DavidGJH Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 John52 - 2018-03-07 10:37 AM DavidGJH - 2018-03-06 5:48 PM An increase in the national debt of two and a half times in seven years. Like comparing it to the so called GDP makes another way of you avoiding mentioning the actual figure.(lol) But you can only avoid saying why Gideon calls himself another name by throwing your toys out of the pram and refusing to discuss it any more :D AW, diddums John52 previously known as Peter James who was banned from this forum! I can see that you're upset from the number of posts that you're making in a vain effort to dig yourself out of the hole you're in. To recap. You posted a graph which you thought showed the Tories in a bad light. But you're not clever enough to realise that it shows the opposite, which was that under Labour the National Debt tripled from £348 billion to over a trillion. You gloss over the fact that the Tories inherited a country that was virtually bankrupt owing to Labour's usual spend, spend spend polices. You gIoss over the fact that the Tories inherited a budget deficit of £99 billion, the highest on record. You gloss over the fact that, since inheriting this mess the Tories have only increased the National Debt by 50% but anyone with a brain can see why they had to borrow after inheriting a country left bankrupt by Labour. Since then, George Osborne, one of the finest Chancellors we've ever had has reduced the deficit and Philip Hammond has eliminated it. How that must rankle! So, John52, previously known as Peter James who was banned from this forum, I have to tell you that as well as not responding on the other subject, I won't be responding any more on this one either. Some of us understand when further arguing is pointless. I shall however, take pleasure in watching as you make a further dozen or so separate posts as you wriggle and squirm in a vain attempt to convince us that the previous Labour administration wasn't, like all Labour governments, a financial disaster. The lesson for you here is before posting graphs and figures, don't just look at the bottom line but read the whole thing carefully and , as in this case, you might realise that the graph doesn't actually support your hypothesis. So I'm in my pram, I've chucked out my toys but only so that I can sit back and have a good laugh as you flounder and bluster and bluster and bluster and bluster. Cheerio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-03-07 9:32 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 9:06 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 6:25 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 9:18 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 7:29 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 4:16 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 2:55 PM Tracker - 2018-03-06 2:39 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 1:54 PM If you don't like living with immigrants for whatever reason the only choice you have is to move. Come up here, we hardly have any which I know will annoy many but it's just the way it is. There is no work up here. Your either in the game now or your not and we are about to check out Immigrants are not an issue here either, especially cocooned from the real world of work that retirement brings. I don't think we are checking out of the game, more like hopefully modifying the game rules to suit our country and our natural people, but with controlled immigration giving us the skills we lack ourselves. However with a succession of weak willed lilly livered governments hell bent on pandering to minorities and the media I wish I could honestly believe that we will make best use of the opportunities that will once again be open to us as a free independant nation. Most of the world survives without the EU so why wouldn't we? Ask me again in five year's time! That's Barry's answer Richard if you don't like immigration which you never said youve gotta move out , maybe you could get on the big red number 350 bus he keeps waffling on about again and again and again .... its undeniable that Immigration was the main reason the majority voted out. The big bus probably did play a roll as well I guess for those who thought we were giving away £350 million for nothing. Rich never said he didnt like immigrants but he did say ("England, like so many other countries, was a more pleasant place before mass immigration swamped it so rather than the oh so convemient racist term beloved by the foreigneer worshippers I prefer patriot and self preservationist as being more realistic and fortunately I am far from alone.") which I took to mean that he would prefer like i think you and many others would that we had less immigrants or probably no immigrants perhaps. My point is you cant have that so whats the point of Brexit if thats the main reason people voted for it? We are going to make ourselves much worse off yet the immigrants will just come from somewhere else if they dont come from Europe. Its like trying to do a King Canute with the tide. Wont happen. You may get rid of a few or find that the nationalities change, we already stopped most of the spongers and its pretty much accepted now that our immigrants are generally hard working but you cant stop the tide and close yourself off, well we cannot as we are simply not set up for it. Im not sure I would like it if my home town was suddenly full of foreigners and the indigenous population moved out but I never liked living in a town anyway and as soon as I could afford to I moved to the country. Things change, economies and the way we work evolve. Going backwards wont change that. Who's on about going backwards ??? ... Whats wrong in wanting regulated immigration like many other countries have ??? Only countries that can afford to have it. The Immigration thing was just a dangling carrot to get people to vote for Brexit. Years of drip feeding from the Mail etc that it was the EU and immigrants to blame for the countries problems have done their job. Your beloved Tory government (and mine remember at one point) could have reduced it both from the EU and of course they have always been able to control it from outside where most immigration comes from but they choose not to because it suits their agenda. We