Rayjsj Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Peterlyn, We are all following this thread, please let us know how you are getting on, Re- The Dealer, etc., sorry couldn't help, don't have a Chausson. Ray :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolero boy Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 pepe63 - 2014-01-08 6:43 PM bolero boy - 2014-01-08 6:17 PM Having spilt an unwanted substance on one of our cushions a while back, I can confirm that even if there is only say 10% wet, this will be squeezed out when the cushion is sat on causing moisture to pass through straight away to the covers. Chris...It's when you find it happening on every seat that you sit on..no matter who's house you're in...now that'd be the time to worry! (lol) Ha, Pepe, don't quite have that problem yet, lol! We got our damaged cushion replaced and it matches perfectly 'moins de l'eau ' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Lynn I've now looked at quite a few adverts for 2007-2009 Chausson Welcome 75 motorhomes. The following links are representative: http://www.leboncoin.fr/caravaning/568913025.htm?ca=6_s 2007 http://www.leboncoin.fr/caravaning/555089623.htm?ca=6_s 2008 http://www.camping-car-conseil.com/fiche_camping_car.php?idannonce=467 2008 http://www.caraworld.de/wohnmobile/chausson/2445478/chausson-welcome-75-sat-tv-klima-solar-garage/bild_3.html 2008 https://www.grossovacanze.com/it/scheda_veicolo.php?id=3385 2008 http://www.lacentrale.fr/camping_car-caravane-occasion-annonce-22458257.html 2009 http://www.truckscout24.de/search/ger/detail.asp?language=ger&vehicletype_id=10&vehicle_id=14749176 2009 It's evident that the 2007 living-area layout alters for 2008-onwards, with a forward-facing banquette being replaced on the left-hand side with L-shaped seating. For 2007 models an (extendable) table is attached to a rail on the left wall and has a single support-leg. To begin to construct the crossways-bed the table will be detached from the rail, its hinged support-leg will be folded and the table will then be re-attached to another rail lower down on the wall. If wished, the table + support-leg could quickly be removed to gain space in the living-area. For 2008 models the table is not attached to the wall but supported by a single 'leg' (pedestal) fixed to the motorhome's floor. The table can be slid/rotated on the top of the pedestal to position it conveniently for people dining. The 2008/2009 photos suggest that there may be more than one design of pedestal (and table-top), but such pedestals (when the table forms a bed-base) are usually telescopic. The table-top is moved to a position where it fits between the seats and the pedestal is then manipulated until the table-top is at the right height. With this type of arrangement neither the table-top nor the pedestal is easily removable. This advert for a 2008 Challenger motorhome (twin to a Chausson) shows a height-adjustable pedestal. http://www.leboncoin.fr/caravaning/525888035.htm?ca=6_s Your description indicates that your Welcome 75 does not have a telescopic pedestal and that you need to remove part of the pedestal's upright section to bring the table-top down to the correct height for bed making. This photo of another 2008 Challenger shows a different type of table leg where it looks like the leg would need to be disassembled to lower the table-top. http://www.leboncoin.fr/caravaning/552093532.htm?ca=6_s Perhaps this is the type of table you have? I would have thought that a motorhome dealership (even one that is not a Chausson agent) ought to be able to decide whether the table arrangement in your Welcome 75 is as one might reasonably expect Chausson to have installed it or whether it's probably a DIY effort. When the table-top is lowered, it will need to be fairly stable. But much of the stability of these secondary beds often comes from how the seat cushions are positioned. You might find that, although the table-top is a bit wobbly when lowered, jamming the cushions on top and in the right order produces a bed safe enough to sleep on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Hi Derek... The "fixed pedestal" table shown in your last link, looks exactly the same as ours( 2008 reg' Chausson Allegro 83). http://www.leboncoin.fr/caravaning/552093532.htm?ca=6_s ...and *if Lynn's table is the same, then it is bl**dy heavy!...and because it can continue to slide about everywhere, it can be a real finger pincher as well!...and therefore, it's not really something that I'd want to be routinely wrestling with every time I need to make up a bed *I say "if" because I can't picture where this separate panel that Lynn mentions, would factor with our set-up. ..although to date, we've never fully assembled our front bed, so we may well be missing a piece as well?..... If we had to use our front bed on a routine basis, then I'd probably be looking into ditching the existing table, for something lighter and freestanding and be looking into constructing some form of separate bed laths/framework arrangement(..something that could be rolled up/dismantled and stored elsewhere).. This may even be the eventual, usable, option for Lynn?... :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 Hi All, thank you so much for all your efforts in helping us