Brexit Leverage

[antony1969]

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 9:46 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 7:42 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 9:20 AM

pelmetman - 2017-11-24 8:18 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-23 6:57 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-23 3:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 6:40 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-21 4:53 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 11:19 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-20 5:57 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-20 5:34 PMThe concerns about food and hygiene are because EU law currently bans products such as Chlorine washed chicken or Hormone fed Beef from the likes of the USA and a whole host of other inferior guff they and the other countries outside the EU would gladly sell us.Once we leave farmers would face stiff competition from this kind of cheap rubbish from countries with lower standards than the UK unless we continue to adhere to the same EU standards and laws that have kept us all from dying of Salmonella and other diseases. We do however in the UK have some of the highest standards of animal welfare in the world and not just the EU but if we are going to see an influx of cheap, substandard and probably dangerous food from the US and God knows where with no EU regulation our home grown stuff will probably end up priced out of the market. As inflation increases and people get poorer as a result of Brexit (which they will) what are they going to opt for? Cheap and suspect or best of British?Hygiene laws and standards set by the EU for takeaways, restaurants etc have also seen a much more level playing field across Europe in recent years. I eat out a fair bit and get takeaways all over Europe and the standards are pretty good. They have to be now. Lets hope thats something else that doesnt slip if we leave the EU.

Are you suggesting we will have to buy chlorine washed chicken from the US once we've left the EU for some strange reason ??? 8-) and why would British food business lower any food standards once we've left the EU ... You like a nice doner kebab heated up again and again and again from a takeaway wherever that is ... Not a great advert for food hygiene ... Another wet argument for me

I am stating that at the moment we are protected from buying cheap and potentially dangerous food types because they are banned by EU law. If those bans are not maintained IF we leave then it opens the doors for cheap, inferior and dangerous food products from all over the world. Whilst our quality products can of course still be bought how long will it be before the cheaper and potentially dodgy stuff pushes them off the shelves. When inflation rises more and money gets tighter (Which it will) which Chicken is going to sell the best in Tescos? Free range fed on corn on the local farm for say a Tenner or some Chlorinated injected with god knows what filth for three quid? They will both look the same, which one is the person who is finding it all a bit of a struggle going to opt for?I do like a Kebab that is true and I feel pretty safe buying one anywhere within the EU as there are strict hygiene and sourcing standards in place and touch wood ive not had a dodgy one yet.

Sorry  Barry but whilst I agree there are EU standards the UK also had/has it's own.  The country is not so backward that we can not formulate our own protections.  However to your claim that EU law is protecting us from dangerous/dodgy foodstuffs it didn't do such a great job in recent years with the number of horse meat in the food chain scandals did it?  

The following might be of interest to you especially the last para in bold:

From the FT.....Feb 2013.

An emerging scandal about illicit horsemeat found in processed foods has raised questions about whether European regulators are capable of coping with an industry whose ingredients and subcontractors increasingly cross national borders.

The EU has developed a food safety system in the wake of the mad cow crisis in the 1990s that emphasises the ability to trace meats back to their source and co-operation between national safety regulators.

Yet that system has been tested in recent years by a string of scandals that reveal the increasingly complex nature of food industry supply chains. In one case, contaminated animal feed in Germany led to scares about dioxin-contaminated eggs and pastries in the UK. In another, far more serious incident, 22 people were killed and more than 2,000 sickened in 2011 by beansprouts thought to have originated in Egypt.

German health officials wrongly pointed the finger at Spanish farmers, causing hundreds-of-millions of euros in losses, and a Russian trade ban, before the case was eventually solved.

Laws are all well and good if monitored and enforced

I am not saying its perfect but the fact remains outside of the EU we wont be protected at all as regards banned products and the sub standard stuff the likes of the US are willing to feed us. Its much more complex than just standards though (there are 4,500 or so EU regulations covering food, farming and environmental standards). The UK food and drink industry is our largest remaining manufacturing sector, bigger than the car and aerospace sectors combined! We only eat half of what we produce though and depend on those standards to be able to export and sell within our biggest market which is of course EUROPE! However 55% of farming income is derived from EU Subsidies and whats more much of it is dependent on EU workers. Can you see where I am going with this yet? :-D We could be in a position soon where there are no strict standards (Assuming there is a free trade deal anyway and a route to market) but we dont meet the requirements anymore for our market place but it could all be hypothetical anyway if there are no workers to produce the blooming food in the first place!All this could lead us to not being able to export anything and having to accept sub standard rubbish from the USA and who knows where else.The entire food sector, its relationship with the EU, our countryside even is at stake here and its way more complex than the Brexiteers thought but then again it all is. :-(

For goodness sake can't you see anything apart from your totally focused view of the EU provides all??

Do you honestly believe that the UK has not got the wherewithall to maintain it's own food standards agency?  Considering this country has been implementing food safety laws since 1266 I really don't think we need overly concern ourselves that we won't be able to control things without  'Daddy' EU holding our hand.

I Think what you will find is "Taking back control" means the current shower of sh1t government doing away with standards and laws that have been put in place by the EU to protect us all because they have been instructed to do so by their bessy mates who are the ones really running the show and the powers behind Brexit. Its happening already with the decision the other day to do away with animal rights. Environmental laws will be next and just wait until they start on workers rights. The lowering of food standards will happen because as they try desperately to cosy up to the like of Trump and the good ole USA they will insist on it. Once that happens of course most of our stuff will end up banned or under strict scrutiny when we try and export it to our nearest neighbours 22 miles away. Its like I said, way more complex than any of you Brexiteers thought or were led to believe.

You really need to do some research Barry *-) .........The UK's animal husbandry standards have led the way in Europe ;-) ........So I suspect if any ones standards slip after BREXIT......it will be the EU's not ours *-) .......

Barry's now telling us that nasty POTUS Trump will flood poor defenceless Britian with nasty chickens when he stitches us up with a trade deal ... Don't know bowt anyone else but my meat says British on it ... If Barry's forecast is correct just buy British meat ... Even a dumb ass Brexit voter can just about manage that

I am sure you will be able to carry on buying the best of British Antony. Your wealthy. I dare say it will cost you a lot more but I suspect that wont bother you or me to be honest. We are probably both in the top 5% of wealth in the UK, probably most of us on here are. Ok thats an assumption based on the fact that we all own motorhomes and seem to have a pretty good lifestyle. When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?) the poor sods who were mainly the ones that were duped into voting out having been told it would be an answer to all their problems will be the ones having to eat it. Standards are already slipping with Shrinkflation and inferior ingredients in an attempt to disguise rising prices. That is only going to get worse.As for animal rights, I will actually say the EU does not have the greatest record but the fact remains the Tories have already said they are doing away with those laws and animals other than domestic pets according to them no longer feel pain or have emotions. Why do you think that is? ITs all part of the preparation for their new order which is to purely serve their Brexit Lords and masters and maximise profits regardless of the loss of care for animals. You watch, employment and human rights will be next. I guarantee it.

You really need to read up on those animal rights before you carry on using at a beating stick Barry ... What has wealth got to do with buying British meat produce ??? ... You bang on about coming out of the EU will affect animals rights but yet you enjoy kebabs supplied by Halal slaughter , Im struggling Barry your guna have to explain it to fick old Brexit me

I have the odd Chicken kebab. Its probably not even Chicken! I have no idea where all the stuff I eat or scoff is sourced from or how its killed. Who does?The point I am making is there can be no other reason for doing away with animal rights laws than profit. Lowering standards to allow in inferior and potentially dangerous products from the USA and other none EU countries can be for no other reason than to appease our so called new trade partners and to increase profits and its the "little people" As you like to call them that will end up scoffing it and our animals that will suffer. I Dont understand why anyone would support that Brexiteer or not really.

You have no idea where the stuff you eat is sourced or how its killed or even like you say if the chicken is chicken ... So your animal rights campaign is fairly selective then ... I said yesterday you need to read up on the supposed lowering of animal standards because its not happening ... If and its more than a big if but if POTUS Trump demands little old us takes in chickens from the US that will clearly be labelled from the US and you don't want to eat US chicken then buy a clearly marked British chicken and I do believe that the vast majority of folk whoever they vote for in this country would not allow any lowering of standards when it comes to animals ... Sorry but its another Barry EU scare story ... Your the forums very own Alistair Campbell ... If your not too busy arranging for your new refugee guests arrival at Barry Towers then maybe you should devote some time to campaigning against real animal cruelty ... https://twitter.com/JaydaBF/status/934023915743129600

[Guest pelmetman]

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

 

 

When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?)

 

 

Funnily enough we were advised by our SIL when she got back from France to stock up on butter "before" we left........as their shelves were bare ;-) ........

 

Now explain how that is BREXIT's fault please? >:-) ........