need immigrants and that wont change. Many Brexiteers have since admitted that immigration wont change much since the referendum yet it was the main reason so many voted out. So you have to ask yourself why we are here. Because its been engineered by the super rich to create an ultra low tax economy. Its the only way we will attract inward investment as China, USA etc will not let us have our cake and eat it anymore than the EU 27 will. It will mean massive deregulation, doing away with workers rights of course and privatisation. Minimum wage and living wage will suffer or could just disappear in a puff of zero hour contract smoke. Have a look at the big wigs that are really behind Brexit and what they are all involved in and then my theory might make more sense. Immigration might have been the focus of the voters but the people behind Brexit dont give a toss about all that. Barry your theory makes no sense to me at all ... You've changed "Tories" for "big wigs" why ??? Because the Big wigs are the super rich that are the Dog that is wagging the Tory tail. Your Right wing media for one. Obviously these are pro EU links but have a read. Why were the likes of Arron Banks etc so keen to pour millions of pounds into Vote Leave? Why did they send out leaflets stating 75 million Turks were heading here? Because this was the easy target to whip up the masses. Immigration! It totally worked as well. Their motive? Well read on but it certainly wasnt Immigration for them, just the deregulation, depression of workers rights and pay and of course a UK tax haven. Singapore in Europe. A complete stitch up. https://infacts.org/super-rich-bought-brexit-victory/ http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-is-about-the-rich-rees-moggs-of-britain-not-anyone-else-1-4896702 Barry your on a different planet to me thankfully Do you know what? I hope your right and I am wrong. Lets face it though. When have the little people (thats you and me) ever come out on top of any major political changes? Five, ten years or whatever from now we will know. Will the Brexiteers who wanted to reduce Immigration and take back control be happy with the outcome and have got their country back with fewer foreigners in it or will the likes of Reek Smug, Arron Banks and the media moguls have been the only ones to have benefited from the Low tax, low regulation economy thats been created as a result? You also have to remember that once Brexit is done, its up to them and the people in power what they actually do about immigration, deregulation, workers rights and tax levels. There will be nobody to stop them doing whatever they want. Lets see how much thought they give to the people who put them there then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 11:59 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 9:32 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 9:06 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 6:25 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 9:18 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 7:29 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 4:16 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 2:55 PM Tracker - 2018-03-06 2:39 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 1:54 PM If you don't like living with immigrants for whatever reason the only choice you have is to move. Come up here, we hardly have any which I know will annoy many but it's just the way it is. There is no work up here. Your either in the game now or your not and we are about to check out Immigrants are not an issue here either, especially cocooned from the real world of work that retirement brings. I don't think we are checking out of the game, more like hopefully modifying the game rules to suit our country and our natural people, but with controlled immigration giving us the skills we lack ourselves. However with a succession of weak willed lilly livered governments hell bent on pandering to minorities and the media I wish I could honestly believe that we will make best use of the opportunities that will once again be open to us as a free independant nation. Most of the world survives without the EU so why wouldn't we? Ask me again in five year's time! That's Barry's answer Richard if you don't like immigration which you never said youve gotta move out , maybe you could get on the big red number 350 bus he keeps waffling on about again and again and again .... its undeniable that Immigration was the main reason the majority voted out. The big bus probably did play a roll as well I guess for those who thought we were giving away £350 million for nothing. Rich never said he didnt like immigrants but he did say ("England, like so many other countries, was a more pleasant place before mass immigration swamped it so rather than the oh so convemient racist term beloved by the foreigneer worshippers I prefer patriot and self preservationist as being more realistic and fortunately I am far from alone.") which I took to mean that he would prefer like i think you and many others would that we had less immigrants or probably no immigrants perhaps. My point is you cant have that so whats the point of Brexit if thats the main reason people voted for it? We are going to make ourselves much worse off yet the immigrants will just come from somewhere else if they dont come from Europe. Its like trying to do a King Canute with the tide. Wont happen. You may get rid of a few or find that the nationalities change, we already stopped most of the spongers and its pretty much accepted now that our immigrants are generally hard working but you cant stop the tide and close yourself off, well we cannot as we are simply not set up for it. Im not sure I would like it if my home town was suddenly full of foreigners and the indigenous population moved out but I never liked living in a town anyway and as soon as I could afford to I moved to the country. Things change, economies and the way we work evolve. Going backwards wont change that. Who's on about going backwards ??? ... Whats wrong in wanting regulated immigration like many other countries have ??? Only countries that can afford to have it. The Immigration thing was just a dangling carrot to get people to vote for Brexit. Years of drip feeding from the Mail etc that