Violet1956 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Anyone waiting with baited breath for Tony's press conference this afternoon? Only read highlights (or should that be lowlights) of the report on line. He doesn't come out of it well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 I formed my own opinion of the fella way before Iraq .... A chancer of the highest order .... Thankfully I never voted for him , many millions were duped by him and his cronies .... Maybe we could go back in time to 97 and have the election all over again .... Hopefully the relatives of our brave lads and lasses sent out to war with third world kit can take comfort with what they probably already knew anyway .... It will of course lead to another chapter to be added to his biography I suppose at some point and bring in even more dosh for the Blairs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted July 6, 2016 Author Share Posted July 6, 2016 You're right of course on this one Anthony. I read some of the stuff from the soldiers about their useless kit e.g. some on duty at checkpoints without the necessary body armour which beggars belief. It's not as if we were responding to a sudden and immediate threat without time for preparation. They were let down very badly, an understatement in relation to those who lost their lives. Some might say there was something akin to criminal negligence. I think there are criticisms of the MOD in the report on that front. :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Yes, unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. :-S Listening/watching Parliament discuss it and I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc has be trotted out! (*That must be why the intervention in Libya has been such a runaway success then? ) Blair's initial response: https://www.sundaypost.com/news/political-news/tony-blair-responds-chilcot-report/ (so basically he seems to be sticking with, " say what you like, I was still right" :-S ) Bottom line is many 10 of 1000s have died(and are still dying?) as a result of his, and his colleagues decision. Oh well, it's not as if he was appointed as some sort of peace envoy or something, is it..?! *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Send him to the Hague >:-( .........but it wont happen.........Paying for your crimes is for lesser mortals *-) ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkc Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Whatever the ultimate judgement of the people on the report one thing is beyond dispute. That the people of this country was badly and disgraceful served by the forces of the Establishment, while being so bravely and honourable served by the heroic men and women of the British armed forces. While the people who sent them to war sat at home with the full weight of the special protection squad around them, the soldiers were sent virtually naked into the streets of Basra. There is IMO no defence for the politicians abject failure, they have not a leg to stand on. Tragically many of the wounded survivors of the conflict share a similar fate. Lessons we should learn? Well not allowing politicians to make decisions in our name away from the spotlight of democratic scrutiny would be a good start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted July 6, 2016 Author Share Posted July 6, 2016 pelmetman - 2016-07-06 2:39 PM Send him to the Hague >:-( .........but it wont happen.........Paying for your crimes is for lesser mortals *-) ...... Dave I could send you the details of the Tooting Popular Front, Lincolnshire Branch if you're interested. On a serious note I think the ICJ prosecutors have already worked out that there is nothing that he can be charged with. Let's hope that he pays in some other way. I had thought that public vilification might hurt but no, he's still likely to believe he is Mr Wonderful. Veronica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 pepe63 - 2016-07-06 1:50 PM Yes, unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. :-S Listening/watching Parliament discuss it and I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc has be trotted out! One of the criticisms is that the Government was completely unprepared for the aftermath of the decision to invade Iraq. Crossing threads, but this Government is/was completely unprepared for the aftermath of a Brexit. And they say lessons have been learned >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 pepe63 - 2016-07-06 1:50 PM Yes, unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. :-S Listening/watching Parliament discuss it and I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc has be trotted out! One of the criticisms is that the Government was completely unprepared for the aftermath of the decision to invade Iraq. Crossing threads, but this Government is/was completely unprepared for the aftermath of a Brexit. And they say lessons have been learned >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 pepe63 - 2016-07-06 1:50 PM Yes, unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. :-S Listening/watching Parliament discuss it and I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc has be trotted out! One of the criticisms is that the Government was completely unprepared for the aftermath of the decision to invade Iraq. Crossing threads, but this Government is/was completely unprepared for the aftermath of a Brexit. And they say lessons have been learned >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 pepe63 - 2016-07-06 1:50 PM Yes, unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. :-S Listening/watching Parliament discuss it and I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc has be trotted out! One of the criticisms is that the Government was completely unprepared for the aftermath of the decision to invade Iraq. Crossing threads, but this Government is/was completely unprepared for the aftermath of a Brexit. And they say lessons have been learned >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 pepe63 - 2016-07-06 1:50 PM Yes, unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. :-S Listening/watching Parliament discuss it and I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc has be trotted out! One of the criticisms is that the Government was completely unprepared for the aftermath of the decision to invade Iraq. Crossing threads, but this Government is/was completely unprepared for the aftermath of a Brexit. And they say lessons have been learned >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Sorry for multiple posts. Stupid computer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-07-06 3:00 PM ... I had thought that public vilification might hurt but no, he's still likely to believe he is Mr Wonderful. Veronica Having just finished watching his statement , and the following *question and answer session, it would seem that he still feels that he did very little(if anything?) wrong. ..and it would seem that as long as you constantly repeat "I did what I did in good