vehicle manufacturer, then a camping tyre should be used, please check with your vehicle insurer regarding change of tyre specification. Thank you for contacting Hankook Tyre Regards Chris Baxter Technical services Manager Hankook Tyre UK Ltd In my opinion a brilliant, comprehensive and caring reply, especially the comments re Camping tyres which they do not make, therefore raising the possibility of losing a sale. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 josie gibblebucket - 2014-01-22 10:51 AM We replaced the caravan tyres with Hankooks. Kwikfit reckoned they are fast becoming a premium brand. *-) Mercedes cars come out the factory with them fitted as standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 There seem to be two versions of Hankook's RA18 in 215/75 R16C size. One has a Load Index of 113 (this is an 8-ply-rated tyre) and the other a Load Index of 116 (this is a 10-ply-rated tyre). Continental's Vanco-2 'white van' range is the same - there are 8-ply-rated and 10-ply-rated versions of the 215/75 R16C size. Michelin's "Agilis Camping" 215/75 R16CP tyre has a Load Index of 113 (It's an 8-ply-rated tyre, which allows it to be "CP"-marked as a 'camping' tyre). Continental's VancoCamper tyre in 215/75 R16C size has a Load Index of 116, but the tyre's 10-ply-rating prevents it from being "CP" marked. So, does the lack of a "CP"-marking prevent this particular size of VancoCamper being a 'camping' tyre, despite it clearly being marketed by Continental for motorhome use and having a higher Load Index than Michelin's equivalent? And does the 'rule' operate in both directions? If 'white van' tyres should not be fitted to a motorhome that starts life with 'camping' tyres, should 'camping' tyres not be fitted to motorhomes that start life with 'white van' tyres? The tyresafe.org website includes motorhome-tyre advice. http://www.tyresafe.org/images/tyre-safety-guide/motorhome-leaflet.pdf This includes the following statement: "Tyres originally fitted to motorhomes are usually of a ‘Light Commercial’ ‘©’ type. They are designed to cater for the higher loads imposed by motorhomes. Before changing the tyre specification always consult either the vehicle or tyre manufacturer. Deviating from the original specification of tyre is likely to have an effect on the handling and general characteristics of the vehicle. Never replace the tyres with ones of a lower speed rating or load capacity." It's occasionaly been said in the motorhome press (I think it originated from a Michelin representative) that 'camping' tyres should always be replaced with 'camping' tyres, and I've some sympathy with such advice as it's a foolproof move. It would be interesting to learn whether insurance providers would feel a need to be told if (as in ChasB's case) it is planned to replace 'camping' tyres with 'white van' tyres with an equal or better load-carrying design capability. This 2006 thread does indicate that there are pitfalls waiting for the unwary http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Tyre-Pressures-Beware-Second-try-/5849/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I expect that if you told your insurer that you were; "Changing my tyres for something that is only intended for a van and is not as originally fitted to the vehicle" The likely response would be somewhat negative. If you said something like this; "I wish to fit some tyres that are stronger, have a higher load rating and are tough enough for the abuse that a even a white van gets every day" They might be more positive about it. I am not here to argue; buy what you like and waste money if you want to. CP tyres are a marketing gimmick; nothing more. The guy from Hankook, while being otherwise very helpful was covering his own butt with the advice about insurers and that is just a sad reflection of the litigious society that we live in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwyn Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Last year we had to replace two Hankook tyres as one was split they were still the same ones from new (2006) we replaced with the same and were very happy, back tyres which are also hankook are still going strong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addie Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I replaced the 4x Michelin Camping tyres on my 2006 Burstner Delfin with 4x RA18 tyres. Couldn't believe the difference it made to the handling, ride or to the noise in the cab. The previous tyres had aged and rubber hardened to a point I'm sure they would have done another 35,000 miles but they were starting to crack on the sidewalls as is all too common. Great tyre and done 5,000 on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WA Michael Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 I don't specifically know the Hankooks you are talking about, but last year we took a recommendation to fit a set of Federals. "Great tyres we fit them to everything", well, they were terrifying. At the first opportunity we got Contis and threw the almost news away. So, four tyres at $218, throw away and replace with Continentals at $305. We went from unsure what would happen when a vehicle passed to agile and safe, no more white knuckles. As I said I don't know the Hankooks, they may be good but I'm never saving money on tyres despite recommendations. 'Got a new service place too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WA Michael Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 I don't specifically know the Hankooks you are talking about, but last year we took a recommendation to fit a set of Federals. "Great tyres we fit them to everything", well, they were terrifying. At the first opportunity we got Contis and threw the almost news away. So, four tyres at $218, throw away and replace with Continentals at $305. We went from unsure what would happen when a vehicle passed to agile and safe, no more white knuckles. As I said I don't know the Hankooks, they may be good but I'm never saving money on tyres despite recommendations. 'Got a new service place too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 WA Michael - 2014-01-24 4:37 PM I don't specifically know the Hankooks you are talking about, but last year we took a recommendation to fit a set of Federals. "Great tyres we fit them to everything", well, they were terrifying. At the first opportunity we got Contis and threw the almost news away. So, four tyres at $218, throw away and replace with Continentals at $305. We went from unsure what would happen when a vehicle passed to agile and safe, no more white knuckles. As I said I don't know the Hankooks, they may be good but I'm never saving money on tyres despite recommendations. 'Got a new service place too. Here in the UK/EU don't have to put up with bulls**t anymore, all tyres have to be officially rated, Federal Ecovan are F/C/75, so that is bad economy/not particularly good wet grip/noisy. conti's are C/B/72 average economy/half reasonable wet grip/not so noisy Hankook's are B/B/70 fairly good economy/half reasonable wet grip/fairly quiet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve928 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 E/C/70 in the size that the OP is considering, according to this link. http://www.durringtontyres.co.uk/TyreSearch/Details/6439/Hankook+Vantra+LT+RA18+22575R16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Steve928 - 2014-01-24 7:50 PM E/C/70 in the size that the OP is considering, according to this link. http://www.durringtontyres.co.uk/TyreSearch/Details/6439/Hankook+Vantra+LT+RA18+22575R16 Those are Vantra LT. http://www.blackcircles.com/catalogue/hankook/vantra-ra18/225/75/R16/R/121/f?returnurl=%2forder%2ftyres%3f%26width%3d225%26profile%3d75%26rim%3d16%26speed%3dAny%26minpricerange%3d0%26maxpricerange%3d0%26manufacturer%3dhankook%26displayall%3d6&tyre=32412935 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve928 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 C/C/70 for the Vantra here: http://www.clickontyres.co.uk/premium-tyres/product/225_75r16_hankook_vantra_ra18_121_120q I wonder what hancook themselves say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Steve928 - 2014-01-24 8:28 PM I wonder what hancook themselves say. B/B/70 or C/C/70 depending on which version of tyre you choose, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 colin - 2014-01-24 9:26 PM Steve928 - 2014-01-24 8:28 PM I wonder what hancook themselves say. B/B/70 or C/C/70 depending on which version of tyre you choose, Could you expand on that statement, please? It's certainly the case that, if labelling information is sought for a 225/75 R16C Vantra LT RA18 via Hankook's website, the two different sets of data you've mentioned are offered, but there's no explanation why and no statement (as far as I can see) that there are two different versions of the RA18 in that size. (There seems to be the suggestion above that there's a difference between a "Hankook RA18" and a "Hankook Vantra LT RA18", but that's not the case. The full designation of this tyre pattern is "Hankook Vantra LT RA18". RA18 is a 'light truck' tyre (hence the "LT") and, even though vendors may contract the name to "Vantra RA18" or "RA18", it's still the same product.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.