it was the EU and immigrants to blame for the countries problems have done their job. Your beloved Tory government (and mine remember at one point) could have reduced it both from the EU and of course they have always been able to control it from outside where most immigration comes from but they choose not to because it suits their agenda. We need immigrants and that wont change. Many Brexiteers have since admitted that immigration wont change much since the referendum yet it was the main reason so many voted out. So you have to ask yourself why we are here. Because its been engineered by the super rich to create an ultra low tax economy. Its the only way we will attract inward investment as China, USA etc will not let us have our cake and eat it anymore than the EU 27 will. It will mean massive deregulation, doing away with workers rights of course and privatisation. Minimum wage and living wage will suffer or could just disappear in a puff of zero hour contract smoke. Have a look at the big wigs that are really behind Brexit and what they are all involved in and then my theory might make more sense. Immigration might have been the focus of the voters but the people behind Brexit dont give a toss about all that. Barry your theory makes no sense to me at all ... You've changed "Tories" for "big wigs" why ??? Because the Big wigs are the super rich that are the Dog that is wagging the Tory tail. Your Right wing media for one. Obviously these are pro EU links but have a read. Why were the likes of Arron Banks etc so keen to pour millions of pounds into Vote Leave? Why did they send out leaflets stating 75 million Turks were heading here? Because this was the easy target to whip up the masses. Immigration! It totally worked as well. Their motive? Well read on but it certainly wasnt Immigration for them, just the deregulation, depression of workers rights and pay and of course a UK tax haven. Singapore in Europe. A complete stitch up. https://infacts.org/super-rich-bought-brexit-victory/ http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-is-about-the-rich-rees-moggs-of-britain-not-anyone-else-1-4896702 Barry your on a different planet to me thankfully Do you know what? I hope your right and I am wrong. Lets face it though. When have the little people (thats you and me) ever come out on top of any major political changes? Five, ten years or whatever from now we will know. Will the Brexiteers who wanted to reduce Immigration and take back control be happy with the outcome and have got their country back with fewer foreigners in it or will the likes of Reek Smug, Arron Banks and the media moguls have been the only ones to have benefited from the Low tax, low regulation economy thats been created as a result? You also have to remember that once Brexit is done, its up to them and the people in power what they actually do about immigration, deregulation, workers rights and tax levels. There will be nobody to stop them doing whatever they want. Lets see how much thought they give to the people who put them there then. Barry I presume it will be up to whoever is in power ... If your team gets in with a decent majority then I doubt very much Corbyn will be doing anything for anyone with money so your theory really all hinges on your much hated Tory government staying in power doesn't it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 11:26 AM Carry on using Gideon, as I'm sure you will. Every time you use it though it emphasises what sort of person you really are. Gideon (real name) is telling the truth. You should try it sometime (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 Does John call Elton John by his real name or any of the many other celebs that choose different names ... Even Jimmy Savile isn't Jimmy it's James if ya want to be picky but yet ive never heard him call him that in the many times hes mentioned him so why pick out George Osbourne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-03-07 1:49 PM Does John call Elton John by his real name or any of the many other celebs that choose different names ... Even Jimmy Savile isn't Jimmy it's James if ya want to be picky but yet ive never heard him call him that in the many times hes mentioned him so why pick out George Osbourne I call the nonce by his real name Sir Jimmy Savile OBE KCSG. Jimmy is the same as James. Gideon is not the same name as George. So I ask again - why is Gideon calling himself something else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 11:45 AM Since then, George Osborne, one of the finest Chancellors we've ever had If you mean Gideon Osborne, whose average annual debt increase was 6 times as much as Gordon Brown - despite all his Austerity for the poor and homeless, this is what he said when visiting Ireland "A Generation ago, the very idea that a British politician would go to Ireland to see how to run an economy would have been laughable. The Irish Republic was seen as Britain’s poor and troubled country cousin, a rural backwater on the edge of Europe. Today things are different. Ireland stands as a shining example of the art of the possible in long-term economic policymaking, and that is why I am in Dublin: to listen and to learn". - George Osborne ,The Times Feb 23 2006 A few days later the Irish Economy crashed. Then he sent them £5 billion of our borrowed money to prop them up before the Royal visit; I guess you won't answer why Gideon is calling himself George? so I will try another. Apart from supporting Cameron’s party leadership campaign, does Gideon have ANY qualifications to be in charge of the nations finances *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 John52 - 2018-03-07 2:14 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 1:49 PM Does John call Elton John by his real name or any of the many other celebs that choose different names ... Even Jimmy Savile isn't Jimmy it's James if ya want to be picky but yet ive never heard him call him that in the many times hes mentioned him so why pick out George Osbourne I call the nonce by his real name Sir Jimmy Savile OBE KCSG. Jimmy is the same as James. Gideon is not the same name as George. So I ask again - why is Gideon calling himself something else? Nope his names is definitely James and definitely more James than the Sir/OBE/KCSG