Gas - France

[alan]

Hi - looking for help with a French trip. I am at present using Calor Gas (propane) but am looking for the French equivalent and realise I will have to buy bottles and regulator, but has anyone any idea of the cost? And what is the most popular and easily available gas in France? Alan

[motorhomefinder]

Hi Alan, we purchased a " Le Cube" during our time in France. It is sold in just about every petrol station. It is a 6 or7 kg bottle that is covered on rubber. It fits nicely in a gas locker. It cost approx 36€ complete with regulator and then about 11€ to get a refill, but that may have changed by now. I am talking of this time last year.

I just signed a contract in the petrol station. There is butane and propane options. When we had finished in France and stayed in Spain, i advertised it on a campsite notice board and sold it very quickly.

[colin]

Have you considered gaslow or similair refillable bottles, I'm looking at this option for new van. As I understand it will require adaptor for use on continent, gas is supposed to work out much cheaper over here not sure about abroad.

[jenny.k]

We are converting our van to Gaslow. We had it in our M/H. Spent 13 weeks in France last year and did not even use one bottle. OK it is a bit expensive the initial out lay, but well worth it be able to fill up when buying the diesel. Have been in touch with Swift re advice for putting it in our Abbey and they say no problem.

[boobabsca]

"I just signed a contract in the petrol station. There is butane and propane options. When we had finished in France and stayed in Spain, i advertised it on a campsite notice board and sold it very quickly."

 

 

 

Does this mean that France, UK & Spain all use different bottles?

 

 

[Brian Kirby]

Not necessarily, but each country has different suppliers, who do not exchange each other's cylinders. 

Thus, Calor, for example, can be exchanged throughout UK, but only for another Calor cylinder; ditto Propagas in France, ditto Repsol (I think!) in Spain, and so on.  The same is true for all of the branded bottled gas suppliers except, so far as I know, Camping Gas and BP Gas. 

You can't swap a UK Calor cylinder for a French Propagas one, and so on.  And you won't (officially) find anyone to re-fill an empty Calor, or Propagas, or Repsol (or whoever's) cylinder.  You simply exchange empty for full.

There are refillers in Spain, but I have no knowledge of their status.  I assume they have the authority and facility to re-fill cylinders from one of the Spanish brands and, provided the fittings match, just somehow fail to notice that yours isn't of that brand!

[boobabsca]

Thankyou Brian, initially, i thought i would drive to France without any gas and sort out the bottles there (thinking i'd be ok in most of Europe), but now i'm not sure which is the best option from below;

 

1) Fit refilable bottles

2) Fit a bulk tank

3) search for a universal brand (is there one?)

[Don Madge]

boobabsca - 2007-05-19 7:41 AM

 

Thankyou Brian, initially, i thought i would drive to France without any gas and sort out the bottles there (thinking i'd be ok in most of Europe), but now i'm not sure which is the best option from below;

 

1) Fit refilable bottles

2) Fit a bulk tank

3) search for a universal brand (is there one?)

 

There is no universal brand in Europe - yet :-(

 

I've travelled through most European countries and a couple outside with my Van.

 

If you plan to travel extensively in Europe the refillable bottle/tank is the best option. If you just plan to visit France/Spain you could manage with a local bottle.

 

With our present van (Timberland LWB Fiat Ducato) we have a 13kg MTH refillable bottle with an external filling point.

 

On our previous van (Laika Ecovip 400i) we had two 60 litre bulk tanks fitted either side of the chassis.

 

If you have room to fit a bulk tank I would suggest going down that road.

 

You will never recuperate the outlay for the refillable bottle/tank but for us it's the convenience rather than economy.

 

Don

[Randonneur]

At the moment, here, the supermarket chain Intermarche are doing a promotion for their own gas, Clairgaz and also Repsol where the bottle is free and also the adaptor and you only pay for the gas. We have just got a Repsol bottle from them and it was 21 euros, I think it is 11kg I think the butane is 13 kg at 24 euros.

 

There may be other chains that are doing the same, but I have not looked.

 

Hope this is of help.

[boobabsca]

Thanks Randonneur,

 

Do you know if Clairgaz and Repsol are freely available in Spain?

 

 

 

[Brian Kirby]

boobabsca - 2007-05-19 11:54 AM Thanks Randonneur, Do you know if Clairgaz and Repsol are freely available in Spain?

Chris

Lets start at the beginning! 

1 What is the largest size cylinder you can get into your gas locker, and how many off?

2 How long do you expect to be away at any one time?

3 Do you favour sites or aires/wild camping?

4 Where do you expect to be going?

5 At what times of the year?

1 Is because the size of your locker is fixed.  Some will take only 1 x 6Kg, some 2 x 6Kg, some 1 x 6 and 1 x 13Kg, and some 2 x 13Kg.  This makes quite a difference!

2 Is because the longer you are away, in conjunction with the sizes of bottles you can carry, the more often you are likely to need to exchange bottles.

