icdsun Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Hi Simple question, does anyone have any info on this please All help gratefully received Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docted Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 Chris Yes to both. Strict letter of the law your speedo should read in MPH and illuminated when dark. Headlights should dip to the the left, if not you will fail MOT and dazzle other road users at night. Docted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 If you import a vehicle to the UK, before it can be registered it must legally conform to certain regulations. These include having a) headlamps that produce a beam-pattern suitable for 'left-hand traffic', b) a rear fog-light on the centre-line or the right-hand side of the vehicle, and c) a speedometer that includes a miles-per-hour display. Thus, for a) the headlamps of a LHD vehicle may need replacement, or it may be possible to adjust the lamps to obtain the required pattern (but use of 'masks' or 'beam benders' is not permitted). For b) it may or may not be necessary to add an extra fog-light - depends what the vehicle has to begin with. For c) the speedometer may need replacement, or it may be feasible to add mph markings to the existing instrument (or to use an 'overlay') as long these are accurate, durable and can be read in all light conditions. There are other requirements and (assuming you have in mind to import a motorhome and are not just being curious) for the full picture I suggest you contact the DVLA via their website (www.dvla.gov.uk) and request an 'Import Pack'. This contains advice and all the documentation necessary for the UK end of the importing process. I also strongly suggest you obtain Mel Eastburn's invaluable guide "Buying a Motorhome in Europe". To get a copy, send an SAE (at least C5 size) together with a cheque (£7 or more) made payable to Mel's favourite charity, MacIntyre Care. The address is: M Eastburn Fact Sheet MMM PO Box 88 Tiverton EX16 7ZN" Mel has additional country-specific fact-sheets, so if you are planning to purchase the vehicle from (say) Germany, then mention this when you apply for the guide and he'll send the German fact-sheet too. Also some useful stuff in the "Frequently Asked Questions - PLEASE READ" thread 3rd down from the top of this forum list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forrester Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 I imported a German LHD M/H last October. I had fitted a R/H side fog lamp, beam benders & it still had the speedo. in KPH only. It needed new pads & discs on the front to pass its MOT, no comment beeing made about lights or speedo!! :-D Before you spend your dosh, go to your garage & see what their attitude is. Forrester. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixters other half Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 I concur with Forrester, I fitted RHD lenses at £70 and found I could have used Beam deflectors !! I put tape on the speedo at the 30 50 and 70 mph equivalents and had no problems - but do check with the MOT station before hand, some are Jobsworths others are realists. Rgds VoH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 ChrisNotwithstanding the last two posts above, Derek's is the correct answer. When you register you sign to the effect your vehicle fully complies with the minimum requirements. Your insurance is issued on the same basis. The risk is obvious.The others have somewhat "got away with it" at sloppy test stations and may be satisfied with that, but the "proper" answer to your question is that you have a legal obligation to do as Derek advises. It is not a question of test station jobsworths, they aren't doing their jobs thoroughly. Who knows what else they let slide past them?I may be cheaper in the short term, but............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjphillips Posted February 19, 2007 Share Posted February 19, 2007 I bought my LHD Laika M/H privately 4 years ago within a couple of weeks had to have it MOT only to find it still had RH dip headlights, the speedo was still in KL & yet it had gone through the initial registration & passed!!!!Fiat price for the LH h/lamp units was £250 + vat,I got the same units next door at the motor parts ctr for £126 incl vat !! As far as the speedo goes I stuck red dots on the glass cover in the apropiate positions & the number s on those in white letroset. With a little plug in light to the cigar holder that was accepted at every MOT test since. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icdsun Posted February 20, 2007 Author Share Posted February 20, 2007 Thanks to you all for the info, it is the official line which is the one to follow as I'm sure that an insurance company would walk/run away from any claim where the vehicle albeit with a MOT etc had not been converted as the regs. interestingly the Burstner we looked at can be bought as a lhd from a UK dealer according to the brochures we received from Burstner UK with a discount of £900.00, which is extremely generous of them:-S, but a long way off the £7.5K we would save from Germany for a similar spec vehicle, it's nice to see old traditions being held highly by the UK MH industry. B-) Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olley Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Hi beam benders are perfectly legal for an MOT. so is a speedo that reads in KPH, so the testers weren't being sloppy. It's only on the first registration were you declare that it conforms to all UK C&U. regulations that their not. Before you guys start slating MOT testers, get your facts right. Olley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 I'd be grateful if you could quote the authority for that, Olley. It is not the impression given by the personal importation pack from DVLA.Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Carry Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Well said Olly, I keep seeing posts saying that you have to change the headlamps, you don't. See the link below, itclearly says masks are not a reason to fail as long as they are positioned correctly and don't cut the amount of light, so taped up headlamps may fail but the clear beam benders you can buy are fine. I am on my third LHD and have had no problems in 7 years with a variety of MOT staions with the speedo being in KPH http://www.motuk.co.uk/manual_160.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Carry Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Brian I will have to dig out what I have, something to do with the construction and use regs and imports, but it was something along the lines of that if it was built/designed as a LHD then as long as you can pass an MOT as per the beam benders as in my post above then it is allowed, had a quick search in the manual and could not see the speedo listed in it at all. No what you mean with the info in the import pack though, it is confusing, think also that importing new is different to second hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olley Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Hi Brian as I said in my post its only when you first register your import that you are suppose to make it comply with all the UK C&U regs, and apart from just recently they just take your word for it. But an MOT is different, their are specific items they check and compliance with C&U regs. is not one of them. Your lights must conform to a set beam pattern but how this is achieved is not part of the test. so stick-on-beam benders are perfectly ok for the test. Olley PS hi fetch and carry, I don't know whether C&U allow LHD lights or not, its only the MOT side that I know about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Brian and Olley (and others), The position is actually very simple: 1. A vehicle registered in the UK must comply with the relevant regulations. These are contained in the Road Vehicles Construction and Use Regulations 1986 and the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989, both as much amended since. To be legal on UK roads, a vehicle registered in the UK must have left dipping headlights, a speedo displaying mph visible in daylight and after dark, a fog light on the UK centreline or offside (twin foglights are acceptable), and any radio controlled locking device must conform to UK/EU regulations. If it doesn't comply then it is not legal on UK roads. 2. However, it can legitimately pass the MoT test without complying with the headlamp or speedo requirement, provided the headlamps are suitably masked. The rear fog lamps MUST comply (A single, UK-nearside fog lamp is actually extremely dangerous in the UK in badly reduced visibility and I always recommend fitting twin lamps so you're covered both here and on the Continent). The radio remote is not checked. The MoT is quite separate, has never checked everything, and does not pretend to. Our legislation is not all 'joined up'. 3. Newly imported vehicles are inspected extremely rarely for their compliance to these regulations. However, most personal imports are now inspected briefly because of a recent scam involving motorhomes, Eastern Europeans and people you'd rather not meet on a dark night. As far as I am aware, these checks tend to be about whether the vehicle, its VIN number, etc., tally with the registration application. 4. So it's up to you. If you don't mind failing to observe the C&U and Lighting Regs, you do not need to do more than tape the headlights and put an overlay on the speedo. BUT, if you do have an accident which is even partly down to you, and in which either poor lighting or excessive speed for the conditions could be argued to have played a part (and 15mph might be too fast for some conditions!), then expect real problems with your insurers. 5. It makes no difference whether the vehicle is new or used - though used vehicles have to start having MoTs on the third anniversary of their FIRST registration, wherever and whenever that was (i.e., NOT on the 3rd anniversary of their importation). My advice has always been to get the overseas dealer to do the headlamps - they can order up RHD ones easily enough, and the removed LHD ones have full stock value to them, where they are useless to a UK dealer. On that basis, they may well agree to do the job for labour cost only, as part of the sales deal. BUT you need to think ahead about these things. Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyishuk Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 O/T How many of you have seen continental lorries in the UK with Beam Benders on their H/lights ? In my travels , one ! ( in 2 years of being that interested :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 Thanks MelI must say I had just assumed that, as the vehicle couldn't legally be registered without these things remedied, they would be picked up during the MoT. Speedo not checked at all, and headlamps with masks, seem strange omissions from the test requisites. However, that is clearly the position. Yer lives and yer learns!I suppose the insurance risk is just that, a risk. With most "fender benders" the issue of compliance would be extremely unlikely to arise. I'd guess it would only be liable to arise where injury resulted, and even if non-compliance was then considered contributory, since insurance had been provided, I guess the insurer (or the insurers' compensation fund) would have to swallow the third party element of any claim, but would, reasonably, leave the insured whistling for any damage to themselves or their vehicle. Maybe not too bad for an accident with no serious outcome, but could be nasty if there were death or serious injury.Re the headlamps, the alternative strategy, which we adopted was to drive the van home with the right dippers, and then buy the left dipping headlamps in UK. It cost about £170 for the pair, but we than had two sets, one for UK use, and the other for European use. Theyre very easy to change, align out of the box, and come fully lamped so it is just two screws per side and then plug them in! It does mean we break the law going to, and from, the UK port - but we do this by day so that just becomes our small risk! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 20, 2007 Share Posted February 20, 2007 tonyishuk - 2007-02-20 4:16 PM O/T How many of you have seen continental lorries in the UK with Beam Benders on their H/lights ? In my travels , one ! ( in 2 years of being that interested :D Not sure where you're going with this, Tony.They aren't UK registered, so much of the foregoing is not, strictly, relevant. However they should a) have headlights adapted to dip left, but b) as you say I've never seen one so equipped (and yes, they do drive after dark), but c) it's our own fault for not holding them back at the port of entry until sorted out. Maybe one of those popular petitions to the Prime Minister to tell someone like Customs to check?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 Regarding right-dipping headlights and the MOT, an MOT tester told me that beam-benders that modify the beam pattern so that the lights 'dip left' are totally acceptable. He said that adhesive 'masks', that blank out the offending part of the right-dipping beam pattern, should also earn the vehicle a pass, but some sort of 'notification' is given to the vehicle owner about it ("Go and buy some beam-benders", perhaps?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W3526602 Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 Hi, The speedometer is not part of the MOT. Did I read somewhere that vehicles VISITING the UK are not required to adjust their headlamps? OT....I once presented an old MG Midjet (OK, not that old, only 1965) for its MOT with half the front wing and half the door skin missing. No point in paying to have them fixed if its going to fail seriously on something else. However, I had folded the sharp edges in so they were not dangerous. Tester ran his hands along the edges, and passed it. 602 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 "Did I read somewhere that vehicles VISITING the UK are not required to adjust their headlamps?" You might have read it, but it's not true. I checked this with the police and a local vehicle 'spot check' DofT station. The police said it's not considered a hot issue for them at present (though it might become so) and the testing-station inspectors said they checked for lights on 'overseas vehicles' being operational but didn't look for wrong beam patterns. Both confirmed, however, that's the headlight-adjustment rules are the same for 'them coming here' as for 'us going there'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fetch Carry Posted February 21, 2007 Share Posted February 21, 2007 Our latest van had to be inspected before being issued with the UK registration, and it went through that inspection with KPH speedo and beam benders. Our previous two VW vans were not inspected. I am not saying that it is right or wrong, just what happend with us. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icdsun Posted February 22, 2007 Author Share Posted February 22, 2007 Hi to all Many Thanks for the help & advise, after some hard bargaining we have ordered a new Burstner from the NEC show as opposed to importing a LHD, we got down to a difference of 900 which we would have almost spent in travelling costs etc. so I would like to Thank everyone for their advise, comments and help. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globetrotter Posted February 22, 2007 Share Posted February 22, 2007 My LHD van with taped up headlights passed its MOT with an "advisory" that beam deflectors were fitted. I would add that I have now fitted new RHD ones as the light quality was abysmal !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 icdsun, In calculating the £900 difference, did you take account of the 8% to 12% discount you would have got in Germany? Just interested, 'cos that's around £4,000 on a £40,000 van. Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 Mel E - 2007-02-23 11:10 AM icdsun, In calculating the £900 difference, did you take account of the 8% to 12% discount you would have got in Germany? Just interested, 'cos that's around £4,000 on a £40,000 van. Mel E I had 4 European quotes, 2 offered no discount and 2 a healthy 18% I find it hard to believe that only a saving of £900 could be achieved. I saved over £8000 on a EuraMobil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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