John52 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 The biggest danger to the economy through Brexit - restricting freee trade, hasn't happened yet. Wheras damage the economy has also been postponed by Osborne's scheme for people to cash in their pensions before they retire 8-) Savers and home buyers hung out to dry by the Term Funding Scheme - which is coming to an end: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2018/feb/03/interest-rates-rise-february-remortgage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-02-22 10:26 AM It has taken 10 years to get borrowing (note: not debt) back to the pre 2007 borrowing levels. As I see it unrepaid borrowing = debt, or am I wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Tracker - 2018-02-22 11:58 AM am I wrong? Yes as usual Mr Financial Advisor ;-) Borrowing is not the same as Borrowed. Debt is what we have already borrowed. Borrowing is the rate at which the debt is increasing (ignoring off balance sheet debt like PFI) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-22 12:29 PM Borrowing is not the same as Borrowed. Debt is what we have already borrowed. Borrowing is the rate at which the debt is increasing (ignoring off balance sheet debt like PFI) When you have finished the process of borrowing money, what you have is more borrowed money which is added to the money which you have already borrowed so you then owe even more borrowed money to the lenders, and that, unless I am very much mistaken = debt. Therefore borrowing is indeed, unless you repay the capital borrowed, increasing the debt, which is what I said. No wonder Gordon Brown ran up so much borrowing debt if that is the looney left thinking and heaven protect us from Calamitous Corbyn! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-22 11:24 AM The biggest danger to the economy through Brexit - restricting freee trade, hasn't happened yet. Wheras damage the economy has also been postponed by Osborne's scheme for people to cash in their pensions before they retire 8-) Savers and home buyers hung out to dry by the Term Funding Scheme - which is coming to an end: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2018/feb/03/interest-rates-rise-february-remortgage Oh dear *-) ......... Its just as well the snowflake generation are unlikely to see the 15% mortgage rates we did >:-) ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-02-22 12:54 PM Its just as well the snowflake generation are unlikely to see the 15% mortgage rates we did >:-) Just vote for Corbyn and the illusionary promise of benefitsfRus - just borrow more money increase the national debt and let our great grand children pay. Simples Oh dear - borrowing more does not mean more debt according to our resident expert so lets all borrow more - bags I a Ferrari on pcp on my new increased pension? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-02-22 12:54 PM John52 - 2018-02-22 11:24 AM The biggest danger to the economy through Brexit - restricting freee trade, hasn't happened yet. Wheras damage the economy has also been postponed by Osborne's scheme for people to cash in their pensions before they retire 8-) Savers and home buyers hung out to dry by the Term Funding Scheme - which is coming to an end: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2018/feb/03/interest-rates-rise-february-remortgage Oh dear *-) ......... Its just as well the snowflake generation are unlikely to see the 15% mortgage rates we did >:-) ....... Yes but the cost of my first house in the early 90s was only twice my wage at the time and it wasn't even a crap one. I would be crapping myself now if I was stretched on a £250k mortgage which I gather is the price of a half decent house and the rates went up even 1% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-02-22 10:39 AM.................................It's funny how quickly you reomoaners forget that your experts predicted an immediate recession? *-) ....... As for pride misplaced......would you vote for a party that is actively planning for a run on the pound if they win? 8-) ......... Not my experts, Dave, I didn't commission their opinions. The pound fell, exports rose, inflation increased, incomes didn't. So who won? So 'tis claimed, but then, you voted for a party that imploded, and its nearest political equivalent accidentally caused a collapse in the value of the pound. Me, I'm highly sceptical of Corbyn, but then I'm also highly sceptical of May. I'm just relieved there isn't an election in immediate prospect! :-D So which party has the best track record on getting the exchange rate right? Which was in power during the 1976 Sterling crisis? Which party brought about a recession in 1981, by adopting high interest rates? Which party decided to shadow the Deutsche Mark in 1988 and caused an unintended sharp rise in inflation, and then stuck to the high interest rates after German reunification, leading to a collapse in house prices? Which party decided to join the ERM at too high a rate, (and apparently without consultation), leading to Black Wednesday? Which party gave interest rate decisions to the Bank of England (and the MPC)? Which party negotiated