camperadi Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 I own a 2009 Burstner Nexxo t660 on a Ford Transit base. It has an Elektroblock EBL99 transformer unit with a panel (IT 96) control panel. During last summer I noticed that the starter battery voltage would no longer display on the control panel. I was in France at the time and everything else worked so I ignored this minor irritation. I later noticed the the voltage gauge worked when connected to an EHU. It shows a voltage of just under 13.5 volts so I concluded it was trickle charging as it is supposed to do. Disconnect the EHU and the gauge stops working again. Over xmas I had no plans to use the vehicle for a number of weeks so I connected EHU to keep the starter battery charged. After 5 weeks when I started the engine it only just started showing signs of a low battery. I have since reconnected to the ehu. Gauge again showed over 13 volts at the starter battery. I then connected a digital voltmeter to the vehicle battery circuit and it reads 11.9 volts. Left it connected to the ehu for 2 days to see if voltage went up. It then read 11.8 volts on the digital voltmeter. Battery is clearly not charging. Have read hand book checked obvious fuses on ebl99 and thats as far as I can do. Help Please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 There are 3 fuses next to/above the Starter battery. Usually 2a, 20a and a 50a but they often get swapped for different values, so only a guide. On the Transit base they are usually under the Drivers seat. One we worked on, the fuse could only be located by removing the seat but I suspect someone had been in there before and moved the wiring as a Battery Master had been fitted which we removed. You will most likely find the 20A fuse melted/corroded. If you can remove it, replace it with a new one. If it is melted into the Fuse holder, then fit a maxi style Fuse holder with a 20amp fuse. These are physically bigger stronger units that resist corrosion and loss of tension in the contacts but are still available with 20a fuses. This cabling can regularly run at 18a, more if some idiot fits a higher wattage Fridge 12v element, so the quality of the fuse is important. The poor quality ones tend to melt into the Fuse holder, which is maybe what you will find, Suggest you renew the 2a fuse as well. Don't 'clean' the old fuse, it can result in thinner blade contacts and some of the cheap fuses have thinner legs anyway, just renew it with a quality one would be our advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camperadi Posted February 8, 2017 Author Share Posted February 8, 2017 Thanks for such a fast reply. Will get onto this as soon as I can and update as to how I get on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andytw Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 I would check that the EBL99 is connected to the vehicle battery on the back of the EBL99. Could just be a loose connection there. Looks like the EBL99 is OK as the 13.5 volts you see when on EHU is the charge voltage provided by the EBL99 but it is not getting to the vehicle battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 The Control Panels 12v Starter battery display is not connected to the Starter battery via the large Starter battery cable at the back of later (2002 on) Schaudt Elektroblocks. Nor is the mains charging sent down this cable. Both Display and 230v charging goes to the Starter battery via the separately fused Fridge 20a feed. This exact functionality is described in better detail in the thread - "Starting the Engine While On mains EHU?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camperadi Posted February 8, 2017 Author Share Posted February 8, 2017 Thanks again for replies. I have just looked under seat and although I cannot see the battery the fuse block is mounted where I can access it without removing the seat. There is the large red fuse which I have not touched. The 20 amp fuse I removed and replaced. There is no sign of burning or discolouration to the fuse fuse holder or wires going into the fuse holder. Sadly It has not cured the problem. There was no other (3rd) fuse. Last January I renewed the starter battery. There was no reason for this other than it was the original Ford battery and at 7 years old I decided it would not last much longer anyway. I cannot remember whether there were more fuses under the seat. If you feel that these were not the correct fuses I will remove the seat for a look. Having seen the last post I have started the engine and switched on the AES fridge and the red warning light came on to say it had selected 12 volts. When I switched off the engine the 12 volt light went out although I did not have the time to wait the 6/7 minutes to see whether it changed over to gas. I now have to go back to earn a living. All help gratefully received Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Getting a red light for the Fridge confirms this circuit is the issue. Sounds like you got the correct fuse, but they should be with the Starter battery not the EBL, under the right hand seat. They might have been the EBL fuses, not the Starter battery ones as there are two sets usually but we don't do so many Transits and they have all been different. Anyway, maybe we have a burnt connector on Pin 1 block 2 of the EBL, the second white connector from the left? I think pin 1 is the top one in this block. Carefully and gently push the plug in to check if it is seated, don't push hard otherwise the connectors and fuses may disappear into the front panel leaving you with a poorly EBL!! (Anyone reading this to diagnose a similar fault on a Elektroblock EBL 220 - the unit is especially sensitive to pressure on the connectors on the lower edge. Very easy to push the sockets off their seating so the sockets/fuses panel slips backwards and the plugs won't then seat correctly). If it doesn't click into place, remove EHU lead if it is plugged in, carefully remove the white plug by just pinching the ends and then withdrawing it gently and check all the pins. Check they are at the same level, not pushed in/recessed. Then check the female cylindrical pin to see if it is enlarged and not making good contact. All the time you are working be mindful of the Brown connector for the control panel, to the right of this block, as it has very thin wires that are easily broken. Look for any burning. If all looks ok then reassemble and check both faults still exist. If the faults are still there, you need to trace