3 Is because if you spend most of your time on sites, with 220V hook up, your fridge won't consume gas - so overall gas consumption will be reduced, whereas if you spend most of your time on aires/wild you'll have to run your fridge on gas whenever you stop - and the consumption will be correspondingly higher.

4 Is because if you spend most of your time in one country, say Spain, it will probably pay you to have at least one locally purchased cylinder.

5 Is because if you anticipate winter camping you'll have a heater working extensively, more so if in mountains, and you'll consume a lot of gas.

If you have a single 6Kg cylinder, for example, and intend Alpine winter sports camping, I think a bulk tank is your only option.  If, however, like us, you tend to camp in the "shoulder" seasons, go South, and stay mainly on site with 220V hook-up, you'll probably find one 13Kg cylinder lasts well over 12 weeks.  If you have 2 x 6Kg cylinders, and intend taking longish trips, I think the balance will be between the bulk tank and the refillables, depending on prices. 

For convenience, we carry 1 x 13Kg Calor and 1 x 13Kg Butagaz (French, and quite a lot cheaper).  Both propane.  Whichever runs out, we have a 13Kg reserve and, because the individual cylinders last for weeks, we are always likely to be able to get a refill without risk of running out.  So far we have managed 10 - 12 week trips around Spain, Portugal, Italy, bits of Germany and Austria without supply problems.  We always start in Northern France, so exchanging the French cylinder is easy (Butagaz being available form almost all supermarkets, and many independent filling stations) and the Calor is easy to change when back in UK. 

If buying a French cylinder I'd be a bit inclined to avoid single outlet suppilers, like Intermarche, because they are better represented in some areas than others.  Repsol, so far as I know, is Spanish, and I've never seen it outside Spain.  Therefore, unless Randonneur knows, I'd have some doubts about its availability at Intermarches all over France.  It may be cheap but, for me, ready availability would be more important if touring widely.

Hope this helps.

[Randonneur]

boobabsca - 2007-05-19 12:54 PM

 

Thanks Randonneur,

 

Do you know if Clairgaz and Repsol are freely available in Spain?

 

 

 

I think Clairgaz is only French, but we are hoping that the Repsol bottle here is the same as the Repsol in Spain, I have been assured it is, that was the reason for going for Repsol, but we have not been down to Spain since so can't tell you, its a chance we will have to take when the time comes.

[geoff]

If you're travelling with Norfolk Line beware !!!

I am planning my first trip on the continent and intended to carry one 6kg bottle of Calor butane PLUS a 10litre LPG refillable, the intention being that the Calor would be used to tide me over when the LPG was empty. My plans have been thrown by the fact that Norfolk Line specify that ONLY ONE BOTTLE can be carried on their ferry.

This rule would therefore negate many of the above answers and also would not allow

campers to take advantage of the Calor Free Bottle Loan.

[Randonneur]

geoff - 2007-05-19 11:37 PM

 

If you're travelling with Norfolk Line beware !!!

I am planning my first trip on the continent and intended to carry one 6kg bottle of Calor butane PLUS a 10litre LPG refillable, the intention being that the Calor would be used to tide me over when the LPG was empty. My plans have been thrown by the fact that Norfolk Line specify that ONLY ONE BOTTLE can be carried on their ferry.

This rule would therefore negate many of the above answers and also would not allow

campers to take advantage of the Calor Free Bottle Loan.

 

We travelled this route, return, last Nov/Dec with 2 bottles, no problems. I know there is a restriction on tanks but did not know about bottles. We always used to take 2 x 7kg bottles when caravanning also, no problems.

[Don Madge]

Its like a lot of rules, very rarely enforced but when something goes wrong the fertilizer hits the fan. 8-)

 

Don

[geoff]

Drifting off my own thread, when travelling on Norfolk line ferries with a camper is there a height problem ?

The reason I ask is that my rooftop aerial is an inch or so higher than my bulbous roof and I've heard of damage being caused when aerials have snagged because ferries have placed campers on double decker car decks .

 

[derek500]

geoff - 2007-05-20 2:49 PM

 

Drifting off my own thread, when travelling on Norfolk line ferries with a camper is there a height problem ?

The reason I ask is that my rooftop aerial is an inch or so higher than my bulbous roof and I've heard of damage being caused when aerials have snagged because ferries have placed campers on double decker car decks .

 

Norfolklines put MHs on the freight deck. It's like an airport hangar!!

[derek500]

geoff - 2007-05-19 11:37 PM

 

If you're travelling with Norfolk Line beware !!!

I am planning my first trip on the continent and intended to carry one 6kg bottle of Calor butane PLUS a 10litre LPG refillable, the intention being that the Calor would be used to tide me over when the LPG was empty. My plans have been thrown by the fact that Norfolk Line specify that ONLY ONE BOTTLE can be carried on their ferry.

This rule would therefore negate many of the above answers and also would not allow

campers to take advantage of the Calor Free Bottle Loan.

 

We always carry two 12kg Repsol bottles. Never had any problems with Norfolklines. They haven't even checked to see if they have been turned off.