the Euro opt-out? Which party failed to rein-in the "silly money party" in the run-up to the 2007/8 financial crash? Quite! So which party, actually, has the best track record on the economy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Tracker - 2018-02-22 2:16 PM Just vote for Corbyn and the illusionary promise of benefitsfRus - just borrow more money increase the national debt So rather than Corbyn borrowing to relieve the homeless and food bank crisis you prefer the Tories borrowing to bribe the DUP to buy their votes and keep themselves in power?. The Tories have borrowed far more than Labour - even before you strip out the amount Labour had to borrow to stop the run on all the Tory Privatised & Bankrupted Building Societies ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Tracker - 2018-02-22 12:45 PM John52 - 2018-02-22 12:29 PM Borrowing is not the same as Borrowed. Debt is what we have already borrowed. Borrowing is the rate at which the debt is increasing (ignoring off balance sheet debt like PFI) When you have finished the process of borrowing money, what you have is more borrowed money which is added to the money which you have already borrowed so you then owe even more borrowed money to the lenders, and that, unless I am very much mistaken = debt. Therefore borrowing is indeed, unless you repay the capital borrowed, increasing the debt, which is what I said. No wonder Gordon Brown ran up so much borrowing debt if that is the looney left thinking and heaven protect us from Calamitous Corbyn! Every time the Tories borrow another £billion to bribe the DUP to vote for them, or borrow £5 billion to bung the Irish in advance of a Royal Visit, that increases our debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-22 4:52 PM Every time the Tories borrow another £billion to bribe the DUP to vote for them, or borrow £5 billion to bung the Irish in advance of a Royal Visit, that increases our debt. Some things never change John - when you are wrong never admit it just change the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Tracker - 2018-02-22 5:14 PM John52 - 2018-02-22 4:52 PM Every time the Tories borrow another £billion to bribe the DUP to vote for them, or borrow £5 billion to bung the Irish in advance of a Royal Visit, that increases our debt. Some things never change John - when you are wrong never admit it just change the subject. Nothing wrong with what I posted. I change the subject when I give up trying to expain it to you :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-22 5:25 PM Nothing wrong with what I posted. I change the subject when I give up trying to expain it to you Hey folks what's that aroma - ah yes I recognise it - yet more bovine excrement from the expert in bovine droppings! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 Barryd999 - 2018-02-22 2:38 PM pelmetman - 2018-02-22 12:54 PM John52 - 2018-02-22 11:24 AM The biggest danger to the economy through Brexit - restricting freee trade, hasn't happened yet. Wheras damage the economy has also been postponed by Osborne's scheme for people to cash in their pensions before they retire 8-) Savers and home buyers hung out to dry by the Term Funding Scheme - which is coming to an end: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2018/feb/03/interest-rates-rise-february-remortgage Oh dear *-) ......... Its just as well the snowflake generation are unlikely to see the 15% mortgage rates we did >:-) ....... Yes but the cost of my first house in the early 90s was only twice my wage at the time and it wasn't even a crap one. I would be crapping myself now if I was stretched on a £250k mortgage which I gather is the price of a half decent house and the rates went up even 1% What is a half decent house Barry ??? ... Don't know the prices in your non-migrant area but here in the sh8tholes of migrant heaven £250k buys you a lot ... Take a look near us Bullet knows the address Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-02-22 7:35 PM Barryd999 - 2018-02-22 2:38 PM pelmetman - 2018-02-22 12:54 PM John52 - 2018-02-22 11:24 AM The biggest danger to the economy through Brexit - restricting freee trade, hasn't happened yet. Wheras damage the economy has also been postponed by Osborne's scheme for people to cash in their pensions before they retire 8-) Savers and home buyers hung out to dry by the Term Funding Scheme - which is coming to an end: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2018/feb/03/interest-rates-rise-february-remortgage Oh dear *-) ......... Its just as well the snowflake generation are unlikely to see the 15% mortgage rates we did >:-) ....... Yes but the cost of my first house in the early 90s was only twice my wage at the time and it wasn't even a crap one. I would be crapping myself now if I was stretched on a £250k mortgage which I gather is the price of a half decent house and the rates went up even 1% What is a half decent house Barry ??? ... Don't know the prices in your non-migrant area but here in the sh8tholes of migrant heaven £250k buys you a lot ... Take a look near us Bullet knows the address You can buy one for a quid in Liverpool :D ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-02-22 3:41 PM So which party has the best track record on getting the exchange rate right? Which was in power during the 1976 Sterling crisis? Which party brought about a recession in 1981, by adopting high interest rates? Which party decided to shadow the Deutsche Mark in 1988 and caused an unintended sharp rise in inflation, and then stuck to the high interest rates after German reunification, leading to a collapse in house prices? Which party decided to join the ERM at too high a rate, (and apparently without consultation), leading to Black Wednesday? Which party gave interest rate decisions to the Bank of England (and the MPC)? Which party negotiated the Euro opt-out? Which party failed to rein-in the "silly money party" in the run-up to the 2007/8 financial crash? Quite! So which party, actually, has the best track record on the economy? Well given that Labour tend to inherit a healthy bank balance and the Tories get left a note saying "Sorry there's no money left"........I'd say the Tories on balance ;-) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-02-23 8:50 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-02-22 3:41 PM So which party has the best track record on getting the exchange rate right? Which was in power during the 1976 Sterling crisis? Which party brought about a recession in 1981, by adopting high interest rates? Which party decided to shadow the Deutsche Mark in 1988 and caused an unintended sharp rise in inflation, and then stuck to the high interest rates after German reunification, leading to a collapse in house prices? Which party decided to join the ERM at too high a rate, (and apparently without consultation), leading to Black Wednesday? Which party gave interest rate decisions to the Bank of England (and the MPC)? Which party negotiated the Euro opt-out? Which party failed to rein-in the "silly money party" in the run-up to the 2007/8 financial crash? Quite! So which party, actually, has the best track record on the economy? Well given that Labour tend to inherit a healthy bank balance and the Tories get left a note saying "Sorry there's no money left"........I'd say the Tories on balance ;-) ........... Instead of regurgitaating Daily Mail tripe like Tracker, why don't you look at the National Debt figures and see who really borrows the most. Osborne's average annual borrowing was more than 5 times Gordon Browns 8-) Darling had to borrow more to bail out the Building Societies the Tories had privatised and bankrupted. But even witht hat Labour borrowed less in their 12 years than the Tories have in their 7 years 8-) These are ONS debt figures, not Daily Mail Tripe. And what have we to show for it. Bribes to the Scots, Welsh, and Irish to buy their votes. And taxpayer funded house price subsidies which have only poured petrol on the housing crisis the Tories created by their Gerrymandering away our council houses. i >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-02-23 8:50 AM the Tories get left a note saying "Sorry there's no money left"... A great situation compared to where we are now. Back then we still owned our own power, water, railways, public housing, dockyards, telecommunications, Building Societies, postal service etc etc, housing was affordable and we didn't have the massive debts rung up by Osborne and Hammond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-23 10:42 AM pelmetman - 2018-02-23 8:50 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-02-22 3:41 PM So which party has the best track record on getting the exchange rate right? Which was in power during the 1976 Sterling crisis? Which party brought about a recession in 1981, by adopting high interest rates? Which party decided to shadow the Deutsche Mark in 1988 and caused an unintended sharp rise in inflation, and then stuck to the high interest rates after German reunification, leading to a collapse in house prices? Which party decided to join the ERM at too high a rate, (and apparently without consultation), leading to Black Wednesday? Which party gave interest rate decisions to the Bank of England (and the MPC)? Which party negotiated the Euro opt-out? Which party failed to rein-in the "silly money party" in the run-up to the 2007/8 financial crash? Quite! So which party, actually, has the best track record on the economy? Well given that Labour tend to inherit a healthy bank balance and the Tories get left a note saying "Sorry there's no money left"........I'd say the Tories on balance ;-) ........... Instead of regurgitaating Daily Mail tripe like Tracker, why don't you look at the National Debt figures and see who really borrows the most. Osborne's average annual borrowing was more than 5 times Gordon Browns 8-) Darling had to borrow more to bail out the Building Societies the Tories had privatised and bankrupted. But even witht hat Labour borrowed less in their 12 years than the Tories have in their 7 years 8-) These are ONS debt figures, not Daily Mail Tripe. And what have we to show for it. Bribes to the Scots, Welsh, and Irish to buy their votes. And taxpayer funded house price subsidies which have only poured petrol on the