sort this out. Yes the table is the last one Pepe63 shows the pedestal is rigid and has to be removed & the table is very heavy - i think the piece that it then sits on to make the bed base has been a DIY job. I also believe the dealer knew this & also that the seats were damp as when we bought it the van was very warm inside. We were daft as we should have made them show us the how the lounge bed was made up & had we have known the problem of heavy table possible DIY piece we would not have bought it as we do want to take are grandchildren with us on occassion. Also are son wishes to use the van with his wife and children. We told the salesman all this when we were looking at the motorhome! Nonetheless we are stuck with it and as suggested by Brian are arranging to take the motorhome to EMM-BEE in Manchester so they can assess for us. I think we will probably consturct a structure as Pepe says - that is for the future when i'm hoping we can move forward. Big thanks and will keep you all posted - you have restored my faith in human nature Linda x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Well...*curiosity finally got the better of me and I've just been outside for a play-about with ours... :$ ..and although it's very awkward to do,once the cushions are pushed aside and the table/pedestal dismantled, it is fairly self explanatory on our set-up(..there are buffers on the underside of the table that just locate into holes on the ledges on the seat bases..). I still can't see where this "homemade" panel section would fit in though...so I can only assume that our layouts may differ slightly.... We have got what looks like a "leg"(1" x1" x 16" steel box section)with two spring-lug catches on the one end..no idea where that goes though?(..it may not even be anything to do with the bed?) * Although I'm afraid, I wasn't "curious" enough to get stuck into juggling about with all the cushions...So you're own you're own with them! (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 Hi Curious, yes there are two holes in the panels of ours - and the original DIY bit has a obvious shop bought bolt on it. To describe its a piece of chip board that has had laminate stuck on it, it has a round hollow piece on top of the piece, which when you remove the table pedestal is cut so as to fit on the base bit attached to the floor. Then you bolt into one of the holes, as above - this is the panel where the seat with 2 seat belts are located - this piece is about 3 foot and sits horizontally/and can tip or fall off! The hole on the other side of the van (its an L shape) as nothing to attach to! I think there are missing bits - fingers crossed the chausson dealers will know!!! Thank you Lynn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Hi (again). Reading your last post, I think I may have been getting the wrong end of the stick?... So is it the case that, when making the bed, this "chipboard panel" is intended to be used, "instead of" the table, ..and NOT "as well as"..? :-S If your "original" table is similar to the one in that earlier link, then doesn't it just span to (and locate on) the lips on the seat bases? (...as ours does). It could be that the previous owner didn't take the original table with them?(...and possibly just used a freestanding one, as we mentioned earlier?)..and maybe they just tried carrying this "panel" as a makeshift, "prototype" bed? (...unsuccessfully by the sounds of it!) Although, just to clarify, ours doesn't make up a "square" 6-7 ft double bed...the table just bridges between the two inward facing settees, with it's rear edge carried by the lip on the travel seats(..and this creates an "L" shaped bed ,with a large "cut out" by the habitation door). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 Hi our bed would be the same as you described on the end of your post - to create an L shaped bed with the table sitting on the 2 inward facing seat bases - there is a cut out by the habitation door. Would accomodate 2 children or 1 small adult. To describe when the seat cushions are removed there are the 2 inward facing seats as you describe with a hole on each at the lip, which the table sits on to make the bed base. The DIY piece is only about 6 inches wide x 3ft long and has a bolt on that bolts into one of the holes on the lips of the seat - then the table is placed on top of the DIY bit. However this only accounts for 1 hole on the lip being used and there is nothing in place to secure to the other seat lip hole? When you remove your pedestal and there is just the piece that is secured to the floor is there something there in place to put the table on to make the bed base secure? You couldn't just sit table on top it needs something to sit into? So sorry this is so confusing - and i do so appreciate the time you are taking to help us. Lynn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Right..let's see if these photos have loaded properly(..fingers crossed.....) 1: Should be the table in place. 2: Table dropped down(viewed from door area) 3: Underside of table mount(showing 1" plus gap between it and pedestal) 4: Table dropped down(viewed from rear) Although the table isn't supported in the middle when in "bed mode"(photo 3)it seems solid enough and doesn't tip or rock about at all...although it wouldn't take much to fashion a "packer"( or even a shorter pedestal tube?)if need be..... To be honest, having now assembled it twice today, it doesn't seem that much of a job anymore...