bit ... You guna call him James from now on ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 11:26 AM You're really not very bright are you John52 previously known as Peter James who was banned from this forum? In a post about your anti-Semitic naming of George Osborne I said: 'I won't be discussing this subject with you any further.' DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 11:45 AM AW, diddums John52 previously known as Peter James who was banned from this forum! I can see that you're upset from the number of posts that you're making in a vain effort to dig yourself out of the hole you're in. Hhhmm........for a "new" poster signed up just over 3 months ago you seem to know an awful lot about this forum after just 17 posts....all in Chatterbox! ;-) So which PBU are you i wonder? :-S Either that or a sock account. (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidGJH Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-03-07 3:48 PM DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 11:26 AM You're really not very bright are you John52 previously known as Peter James who was banned from this forum? In a post about your anti-Semitic naming of George Osborne I said: 'I won't be discussing this subject with you any further.' DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 11:45 AM AW, diddums John52 previously known as Peter James who was banned from this forum! I can see that you're upset from the number of posts that you're making in a vain effort to dig yourself out of the hole you're in. Hhhmm........for a "new" poster signed up just over 3 months ago you seem to know an awful lot about this forum after just 17 posts....all in Chatterbox! ;-) So which PBU are you i wonder? :-S Either that or a sock account. (lol) Didn't you see my reply to Tracker above? He suggested that John52 had a previous name. If you do as I did and just type in his favourite phrase 'unelected her majesty the Queen' into the search box you get a string of threads. Open some of the earlier ones and it's obvious that John52 was previously called Peter James. Other later threads mentioned that Peter James had been banned. I browse this forum and have no intention of being a regular poster but I'm afraid that the latest lies from John52, previously known as Peter James who was banned from this forum, made it hard for me to stay silent so I decided to point out his untruths. I have no idea what a pbu is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-03-07 3:48 PM......................So which PBU are you i wonder? :-S Hadenough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-03-07 12:08 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 11:59 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 9:32 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 9:06 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 6:25 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 9:18 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 7:29 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 4:16 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 2:55 PM Tracker - 2018-03-06 2:39 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 1:54 PM If you don't like living with immigrants for whatever reason the only choice you have is to move. Come up here, we hardly have any which I know will annoy many but it's just the way it is. There is no work up here. Your either in the game now or your not and we are about to check out Immigrants are not an issue here either, especially cocooned from the real world of work that retirement brings. I don't think we are checking out of the game, more like hopefully modifying the game rules to suit our country and our natural people, but with controlled immigration giving us the skills we lack ourselves. However with a succession of weak willed lilly livered governments hell bent on pandering to minorities and the media I wish I could honestly believe that we will make best use of the opportunities that will once again be open to us as a free independant nation. Most of the world survives without the EU so why wouldn't we? Ask me again in five year's time! That's Barry's answer Richard if you don't like immigration which you never said youve gotta move out , maybe you could get on the big red number 350 bus he keeps waffling on about again and again and again .... its undeniable that Immigration was the main reason the majority voted out. The big bus probably did play a roll as well I guess for those who thought we were giving away £350 million for nothing. Rich never said he didnt like immigrants but he did say ("England, like so many other countries, was a more pleasant place before mass immigration swamped it so rather than the oh so convemient racist term beloved by the foreigneer worshippers I prefer patriot and self preservationist as being more realistic and fortunately I am far from alone.") which I took to mean that he would prefer like i think you and many others would that we had less immigrants or probably no immigrants perhaps. My point is you cant have that so whats the point of Brexit if thats the main reason people voted for it? We are going to make ourselves much worse off yet the immigrants will just come from somewhere else if they dont come from Europe. Its like trying to do a King Canute with the tide. Wont happen. You may get rid of a few or find that the nationalities change, we already stopped most of the spongers and its pretty much accepted now that our immigrants are generally hard working but you cant stop the tide and close yourself off, well we cannot as we are simply not set up for it. Im not sure I would like it if my home town was suddenly full of foreigners and the indigenous population moved out but I never liked living in a town anyway and as soon as I could afford to I moved to the country. Things change, economies and the way we work evolve. Going backwards wont change that. Who's on about going backwards ??? ... Whats wrong in wanting regulated immigration like many other countries have ??? Only countries that can afford to have it. The Immigration thing was just a dangling carrot to get people to vote for Brexit. Years of drip feeding from the Mail etc that it was the EU and immigrants to blame for the countries problems have done