 

Another positive of BREXIT will be our ability to prevent the import of from Eastern European and Irish puppy farms.....and about bleedin time to >:-( ..........

 

 

[Barryd999]

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 6:44 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 9:46 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 7:42 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 9:20 AM

pelmetman - 2017-11-24 8:18 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-23 6:57 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-23 3:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 6:40 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-21 4:53 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 11:19 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-20 5:57 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-20 5:34 PMThe concerns about food and hygiene are because EU law currently bans products such as Chlorine washed chicken or Hormone fed Beef from the likes of the USA and a whole host of other inferior guff they and the other countries outside the EU would gladly sell us.Once we leave farmers would face stiff competition from this kind of cheap rubbish from countries with lower standards than the UK unless we continue to adhere to the same EU standards and laws that have kept us all from dying of Salmonella and other diseases. We do however in the UK have some of the highest standards of animal welfare in the world and not just the EU but if we are going to see an influx of cheap, substandard and probably dangerous food from the US and God knows where with no EU regulation our home grown stuff will probably end up priced out of the market. As inflation increases and people get poorer as a result of Brexit (which they will) what are they going to opt for? Cheap and suspect or best of British?Hygiene laws and standards set by the EU for takeaways, restaurants etc have also seen a much more level playing field across Europe in recent years. I eat out a fair bit and get takeaways all over Europe and the standards are pretty good. They have to be now. Lets hope thats something else that doesnt slip if we leave the EU.

Are you suggesting we will have to buy chlorine washed chicken from the US once we've left the EU for some strange reason ??? 8-) and why would British food business lower any food standards once we've left the EU ... You like a nice doner kebab heated up again and again and again from a takeaway wherever that is ... Not a great advert for food hygiene ... Another wet argument for me

I am stating that at the moment we are protected from buying cheap and potentially dangerous food types because they are banned by EU law. If those bans are not maintained IF we leave then it opens the doors for cheap, inferior and dangerous food products from all over the world. Whilst our quality products can of course still be bought how long will it be before the cheaper and potentially dodgy stuff pushes them off the shelves. When inflation rises more and money gets tighter (Which it will) which Chicken is going to sell the best in Tescos? Free range fed on corn on the local farm for say a Tenner or some Chlorinated injected with god knows what filth for three quid? They will both look the same, which one is the person who is finding it all a bit of a struggle going to opt for?I do like a Kebab that is true and I feel pretty safe buying one anywhere within the EU as there are strict hygiene and sourcing standards in place and touch wood ive not had a dodgy one yet.

Sorry  Barry but whilst I agree there are EU standards the UK also had/has it's own.  The country is not so backward that we can not formulate our own protections.  However to your claim that EU law is protecting us from dangerous/dodgy foodstuffs it didn't do such a great job in recent years with the number of horse meat in the food chain scandals did it?  

The following might be of interest to you especially the last para in bold:

From the FT.....Feb 2013.

An emerging scandal about illicit horsemeat found in processed foods has raised questions about whether European regulators are capable of coping with an industry whose ingredients and subcontractors increasingly cross national borders.

The EU has developed a food safety system in the wake of the mad cow crisis in the 1990s that emphasises the ability to trace meats back to their source and co-operation between national safety regulators.

Yet that system has been tested in recent years by a string of scandals that reveal the increasingly complex nature of food industry supply chains. In one case, contaminated animal feed in Germany led to scares about dioxin-contaminated eggs and pastries in the UK. In another, far more serious incident, 22 people were killed and more than 2,000 sickened in 2011 by beansprouts thought to have originated in Egypt.

German health officials wrongly pointed the finger at Spanish farmers, causing hundreds-of-millions of euros in losses, and a Russian trade ban, before the case was eventually solved.

Laws are all well and good if monitored and enforced

I am not saying its perfect but the fact remains outside of the EU we wont be protected at all as regards banned products and the sub standard stuff the likes of the US are willing to feed us. Its much more complex than just standards though (there are 4,500 or so EU regulations covering food, farming and environmental standards). The UK food and drink industry is our largest remaining manufacturing sector, bigger than the car and aerospace sectors combined! We only eat half of what we produce though and depend on those standards to be able to export and sell within our biggest market which is of course EUROPE! However 55% of farming income is derived from EU Subsidies and whats more much of it is dependent on EU workers. Can you see where I am going with this yet? :-D We could be in a position soon where there are no strict standards (Assuming there is a free trade deal anyway and a route to market) but we dont meet the requirements anymore for our market place but it could all be hypothetical anyway if there are no workers to produce the blooming food in the first place!All this could lead us to not being able to export anything and having to accept sub standard rubbish from the USA and who knows where else.The entire food sector, its relationship with the EU, our countryside even is at stake here and its way more complex than the Brexiteers thought but then again it all is. :-(

For goodness sake can't you see anything apart from your totally focused view of the EU provides all??

Do you honestly believe that the UK has not got the wherewithall to maintain it's own food standards agency?  Considering this country has been implementing food safety laws since 1266 I really don't think we need overly concern ourselves that we won't be able to control things without  'Daddy' EU holding our hand.

I Think what you will find is "Taking back control" means the current shower of sh1t government doing away with standards and laws that have been put in place by the EU to protect us all because they have been instructed to do so by their bessy mates who are the ones really running the show and the powers behind Brexit. Its happening already with the decision the other day to do away with animal rights. Environmental laws will be next and just wait until they start on workers rights. The lowering of food standards will happen because as they try desperately to cosy up to the like of Trump and the good ole USA they will insist on it. Once that happens of course most of our stuff will end up banned or under strict scrutiny when we try and export it to our nearest neighbours 22 miles away. Its like I said, way more complex than any of you Brexiteers thought or were led to believe.

You really need to do some research Barry *-) .........The UK's animal husbandry standards have led the way in Europe ;-) ........So I suspect if any ones standards slip after BREXIT......it will be the EU's not ours *-) .......

Barry's now telling us that nasty POTUS Trump will flood poor defenceless Britian with nasty chickens when he stitches us up with a trade deal ... Don't know bowt anyone else but my meat says British on it ... If Barry's forecast is correct just buy British meat ... Even a dumb ass Brexit voter can just about manage that

I am sure you will be able to carry on buying the best of British Antony. Your wealthy. I dare say it will cost you a lot more but I suspect that wont bother you or me to be honest. We are probably both in the top 5% of wealth in the UK, probably most of us on here are. Ok thats an assumption based on the fact that we all own motorhomes and seem to have a pretty good lifestyle. When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?) the poor sods who were mainly the ones that were duped into voting out having been told it would be an answer to all their problems will be the ones having to eat it. Standards are already slipping with Shrinkflation and inferior ingredients in an attempt to disguise rising prices. That is only going to get worse.As for animal rights, I will actually say the EU does not have the greatest record but the fact remains the Tories have already said they are doing away with those laws and animals other than domestic pets according to them no longer feel pain or have emotions. Why do you think that is? ITs all part of the preparation for their new order which is to purely serve their Brexit Lords and masters and maximise profits regardless of the loss of care for animals. You watch, employment and human rights will be next. I guarantee it.

You really need to read up on those animal rights before you carry on using at a beating stick Barry ... What has wealth got to do with buying British meat produce ??? ... You bang on about coming out of the EU will affect animals rights but yet you enjoy kebabs supplied by Halal slaughter , Im struggling Barry your guna have to explain it to fick old Brexit me

I have the odd Chicken kebab. Its probably not even Chicken! I have no idea where all the stuff I eat or scoff is sourced from or how its killed. Who does?The point I am making is there can be no other reason for doing away with animal rights laws than profit. Lowering standards to allow in inferior and potentially dangerous products from the USA and other none EU countries can be for no other reason than to appease our so called new trade partners and to increase profits and its the "little people" As you like to call them that will end up scoffing it and our animals that will suffer. I Dont understand why anyone would support that Brexiteer or not really.

You have no idea where the stuff you eat is sourced or how its killed or even like you say if the chicken is chicken ... So your animal rights campaign is fairly selective then ... I said yesterday you need to read up on the supposed lowering of animal standards because its not happening ... If and its more than a big if but if POTUS Trump demands little old us takes in chickens from the US that will clearly be labelled from the US and you don't want to eat US chicken then buy a clearly marked British chicken and I do believe that the vast majority of folk whoever they vote for in this country would not allow any lowering of standards when it comes to animals ... Sorry but its another Barry EU scare story ... Your the forums very own Alistair Campbell ... If your not too busy arranging for your new refugee guests arrival at Barry Towers then maybe you should devote some time to campaigning against real animal cruelty ... https://twitter.com/JaydaBF/status/934023915743129600

Isnt it? https://www.farminguk.com/news/MPs-vote-to-reject-inclusion-of-animal-sentience-in-Withdrawal-Bill_47923.htmlYour still missing the point regarding dodgy food that will appear on our shelves. Yes there will be choice but at what cost? What are those who are less well off going to chose. A £2.99 product thats potentially dangerous or a £10 british product?