housing crisis the Tories created by their Gerrymandering away our council houses. i >:-) Council houses bought mainly by ............. Working class Labour voters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-02-23 11:32 AM John52 - 2018-02-23 10:42 AM pelmetman - 2018-02-23 8:50 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-02-22 3:41 PM So which party has the best track record on getting the exchange rate right? Which was in power during the 1976 Sterling crisis? Which party brought about a recession in 1981, by adopting high interest rates? Which party decided to shadow the Deutsche Mark in 1988 and caused an unintended sharp rise in inflation, and then stuck to the high interest rates after German reunification, leading to a collapse in house prices? Which party decided to join the ERM at too high a rate, (and apparently without consultation), leading to Black Wednesday? Which party gave interest rate decisions to the Bank of England (and the MPC)? Which party negotiated the Euro opt-out? Which party failed to rein-in the "silly money party" in the run-up to the 2007/8 financial crash? Quite! So which party, actually, has the best track record on the economy? Well given that Labour tend to inherit a healthy bank balance and the Tories get left a note saying "Sorry there's no money left"........I'd say the Tories on balance ;-) ........... Instead of regurgitaating Daily Mail tripe like Tracker, why don't you look at the National Debt figures and see who really borrows the most. Osborne's average annual borrowing was more than 5 times Gordon Browns 8-) Darling had to borrow more to bail out the Building Societies the Tories had privatised and bankrupted. But even witht hat Labour borrowed less in their 12 years than the Tories have in their 7 years 8-) These are ONS debt figures, not Daily Mail Tripe. And what have we to show for it. Bribes to the Scots, Welsh, and Irish to buy their votes. And taxpayer funded house price subsidies which have only poured petrol on the housing crisis the Tories created by their Gerrymandering away our council houses. i >:-) Council houses bought mainly by ............. Working class Labour voters In which case the Tories Gerrymandering backfired on them :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-02-22 7:35 PM Barryd999 - 2018-02-22 2:38 PM pelmetman - 2018-02-22 12:54 PM John52 - 2018-02-22 11:24 AM The biggest danger to the economy through Brexit - restricting freee trade, hasn't happened yet. Wheras damage the economy has also been postponed by Osborne's scheme for people to cash in their pensions before they retire 8-) Savers and home buyers hung out to dry by the Term Funding Scheme - which is coming to an end: https://www.theguardian.com/money/2018/feb/03/interest-rates-rise-february-remortgage Oh dear *-) ......... Its just as well the snowflake generation are unlikely to see the 15% mortgage rates we did >:-) ....... Yes but the cost of my first house in the early 90s was only twice my wage at the time and it wasn't even a crap one. I would be crapping myself now if I was stretched on a £250k mortgage which I gather is the price of a half decent house and the rates went up even 1% What is a half decent house Barry ??? ... Don't know the prices in your non-migrant area but here in the sh8tholes of migrant heaven £250k buys you a lot ... Take a look near us Bullet knows the address It was just a stab in the dark at an average house price in the UK. I wasnt that far out and this was 2017 https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-house-price-index-hpi-for-january-2017 Even the average price of a terrace house is approaching £200k. Of course this will vary all over the country dramatically. The worry though is two fold. We havent recovered enough from the last recession to throw caution to the wind with an idea like Brexit and people didnt learn from that and are still maxed out with debt. They cant afford to take a hit either. If you take any big risk that may long term (you think) become fruitful but you may take a bit of a hit in the short term you have to be in a good position to take that hit. I dont think we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-23 12:02 PM antony1969 - 2018-02-23 11:32 AM John52 - 2018-02-23 10:42 AM pelmetman - 2018-02-23 8:50 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-02-22 3:41 PM So which party has the best track record on getting the exchange rate right? Which was in power during the 1976 Sterling crisis? Which party brought about a recession in 1981, by adopting high interest rates? Which party decided to shadow the Deutsche Mark in 1988 and caused an unintended sharp rise in inflation, and then stuck to the high interest rates after German reunification, leading to a collapse in house prices? Which party decided to join the ERM at too high a rate, (and apparently without consultation), leading to Black Wednesday? Which party gave interest rate decisions to the Bank of England (and the MPC)? Which party negotiated the Euro opt-out? Which party failed to rein-in the "silly money party" in the run-up to the 2007/8 financial crash? Quite! So which party, actually, has the