Trev23 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Hi, I'm new to motorhoming and looking at buying a 2010 Elddis 120, it has a quoted payload of 379KG unladen weight 2621KG and Max weight 3000KG. Am I correct in thinking, as the van is older (I believe they changed the way they calculate payload in 2015) they have added a driver (75kg) 90% water and diesel to the unladen weight so the 379KG payload does not need to include the driver, water and diesel, just passengers, clothes, beer, wine, whisky, food, bedding equipment etc? Thanks * Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 If the vehicle is plated for a maximum permissable weight of 3000kg that's it, you cannot exceed that weight whichever way you load it - and it does need to include the driver, the contents of the water, waste and fuel tanks, the food in the fridge and cupboards and even anything you have in your pockets as you climb in! Fitted accessories such as awnings and solar panels add to the vehicle's base weight and come off the payload too. This MH sounds like it hasn't got much payload at all so before you buy it take it to a weighbridge (or get the dealer to do so) to get a baseline weight, taking note of what is l]already loaded, then subtract the figure from 3000kg and that's what you can load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 The 2010 brochure is available here: http://www.elddis.co.uk/documents/Brochures/2010/autoquest-brochure.pdf ....and confirms the basis that you set out. (and as you imply, the basis for the quoted weights on current models is somewhat different). The basis for the 2010 figures also implies that a (the maximum?) tolerance for materials variation has been taken into account. The payload of 379kg is pretty low, but IF it has been calculated in accordance with what the brochure states, then it is probably just about workable for two people who travel fairly lightly, and with few added accessories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowie Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Hi Trev, who is "quoting" the payload? Original sales lit or current dealer lit? Shouldn't be your responsibility to verify. I'm surprised it's only 3000Kg gross. As StuzartO says, not much to play with Regards alanb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trev23 Posted July 20, 2017 Author Share Posted July 20, 2017 Hi Snowie, The current dealer is quoting them, but they are exactly the same as on the download link Robinhood sent (cheers Robin). My thinking is those figures from the 2010 brochure are pre 2013 so unladen weight takes into account driver weight, diesel and water (as payload seems so low this is possible). Yes I could borrow the van and take it to a weighbridge but I shouldn't have to, given I'm buying from one of the largest dealers in the country. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 The weight on each axle also needs to be considered as neither can be overweight. Looking at the images in the brochure I would guess much of the loaded weight will be on the rear axle. You mention passengers but the 120 seems to be a 2-berth and thus will be suitable for one passenger. As a couple, we could manage a few weeks away in the UK on a payload of 300kg but it would be very tight. Travelling with just 20 litres of water [doable if using sites] would give you another 25kg. Can you dump the wine and beer and carry a second bottle of whiskey? Good to read a newbie is aware of the importance of payload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 If you are buying from a dealer, do a bit of internet research on customer service post sale. Some are better than others. Unfortunately, size of the dealership is not necessarily a good guide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Trev, Slightly off topic but have you read the recent posts on problems with Elddis MH's, especially damp? Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trev23 Posted July 20, 2017 Author Share Posted July 20, 2017 Hi Brock, Sorry can't compromise with the beer and wine, but an extra bottle of whisky is a good idea instead of the water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 A rider to the above. Your van has a fairly long rear overhang, and a short wheelbase, which will amplify the load imposed on the rear axle by any items you stow aft of the axle. It appears that the rear axle limit is 1,650kg (bit difficult to see if it's that or 1,850kg in Robin's linked catalogue). The Fiat VIN plate under the bonnet, on the front cross member, will confirm which it is. I therefore think you would be wise to take the van in fully laden state (i.e. with everything (inc food and liquids, etc.) and everyone, on board, including full fuel, full water, and full gas cylinder) as for a trip, and then check its weight, but also the load on each axle. Usually place the van centrally on the weighbridge platform for the maximum weight, then drive the front wheels just clear of the platform, so as to leave the rear wheels as close to the centre as possible, and take the rear axle load. The front axle load is then max weight minus rear axle load. The weighbridge operator should understand what is required, and may suggest doing the opposite. I just suspect you may have to take care not to exceed the rear axle load. I also suspect you may find the ride harsh, and with those relatively low maximum axle loads, once you know the actual load on each axle, you will be able to reduce the tyre pressures below the 60psi F/65psi R recommended in the catalogue, which should soften the ride noticeably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trev23 Posted July 20, 2017 Author Share Posted July 20, 