[Barryd999]

pelmetman - 2017-11-25 8:38 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

 

 

When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?)

 

 

Funnily enough we were advised by our SIL when she got back from France to stock up on butter "before" we left........as their shelves were bare ;-) ........

 

Now explain how that is BREXIT's fault please? >:-) ........

 

Another positive of BREXIT will be our ability to prevent the import of from Eastern European and Irish puppy farms.....and about bleedin time to >:-( ..........

 

 

I agree with that last statement Dave. Dairy is at a record high since Brexit because of the way its priced and the weak pound but also combined with an increase in demand, a perfect dairy storm!

[Guest pelmetman]

Barryd999 - 2017-11-25 10:27 AM

 

pelmetman - 2017-11-25 8:38 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

 

 

When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?)

 

 

Funnily enough we were advised by our SIL when she got back from France to stock up on butter "before" we left........as their shelves were bare ;-) ........

 

Now explain how that is BREXIT's fault please? >:-) ........

 

Another positive of BREXIT will be our ability to prevent the import of from Eastern European and Irish puppy farms.....and about bleedin time to >:-( ..........

 

 

I agree with that last statement Dave. Dairy is at a record high since Brexit because of the way its priced and the weak pound but also combined with an increase in demand, a perfect dairy storm!

 

Eh? how does a weak pound make butter produced in the UK using British milk, from cows fed on British grass, make it more expensive? :-S .......

 

The reason its more expensive .......Is because of supply & demand ;-) .........

 

From countries like China due to its dodgy food scandals and Qatar due to its trade embargo with its neighbours are helping fuel demand for EU dairy NOT BREXIT *-) .......

 

Your be telling us next its snowing because of BREXIT (lol) ........

 

 

 

 

[antony1969]

Barryd999 - 2017-11-25 10:22 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 6:44 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 9:46 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 7:42 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 9:20 AM

pelmetman - 2017-11-24 8:18 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-23 6:57 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-23 3:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 6:40 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-21 4:53 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 11:19 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-20 5:57 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-20 5:34 PMThe concerns about food and hygiene are because EU law currently bans products such as Chlorine washed chicken or Hormone fed Beef from the likes of the USA and a whole host of other inferior guff they and the other countries outside the EU would gladly sell us.Once we leave farmers would face stiff competition from this kind of cheap rubbish from countries with lower standards than the UK unless we continue to adhere to the same EU standards and laws that have kept us all from dying of Salmonella and other diseases. We do however in the UK have some of the highest standards of animal welfare in the world and not just the EU but if we are going to see an influx of cheap, substandard and probably dangerous food from the US and God knows where with no EU regulation our home grown stuff will probably end up priced out of the market. As inflation increases and people get poorer as a result of Brexit (which they will) what are they going to opt for? Cheap and suspect or best of British?Hygiene laws and standards set by the EU for takeaways, restaurants etc have also seen a much more level playing field across Europe in recent years. I eat out a fair bit and get takeaways all over Europe and the standards are pretty good. They have to be now. Lets hope thats something else that doesnt slip if we leave the EU.

Are you suggesting we will have to buy chlorine washed chicken from the US once we've left the EU for some strange reason ??? 8-) and why would British food business lower any food standards once we've left the EU ... You like a nice doner kebab heated up again and again and again from a takeaway wherever that is ... Not a great advert for food hygiene ... Another wet argument for me

I am stating that at the moment we are protected from buying cheap and potentially dangerous food types because they are banned by EU law. If those bans are not maintained IF we leave then it opens the doors for cheap, inferior and dangerous food products from all over the world. Whilst our quality products can of course still be bought how long will it be before the cheaper and potentially dodgy stuff pushes them off the shelves. When inflation rises more and money gets tighter (Which it will) which Chicken is going to sell the best in Tescos? Free range fed on corn on the local farm for say a Tenner or some Chlorinated injected with god knows what filth for three quid? They will both look the same, which one is the person who is finding it all a bit of a struggle going to opt for?I do like a Kebab that is true and I feel pretty safe buying one anywhere within the EU as there are strict hygiene and sourcing standards in place and touch wood ive not had a dodgy one yet.

Sorry  Barry but whilst I agree there are EU standards the UK also had/has it's own.  The country is not so backward that we can not formulate our own protections.  However to your claim that EU law is protecting us from dangerous/dodgy foodstuffs it didn't do such a great job in recent years with the number of horse meat in the food chain scandals did it?  

The following might be of interest to you especially the last para in bold:

From the FT.....Feb 2013.

An emerging scandal about illicit horsemeat found in processed foods has raised questions about whether European regulators are capable of coping with an industry whose ingredients and subcontractors increasingly cross national borders.

The EU has developed a food safety system in the wake of the mad cow crisis in the 1990s that emphasises the ability to trace meats back to their source and co-operation between national safety regulators.

Yet that system has been tested in recent years by a string of scandals that reveal the increasingly complex nature of food industry supply chains. In one case, contaminated animal feed in Germany led to scares about dioxin-contaminated eggs and pastries in the UK. In another, far more serious incident, 22 people were killed and more than 2,000 sickened in 2011 by beansprouts thought to have originated in Egypt.

German health officials wrongly pointed the finger at Spanish farmers, causing hundreds-of-millions of euros in losses, and a Russian trade ban, before the case was eventually solved.

Laws are all well and good if monitored and enforced

I am not saying its perfect but the fact remains outside of the EU we wont be protected at all as regards banned products and the sub standard stuff the likes of the US are willing to feed us. Its much more complex than just standards though (there are 4,500 or so EU regulations covering food, farming and environmental standards). The UK food and drink industry is our largest remaining manufacturing sector, bigger than the car and aerospace sectors combined! We only eat half of what we produce though and depend on those standards to be able to export and sell within our biggest market which is of course EUROPE! However 55% of farming income is derived from EU Subsidies and whats more much of it is dependent on EU workers. Can you see where I am going with this yet? :-D We could be in a position soon where there are no strict standards (Assuming there is a free trade deal anyway and a route to market) but we dont meet the requirements anymore for our market place but it could all be hypothetical anyway if there are no workers to produce the blooming food in the first place!All this could lead us to not being able to export anything and having to accept sub standard rubbish from the USA and who knows where else.The entire food sector, its relationship with the EU, our countryside even is at stake here and its way more complex than the Brexiteers thought but then again it all is. :-(

For goodness sake can't you see anything apart from your totally focused view of the EU provides all??

Do you honestly believe that the UK has not got the wherewithall to maintain it's own food standards agency?  Considering this country has been implementing food safety laws since 1266 I really don't think we need overly concern ourselves that we won't be able to control things without  'Daddy' EU holding our hand.

I Think what you will find is "Taking back control" means the current shower of sh1t government doing away with standards and laws that have been put in place by the EU to protect us all because they have been instructed to do so by their bessy mates who are the ones really running the show and the powers behind Brexit. Its happening already with the decision the other day to do away with animal rights. Environmental laws will be next and just wait until they start on workers rights. The lowering of food standards will happen because as they try desperately to cosy up to the like of Trump and the good ole USA they will insist on it. Once that happens of course most of our stuff will end up banned or under strict scrutiny when we try and export it to our nearest neighbours 22 miles away. Its like I said, way more complex than any of you Brexiteers thought or were led to believe.

You really need to do some research Barry *-) .........The UK's animal husbandry standards have led the way in Europe ;-) ........So I suspect if any ones standards slip after BREXIT......it will be the EU's not ours *-) .......

Barry's now telling us that nasty POTUS Trump will flood poor defenceless Britian with nasty chickens when he stitches us up with a trade deal ... Don't know bowt anyone else but my meat says British on it ... If Barry's forecast is correct just buy British meat ... Even a dumb ass Brexit voter can just about manage that

I am sure you will be able to carry on buying the best of British Antony. Your wealthy. I dare say it will cost you a lot more but I suspect that wont bother you or me to be honest. We are probably both in the top 5% of wealth in the UK, probably most of us on here are. Ok thats an assumption based on the fact that we all own motorhomes and seem to have a pretty good lifestyle. When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?) the poor sods who were mainly the ones that were duped into voting out having been told it would be an answer to all their problems will be the ones having to eat it. Standards are already slipping with Shrinkflation and inferior ingredients in an attempt to disguise rising prices. That is only going to get worse.As for animal rights, I will actually say the EU does not have the greatest record but the fact remains the Tories have already said they are doing away with those laws and animals other than domestic pets according to them no longer feel pain or have emotions. Why do you think that is? ITs all part of the preparation for their new order which is to purely serve their Brexit Lords and masters and maximise profits regardless of the loss of care for animals. You watch, employment and human rights will be next. I guarantee it.

