Spare tyre

[Tracker]

When first aquiring a different van, or when the wheels have been removed in a garage, it is simpl enough to slacken and retighten each wheel nut in the safety and convenience of your own drive where tools are avaialable and at least you will then know that if ever you need a wheel off you not only will you have what you need but you will be able to manage it.

[pepe63xnotuse]

Brian Kirby - 2016-03-11 12:48 PM

 

The points, surely, are simple.

 

First, if you have a spare, you can use it. If you don't, you can't.

 

Second, you can't choose where you will get a flat.

 

With a spare, on a campsite, on a weekday, during normal working ours, no problem. But with no spare, half way up an Alp, on a minor pass, on a Sunday, at 6:00 pm? Work it out. :-)

 

Of course it may not happen, and it almost certainly won't in either of those ways. But, do you know when and where it will happen? Hence, insurance against the unexpected.

 

Yes..and in Michele's case, with two (I think?) disabled youngsters(with wheelchairs) on board...:-S

 

You'd need to be pretty cavalier(..or just bl**dy minded) not to carry a spare in those circumstances.

[rupert123]

webby1 - 2016-03-10 8:27 PM

 

Rupert thanks for a measured post about this obsession with the spare wheel/tyre.

 

Granted in a ideal world carry a spare wheel, alternator,water pump etc etc.

 

(My) Breakdown insurance covers you if a tyre was not supplied as standard..........so you get recovered to a garage where you pay over the odds for a tyre (what ???? 10 times the cost)

 

OR wait in your lovely motorhome for one to be delivered (what???? 10 days to wait)

 

OR you may never have a puncture.

Thanks for that. I have never tried to knock people who carry one, indeed as I have one myself that would not make much sense. However I do get exasperated at the 'holy that thou' attitude that insists it is the only way. As to things that people carry and the lengths they go to in the rare event that you actually get a puncture and have the means to change a tyre yourself it begs the question how do they manage to walk out the door in the morning without a risk assessment. Special wheel braces, trolley jacks etc., no wonder they also become obsessed with vans payload. Even with a spare I would not attempt to change it but just take the precaution of asking my garage while the van is in for service to check the lowering stuff is all ok and check the tyre pressure, the tyre is still the original one, never been on. If as Michelle has done and I identified a van that suited my requirements but could not take a spare it would not bother me in the least. In the unlikely event I got a puncture I would sort it out if and when, no bother. I could not ignore it completely with no spare and would make sure the emergency kit was a good one, indeed the one on both my Swifts was very good with a compressor capable of pumping a tyre up. I also added, as mentioned already, a set of emergency tyre plugs, frowned on these days but in common use in the seventies, indeed the then normal way to repair a tubeless puncture. I see no reason what was once considered a permanent repair should not be used as emergency one now.

[mike 202]

Michele, if your tyre is wrecked then obviously you need a spare. But if it is a nail in the tyre you could use one of those sealant cans, unfortunately garages will not then repair the puncture. This is because the goo stops the patch from vulcanising (gluing) to the tyre. So it's a new tyre.

I have just bought from Argos Silverline tyre repair kit. Argos 248/8802 @ £14:99. The kit specifically states off road use only which removes any legal claims from them, but if it is good enough for off road then it will be good enough for on road. The advantage in my opinion is that removing a nail from the tyre to get you to a garage is bette than leaving the nail in the tyre. Also the tyre is repairable.

Slightly of topic I know but may be of some use to forum members, even if only for a car without a spare.

The above put on here only to try to help.

Mike

[Brian Kirby]

mike 202 - 2016-03-12 11:16 AM................The kit specifically states off road use only which removes any legal claims from them, but if it is good enough for off road then it will be good enough for on road. ........................Mike

Only, I think, if you drive on road at the same speed as you would off road. I'd suggest you check with the manufacturer why that caveat has been added to the instructions for use.

[rupert123]

Brian Kirby - 2016-03-12 1:11 PM

 

mike 202 - 2016-03-12 11:16 AM................The kit specifically states off road use only which removes any legal claims from them, but if it is good enough for off road then it will be good enough for on road. ........................Mike

Only, I think, if you drive on road at the same speed as you would off road. I'd suggest you check with the manufacturer why that caveat has been added to the instructions for use.

Brian if you read my post above Mikes this is just a new version of the one I was talking about. It was regarded as normal in the 70's and I see no reason why much has altered since other than it is now frowned on. the only reason they say for off road only is insure no comeback if someone uses it as a repair kit on road and has a problem. Certainly I would see no problem if used in an emergency but you take responsibility for its use, something else the take no chances brigade are going to have a problem with I know.