their job. Your beloved Tory government (and mine remember at one point) could have reduced it both from the EU and of course they have always been able to control it from outside where most immigration comes from but they choose not to because it suits their agenda. We need immigrants and that wont change. Many Brexiteers have since admitted that immigration wont change much since the referendum yet it was the main reason so many voted out. So you have to ask yourself why we are here. Because its been engineered by the super rich to create an ultra low tax economy. Its the only way we will attract inward investment as China, USA etc will not let us have our cake and eat it anymore than the EU 27 will. It will mean massive deregulation, doing away with workers rights of course and privatisation. Minimum wage and living wage will suffer or could just disappear in a puff of zero hour contract smoke. Have a look at the big wigs that are really behind Brexit and what they are all involved in and then my theory might make more sense. Immigration might have been the focus of the voters but the people behind Brexit dont give a toss about all that. Barry your theory makes no sense to me at all ... You've changed "Tories" for "big wigs" why ??? Because the Big wigs are the super rich that are the Dog that is wagging the Tory tail. Your Right wing media for one. Obviously these are pro EU links but have a read. Why were the likes of Arron Banks etc so keen to pour millions of pounds into Vote Leave? Why did they send out leaflets stating 75 million Turks were heading here? Because this was the easy target to whip up the masses. Immigration! It totally worked as well. Their motive? Well read on but it certainly wasnt Immigration for them, just the deregulation, depression of workers rights and pay and of course a UK tax haven. Singapore in Europe. A complete stitch up. https://infacts.org/super-rich-bought-brexit-victory/ http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-is-about-the-rich-rees-moggs-of-britain-not-anyone-else-1-4896702 Barry your on a different planet to me thankfully Do you know what? I hope your right and I am wrong. Lets face it though. When have the little people (thats you and me) ever come out on top of any major political changes? Five, ten years or whatever from now we will know. Will the Brexiteers who wanted to reduce Immigration and take back control be happy with the outcome and have got their country back with fewer foreigners in it or will the likes of Reek Smug, Arron Banks and the media moguls have been the only ones to have benefited from the Low tax, low regulation economy thats been created as a result? You also have to remember that once Brexit is done, its up to them and the people in power what they actually do about immigration, deregulation, workers rights and tax levels. There will be nobody to stop them doing whatever they want. Lets see how much thought they give to the people who put them there then. Barry I presume it will be up to whoever is in power ... If your team gets in with a decent majority then I doubt very much Corbyn will be doing anything for anyone with money so your theory really all hinges on your much hated Tory government staying in power doesn't it I keep telling you, They are not really my team but yes your correct. That could put a spanner in the works but possibly not. Whoever is in charge could be forced down the low tax state route if there is no other way of inciting inward investment anyway. The dastardly plan of the top tier Brexiteers though does kind of depend on the Tories staying in power though. Who the feck knows? Think ill get pished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted March 7, 2018 Author Share Posted March 7, 2018 Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 6:09 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 12:08 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 11:59 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 9:32 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 9:06 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 6:25 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 9:18 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 7:29 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 4:16 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 2:55 PM Tracker - 2018-03-06 2:39 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 1:54 PM If you don't like living with immigrants for whatever reason the only choice you have is to move. Come up here, we hardly have any which I know will annoy many but it's just the way it is. There is no work up here. Your either in the game now or your not and we are about to check out Immigrants are not an issue here either, especially cocooned from the real world of work that retirement brings. I don't think we are checking out of the game, more like hopefully modifying the game rules to suit our country and our natural people, but with controlled immigration giving us the skills we lack ourselves. However with a succession of weak willed lilly livered governments hell bent on pandering to minorities and the media I wish I could honestly believe that we will make best use of the opportunities that will once again be open to us as a free independant nation. Most of the world survives without the EU so why wouldn't we? Ask me again in five year's time! That's Barry's answer Richard if you don't like immigration which you never said youve gotta move out , maybe you could get on the big red number 350 bus he keeps waffling on about again and again and again .... its undeniable that Immigration was the main reason the majority voted out. The big bus probably did play a roll as well I guess for those who thought we were giving away £350 million for nothing. Rich never said he didnt like immigrants but he did say ("England, like so many other countries, was a more pleasant place before mass immigration swamped it so rather than the oh so convemient racist term beloved by the foreigneer worshippers I prefer patriot and self preservationist as being more realistic and fortunately I am far from alone.") which I took to mean that he would prefer like i think you and many others would that we had less immigrants or probably no immigrants perhaps. My