You really need to read up on those animal rights before you carry on using at a beating stick Barry ... What has wealth got to do with buying British meat produce ??? ... You bang on about coming out of the EU will affect animals rights but yet you enjoy kebabs supplied by Halal slaughter , Im struggling Barry your guna have to explain it to fick old Brexit me

I have the odd Chicken kebab. Its probably not even Chicken! I have no idea where all the stuff I eat or scoff is sourced from or how its killed. Who does?The point I am making is there can be no other reason for doing away with animal rights laws than profit. Lowering standards to allow in inferior and potentially dangerous products from the USA and other none EU countries can be for no other reason than to appease our so called new trade partners and to increase profits and its the "little people" As you like to call them that will end up scoffing it and our animals that will suffer. I Dont understand why anyone would support that Brexiteer or not really.

You have no idea where the stuff you eat is sourced or how its killed or even like you say if the chicken is chicken ... So your animal rights campaign is fairly selective then ... I said yesterday you need to read up on the supposed lowering of animal standards because its not happening ... If and its more than a big if but if POTUS Trump demands little old us takes in chickens from the US that will clearly be labelled from the US and you don't want to eat US chicken then buy a clearly marked British chicken and I do believe that the vast majority of folk whoever they vote for in this country would not allow any lowering of standards when it comes to animals ... Sorry but its another Barry EU scare story ... Your the forums very own Alistair Campbell ... If your not too busy arranging for your new refugee guests arrival at Barry Towers then maybe you should devote some time to campaigning against real animal cruelty ... https://twitter.com/JaydaBF/status/934023915743129600

Isnt it? https://www.farminguk.com/news/MPs-vote-to-reject-inclusion-of-animal-sentience-in-Withdrawal-Bill_47923.htmlYour still missing the point regarding dodgy food that will appear on our shelves. Yes there will be choice but at what cost? What are those who are less well off going to chose. A £2.99 product thats potentially dangerous or a £10 british product?

Government says its all covered by the 2006 act ... I would imagine that act is available to read somewhere ... If you want to read the act and then compare to the EU legislation and tell me whats missing then I will gladly say your right ... Dodgy food isn't going to end up on our shelves is it anymore than its already available ... Who in their right mind wether your a remain or leave voter would stand for such change to food and animal welfare ... If your trying to say chickens are going to go from £3 to £10 your mad ... Your concerned about animal welfare but ignore Halal killing and tuck into chicken kebabs without a second thought ... Your argument isn't an argument

[Barryd999]

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 11:58 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-25 10:22 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 6:44 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 9:46 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 7:42 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 9:20 AM

pelmetman - 2017-11-24 8:18 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-23 6:57 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-23 3:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 6:40 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-21 4:53 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 11:19 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-20 5:57 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-20 5:34 PMThe concerns about food and hygiene are because EU law currently bans products such as Chlorine washed chicken or Hormone fed Beef from the likes of the USA and a whole host of other inferior guff they and the other countries outside the EU would gladly sell us.Once we leave farmers would face stiff competition from this kind of cheap rubbish from countries with lower standards than the UK unless we continue to adhere to the same EU standards and laws that have kept us all from dying of Salmonella and other diseases. We do however in the UK have some of the highest standards of animal welfare in the world and not just the EU but if we are going to see an influx of cheap, substandard and probably dangerous food from the US and God knows where with no EU regulation our home grown stuff will probably end up priced out of the market. As inflation increases and people get poorer as a result of Brexit (which they will) what are they going to opt for? Cheap and suspect or best of British?Hygiene laws and standards set by the EU for takeaways, restaurants etc have also seen a much more level playing field across Europe in recent years. I eat out a fair bit and get takeaways all over Europe and the standards are pretty good. They have to be now. Lets hope thats something else that doesnt slip if we leave the EU.

Are you suggesting we will have to buy chlorine washed chicken from the US once we've left the EU for some strange reason ??? 8-) and why would British food business lower any food standards once we've left the EU ... You like a nice doner kebab heated up again and again and again from a takeaway wherever that is ... Not a great advert for food hygiene ... Another wet argument for me

I am stating that at the moment we are protected from buying cheap and potentially dangerous food types because they are banned by EU law. If those bans are not maintained IF we leave then it opens the doors for cheap, inferior and dangerous food products from all over the world. Whilst our quality products can of course still be bought how long will it be before the cheaper and potentially dodgy stuff pushes them off the shelves. When inflation rises more and money gets tighter (Which it will) which Chicken is going to sell the best in Tescos? Free range fed on corn on the local farm for say a Tenner or some Chlorinated injected with god knows what filth for three quid? They will both look the same, which one is the person who is finding it all a bit of a struggle going to opt for?I do like a Kebab that is true and I feel pretty safe buying one anywhere within the EU as there are strict hygiene and sourcing standards in place and touch wood ive not had a dodgy one yet.

Sorry  Barry but whilst I agree there are EU standards the UK also had/has it's own.  The country is not so backward that we can not formulate our own protections.  However to your claim that EU law is protecting us from dangerous/dodgy foodstuffs it didn't do such a great job in recent years with the number of horse meat in the food chain scandals did it?  

The following might be of interest to you especially the last para in bold:

From the FT.....Feb 2013.

An emerging scandal about illicit horsemeat found in processed foods has raised questions about whether European regulators are capable of coping with an industry whose ingredients and subcontractors increasingly cross national borders.

The EU has developed a food safety system in the wake of the mad cow crisis in the 1990s that emphasises the ability to trace meats back to their source and co-operation between national safety regulators.

Yet that system has been tested in recent years by a string of scandals that reveal the increasingly complex nature of food industry supply chains. In one case, contaminated animal feed in Germany led to scares about dioxin-contaminated eggs and pastries in the UK. In another, far more serious incident, 22 people were killed and more than 2,000 sickened in 2011 by beansprouts thought to have originated in Egypt.

German health officials wrongly pointed the finger at Spanish farmers, causing hundreds-of-millions of euros in losses, and a Russian trade ban, before the case was eventually solved.

Laws are all well and good if monitored and enforced

I am not saying its perfect but the fact remains outside of the EU we wont be protected at all as regards banned products and the sub standard stuff the likes of the US are willing to feed us. Its much more complex than just standards though (there are 4,500 or so EU regulations covering food, farming and environmental standards). The UK food and drink industry is our largest remaining manufacturing sector, bigger than the car and aerospace sectors combined! We only eat half of what we produce though and depend on those standards to be able to export and sell within our biggest market which is of course EUROPE! However 55% of farming income is derived from EU Subsidies and whats more much of it is dependent on EU workers. Can you see where I am going with this yet? :-D We could be in a position soon where there are no strict standards (Assuming there is a free trade deal anyway and a route to market) but we dont meet the requirements anymore for our market place but it could all be hypothetical anyway if there are no workers to produce the blooming food in the first place!All this could lead us to not being able to export anything and having to accept sub standard rubbish from the USA and who knows where else.The entire food sector, its relationship with the EU, our countryside even is at stake here and its way more complex than the Brexiteers thought but then again it all is. :-(

For goodness sake can't you see anything apart from your totally focused view of the EU provides all??

Do you honestly believe that the UK has not got the wherewithall to maintain it's own food standards agency?  Considering this country has been implementing food safety laws since 1266 I really don't think we need overly concern ourselves that we won't be able to control things without  'Daddy' EU holding our hand.

I Think what you will find is "Taking back control" means the current shower of sh1t government doing away with standards and laws that have been put in place by the EU to protect us all because they have been instructed to do so by their bessy mates who are the ones really running the show and the powers behind Brexit. Its happening already with the decision the other day to do away with animal rights. Environmental laws will be next and just wait until they start on workers rights. The lowering of food standards will happen because as they try desperately to cosy up to the like of Trump and the good ole USA they will insist on it. Once that happens of course most of our stuff will end up banned or under strict scrutiny when we try and export it to our nearest neighbours 22 miles away. Its like I said, way more complex than any of you Brexiteers thought or were led to believe.

You really need to do some research Barry *-) .........The UK's animal husbandry standards have led the way in Europe ;-) ........So I suspect if any ones standards slip after BREXIT......it will be the EU's not ours *-) .......