the wire from Block 2 pin 1 back to it's connection on the starter batter. It should be permanently live with the Starter batteries voltage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 Stuart, Did you physically test the 20A fuse or just give it a 'visual' and put it back? If you didn't actually test it then I would suggest getting a multimeter and checking for 12V at either end of the fuse whilst it is in situ. Fuses normally have 2 small holes in the top near the Amp figure to allow a meter probe to be touched on the metal without pulling the fuse. Ground the black meter lead to a good clean earth point for this test. The only other question then is has it ever charged since you replaced the battery? If not, or if you are not sure, then it would be worth removing the seat and checking you did not miss a connection or wire whilst replacing the battery. Or possibly even getting any single wire connected to the 'wrong' terminal, ie a sensing wire going to Negative rather than Positive? Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camperadi Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 Thanks again for all input. I have just managed to go and check the connection 2 on the ebl. This was tight and properly clicked in. Removed it and checked wires pins and sockets as suggested. All seemed fine and with no signs of burning distortion or discolouration. Clicked it back together. Sadly the problem still exists.The 2 fuses that I checked are under the drivers (off Side) seat. The EBL 99 is under the passenger seat. The 2 fuses are mounted on the outside of the battery box under the seat in a small storage area. The battery is fully enclosed and can only be accessed from the top after removing the seat. I replaced the 20 amp fuse with a new one. I was really tight on time and have put the old one to one side so I can check it later. The fault started 5/6 months after new battery was fitted. My comment about the RED 12 volt indicator lamp was to say that in my mind the fridge (AES Dometic RM 7655) was working when the engine was running and the AES automatically selected 12volts. You now have me wondering whether red means there is a fault. I have checked the hand book and no colour is mentioned except to say that a gas fault flashes amber and red if there is no gas supply. Gas is amber 240v is green and 12 volt shows red. What did shock me is that if you manually select 12volts the book states it will run on 12 volts without the engine running. It does of course warn of a flat battery. Perhaps someone with this fridge could confirm what colour thier 12v warning light is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Check for 12v at Pin 1 block 2. If there isn't permanent 12v at that pin then some how or other, the cable between there and the battery has a break. You could create a bridging cable and take 12v from the Starter battery connector at the rear of the EBL and apply it to the cable of Pin 1, Block 2, and if every thing then works I would suggest you lift the seat and follow the cable through? Suggest you don't test the fridge for long unless your cable 'bridge' will take 17amps, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camperadi Posted February 19, 2017 Author Share Posted February 19, 2017 I have now managed to find time to lift the drivers seat and check further. Nothing was found to be wrong under the seat. There is power to the 20amp fuse. I tested the original fuse which was fine. The wiring then disappears under a false floor to the EBL. There is no live at socket 2 pin 1. At this point I have decided to proceed no further. The fridge still works on 12 volts. Its only through the winter I have used the trickle charge facility as the van is regularly used. I can monitor the battery by an independent voltmeter and charge in the winter as required. Many thanks to all but in particular aandn caravans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandaemon Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 I had a similar problem a few years ago and it turned out be the 2A fuse which provided the trickle chsrge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camperadi Posted February 19, 2017 Author Share Posted February 19, 2017 Where was 2 amp fuse. Was it near to starter battery or by the transformer unit. aandncaravans mentioned a 2 amp fuse but mine didn't have one in the small fuse pack by the starter battery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandaemon Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 Mine was by the starter battery and was corroded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 This might be a bit late for you, but we have just fixed a Hymer 522 on a 2008 Transit base with exactly the same fault as yours. This was wired differently to what we have seen before, although I am starting to think that where the Transit is concern, there isn't a standard. This was different, in that the Starter battery fuses were under the Passenger seat with the Schaudt Elektroblock EBL 99 and the habitation battery located behind it. Main feed from the Starter Battery (a single Silver Yuasa mounted to the rear of the seat base) to the back of the EBL 99 ran from under the Drivers seat across to the Passenger seat to a 50a fuse. The separate Fridge supply cable, which is also used to supply the 'Mains battery charger 14v' to the Starter battery, follows the same route into a 20amp fuse holder. The fuses under the passenger seat are as follows, working top down : Habitation 50a main fuse and 2a sensing fuse. Then below that the Starter battery main Alternator charging 50a fuse and 20a Fridge fuse. The cable from the 20a Fridge fuse went to a Schaudt DP02 (D+ booster) and the other side of the D+ booster plugged into Block 2 on the EBL. I initially thought the DP02 had died, but the Fridge cable on Pin 1 block 2 had 12.8v. Turned out the EBL 99 was at fault, which we replaced with a new one and all then worked as it should. I have looked at the EBL 99 tonight and it has burnt track and electronics which I am pretty sure wasn't the original fault. Most likely from someone being careless with a multimeter probe as the owner had taken it to 3 other companies before coming to us. Can I suggest you look to see if you have this same arrangement of 4 fuses under the passenger seat? If you have, test that 12v is getting through the Schaudt DP02, it maybe the unit has failed or a connector has detached? . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.