DVLA - Motorhome Classification

[trialsrider]

I'm trying to get my race van classed as a motor caravan on the logbook. It is s professional conversion not one done by myself. It used to be a very simple process. I have had 3 previous vans that have been converted for me reclassified as motor caravans by the DVLA. The benefits of reclassification are minimal but when selling the van every prospective purchaser asks if it has been reclassified with the DVLA. That is the sole reason I want it done.

 

You use to send off a few photos showing one window, a cooker, storage, seating and a six foot bed and they would reclassify it. In 2019 the DVLA changed the requirements. they now say you must have the following exterior features.

 

- 2 or more windows on at least one side of the main body (this does not include windows on the driver or passenger doors) to provide a reasonable amount of daylight into the living accommodation.

 

- A separate door which provides access to the living accommodation of the vehicle (this excludes the driver and passenger doors); a window on this door counts as a separate window on the main body.

 

- Motor caravan-style graphics on both sides of the vehicle.

 

- An awning bar attached to either side of the vehicle.

 

- A high-top roof (this does not include a pop-top elevating roof).

 

The problem I have is with the windows. I have one Seitz S4 window on both nearside and offside of the van. This can't change due to the layout of the van and the garage. What I was wondering is whether my two roof windows could be classed as being on one side of the main body? Could the roof be classed as a side ? They certainly let light into the living area.

 

Has anybody got experience of this DVLA process ?

[BruceM]

Not done it myself however DVLA state “This list describes the external features which are commonly seen in motor caravans, and it is intended to provide guidance on what DVLA expects to see when considering your application:”, ie it is for guidance only. It’s reasonable to expect the living accommodation to have windows. If you have windows on your rear doors I’d have thought that would do if you talk to the right person. They may still fault you though if the van just looks like a van and not a motorhome, the objective after all is to be able to identify it as a motorhome when on the road. Basically, I think you will need to have a go at arguing your case.

 

[Vito]

Yes I have just been through the process. And mine "failed" the "does it look like a motorhome to the individual who is assessing your application". If you look on the self build motorhome forum you will see that this is a random process but very heavily biased to not allowing a change to motorhome on the log book. I have no idea why... I can't see any sense in what is a change in policy (someone has asked under the freedom of information act about the numbers passed and failed over a period of time and it has changed substantially). And it is a legal requirement for use to tell them of a change of use. Anyway, the letter you get back for a "fail" says you have no right to appeal unless you make significant further changes.

 

In fairness my camper conversion is subtle and I do not have a high top or fancy graphics. But it meets all of the other requirements. I'm not overly bothered keeping it as a "van with windows" , although I would like clarity over which speed limits I need to adhere to. I have contacted the DVSA and they confirm it should be MoTd as a camper (class 4 instead of 7) as it has all the required features. But they would not be drawn on which speed limits apply to it.

 

Cheers

Nick

[Keithl]

Vito - 2020-05-02 6:06 PM

 

Yes I have just been through the process. And mine "failed" the "does it look like a motorhome to the individual who is assessing your application".

 

...a "van with windows" , although I would like clarity over which speed limits I need to adhere to. I have contacted the DVSA and ... they would not be drawn on which speed limits apply to it.

 

Cheers

Nick

 

The 'unrestricted' or 'car' speed limits ONLY apply to "Motorhomes or motor caravans (not more than 3.05 tonnes maximum unladen weight)" so as you are now registered as a "van with windows" you are still a 'Van' and do not qualify and the reduced speed limits will almost certainly apply. This limits your speed to 50 on Single Carriageways and 60 on Dual Carriageways, but still allows 70 on Motorways.

 

See Gov.uk for clarification.

 

https://www.gov.uk/speed-limits

 

Keith.

[BruceM]

Vito - 2020-05-02 6:06 PM

I can't see any sense in what is a change in policy (someone has asked under the freedom of information act about the numbers passed and failed over a period of time and it has changed substantially).

 

Cheers

Nick

I suspect that the change in approach is down to the need for police/security enforcement – possibly something that is being increasingly automated (AI rules?) – ie APNR flags your van up as being insured, with insurance, a valid MOT and a campervan, but it looks like a vanilla van. Could be cloned number plates? - pull it over and check. Perhaps a forum member with appropriate connections can provide a less speculative rational.

[Derek Uzzell]

There’s a good deal of ‘stuff’ on-line about this issue

 

https://tinyurl.com/y763d52s

 

It came up in the “Letters” section of the latest (June) issue of MMM magazine where it was mentioned that there’s an ongoing petition.

 

https://petition.parliament.uk/archived/petitions/268981

 

 

[trialsrider]

Thanks for all your responses. I'm going to give the DVLA a ring and see what they have to say. It does seem a very strict criteria. For instance a brand new vw California straight out of the vw factory would not meet this criteria as it has a pop top roof. It would be the same for some westfalias.

[BruceM]

I’m probably stating the obvious but having pondered on this issue it’s clear that

 

1. A vehicle may be registered with DVLA as a motor caravan.

2. The Body type classification though must accurately describe the appearance of the vehicle. So in the same way that if the vehicle is grey it must be registered as colour grey, if it does not immediately look like a motor caravan it must be registered as having a van body type.

 

So in extremis stealth motor caravans will have to be registered as having a body type of van.

 

That seems eminently reasonable. The issue is purely on where the line is drawn on what looks like a motor caravan. It sounds to me that the ops van still looks like a van – albeit with a couple of windows on one side of it. I can understand pop up roofs being excluded as evidence as when down, the van body shape is little changed. The need for windows on both side of the van appears a bit extreme at first but then thinking about it, it all depends on which side of the vehicle it is viewed from. With only one window it will look like a windowless van.