Barry's now telling us that nasty POTUS Trump will flood poor defenceless Britian with nasty chickens when he stitches us up with a trade deal ... Don't know bowt anyone else but my meat says British on it ... If Barry's forecast is correct just buy British meat ... Even a dumb ass Brexit voter can just about manage that

I am sure you will be able to carry on buying the best of British Antony. Your wealthy. I dare say it will cost you a lot more but I suspect that wont bother you or me to be honest. We are probably both in the top 5% of wealth in the UK, probably most of us on here are. Ok thats an assumption based on the fact that we all own motorhomes and seem to have a pretty good lifestyle. When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?) the poor sods who were mainly the ones that were duped into voting out having been told it would be an answer to all their problems will be the ones having to eat it. Standards are already slipping with Shrinkflation and inferior ingredients in an attempt to disguise rising prices. That is only going to get worse.As for animal rights, I will actually say the EU does not have the greatest record but the fact remains the Tories have already said they are doing away with those laws and animals other than domestic pets according to them no longer feel pain or have emotions. Why do you think that is? ITs all part of the preparation for their new order which is to purely serve their Brexit Lords and masters and maximise profits regardless of the loss of care for animals. You watch, employment and human rights will be next. I guarantee it.

You really need to read up on those animal rights before you carry on using at a beating stick Barry ... What has wealth got to do with buying British meat produce ??? ... You bang on about coming out of the EU will affect animals rights but yet you enjoy kebabs supplied by Halal slaughter , Im struggling Barry your guna have to explain it to fick old Brexit me

I have the odd Chicken kebab. Its probably not even Chicken! I have no idea where all the stuff I eat or scoff is sourced from or how its killed. Who does?The point I am making is there can be no other reason for doing away with animal rights laws than profit. Lowering standards to allow in inferior and potentially dangerous products from the USA and other none EU countries can be for no other reason than to appease our so called new trade partners and to increase profits and its the "little people" As you like to call them that will end up scoffing it and our animals that will suffer. I Dont understand why anyone would support that Brexiteer or not really.

You have no idea where the stuff you eat is sourced or how its killed or even like you say if the chicken is chicken ... So your animal rights campaign is fairly selective then ... I said yesterday you need to read up on the supposed lowering of animal standards because its not happening ... If and its more than a big if but if POTUS Trump demands little old us takes in chickens from the US that will clearly be labelled from the US and you don't want to eat US chicken then buy a clearly marked British chicken and I do believe that the vast majority of folk whoever they vote for in this country would not allow any lowering of standards when it comes to animals ... Sorry but its another Barry EU scare story ... Your the forums very own Alistair Campbell ... If your not too busy arranging for your new refugee guests arrival at Barry Towers then maybe you should devote some time to campaigning against real animal cruelty ... https://twitter.com/JaydaBF/status/934023915743129600

Isnt it? https://www.farminguk.com/news/MPs-vote-to-reject-inclusion-of-animal-sentience-in-Withdrawal-Bill_47923.htmlYour still missing the point regarding dodgy food that will appear on our shelves. Yes there will be choice but at what cost? What are those who are less well off going to chose. A £2.99 product thats potentially dangerous or a £10 british product?

Government says its all covered by the 2006 act ... I would imagine that act is available to read somewhere ... If you want to read the act and then compare to the EU legislation and tell me whats missing then I will gladly say your right ... Dodgy food isn't going to end up on our shelves is it anymore than its already available ... Who in their right mind wether your a remain or leave voter would stand for such change to food and animal welfare ... If your trying to say chickens are going to go from £3 to £10 your mad ... Your concerned about animal welfare but ignore Halal killing and tuck into chicken kebabs without a second thought ... Your argument isn't an argument

The 2006 act only covers domestic animals not livestock. Of course products like free range good old British chickens will go up in price because they will be competing with sh!te of a much lower standard which are currently banned in the UK under EU law.

[antony1969]

Barryd999 - 2017-11-26 11:52 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 11:58 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-25 10:22 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 6:44 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 9:46 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 7:42 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 9:20 AM

pelmetman - 2017-11-24 8:18 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-23 6:57 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-23 3:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 6:40 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-21 4:53 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 11:19 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-20 5:57 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-20 5:34 PMThe concerns about food and hygiene are because EU law currently bans products such as Chlorine washed chicken or Hormone fed Beef from the likes of the USA and a whole host of other inferior guff they and the other countries outside the EU would gladly sell us.Once we leave farmers would face stiff competition from this kind of cheap rubbish from countries with lower standards than the UK unless we continue to adhere to the same EU standards and laws that have kept us all from dying of Salmonella and other diseases. We do however in the UK have some of the highest standards of animal welfare in the world and not just the EU but if we are going to see an influx of cheap, substandard and probably dangerous food from the US and God knows where with no EU regulation our home grown stuff will probably end up priced out of the market. As inflation increases and people get poorer as a result of Brexit (which they will) what are they going to opt for? Cheap and suspect or best of British?Hygiene laws and standards set by the EU for takeaways, restaurants etc have also seen a much more level playing field across Europe in recent years. I eat out a fair bit and get takeaways all over Europe and the standards are pretty good. They have to be now. Lets hope thats something else that doesnt slip if we leave the EU.

Are you suggesting we will have to buy chlorine washed chicken from the US once we've left the EU for some strange reason ??? 8-) and why would British food business lower any food standards once we've left the EU ... You like a nice doner kebab heated up again and again and again from a takeaway wherever that is ... Not a great advert for food hygiene ... Another wet argument for me

I am stating that at the moment we are protected from buying cheap and potentially dangerous food types because they are banned by EU law. If those bans are not maintained IF we leave then it opens the doors for cheap, inferior and dangerous food products from all over the world. Whilst our quality products can of course still be bought how long will it be before the cheaper and potentially dodgy stuff pushes them off the shelves. When inflation rises more and money gets tighter (Which it will) which Chicken is going to sell the best in Tescos? Free range fed on corn on the local farm for say a Tenner or some Chlorinated injected with god knows what filth for three quid? They will both look the same, which one is the person who is finding it all a bit of a struggle going to opt for?I do like a Kebab that is true and I feel pretty safe buying one anywhere within the EU as there are strict hygiene and sourcing standards in place and touch wood ive not had a dodgy one yet.

Sorry  Barry but whilst I agree there are EU standards the UK also had/has it's own.  The country is not so backward that we can not formulate our own protections.  However to your claim that EU law is protecting us from dangerous/dodgy foodstuffs it didn't do such a great job in recent years with the number of horse meat in the food chain scandals did it?  

The following might be of interest to you especially the last para in bold:

From the FT.....Feb 2013.

An emerging scandal about illicit horsemeat found in processed foods has raised questions about whether European regulators are capable of coping with an industry whose ingredients and subcontractors increasingly cross national borders.

The EU has developed a food safety system in the wake of the mad cow crisis in the 1990s that emphasises the ability to trace meats back to their source and co-operation between national safety regulators.

Yet that system has been tested in recent years by a string of scandals that reveal the increasingly complex nature of food industry supply chains. In one case, contaminated animal feed in Germany led to scares about dioxin-contaminated eggs and pastries in the UK. In another, far more serious incident, 22 people were killed and more than 2,000 sickened in 2011 by beansprouts thought to have originated in Egypt.

German health officials wrongly pointed the finger at Spanish farmers, causing hundreds-of-millions of euros in losses, and a Russian trade ban, before the case was eventually solved.

Laws are all well and good if monitored and enforced

I am not saying its perfect but the fact remains outside of the EU we wont be protected at all as regards banned products and the sub standard stuff the likes of the US are willing to feed us. Its much more complex than just standards though (there are 4,500 or so EU regulations covering food, farming and environmental standards). The UK food and drink industry is our largest remaining manufacturing sector, bigger than the car and aerospace sectors combined! We only eat half of what we produce though and depend on those standards to be able to export and sell within our biggest market which is of course EUROPE! However 55% of farming income is derived from EU Subsidies and whats more much of it is dependent on EU workers. Can you see where I am going with this yet? :-D We could be in a position soon where there are no strict standards (Assuming there is a free trade deal anyway and a route to market) but we dont meet the requirements anymore for our market place but it could all be hypothetical anyway if there are no workers to produce the blooming food in the first place!All this could lead us to not being able to export anything and having to accept sub standard rubbish from the USA and who knows where else.The entire food sector, its relationship with the EU, our countryside even is at stake here and its way more complex than the Brexiteers thought but then again it all is. :-(

For goodness sake can't you see anything apart from your totally focused view of the EU provides all??

Do you honestly believe that the UK has not got the wherewithall to maintain it's own food standards agency?  Considering this country has been implementing food safety laws since 1266 I really don't think we need overly concern ourselves that we won't be able to control things without  'Daddy' EU holding our hand.

I Think what you will find is "Taking back control" means the current shower of sh1t government doing away with standards and laws that have been put in place by the EU to protect us all because they have been instructed to do so by their bessy mates who are the ones really running the show and the powers behind Brexit. Its happening already with the decision the other day to do away with animal rights. Environmental laws will be next and just wait until they start on workers rights. The lowering of food standards will happen because as they try desperately to cosy up to the like of Trump and the good ole USA they will insist on it. Once that happens of course most of our stuff will end up banned or under strict scrutiny when we try and export it to our nearest neighbours 22 miles away. Its like I said, way more complex than any of you Brexiteers thought or were led to believe.