best track record on the economy? Well given that Labour tend to inherit a healthy bank balance and the Tories get left a note saying "Sorry there's no money left"........I'd say the Tories on balance ;-) ........... Instead of regurgitaating Daily Mail tripe like Tracker, why don't you look at the National Debt figures and see who really borrows the most. Osborne's average annual borrowing was more than 5 times Gordon Browns 8-) Darling had to borrow more to bail out the Building Societies the Tories had privatised and bankrupted. But even witht hat Labour borrowed less in their 12 years than the Tories have in their 7 years 8-) These are ONS debt figures, not Daily Mail Tripe. And what have we to show for it. Bribes to the Scots, Welsh, and Irish to buy their votes. And taxpayer funded house price subsidies which have only poured petrol on the housing crisis the Tories created by their Gerrymandering away our council houses. i >:-) Council houses bought mainly by ............. Working class Labour voters In which case the Tories Gerrymandering backfired on them :D Why Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-23 10:42 AM Instead of regurgitaating Daily Mail tripe like Tracker, I have never read the daily mail or any other tripepaper so unlike you I don't let others fashion my views nor corrupt me into believing that JC is the sainted solution to all our ills. Having endured too many years of mismanagement by successive governments of both sides my own unbiased, uninfluenced view based on my own experiences of life in the UK is that Labour in general make a bigger cock up of the economy than the Tories in general - albeit only by a small margin. Who would I vote for - none of the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 John52 - 2018-02-22 4:52 PM Borrowing is not the same as Borrowed. Debt is what we have already borrowed. Borrowing is the rate at which the debt is increasing (ignoring off balance sheet debt like PFI) Every time the Tories borrow another £billion to bribe the DUP to vote for them, or borrow £5 billion to bung the Irish in advance of a Royal Visit, that increases our debt. Ah, I think I understand now, when Labour borrow to pay benefits it is called borrowing but when the Tories borrow to bribe the DUP it is called debt. When compared to Corbyn's disgraceful hollow promise to end student tuition fees in order to gain thousands of student votes, the Tory / DUP deal does not sound so bad after all. Thank you john for clarifying that one, my goodness that fence you are sat upon must be getting mighty uncomfortable for you to at last understand how wrong your regurgitated views are, maybe a few more highly selective cut and pastes will help you feel better as that is your undisputed speciality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted February 23, 2018 Share Posted February 23, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-02-23 2:19 PM John52 - 2018-02-23 12:02 PM antony1969 - 2018-02-23 11:32 AM John52 - 2018-02-23 10:42 AM pelmetman - 2018-02-23 8:50 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-02-22 3:41 PM So which party has the best track record on getting the exchange rate right? Which was in power during the 1976 Sterling crisis? Which party brought about a recession in 1981, by adopting high interest rates? Which party decided to shadow the Deutsche Mark in 1988 and caused an unintended sharp rise in inflation, and then stuck to the high interest rates after German reunification, leading to a collapse in house prices? Which party decided to join the ERM at too high a rate, (and apparently without consultation), leading to Black Wednesday? Which party gave interest rate decisions to the Bank of England (and the MPC)? Which party negotiated the Euro opt-out? Which party failed to rein-in the "silly money party" in the run-up to the 2007/8 financial crash? Quite! So which party, actually, has the best track record on the economy? Well given that Labour tend to inherit a healthy bank balance and the Tories get left a note saying "Sorry there's no money left"........I'd say the Tories on balance ;-) ........... Instead of regurgitaating Daily Mail tripe like Tracker, why don't you look at the National Debt figures and see who really borrows the most. Osborne's average annual borrowing was more than 5 times Gordon Browns 8-) Darling had to borrow more to bail out the Building Societies the Tories had privatised and bankrupted. But even witht hat Labour borrowed less in their 12 years than the Tories have in their 7 years 8-) These are ONS debt figures, not Daily Mail Tripe. And what have we to show for it. Bribes to the Scots, Welsh, and Irish to buy their votes. And taxpayer funded house price subsidies which have only poured petrol on the housing crisis the Tories created by their Gerrymandering away our council houses. i >:-) Council houses bought mainly by ............. Working class Labour voters In which case the Tories Gerrymandering backfired on them :D Why At the risk of stating he obvious because they took the bribe of a cheap council house and still didn't vote Tory (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.