[boobabsca]

Thanks very much everyone, i think i'm going to DIY fit a bulk tank.

 

I've read a write up by Clive that was mentioned and referred to in a previous thread.

 

http://www.motts.dsl.pipex.com/GASKIT.htm

 

This option appears to be the most economical, convenient and has an added bonus of giving me an extra locker.

 

Brian;

1) Not sure

2) 6 months trip to Spain from Nov 07, many smaller trips before hand

3) I prefer wild camping, but will probably mix things up with some of each

4) The destinations will vary enormously, from the Lakes to Southern Spain to Ski-ing in the Alps

5) All times of year

 

Looking at the figures, it looks as though the installation will never quite pay for itself, but i think for the added convenience it's a worthwhile expense. It also favours a gas genny should i choose, although i'd rather manage without, it may become a necassary evil when ski-ing. I would still prefer an additional battery and a good solar panel.

 

Geoff;

Planning on euro tunnel as have a dog. (least stressfull)

 

Randonneur;

Thanks, that info was very helpful, How's the weather down there?

 

Don;

thanks, have you seen this link?

 

http://www.gas-tankstellen.de/menu.php

 

It's looking a bit slim in Spain, lets hope it improves!

 

 

 

 

[Derek Uzzell]

The Norfolk Lines "one LPG-cylinder only" restriction is mentioned in the FAQs section of the Ferries to France part of their website.

 

I've e-mailed the company about it and been told that, because propane is more hazardous than butane, vehicles travelling with Norfolk can carry just one propane cylinder (size unspecified), but up to 3 x 15kg butane cylinders are allowed.

 

Don't bother to comment on this yet, as I've gone back to the company and asked for confirmation that the above statement is indeed correct.

[Derek Uzzell]

Just sent e-mail Number 3 to Norfolk Line.

 

I suspect that I shan't get an answer about this that I'm comfortable with (and, as it's very unlikely I shall use the Norfolkline routes I'm beginning to lose heart), but you never know your luck.

 

Watch this space, but don't hold your breath!

[Randonneur]

boobabsca - 2007-05-20 10:42 PM

 

 

Randonneur;

Thanks, that info was very helpful, How's the weather down there?

 

 

 

Sorry, I have only just seen the post. The weather was very mixed last week but this week has been scorching, We are supposed to be getting storms, but looking out I can't see that happening.

[Derek Uzzell]

I have now received a reply from Norfolkline's Customer Services department about gas-carriage on their ferry service to France.

 

At present the Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) section of the Ferries to France part of the Norfolkline website contains the following:

 

"Q. Do your ships accept vehicles which run on Liquified Petroleum Gas LPG?

 

A. Yes, vehicles converted to LPG or motor homes carrying LPG cylinders are accepted onboard our ferries. Please note however, vehicles are limited to carrying one LPG cylinder we also ask that you advise the staff at the check in booth before you check in."

 

Clearly this "one LPG cylinder" restriction would present major potential problems for many leisure vehicle owners who might be considering travelling with Norfolkline, as Geoff's earlier posting on this thread reveals. I have advised Norfolkline of this and the relevant part of their latest response is:

 

"I have been in contact with our Health & Safety Officer, and the head of Operations with regard to carrying LPG and it appears that there has been some confusion with the wording on our website. Therefore the necessary changes will be made to ensure our passengers have a better understanding when carrying any type of gas.

 

'The amount of LPG carried in private vehicles (caravans, motorhomes, etc.) for heating/cooking purposes is restricted to a maximum weight of 47 kilos. (This figure excludes the weight of the storage cylinders/tanks themselves.) Additionally, any vehicle having an LPG storage system that involves removable gas containers is limited to a maximum of three cylinders that must be properly secured in a purpose-designed storage compartment.'"

 

So, while Norfolkline's website is being revised, if you adhere to the limits set in the last paragraph, you should have no problems even in the unlikely event of your vehicle being checked at embarkation.

 

(I'm also copying this to the Motorhome Matters forum.)

[emmitdb]

Greetings All,

Can I drag this thread back to the original question?

When I visited France earlier I made a discovery re. french Gas bottles.

The outlet on a french 13kgs propane bottle can be directly connected to a gas tail for a British Butane 'dumpy' bottle designed to fit the new type bulkhead regulator. In otherwords the french bottle has a large male left handed thread.

[Brian Kirby]

emmitdb - 2007-06-26 8:16 PM Greetings All, Can I drag this thread back to the original question? When I visited France earlier I made a discovery re. french Gas bottles. The outlet on a french 13kgs propane bottle can be directly connected to a gas tail for a British Butane 'dumpy' bottle designed to fit the new type bulkhead regulator. In otherwords the french bottle has a large male left handed thread.

I think you'll find French "regular" cylinders of whatever size, and whether butane or propane, have the same connector as the "regular" UK butane cylinders. 

However, UK propane, as used by Calor for example, will not fit anything from across the ditch.