point is you cant have that so whats the point of Brexit if thats the main reason people voted for it? We are going to make ourselves much worse off yet the immigrants will just come from somewhere else if they dont come from Europe. Its like trying to do a King Canute with the tide. Wont happen. You may get rid of a few or find that the nationalities change, we already stopped most of the spongers and its pretty much accepted now that our immigrants are generally hard working but you cant stop the tide and close yourself off, well we cannot as we are simply not set up for it. Im not sure I would like it if my home town was suddenly full of foreigners and the indigenous population moved out but I never liked living in a town anyway and as soon as I could afford to I moved to the country. Things change, economies and the way we work evolve. Going backwards wont change that. Who's on about going backwards ??? ... Whats wrong in wanting regulated immigration like many other countries have ??? Only countries that can afford to have it. The Immigration thing was just a dangling carrot to get people to vote for Brexit. Years of drip feeding from the Mail etc that it was the EU and immigrants to blame for the countries problems have done their job. Your beloved Tory government (and mine remember at one point) could have reduced it both from the EU and of course they have always been able to control it from outside where most immigration comes from but they choose not to because it suits their agenda. We need immigrants and that wont change. Many Brexiteers have since admitted that immigration wont change much since the referendum yet it was the main reason so many voted out. So you have to ask yourself why we are here. Because its been engineered by the super rich to create an ultra low tax economy. Its the only way we will attract inward investment as China, USA etc will not let us have our cake and eat it anymore than the EU 27 will. It will mean massive deregulation, doing away with workers rights of course and privatisation. Minimum wage and living wage will suffer or could just disappear in a puff of zero hour contract smoke. Have a look at the big wigs that are really behind Brexit and what they are all involved in and then my theory might make more sense. Immigration might have been the focus of the voters but the people behind Brexit dont give a toss about all that. Barry your theory makes no sense to me at all ... You've changed "Tories" for "big wigs" why ??? Because the Big wigs are the super rich that are the Dog that is wagging the Tory tail. Your Right wing media for one. Obviously these are pro EU links but have a read. Why were the likes of Arron Banks etc so keen to pour millions of pounds into Vote Leave? Why did they send out leaflets stating 75 million Turks were heading here? Because this was the easy target to whip up the masses. Immigration! It totally worked as well. Their motive? Well read on but it certainly wasnt Immigration for them, just the deregulation, depression of workers rights and pay and of course a UK tax haven. Singapore in Europe. A complete stitch up. https://infacts.org/super-rich-bought-brexit-victory/ http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-is-about-the-rich-rees-moggs-of-britain-not-anyone-else-1-4896702 Barry your on a different planet to me thankfully Do you know what? I hope your right and I am wrong. Lets face it though. When have the little people (thats you and me) ever come out on top of any major political changes? Five, ten years or whatever from now we will know. Will the Brexiteers who wanted to reduce Immigration and take back control be happy with the outcome and have got their country back with fewer foreigners in it or will the likes of Reek Smug, Arron Banks and the media moguls have been the only ones to have benefited from the Low tax, low regulation economy thats been created as a result? You also have to remember that once Brexit is done, its up to them and the people in power what they actually do about immigration, deregulation, workers rights and tax levels. There will be nobody to stop them doing whatever they want. Lets see how much thought they give to the people who put them there then. Barry I presume it will be up to whoever is in power ... If your team gets in with a decent majority then I doubt very much Corbyn will be doing anything for anyone with money so your theory really all hinges on your much hated Tory government staying in power doesn't it I keep telling you, They are not really my team but yes your correct. That could put a spanner in the works but possibly not. Whoever is in charge could be forced down the low tax state route if there is no other way of inciting inward investment anyway. The dastardly plan of the top tier Brexiteers though does kind of depend on the Tories staying in power though. Who the feck knows? Think ill get pished. They are your team and especially now Corbyns back tracked on staying in the customs union ... Trouble is for you it sits uncomfortable in your stomach to admit it because he's not naturally what you'd vote for ... You've allowed yourself to fall for it so you'll have to sit in your own sh8T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-03-07 4:56 PM Bulletguy - 2018-03-07 3:48 PM......................So which PBU are you i wonder? :-S Hadenough. Certainly fits his 'mo'. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 4:15 PM Peter James who was banned from this forum. Youre wrong again. Peter James was not banned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-03-07 6:35 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 6:09 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 12:08 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 11:59 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 9:32 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-07 9:06 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-07 6:25 AM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 9:18 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 7:29 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 4:16 PM antony1969 - 2018-03-06 2:55 PM Tracker - 2018-03-06 2:39 PM Barryd999 - 2018-03-06 1:54 PM If you don't like living with immigrants for whatever reason the only choice you have is to move. Come up here, we hardly have any which I know will annoy many but it's just the way it is. There is no work up here. Your either in the game now or your not and we are about to check out Immigrants are not an issue here either, especially cocooned from the real world of work that retirement brings. I don't think we are checking out of the game, more like hopefully modifying the game rules to suit our country and our natural people, but with controlled immigration giving us the skills we lack ourselves. However with a succession of weak willed lilly livered governments hell bent on pandering to minorities and the media I wish I could honestly believe that we will make best use of the opportunities that will once again be open to us as a free independant nation. Most of the world survives without the EU so why wouldn't we? Ask me again in five year's time! That's Barry's answer Richard if you don't like immigration which you never said youve gotta move out , maybe you could get on the big red number 350 bus he keeps waffling on about again and again and again .... its undeniable that Immigration was the main reason the majority voted out. The big bus probably did play a roll as well I guess for those who thought we were giving away £350 million for nothing. Rich never said he didnt like immigrants but he did say ("England, like so many other countries, was a more pleasant place before mass immigration swamped it so rather than the oh so convemient racist term beloved by the foreigneer worshippers I prefer patriot and self preservationist as being more realistic and fortunately I am far from alone.") which I took to mean that he would prefer like i think you and many others would that we had less immigrants or probably no immigrants perhaps. My point is you cant have that so whats the point of Brexit if thats the main reason people voted for it? We are going to make ourselves much worse off yet the immigrants will just come from somewhere else if they dont come from Europe. Its like trying to do a King Canute with the tide. Wont happen. You may get rid of a few or find that the nationalities change, we already stopped most of the spongers and its pretty much accepted now that our immigrants are generally hard working but you cant stop the tide and close yourself off, well we cannot as we are simply not set up for it. Im not sure I would like it if my home town was suddenly full of foreigners and the indigenous population moved out but I never liked living in a town anyway and as soon as I could afford to I moved to the country. Things change, economies and the way we work evolve. Going backwards wont change that. Who's on about going backwards ??? ... Whats wrong in wanting regulated immigration like many other countries have ??? Only countries that can afford to have it. The Immigration thing was just a dangling carrot to get people to vote for Brexit. Years of drip feeding from the Mail etc that it was the EU and immigrants to blame for the countries problems have done their job. Your beloved Tory government (and mine remember at one point) could have reduced it both from the EU and of course they have always been able to control it from outside where most immigration comes from but they choose not to because it suits their agenda. We need immigrants and that wont change. Many Brexiteers have since admitted that immigration wont change much since the referendum yet it was the main reason so many voted out. So you have to ask yourself why we are here. Because its been engineered by the super rich to create an ultra low tax economy. Its the only way we will attract inward investment as China, USA etc will not let us have our cake and eat it anymore than the EU 27 will. It will mean massive deregulation, doing away with workers rights of course and privatisation. Minimum wage and living wage will suffer or could just disappear in a puff of zero hour contract smoke. Have a look at the big wigs that are really behind Brexit and what they are all involved in and then my theory might make more sense. Immigration might have been the focus of the voters but the people behind Brexit dont give a toss about all that. Barry your theory makes no sense to me at all ... You've changed "Tories" for "big wigs" why ??? Because the Big wigs are the super rich that are the Dog that is wagging the Tory tail. Your Right wing media for one. Obviously these are pro EU links but have a read. Why were the likes of Arron Banks etc so keen to pour millions of pounds into Vote Leave? Why did they send out leaflets stating 75 million Turks were heading here? Because this was the easy target to whip up the masses. Immigration! It totally worked as well. Their motive? Well read on but it certainly wasnt Immigration for them, just the deregulation, depression of workers rights and pay and of course a UK tax haven. Singapore in Europe. A complete stitch up. https://infacts.org/super-rich-bought-brexit-victory/ http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/brexit-is-about-the-rich-rees-moggs-of-britain-not-anyone-else-1-4896702 Barry your on a different planet to me thankfully Do you know what? I hope your right and I am wrong. Lets face it though. When have the little people (thats you and me) ever come out on top of any major political changes? Five, ten years or whatever from now we will know. Will the Brexiteers who wanted to reduce Immigration and take back control be happy with the outcome and have got their country back with fewer foreigners in it or will the likes of Reek Smug, Arron Banks and the media moguls have been the only ones to have benefited from the Low tax, low regulation economy thats been created as a result? You also have to remember that once Brexit is done, its up to them and the people in power what they actually do about immigration, deregulation, workers rights and tax levels. There will be nobody to stop them doing whatever they want. Lets see how much thought they give to the people who put them there then. Barry I presume it will be up to whoever is in power ... If your team gets in with a decent majority then I doubt very much Corbyn will be doing anything for anyone with money so your theory really all hinges on your much hated Tory government staying in power doesn't it I keep