faith", you can, quite literally, get away with murder. :-S *Didn't catch his name but one reporter made him visibly uncomfortable ( on the subject of relatives of forces personnel killed). I paraphraph: "..here we are, faced with a teary eyed Mr Blair, telling relatives that he feels their pain...and yet at the same time he is still adamant that he would do the same again...." :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 candapack - 2016-07-06 3:33 PM pepe63 - 2016-07-06 1:50 PM Yes, unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. :-S Listening/watching Parliament discuss it and I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc has be trotted out! One of the criticisms is that the Government was completely unprepared for the aftermath of the decision to invade Iraq. Crossing threads, but this Government is/was completely unprepared for the aftermath of a Brexit. And they say lessons have been learned >:-) Bingo! :-) Funny you should say that, the same thought struck me immediately the summary of the report was broadcast. Very different consequences in terms of deaths and injuries versus economic damage, of course. I don't wish to seem to trivialise the importance of Chilcot's findings, but as a testament to the way in which politicians' egos get in the way of rational thought and analysis when making decisions with potentially catastrophic outcomes if got wrong, a stark warning. Everyone else should, of course, conduct detailed risk assessments when confronting momentous or hazardous decisions, but not governments - especially those made up of political ideologues (are there any others?) with "well, I just believe", as their catchphrase. It also seems from what is now coming to light, that the responsibility attaches more to Blair than to his cabinet, as he seems to have deliberately kept them in the dark, only revealing his intentions to a select few until it was, in effect, too late to stop him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Double post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 OIL WAS THE AIM. Make no mistake ... whoever controls the worlds minerals is the survivor The remainder of the whole affair was a stich up by Blair and Bush to gain access to the oil fields. It had nothing to do with weapons. The UK and the US both had sophisticated equipment plus spies to find any sources of weapons. And why is nothing said about it ? Because its disguised and avoided by talking of other problems. That's how governments work. Its clever its manipulative and it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 The question I would most like answered is why has it taken 14 years for us to find out about the letter from Bliar to Bush promising to be with him whatever - 8 months before he put it to cabinet!!! Apparently we only found out about it at all because he sent it to America where the British Authorities can't censor it. As for the Terrorist Tory Bliar I thought I couldn't despise him any more until he said the military operation was the easy part!!! FFS it was the only successful part because Bliar wasn't involved - that doesn't mean it was easy!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 and as for saying avoiding the invasion of Iraq is hindsight - half a million people including Jeremy Corbyn demonstrated against going to war - Robin Cook resigned over it - Bliar must have had his eyes closed and his fingers in his ears if avoiding the war is hindsight!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 John52 - 2016-07-06 7:16 PM and as for saying avoiding the invasion of Iraq is hindsight - half a million people including Jeremy Corbyn demonstrated against going to war - Robin Cook resigned over it - Bliar must have had his eyes closed and his fingers in his ears if avoiding the war is hindsight!!! Wow , crikey ... A first Corbyn got sumat right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 John52, That is how the system works. It employs people, countless hours and tons of paper. Whenever there is something to hide or an avoidance of the truth is the object (Hillsborough is a prime case here) the result will always be stretched and stretched, above all it employs people, its a psychological move to minimise the gravity of the situation. The aim of the invasion was OIL ... nothing else ... At all times the "Establishment" must survive. People are expendable. There's nothing else to add Other disguised situations are the Twin Towers and the shooting of WPC Yvonne Fletcher, all known about well before. John, you and I are nothing, find another interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 pepe63 - 2016-07-06 1:50 PM ..Unfortunately I don't think this report is going to bring to light anything that we aren't already suspicious of or are indeed already fully aware of. ..I've lost count of the amount of time the phrase *" ..lessons must be...have been learned.." etc Chilcot has done a good job and the prospect of a retrospective detailed inquiry of this sort into a government's actions will do a lot to discourage a cavalier approach like Blair's in future. Blair presumably thought it was just a question of political practicalities and whether he could swing his deal with George Bush through the UK system but he is now clearly hurting from the personal rebukes, especially being reminded that he has blood on his hands. That accusation shook him when he was first confronted with it by the bloke who refused to shake his hand and it's stuck hard. And even if Blair will be immune from prosecution, even if he cannot be made to face any court or pay any personal financial penalty, he will at the very least face endless public reminders of the shame he should feel. The families are clearly not going to drop their campaign and good luck to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek pringle Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 hi, Blair and others in the establishment keep saying they had been given wrong intelligence regarding W.O.M.D. but I have never heard who gave this wildly wrong advice. I am surprised nobody has bored in to this fact because it is easy for Blair to hide behind and try to exonerate himself from his decision. I can understand these secret services that obtain this info must remain so but surely Chilcott would have access. cheers derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Maybe but neither he or anyone else would be permitted to divulge it. That's why these events take a long time to be released i.e. long enough for those involved with the facts to be retired, dead or completely out of it. That's the way the world in run ... in all countries and why I choose to stay out of it. No more from me. Will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted July 7, 2016 Share Posted July 7, 2016 Where you going Will?? I know you live near gatwick, but is R Branson running his intergalactic flights yet? Send us a post card!! PJay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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