(..although tatting about with all the cushions and bedding, would be a different matter though... ;-) ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 Hi - thank you so much for your pictures, which have helped so much. I think that DIY contraption we have has been designed to make the table more stable when its in bed mode. Your right a small length of tube would do the same in a less awkward way! We now have the problem of the damp cushions, which will have to be replace. You have been an Angel & i so apprecite. Lynn :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Glad we've partially sorted the bed out..and at least I know how ours goes together now(..although the mrs can sort out where the cushions go. (lol) ) As for your cushions...so have you been promised replacements then?..if you have, all well and good(..that is, when/if you actually get them!).. Unfortunately, all too often dealers will promise you all sorts...and then after months of the "..they should be in amongst the next delivery.."/"Oh!..we forgot to order them"/"...sorry, they've sent the wrong ones..", delaying tactics, you eventually get..."..they now tell us they don't make them anymore, mate!"... *-) As a back up plan, couldn't they just be professionally cleaned and dried?(...paid for by the dealer). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 pepe63 - 2014-01-09 4:33 PM As for your cushions...so have you been promised replacements then?..if you have, all well and good(..that is, when/if you actually get them!).. Unfortunately, all too often dealers will promise you all sorts...and then after months of the "..they should be in amongst the next delivery.."/"Oh!..we forgot to order them"/"...sorry, they've sent the wrong ones..", delaying tactics, you eventually get..."..they now tell us they don't make them anymore, mate!"... *-) As a back up plan, couldn't they just be professionally cleaned and dried?(...paid for by the dealer). Or get replacements made by the likes of Careavan Link and send the bill to the dealer! We can recommend their services if you choose to go this route. Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 Thank you Keith - they will have to be replaced and i will ensure that the dealer who sold us the van will foot the bill. You have all been so kind - mu husband sends his special thanks & we will keep everyone posted as to the outcome of this sorry tale. Just a shame we felt into the hands of this dealership, we used because they were close to home! ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 pepe63 - 2014-01-09 4:33 PM Glad we've partially sorted the bed out..and at least I know how ours goes together now(..although the mrs can sort out where the cushions go. (lol) ) As for your cushions...so have you been promised replacements then?..if you have, all well and good(..that is, when/if you actually get them!).. Unfortunately, all too often dealers will promise you all sorts...and then after months of the "..they should be in amongst the next delivery.."/"Oh!..we forgot to order them"/"...sorry, they've sent the wrong ones..", delaying tactics, you eventually get..."..they now tell us they don't make them anymore, mate!"... *-) As a back up plan, couldn't they just be professionally cleaned and dried?(...paid for by the dealer). Just one thing I don't understand. From Pepe's photos, it would appear the lowered table top is fully supported along two opposite edges, and from his description, that it has locating devices to prevent it sliding around. Why, then, is it unstable in this position? From what I have seen/read, it seems it should be completely stable. Is there actually a problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 Hi Brian, yes what Pepe says about a device from preventing it sliding is missing on our' - my son has spoken to Highbridges this morning and they confirm that the table is missing bits to make up the bed so as to be secure. Our seems to slide all over the place & there is nothing in situ to prevent this - a small child could get a hand or arm/leg etc trapped in it! We are waiting for Emm-Bee from Manchester to contact us back to arrange the assessment next week - we will also ensure they do a damp test as well given the wet seats. Thanks Brian Linda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Hello again.. As it's been confirmed by Highbridge that your bed has "missing bits", I can only assume that, as our set-up is stable (and appears "complete") "as is", then although similar, our tables/bed layouts must differ slightly?(....not unsurprising I suppose, as the vans are different models after all...). ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 It will be interesting to see what Highbridge provides. Chausson used this method of constructing an 'occasional' bed for quite a few years (I remember the 2004 Welcome 74 having it). As far as I'm aware, once the table-top has been placed on the ledges on the fronts of the seat bases, the only 'mechanical' things that retain it there are the "buffers" on the table's underside that pepe63 mentions in his 9 January 2014 11:30 AM posting. This is a pretty rudimentary way of constructing a bed and it needs to be accepted that Chausson will assume that, before the vehicle is driven, the bed will always be dismantled and the table-top replaced on its pedestal column. As long as there's something (be it ever so minimalstic) that prevents the table-top sliding about on the ledges, that should be enough for safety once the bed has been fully made up. As I've said before, when the seat-cushions have been shoe-horned together on the table-top's upper surface in the correct order, there should be little opportunity for the table-top to move around beneath. However, magazine articles on motorhomes with beds formed from multiple cushions indicate that it's often far from obvious how the cushions are meant to be positioned and/or which way up they should go (and there rarely seem to be instructions in the handbook). Supplementary cushions are sometimes needed to successfully construct an occasional bed, but aren't always passed on when a motorhome changes hands. (My 1st motorhome - a Herald - needed an extra cushion to make up one of its single lounge beds and the dealer who sold me the vehicle had to recover this from the previous owner who had stored the cushion in his loft and forgotten about it.) I doubt that will be so in this instance, but it's perhaps worth mentioning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 Hi Derek, Yes the table is like Pepe' only bigger but it seems the problem is that there are no buffers under the table as Pepe says are on his. I think that is why the DIY piece has been made by a previous owner? Thank you Lynn :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 peterlyn - 2014-01-10 3:10 PM Hi Derek, Yes the table is u like Pepe' only bigger but it seems the problem is that there are no buffers under the table as Pepe says are on his.... Mornin'... :-D In which "direction" is it bigger?...presumably it projects forward, beyond the seat bases then?..and this it why it tips...? If this is the case, I would've thought that there'd be tell-tale signs on the underside, which would point towards the use of detachable leg(s)/prop etc?.. Edit: Just had a thought!..It isn't supposed to be supported by the judicially positioned front seats by any chance? RE: "Buffers" Just to clarify, these are about 10mm dia and although they act as dowels, our table is so "snug", it probably wouldn't need these anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 pepe63 The difficulty in diagnosis is compounded by Chausson seemingly having used a variety of ways of mounting the table in Welcome 75s across the 2007-2009 period and not always fitting the same table-top. This advert is said to be for a 2008 Citroen-based Welcome 75. http://www.masters-france.com/annonces/product.php?id_product=2184 The table's pedestal seems to be like yours and Linda's but the table-top has a hinged section. Somewhat worryingly, there also seems to be a 'filler' cushion lying on the left-hand seat-base that might be needed when the bed is constructed. I very much doubt Chausson would have been 'clever' when using the table-top as a bed base. Consequently, if there are holes in the ledges on which the table-top sits, I'd expect there to be (as with your table) something on the underside of the table-top to fit into those holes. It would be worth Linda checking beneath the table-top edges if there are any signs of 'buffers' ever having been there. There are Welcome 75 layout drawings on-line, but none suggests that the cab seats are employed as part of the bed-making procedure. If the layout drawings accurately reflect the procedure, the table-top is just positioned so that two opposite edges are against the fronts of the left and right longitudinal settees, and a 3rd table-edge is against the front of the lateral banquette. Essentially, the table-top goes exactly where one would anticipate it should go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 11, 2014 Author Share Posted January 11, 2014 Hi Derek & Pepe, the motorhoeme table you have found is ours exactly! The problem with the table is that it does'nt fit snugly - and slides about and will actually tip up! There are no filler cushions but i do feel there needed hence finding two square cushions in the motorhome when we bought it. My son is up tomorrow and i will get him to look under the table to see if there is any evidence of previous buffers etc... To heavy for me and my husband to poorly to lift. I will keep you posted. Thank you so very much for all your help & support. Linda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterlyn Posted January 14, 2014 Author Share Posted January 14, 2014 Hi all, yes there are missing bits from the table (sent photo of top and bottom to chausson dealer by email) - chausson dealer thinks that the table we have is not the original and has sent details to chausson to find original. We will be taking the motorhome there later this week to test for damp etc... The plot continues.... Linda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Hi... Well...not having the original(correct?) table would cloud the issue slightly, wouldn't it... (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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