[rupert123]

Michelle,

Something I forgot to mention and have not seen in this thread is that during the time I had no spare is that I always had my tyres filled with puncture seal. Did it work, no idea because I never had a puncture and even with a spare it is a habit I have continued, it does not prevent a puncture being repaired if you did have one as it is water soluble so can be simply washed out.

[kevina]

The photos below show how I carry a 15" spare wheel in, what I think is, the same sized Rapido garage, albeit on a 7090.

 

There is plenty of space to fit a 16" wheel.

 

Kev

[kevina]

duplicate

[Brian Kirby]

rupert123 - 2016-03-12 3:11 PM.......................Certainly I would see no problem if used in an emergency but you take responsibility for its use, something else the take no chances brigade are going to have a problem with I know.

I think one should always, where possible, point out risks, and and then leave others to decide what they want to do about them. I'm not bothered if they then take a cavalier attitude, or a risk averse attitude, just so long as they've been warned what they're facing. Seems only fair to me.

[rupert123]

Brian Kirby - 2016-03-12 6:12 PM

 

rupert123 - 2016-03-12 3:11 PM.......................Certainly I would see no problem if used in an emergency but you take responsibility for its use, something else the take no chances brigade are going to have a problem with I know.

I think one should always, where possible, point out risks, and and then leave others to decide what they want to do about them. I'm not bothered if they then take a cavalier attitude, or a risk averse attitude, just so long as they've been warned what they're facing. Seems only fair to me.

As you often do Brian you have edited the quote to take out the bits you do not want to answer so make the rest a little out of context. I would not in any way see this type of repair, if done properly, as taking a cavalier attitude. It is hoped that the suppliers of these kits give a decent set of instructions as they do need to be followed. I have not read the ones with my kit as I have done a lot of these repairs in my garage days and know how it all works. Perhaps I will dig my kit out tomorrow and report back on the quality of them.

[Derek Uzzell]

kevina - 2016-03-12 3:55 PM

 

The photos below show how I carry a 15" spare wheel in, what I think is, the same sized Rapido garage, albeit on a 7090.

 

There is plenty of space to fit a 16" wheel.

 

Kev

 

Your Rapido has a voluminous garage with an access-door on each side of the motorhome. Because of the 7090’s rear island-bed layout the garage can extend right across the vehicle and (as you point out) carrying a spare-wheel within the garage presents no difficulty.

 

A 9005dFH’s layout has a transverse bathroom at the rear of the motorhome. The garage is accessed via a door on the vehicle’s right, but there is no door directly opposite on the left-hand side. It’s not easy to tell from photos how deep a 9005dFH’s garage is (see my posting of 9 March 2016 8:34 AM) but even if it’s not practicable to carry a spare-wheel horizontally as you do, it may well be possible to carry one vertically. Plainly, if a spare-wheel can go in a 9005dFH’s garage, that’s the logical place to house it.

 

The depth of my Rapido 640’s garage is inhibited by the bathroom, though there is a narrow low-level ‘slot’ that extends from side to side. I could have taken your approach but it would have been space-consuming. Fortunately the diameter of the 15” wheel/tyre combination fitted to my 640 means that it’s possible (just) to house a spare-wheel vertically and conveniently against the front or rear wall of the garage. If the motorhome had 16” wheels I would have needed to carry the spare-wheel ‘flat', or (possibly) vertically against the garage’s inner longitudinal wall where it would have been difficult to reach. I chose to mount the spare-wheel vertically on the garage’s front wall because that’s much more heavily constructed than the rear wall.

[Brian Kirby]

rupert123 - 2016-03-12 8:12 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2016-03-12 6:12 PM

 

rupert123 - 2016-03-12 3:11 PM.......................Certainly I would see no problem if used in an emergency but you take responsibility for its use, something else the take no chances brigade are going to have a problem with I know.

I think one should always, where possible, point out risks, and and then leave others to decide what they want to do about them. I'm not bothered if they then take a cavalier attitude, or a risk averse attitude, just so long as they've been warned what they're facing. Seems only fair to me.

As you often do Brian you have edited the quote to take out the bits you do not want to answer so make the rest a little out of context. I would not in any way see this type of repair, if done properly, as taking a cavalier attitude. It is hoped that the suppliers of these kits give a decent set of instructions as they do need to be followed. I have not read the ones with my kit as I have done a lot of these repairs in my garage days and know how it all works. Perhaps I will dig my kit out tomorrow and report back on the quality of them.

OK, I'll leave your post intact, though it makes mine longer. The bit I was seeking to respond to is the bit in yours above that I have emboldened. That was all.