You really need to do some research Barry *-) .........The UK's animal husbandry standards have led the way in Europe ;-) ........So I suspect if any ones standards slip after BREXIT......it will be the EU's not ours *-) .......

Barry's now telling us that nasty POTUS Trump will flood poor defenceless Britian with nasty chickens when he stitches us up with a trade deal ... Don't know bowt anyone else but my meat says British on it ... If Barry's forecast is correct just buy British meat ... Even a dumb ass Brexit voter can just about manage that

I am sure you will be able to carry on buying the best of British Antony. Your wealthy. I dare say it will cost you a lot more but I suspect that wont bother you or me to be honest. We are probably both in the top 5% of wealth in the UK, probably most of us on here are. Ok thats an assumption based on the fact that we all own motorhomes and seem to have a pretty good lifestyle. When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?) the poor sods who were mainly the ones that were duped into voting out having been told it would be an answer to all their problems will be the ones having to eat it. Standards are already slipping with Shrinkflation and inferior ingredients in an attempt to disguise rising prices. That is only going to get worse.As for animal rights, I will actually say the EU does not have the greatest record but the fact remains the Tories have already said they are doing away with those laws and animals other than domestic pets according to them no longer feel pain or have emotions. Why do you think that is? ITs all part of the preparation for their new order which is to purely serve their Brexit Lords and masters and maximise profits regardless of the loss of care for animals. You watch, employment and human rights will be next. I guarantee it.

You really need to read up on those animal rights before you carry on using at a beating stick Barry ... What has wealth got to do with buying British meat produce ??? ... You bang on about coming out of the EU will affect animals rights but yet you enjoy kebabs supplied by Halal slaughter , Im struggling Barry your guna have to explain it to fick old Brexit me

I have the odd Chicken kebab. Its probably not even Chicken! I have no idea where all the stuff I eat or scoff is sourced from or how its killed. Who does?The point I am making is there can be no other reason for doing away with animal rights laws than profit. Lowering standards to allow in inferior and potentially dangerous products from the USA and other none EU countries can be for no other reason than to appease our so called new trade partners and to increase profits and its the "little people" As you like to call them that will end up scoffing it and our animals that will suffer. I Dont understand why anyone would support that Brexiteer or not really.

You have no idea where the stuff you eat is sourced or how its killed or even like you say if the chicken is chicken ... So your animal rights campaign is fairly selective then ... I said yesterday you need to read up on the supposed lowering of animal standards because its not happening ... If and its more than a big if but if POTUS Trump demands little old us takes in chickens from the US that will clearly be labelled from the US and you don't want to eat US chicken then buy a clearly marked British chicken and I do believe that the vast majority of folk whoever they vote for in this country would not allow any lowering of standards when it comes to animals ... Sorry but its another Barry EU scare story ... Your the forums very own Alistair Campbell ... If your not too busy arranging for your new refugee guests arrival at Barry Towers then maybe you should devote some time to campaigning against real animal cruelty ... https://twitter.com/JaydaBF/status/934023915743129600

Isnt it? https://www.farminguk.com/news/MPs-vote-to-reject-inclusion-of-animal-sentience-in-Withdrawal-Bill_47923.htmlYour still missing the point regarding dodgy food that will appear on our shelves. Yes there will be choice but at what cost? What are those who are less well off going to chose. A £2.99 product thats potentially dangerous or a £10 british product?

Government says its all covered by the 2006 act ... I would imagine that act is available to read somewhere ... If you want to read the act and then compare to the EU legislation and tell me whats missing then I will gladly say your right ... Dodgy food isn't going to end up on our shelves is it anymore than its already available ... Who in their right mind wether your a remain or leave voter would stand for such change to food and animal welfare ... If your trying to say chickens are going to go from £3 to £10 your mad ... Your concerned about animal welfare but ignore Halal killing and tuck into chicken kebabs without a second thought ... Your argument isn't an argument

The 2006 act only covers domestic animals not livestock. Of course products like free range good old British chickens will go up in price because they will be competing with sh!te of a much lower standard which are currently banned in the UK under EU law.

Now you've introduced two little words to the debate "free range" ... two words up until now you hadn't used and that as you well know make a big difference ... British free range chickens can't compete with British mass produced chickens never mind foreign chickens ... Im guessing the price difference would be around double with British produce of the same size chickens ... Buying British free range over non British free range of course comes at a cost but that wasn't your original argument ... Does your Halal slaughtering local kebab man sell free range chicken kebabs ???

[Barryd999]

antony1969 - 2017-11-26 12:56 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-26 11:52 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 11:58 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-25 10:22 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 6:44 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 9:46 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 7:42 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 9:20 AM

pelmetman - 2017-11-24 8:18 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-23 6:57 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-23 3:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 6:40 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-21 4:53 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 11:19 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-20 5:57 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-20 5:34 PMThe concerns about food and hygiene are because EU law currently bans products such as Chlorine washed chicken or Hormone fed Beef from the likes of the USA and a whole host of other inferior guff they and the other countries outside the EU would gladly sell us.Once we leave farmers would face stiff competition from this kind of cheap rubbish from countries with lower standards than the UK unless we continue to adhere to the same EU standards and laws that have kept us all from dying of Salmonella and other diseases. We do however in the UK have some of the highest standards of animal welfare in the world and not just the EU but if we are going to see an influx of cheap, substandard and probably dangerous food from the US and God knows where with no EU regulation our home grown stuff will probably end up priced out of the market. As inflation increases and people get poorer as a result of Brexit (which they will) what are they going to opt for? Cheap and suspect or best of British?Hygiene laws and standards set by the EU for takeaways, restaurants etc have also seen a much more level playing field across Europe in recent years. I eat out a fair bit and get takeaways all over Europe and the standards are pretty good. They have to be now. Lets hope thats something else that doesnt slip if we leave the EU.

Are you suggesting we will have to buy chlorine washed chicken from the US once we've left the EU for some strange reason ??? 8-) and why would British food business lower any food standards once we've left the EU ... You like a nice doner kebab heated up again and again and again from a takeaway wherever that is ... Not a great advert for food hygiene ... Another wet argument for me

I am stating that at the moment we are protected from buying cheap and potentially dangerous food types because they are banned by EU law. If those bans are not maintained IF we leave then it opens the doors for cheap, inferior and dangerous food products from all over the world. Whilst our quality products can of course still be bought how long will it be before the cheaper and potentially dodgy stuff pushes them off the shelves. When inflation rises more and money gets tighter (Which it will) which Chicken is going to sell the best in Tescos? Free range fed on corn on the local farm for say a Tenner or some Chlorinated injected with god knows what filth for three quid? They will both look the same, which one is the person who is finding it all a bit of a struggle going to opt for?I do like a Kebab that is true and I feel pretty safe buying one anywhere within the EU as there are strict hygiene and sourcing standards in place and touch wood ive not had a dodgy one yet.

Sorry  Barry but whilst I agree there are EU standards the UK also had/has it's own.  The country is not so backward that we can not formulate our own protections.  However to your claim that EU law is protecting us from dangerous/dodgy foodstuffs it didn't do such a great job in recent years with the number of horse meat in the food chain scandals did it?  

The following might be of interest to you especially the last para in bold:

From the FT.....Feb 2013.

An emerging scandal about illicit horsemeat found in processed foods has raised questions about whether European regulators are capable of coping with an industry whose ingredients and subcontractors increasingly cross national borders.

The EU has developed a food safety system in the wake of the mad cow crisis in the 1990s that emphasises the ability to trace meats back to their source and co-operation between national safety regulators.

Yet that system has been tested in recent years by a string of scandals that reveal the increasingly complex nature of food industry supply chains. In one case, contaminated animal feed in Germany led to scares about dioxin-contaminated eggs and pastries in the UK. In another, far more serious incident, 22 people were killed and more than 2,000 sickened in 2011 by beansprouts thought to have originated in Egypt.

German health officials wrongly pointed the finger at Spanish farmers, causing hundreds-of-millions of euros in losses, and a Russian trade ban, before the case was eventually solved.