 

I suspect that manufacturers will simply change their designs to comply although only if they feel if the body type classification is really of any great significance.

[Derek Uzzell]

DVLA guidance on converting a vehicle into a motor caravan is here:

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/converting-a-vehicle-into-a-motor-caravan/converting-a-vehicle-into-a-motor-caravan

 

Trialsrider’s main problem seems to be that his race-van conversion does not meet the DVLA’s ‘expectation’

 

- 2 or more windows on at least one side of the main body (this does not include windows on the driver or passenger doors) to provide a reasonable amount of daylight into the living accommodation.

 

although his race-van does have one window in each side-panel.

 

The DVLA’s gudance does not define the type nor size of the windows, nor how a “reasonable amount of daylight” should be assessed. Everybody knows that a panel-van has a roof, an underside, a front, a back and two sides, so there should be no doubt what a “side of the main body” is (and it’s not the roof or rear doors).

 

Assuming that the window on each side of Trialsrider’s race-van is fairly large, logically there ought not to be a DVLA insistence that a 2nd window be inserted into one of the sides. But there are really small windows available (example in attachment below) that I’m guessing could be fitted if the 2-windows-on-a side thing stops the race-van being reclassified.

 

If Triasrider provides the DVLA with photos of his race-van and asks if anything further needs to be done to allow it to be reclassified, he may find that no extra window is necessary.

 

[trialsrider]

Derek Uzzell - 2020-05-04 8:33 AM

 

DVLA guidance on converting a vehicle into a motor caravan is here:

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/converting-a-vehicle-into-a-motor-caravan/converting-a-vehicle-into-a-motor-caravan

 

Trialsrider’s main problem seems to be that his race-van conversion does not meet the DVLA’s ‘expectation’

 

- 2 or more windows on at least one side of the main body (this does not include windows on the driver or passenger doors) to provide a reasonable amount of daylight into the living accommodation.

 

although his race-van does have one window in each side-panel.

 

The DVLA’s gudance does not define the type nor size of the windows, nor how a “reasonable amount of daylight” should be assessed. Everybody knows that a panel-van has a roof, an underside, a front, a back and two sides, so there should be no doubt what a “side of the main body” is (and it’s not the roof or rear doors).

 

Assuming that the window on each side of Trialsrider’s race-van is fairly large, logically there ought not to be a DVLA insistence that a 2nd window be inserted into one of the sides. But there are really small windows available (example in attachment below) that I’m guessing could be fitted if the 2-windows-on-a side thing stops the race-van being reclassified.

 

If Triasrider provides the DVLA with photos of his race-van and asks if anything further needs to be done to allow it to be reclassified, he may find that no extra window is necessary.

 

 

Hi Derek

 

Following your response I spoke to the DVLA. They were very helpful. The lady implied there was a degree of flexibility within the window rule and agreed that one big window could let in more light than two small ones. She stressed the importance of a covering letter to explain the finer details regarding the windows.

 

My windows are Seitz S4 900 x 500 with two mini hekis in the roof. The living area of the van is very light and airy. The only place a second window could go is by the bed above the garage and I wouldn't want a window there as I like to sleep in darkness.

 

So I'm going to fit some tastefull graphics and then take some photos. Hopefully with a good covering letter and good documentation I may be lucky. I suppose it also depends on whose desk it falls on too.

[TeamRienza]

Two thoughts struck me, both not strictly complying with the law as interpreted by DVLA , but then a bad law deserves to be ridiculed.

 

1. Fit a window in the side of the van. The fact that it might be in the back of a wardrobe is irrelevant. It could have opaque plastic and could still function if the door was open.

 

2. The naughty one. Have a decal of a full sized window made and stuck on the side. If it happened to fall off after the V5 reclassification I don’t suppose the DVLA would worry too much.

 

These thoughts apply only if the van is reclassified by submission of photos rather than physical examination.

 

Davy

[pepe63xnotuse]

trialsrider - 2020-05-02 8:52 PM

 

Thanks for all your responses. I'm going to give the DVLA a ring and see what they have to say. It does seem a very strict criteria. For instance a brand new vw California straight out of the vw factory would not meet this criteria as it has a pop top roof. It would be the same for some westfalias.

 

Hi.

Off topic...

Am I right in saying that the VW California (and presumably similar "factory" campers?) are classified a "MPV" now?..

and if so, I wonder if that "class" is something that those who have converted smaller, (possibly pop-roofed) vans, could aim to get their vans reclassified as?...or whether it's a "from the factory only" class?

(I'm assuming that there is something to be be gained by doing this, rather than stay as windowed van? eg speed limits? insurance?)

 

Hopefully, in the case of you van, some suitable graphic to make it look more motorhome-like should help sway them?

(even if you go a bit OTT and a bit cheesy with them?..You can always pull 'em off after the photos are taken).

 

 

[Derek Uzzell]

TeamRienza - 2020-05-04 3:13 PM

 

Two thoughts struck me, both not strictly complying with the law as interpreted by DVLA , but then a bad law deserves to be ridiculed...

 

As has been emphasised above, there is no ‘law’ regarding van-to-motorhome reclassification, just DVLA ‘guidance’.

 

The relevant website (link in my previous posting) advises

 

Your vehicle may also require a DVLA inspection. DVLA will cover the cost of the inspection, but any costs associated with transporting the vehicle to the inspection will not be reimbursed. If the vehicle cannot be inspected, the application will be refused and no further action will be taken.

 

You must provide clear evidence that the vehicle you have converted will permanently be a ‘motor caravan’ and it meets the requirements for the internal and external features.

 

The classification of VW’s “California” models was discussed here:

 

https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/motorhome-campervan-mpv.32395/