 

I'm not qualified to argue whether the kits you refer to are "safe" for on road use, or not - so I did not. I assume that a product that has been withdrawn from normal use will have been withdrawn for good reason. Therefore, I wouldn't use one in that way. On the use of these kits contrary to instructions, I would only say it seems unwise - unless risk in doing so is known, fully understood, and accepted.

 

More generally, I think it unhelpful to disparage those with higher risk aversion: vide, the "take no chances brigade". Shouldn't people be able to do what they are comfortable doing, without being publicly ridiculed for their choices?

[rupert123]

Brian Kirby - 2016-03-13 11:49 AM

 

rupert123 - 2016-03-12 8:12 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2016-03-12 6:12 PM

 

rupert123 - 2016-03-12 3:11 PM.......................Certainly I would see no problem if used in an emergency but you take responsibility for its use, something else the take no chances brigade are going to have a problem with I know.

I think one should always, where possible, point out risks, and and then leave others to decide what they want to do about them. I'm not bothered if they then take a cavalier attitude, or a risk averse attitude, just so long as they've been warned what they're facing. Seems only fair to me.

As you often do Brian you have edited the quote to take out the bits you do not want to answer so make the rest a little out of context. I would not in any way see this type of repair, if done properly, as taking a cavalier attitude. It is hoped that the suppliers of these kits give a decent set of instructions as they do need to be followed. I have not read the ones with my kit as I have done a lot of these repairs in my garage days and know how it all works. Perhaps I will dig my kit out tomorrow and report back on the quality of them.

OK, I'll leave your post intact, though it makes mine longer. The bit I was seeking to respond to is the bit in yours above that I have emboldened. That was all.

 

I'm not qualified to argue whether the kits you refer to are "safe" for on road use, or not - so I did not. I assume that a product that has been withdrawn from normal use will have been withdrawn for good reason. Therefore, I wouldn't use one in that way. On the use of these kits contrary to instructions, I would only say it seems unwise - unless risk in doing so is known, fully understood, and accepted.

 

More generally, I think it unhelpful to disparage those with higher risk aversion: vide, the "take no chances brigade". Shouldn't people be able to do what they are comfortable doing, without being publicly ridiculed for their choices?

Brian we are talking here about emergency repairs, a get you out of trouble thing, at least I think we are. If a standard plug type repair is used for this and treated with care it is ok for an EMERGENCY. All I am saying is that they were used in the past as a permanent repair so I see no reason that they should not be used now as an emergency one. Things have moved on and I assume at some time you may have had a puncture repaired, from a personal point of view I have not had one done in years, in fact cannot remember the last one, must be over 30 years ago. If you take a tyre in for repair these days they will always remove the tyre from the wheel to inspect for internal damage, in at least 50% of cases it will be deemed not repairable anyway. The repair will be a vulcanised one and is much better than the old type plug so plug use was stopped but this does not make the plug repair useless, EMERGENCY ONLY. Just suppose you got stuck on your remote mountain pass, nail in tyre. Well pull the nail out put in plug, put the kettle on have a cup of tea while you wait for glue to vulcanise, pump up tyre, move on to safe place for the night, good nights sleep, phone the breakdown man, problem solved. Now while you may call it public ridicule we do have a take no chances brigade, look at how many still go on about reverse polarity and why take the chance of not checking, what chance? If you plug a tyre and drive in a proper manner what chance, even if the plug fails it is unlikely to simply blow out it will lose pressure slowly, you will be no worse off. I do not feel the need to constantly remind people of the bloody obvious, I assume most have some common sense, but you clearly do feel this need.

[mike 202]

For what it's worth, I was merely suggesting that a temporary plug repair instead of using one of the liquid repair kits either as supplied by car makers or the ones from say halfords would then allow the tyre to be properly repaired at a garage.

It is well known that garages will not repair any tyre filled with one of these sealant liquids and therefore a new (if available) tyre at say £150 will be required.

 

I have used puncture seal in the past and therefore the possibility of a puncture is very remote, however the prudent amongst us will still check for nails in the tyre at regular intervals.

 

As a final thought the following scenario without puncture seal (some advice is don't use it) :-

 

You are out in the back of beyond, possibly it is dark and you are unlucky enough to get two punctures, spare wheel takes care of one, but you are still in a non mobile situation, so for a £15 plug repair kit you will be mobile, drive carefully to a garage and get the punctures repaired.

 

Each to his own of course. There are many videos on-line to help each make up their mind. I hope never to get a puncture but in a worse case, I will use the plug kit to get me out of trouble.