Laws are all well and good if monitored and enforced

I am not saying its perfect but the fact remains outside of the EU we wont be protected at all as regards banned products and the sub standard stuff the likes of the US are willing to feed us. Its much more complex than just standards though (there are 4,500 or so EU regulations covering food, farming and environmental standards). The UK food and drink industry is our largest remaining manufacturing sector, bigger than the car and aerospace sectors combined! We only eat half of what we produce though and depend on those standards to be able to export and sell within our biggest market which is of course EUROPE! However 55% of farming income is derived from EU Subsidies and whats more much of it is dependent on EU workers. Can you see where I am going with this yet? :-D We could be in a position soon where there are no strict standards (Assuming there is a free trade deal anyway and a route to market) but we dont meet the requirements anymore for our market place but it could all be hypothetical anyway if there are no workers to produce the blooming food in the first place!All this could lead us to not being able to export anything and having to accept sub standard rubbish from the USA and who knows where else.The entire food sector, its relationship with the EU, our countryside even is at stake here and its way more complex than the Brexiteers thought but then again it all is. :-(

For goodness sake can't you see anything apart from your totally focused view of the EU provides all??

Do you honestly believe that the UK has not got the wherewithall to maintain it's own food standards agency?  Considering this country has been implementing food safety laws since 1266 I really don't think we need overly concern ourselves that we won't be able to control things without  'Daddy' EU holding our hand.

I Think what you will find is "Taking back control" means the current shower of sh1t government doing away with standards and laws that have been put in place by the EU to protect us all because they have been instructed to do so by their bessy mates who are the ones really running the show and the powers behind Brexit. Its happening already with the decision the other day to do away with animal rights. Environmental laws will be next and just wait until they start on workers rights. The lowering of food standards will happen because as they try desperately to cosy up to the like of Trump and the good ole USA they will insist on it. Once that happens of course most of our stuff will end up banned or under strict scrutiny when we try and export it to our nearest neighbours 22 miles away. Its like I said, way more complex than any of you Brexiteers thought or were led to believe.

You really need to do some research Barry *-) .........The UK's animal husbandry standards have led the way in Europe ;-) ........So I suspect if any ones standards slip after BREXIT......it will be the EU's not ours *-) .......

Barry's now telling us that nasty POTUS Trump will flood poor defenceless Britian with nasty chickens when he stitches us up with a trade deal ... Don't know bowt anyone else but my meat says British on it ... If Barry's forecast is correct just buy British meat ... Even a dumb ass Brexit voter can just about manage that

I am sure you will be able to carry on buying the best of British Antony. Your wealthy. I dare say it will cost you a lot more but I suspect that wont bother you or me to be honest. We are probably both in the top 5% of wealth in the UK, probably most of us on here are. Ok thats an assumption based on the fact that we all own motorhomes and seem to have a pretty good lifestyle. When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?) the poor sods who were mainly the ones that were duped into voting out having been told it would be an answer to all their problems will be the ones having to eat it. Standards are already slipping with Shrinkflation and inferior ingredients in an attempt to disguise rising prices. That is only going to get worse.As for animal rights, I will actually say the EU does not have the greatest record but the fact remains the Tories have already said they are doing away with those laws and animals other than domestic pets according to them no longer feel pain or have emotions. Why do you think that is? ITs all part of the preparation for their new order which is to purely serve their Brexit Lords and masters and maximise profits regardless of the loss of care for animals. You watch, employment and human rights will be next. I guarantee it.

You really need to read up on those animal rights before you carry on using at a beating stick Barry ... What has wealth got to do with buying British meat produce ??? ... You bang on about coming out of the EU will affect animals rights but yet you enjoy kebabs supplied by Halal slaughter , Im struggling Barry your guna have to explain it to fick old Brexit me

I have the odd Chicken kebab. Its probably not even Chicken! I have no idea where all the stuff I eat or scoff is sourced from or how its killed. Who does?The point I am making is there can be no other reason for doing away with animal rights laws than profit. Lowering standards to allow in inferior and potentially dangerous products from the USA and other none EU countries can be for no other reason than to appease our so called new trade partners and to increase profits and its the "little people" As you like to call them that will end up scoffing it and our animals that will suffer. I Dont understand why anyone would support that Brexiteer or not really.

You have no idea where the stuff you eat is sourced or how its killed or even like you say if the chicken is chicken ... So your animal rights campaign is fairly selective then ... I said yesterday you need to read up on the supposed lowering of animal standards because its not happening ... If and its more than a big if but if POTUS Trump demands little old us takes in chickens from the US that will clearly be labelled from the US and you don't want to eat US chicken then buy a clearly marked British chicken and I do believe that the vast majority of folk whoever they vote for in this country would not allow any lowering of standards when it comes to animals ... Sorry but its another Barry EU scare story ... Your the forums very own Alistair Campbell ... If your not too busy arranging for your new refugee guests arrival at Barry Towers then maybe you should devote some time to campaigning against real animal cruelty ... https://twitter.com/JaydaBF/status/934023915743129600

Isnt it? https://www.farminguk.com/news/MPs-vote-to-reject-inclusion-of-animal-sentience-in-Withdrawal-Bill_47923.htmlYour still missing the point regarding dodgy food that will appear on our shelves. Yes there will be choice but at what cost? What are those who are less well off going to chose. A £2.99 product thats potentially dangerous or a £10 british product?

Government says its all covered by the 2006 act ... I would imagine that act is available to read somewhere ... If you want to read the act and then compare to the EU legislation and tell me whats missing then I will gladly say your right ... Dodgy food isn't going to end up on our shelves is it anymore than its already available ... Who in their right mind wether your a remain or leave voter would stand for such change to food and animal welfare ... If your trying to say chickens are going to go from £3 to £10 your mad ... Your concerned about animal welfare but ignore Halal killing and tuck into chicken kebabs without a second thought ... Your argument isn't an argument

The 2006 act only covers domestic animals not livestock. Of course products like free range good old British chickens will go up in price because they will be competing with sh!te of a much lower standard which are currently banned in the UK under EU law.

Now you've introduced two little words to the debate "free range" ... two words up until now you hadn't used and that as you well know make a big difference ... British free range chickens can't compete with British mass produced chickens never mind foreign chickens ... Im guessing the price difference would be around double with British produce of the same size chickens ... Buying British free range over non British free range of course comes at a cost but that wasn't your original argument ... Does your Halal slaughtering local kebab man sell free range chicken kebabs ???

I Think I mentioned Free Range earlier but it doesnt matter, even mass produced British chickens will be under threat from inferior, cheaper imported crap if we do away with the laws that protect us from them and thus people will buy the cheapest especially in post Brexit Britain when cash gets tighter for many (Ironically probably those that voted out). I never eat Kebabs in the UK as they are disgusting.

[Guest pelmetman]

Barryd999 - 2017-11-26 2:36 PM

I never eat Kebabs in the UK as they are disgusting.

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSLA76533220070903

 

(lol) (lol) (lol) ........

 

I've lost count of the number of times I've been p*ssed.......But I do recall the 2 times when I've been p*ssed enough to eat a kebab 8-) .......

 

 

[antony1969]

Barryd999 - 2017-11-26 2:36 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-26 12:56 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-26 11:52 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 11:58 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-25 10:22 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-25 6:44 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 9:46 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 7:42 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-24 6:18 PM

antony1969 - 2017-11-24 9:20 AM

pelmetman - 2017-11-24 8:18 AM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-23 6:57 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-23 3:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 6:40 PM

RogerC - 2017-11-21 4:53 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-21 11:19 AM

antony1969 - 2017-11-20 5:57 PM

Barryd999 - 2017-11-20 5:34 PMThe concerns about food and hygiene are because EU law currently bans products such as Chlorine washed chicken or Hormone fed Beef from the likes of the USA and a whole host of other inferior guff they and the other countries outside the EU would gladly sell us.Once we leave farmers would face stiff competition from this kind of cheap rubbish from countries with lower standards than the UK unless we continue to adhere to the same EU standards and laws that have kept us all from dying of Salmonella and other diseases. We do however in the UK have some of the highest standards of animal welfare in the world and not just the EU but if we are going to see an influx of cheap, substandard and probably dangerous food from the US and God knows where with no EU regulation our home grown stuff will probably end up priced out of the market. As inflation increases and people get poorer as a result of Brexit (which they will) what are they going to opt for? Cheap and suspect or best of British?Hygiene laws and standards set by the EU for takeaways, restaurants etc have also seen a much more level playing field across Europe in recent years. I eat out a fair bit and get takeaways all over Europe and the standards are pretty good. They have to be now. Lets hope thats something else that doesnt slip if we leave the EU.