2017 Cheers for the responses, As for dealer customer service and damp. I've run my own business for many years, I know we provide a top notch service but you can't please all the people all the time, I've read some good and some bad reviews, but I know people are more likely to shout when things go wrong than when they go right. I'm confident I could get avwarranty honoured if needs be. Brian, I'd not even thought about ride comfort, I guess that's why an earlier forum post talks about air ride suspension. I'm still trying to get to the bottom of Elddis brochure from 2010 and does it's unladen weight include driver and water, if it does the van is perfect for us as beginners. I may try ringing Elddis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Trev23 - 2017-07-20 4:59 PM.....................I'm still trying to get to the bottom of Elddis brochure from 2010 and does it's unladen weight include driver and water, if it does the van is perfect for us as beginners. I may try ringing Elddis. Trev, if you view the Elddis brochure as .pdf, and go to the notes at the bottom of page 10, below "Key features" I think you will find that they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Trev23 - 2017-07-20 4:59 PM Cheers for the responses, As for dealer customer service and damp. I've run my own business for many years, I know we provide a top notch service but you can't please all the people all the time, I've read some good and some bad reviews, but I know people are more likely to shout when things go wrong than when they go right. I'm confident I could get avwarranty honoured if needs be. Brian, I'd not even thought about ride comfort, I guess that's why an earlier forum post talks about air ride suspension. I'm still trying to get to the bottom of Elddis brochure from 2010 and does it's unladen weight include driver and water, if it does the van is perfect for us as beginners. I may try ringing Elddis. Surely UNLADEN , means NO Load? Water would not be included, nor would fuel, as they come empty from factory As for driver , No That could vary according to size ! Could be a 10 stone or a 20 stone driver? PJay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 PJay - 2017-07-20 6:25 PM..............................Surely UNLADEN , means NO Load? Water would not be included, nor would fuel, as they come empty from factory As for driver , No That could vary according to size ! Could be a 10 stone or a 20 stone driver? PJay You are right Pauline, but if you read the notes I refer to above in my reply to Trevor, I think you will see that Elddis misapplied the term "unladen", and should instead have referred to Mass in Running Order, which is what they appear to describe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trev23 Posted July 20, 2017 Author Share Posted July 20, 2017 I think my confusion has come from the dealer quoting the unladen weight which was exactly the same as the MIRO weight. As Brian points out, the brochure says the MIRO weight includes an allowance for the driver, full tank of fuel, 90-% of water and a gas bottle. So I have 370kg for a passenger food beer clothes bedding etc. This is exactly what I thought due to the year the brochure was produced. After 2015 the MIRO weight does not include these, I may be mistaken. Thanks Trev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Brian Kirby - 2017-07-20 6:50 PM PJay - 2017-07-20 6:25 PM..............................Surely UNLADEN , means NO Load? Water would not be included, nor would fuel, as they come empty from factory As for driver , No That could vary according to size ! Could be a 10 stone or a 20 stone driver? PJay You are right Pauline, but if you read the notes I refer to above in my reply to Trevor, I think you will see that Elddis misapplied the term "unladen", and should instead have referred to Mass in Running Order, which is what they appear to describe. The CoC for my globecar is the same, I was a bit concerned that my payload would be down as it quoted unladen weight, but the MOT check weight showed that it was the MIRO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
globebuster Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 Trev, Whilst I don't necessarily tar all Elddis products with the same brush, you need to pay particular attention to this model [and its variants] very carefully for what are inherent design flaws. Check the rear quarters and the underside very carefully for damp and rot - I have never yet encountered one of this design that doesn't have a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I agree with Globebuster, too many problems with them to risk your hard earned cash on. As for payload 379kg is for the basic spec, you need to deduct the weight of any extras fitted. An awning weighs 35-40kg, 2nd battery 25-30kg, solar panel 10kg, sat dish 15kg etc. You can easily add well over a 100 kg in extras. Our last van had a payload of 520kg we gave up trying to run it at 3500kg and uprated it to 3850 it was still tight on the rear axle. Didn't make the same mistake twice, new van is on a 4500kg chassis with 1200kg of payload. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted July 22, 2017 Share Posted July 22, 2017 Hi Trev Approach the dealer regarding obtaining a weighbridge certificate & insist it is a "Condition of Purchase" I don't see if you have mentioned any fitted extra's, which will reduce the Elldis brochure quoted MIRO ? Better still if you can accompany the sales person to the weighbridge, so you are sure it is actually the same motorhome you are interested in purchasing. If the dealer is reluctant to do this, it would raise alarm bells for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.