Are you suggesting we will have to buy chlorine washed chicken from the US once we've left the EU for some strange reason ??? 8-) and why would British food business lower any food standards once we've left the EU ... You like a nice doner kebab heated up again and again and again from a takeaway wherever that is ... Not a great advert for food hygiene ... Another wet argument for me

I am stating that at the moment we are protected from buying cheap and potentially dangerous food types because they are banned by EU law. If those bans are not maintained IF we leave then it opens the doors for cheap, inferior and dangerous food products from all over the world. Whilst our quality products can of course still be bought how long will it be before the cheaper and potentially dodgy stuff pushes them off the shelves. When inflation rises more and money gets tighter (Which it will) which Chicken is going to sell the best in Tescos? Free range fed on corn on the local farm for say a Tenner or some Chlorinated injected with god knows what filth for three quid? They will both look the same, which one is the person who is finding it all a bit of a struggle going to opt for?I do like a Kebab that is true and I feel pretty safe buying one anywhere within the EU as there are strict hygiene and sourcing standards in place and touch wood ive not had a dodgy one yet.

Sorry  Barry but whilst I agree there are EU standards the UK also had/has it's own.  The country is not so backward that we can not formulate our own protections.  However to your claim that EU law is protecting us from dangerous/dodgy foodstuffs it didn't do such a great job in recent years with the number of horse meat in the food chain scandals did it?  

The following might be of interest to you especially the last para in bold:

From the FT.....Feb 2013.

An emerging scandal about illicit horsemeat found in processed foods has raised questions about whether European regulators are capable of coping with an industry whose ingredients and subcontractors increasingly cross national borders.

The EU has developed a food safety system in the wake of the mad cow crisis in the 1990s that emphasises the ability to trace meats back to their source and co-operation between national safety regulators.

Yet that system has been tested in recent years by a string of scandals that reveal the increasingly complex nature of food industry supply chains. In one case, contaminated animal feed in Germany led to scares about dioxin-contaminated eggs and pastries in the UK. In another, far more serious incident, 22 people were killed and more than 2,000 sickened in 2011 by beansprouts thought to have originated in Egypt.

German health officials wrongly pointed the finger at Spanish farmers, causing hundreds-of-millions of euros in losses, and a Russian trade ban, before the case was eventually solved.

Laws are all well and good if monitored and enforced

I am not saying its perfect but the fact remains outside of the EU we wont be protected at all as regards banned products and the sub standard stuff the likes of the US are willing to feed us. Its much more complex than just standards though (there are 4,500 or so EU regulations covering food, farming and environmental standards). The UK food and drink industry is our largest remaining manufacturing sector, bigger than the car and aerospace sectors combined! We only eat half of what we produce though and depend on those standards to be able to export and sell within our biggest market which is of course EUROPE! However 55% of farming income is derived from EU Subsidies and whats more much of it is dependent on EU workers. Can you see where I am going with this yet? :-D We could be in a position soon where there are no strict standards (Assuming there is a free trade deal anyway and a route to market) but we dont meet the requirements anymore for our market place but it could all be hypothetical anyway if there are no workers to produce the blooming food in the first place!All this could lead us to not being able to export anything and having to accept sub standard rubbish from the USA and who knows where else.The entire food sector, its relationship with the EU, our countryside even is at stake here and its way more complex than the Brexiteers thought but then again it all is. :-(

For goodness sake can't you see anything apart from your totally focused view of the EU provides all??

Do you honestly believe that the UK has not got the wherewithall to maintain it's own food standards agency?  Considering this country has been implementing food safety laws since 1266 I really don't think we need overly concern ourselves that we won't be able to control things without  'Daddy' EU holding our hand.

I Think what you will find is "Taking back control" means the current shower of sh1t government doing away with standards and laws that have been put in place by the EU to protect us all because they have been instructed to do so by their bessy mates who are the ones really running the show and the powers behind Brexit. Its happening already with the decision the other day to do away with animal rights. Environmental laws will be next and just wait until they start on workers rights. The lowering of food standards will happen because as they try desperately to cosy up to the like of Trump and the good ole USA they will insist on it. Once that happens of course most of our stuff will end up banned or under strict scrutiny when we try and export it to our nearest neighbours 22 miles away. Its like I said, way more complex than any of you Brexiteers thought or were led to believe.

You really need to do some research Barry *-) .........The UK's animal husbandry standards have led the way in Europe ;-) ........So I suspect if any ones standards slip after BREXIT......it will be the EU's not ours *-) .......

Barry's now telling us that nasty POTUS Trump will flood poor defenceless Britian with nasty chickens when he stitches us up with a trade deal ... Don't know bowt anyone else but my meat says British on it ... If Barry's forecast is correct just buy British meat ... Even a dumb ass Brexit voter can just about manage that

I am sure you will be able to carry on buying the best of British Antony. Your wealthy. I dare say it will cost you a lot more but I suspect that wont bother you or me to be honest. We are probably both in the top 5% of wealth in the UK, probably most of us on here are. Ok thats an assumption based on the fact that we all own motorhomes and seem to have a pretty good lifestyle. When this crap starts to fill up our shelves and standards are dropped though and British products rocket (have you seen the rises in Dairy since Brexit?) the poor sods who were mainly the ones that were duped into voting out having been told it would be an answer to all their problems will be the ones having to eat it. Standards are already slipping with Shrinkflation and inferior ingredients in an attempt to disguise rising prices. That is only going to get worse.As for animal rights, I will actually say the EU does not have the greatest record but the fact remains the Tories have already said they are doing away with those laws and animals other than domestic pets according to them no longer feel pain or have emotions. Why do you think that is? ITs all part of the preparation for their new order which is to purely serve their Brexit Lords and masters and maximise profits regardless of the loss of care for animals. You watch, employment and human rights will be next. I guarantee it.

You really need to read up on those animal rights before you carry on using at a beating stick Barry ... What has wealth got to do with buying British meat produce ??? ... You bang on about coming out of the EU will affect animals rights but yet you enjoy kebabs supplied by Halal slaughter , Im struggling Barry your guna have to explain it to fick old Brexit me

I have the odd Chicken kebab. Its probably not even Chicken! I have no idea where all the stuff I eat or scoff is sourced from or how its killed. Who does?The point I am making is there can be no other reason for doing away with animal rights laws than profit. Lowering standards to allow in inferior and potentially dangerous products from the USA and other none EU countries can be for no other reason than to appease our so called new trade partners and to increase profits and its the "little people" As you like to call them that will end up scoffing it and our animals that will suffer. I Dont understand why anyone would support that Brexiteer or not really.

You have no idea where the stuff you eat is sourced or how its killed or even like you say if the chicken is chicken ... So your animal rights campaign is fairly selective then ... I said yesterday you need to read up on the supposed lowering of animal standards because its not happening ... If and its more than a big if but if POTUS Trump demands little old us takes in chickens from the US that will clearly be labelled from the US and you don't want to eat US chicken then buy a clearly marked British chicken and I do believe that the vast majority of folk whoever they vote for in this country would not allow any lowering of standards when it comes to animals ... Sorry but its another Barry EU scare story ... Your the forums very own Alistair Campbell ... If your not too busy arranging for your new refugee guests arrival at Barry Towers then maybe you should devote some time to campaigning against real animal cruelty ... https://twitter.com/JaydaBF/status/934023915743129600

Isnt it? https://www.farminguk.com/news/MPs-vote-to-reject-inclusion-of-animal-sentience-in-Withdrawal-Bill_47923.htmlYour still missing the point regarding dodgy food that will appear on our shelves. Yes there will be choice but at what cost? What are those who are less well off going to chose. A £2.99 product thats potentially dangerous or a £10 british product?

Government says its all covered by the 2006 act ... I would imagine that act is available to read somewhere ... If you want to read the act and then compare to the EU legislation and tell me whats missing then I will gladly say your right ... Dodgy food isn't going to end up on our shelves is it anymore than its already available ... Who in their right mind wether your a remain or leave voter would stand for such change to food and animal welfare ... If your trying to say chickens are going to go from £3 to £10 your mad ... Your concerned about animal welfare but ignore Halal killing and tuck into chicken kebabs without a second thought ... Your argument isn't an argument

The 2006 act only covers domestic animals not livestock. Of course products like free range good old British chickens will go up in price because they will be competing with sh!te of a much lower standard which are currently banned in the UK under EU law.

Now you've introduced two little words to the debate "free range" ... two words up until now you hadn't used and that as you well know make a big difference ... British free range chickens can't compete with British mass produced chickens never mind foreign chickens ... Im guessing the price difference would be around double with British produce of the same size chickens ... Buying British free range over non British free range of course comes at a cost but that wasn't your original argument ... Does your Halal slaughtering local kebab man sell free range chicken kebabs ???

I Think I mentioned Free Range earlier but it doesnt matter, even mass produced British chickens will be under threat from inferior, cheaper imported crap if we do away with the laws that protect us from them and thus people will buy the cheapest especially in post Brexit Britain when cash gets tighter for many (Ironically probably those that voted out). I never eat Kebabs in the UK as they are disgusting.

I think you didn't mention free range Barry ... Too right those kebabs are disgusting ... The way the animals are slaughtered for one but that doesn't seem to come under your concerns for animal welfare