telling you, They are not really my team but yes your correct. That could put a spanner in the works but possibly not. Whoever is in charge could be forced down the low tax state route if there is no other way of inciting inward investment anyway. The dastardly plan of the top tier Brexiteers though does kind of depend on the Tories staying in power though. Who the feck knows? Think ill get pished. They are your team and especially now Corbyns back tracked on staying in the customs union ... Trouble is for you it sits uncomfortable in your stomach to admit it because he's not naturally what you'd vote for ... You've allowed yourself to fall for it so you'll have to sit in your own sh8T Not necessarily. Some half hearted guff about staying in "A" Customs union doesn't really turn me on. I dont think staying in the customs union or / and the single market while still leaving is a great idea. It will simply mean us staying in but having no say in anything. What I would prefer to see is a policy that guarantees the public a vote on the final deal which includes a remain option or a Parliamentary free vote with a remain option. Whoever comes up with that gets my vote. I accept of course that scenario is unlikely but the entire thing has been bonkers from the start so who knows what might be on the table six months or a year from now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-03-07 8:45 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-03-07 4:56 PM Bulletguy - 2018-03-07 3:48 PM......................So which PBU are you i wonder? :-S Hadenough. Certainly fits his 'mo'. ;-) 8-) ....... Saving the UK appears to involve supping with the devil :-S .......... As they say "better the devil you know" >:-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 John52 - 2018-03-08 9:41 AM DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 4:15 PM Peter James who was banned from this forum. Youre wrong again. Peter James was not banned. Did he leave of his own accord? ;-) ......... Am I the only "original" nut job left who has never been banned or advised to leave? 8-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-03-08 2:55 PM John52 - 2018-03-08 9:41 AM DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 4:15 PM Peter James who was banned from this forum. Youre wrong again. Peter James was not banned. Did he leave of his own accord? ;-) ......... Am I the only "original" nut job left who has never been banned or advised to leave? 8-) ........ Nope because Peter James (yes me) was not banned or advised to leave. It was a misunderstanding that got out of hand. Peter James was sent off for the situation to cool down. Suspended for 3 months and told he would be welcome to return. I thought it best to return with this new name 'John52' for a fresh start to avoid anyone stirring it and trying to restart the argument. PS I have no other names on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 And now I have explained why I have 2 names perhaps one of Gideon/George Osborne's fans will explain why he has 2 names? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted March 10, 2018 Author Share Posted March 10, 2018 John52 - 2018-03-10 2:39 AM pelmetman - 2018-03-08 2:55 PM John52 - 2018-03-08 9:41 AM DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 4:15 PM Peter James who was banned from this forum. Youre wrong again. Peter James was not banned. Did he leave of his own accord? ;-) ......... Am I the only "original" nut job left who has never been banned or advised to leave? 8-) ........ Nope because Peter James (yes me) was not banned or advised to leave. It was a misunderstanding that got out of hand. Peter James was sent off for the situation to cool down. Suspended for 3 months and told he would be welcome to return. I thought it best to return with this new name 'John52' for a fresh start to avoid anyone stirring it and trying to restart the argument. PS I have no other names on this forum. So you got banned for 3 months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 John52 - 2018-03-07 11:03 AM PS: Have you managed to find any Communist policies in Corbyn's manifesto yet *-) They're working on it ;-) .......... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4441974/Andrew-Fisher-man-write-Labour-s-manifesto.html They're just trying to make it look less like a copy of Lenin's ideas for state capitalism *-) ........ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Economic_Policy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-03-10 7:31 AM John52 - 2018-03-10 2:39 AM pelmetman - 2018-03-08 2:55 PM John52 - 2018-03-08 9:41 AM DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 4:15 PM Peter James who was banned from this forum. Youre wrong again. Peter James was not banned. Did he leave of his own accord? ;-) ......... Am I the only "original" nut job left who has never been banned or advised to leave? 8-) ........ Nope because Peter James (yes me) was not banned or advised to leave. It was a misunderstanding that got out of hand. Peter James was sent off for the situation to cool down. Suspended for 3 months and told he would be welcome to return. I thought it best to return with this new name 'John52' for a fresh start to avoid anyone stirring it and trying to restart the argument. PS I have no other names on this forum. So you got banned for 3 months Peter James got banned from posting for 3 months. But just to say banned implies the ban is still in force - and implies that the new name is being used to evade it which is not the case. So If you must cut it down to one word the word is 'suspended' Now can you say why Osborne is using 2 names *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-03-10 8:27 AM John52 - 2018-03-07 11:03 AM PS: Have you managed to find any Communist policies in Corbyn's manifesto yet *-) They're working on it ;-) .......... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4441974/Andrew-Fisher-man-write-Labour-s-manifesto.html They're just trying to make it look less like a copy of Lenin's ideas for state capitalism *-) ........ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Economic_Policy An accurate headline that concerns them would be 'Corbyn and the EU might tax 'Newspaper' and property billionaires. But thats not so good for rabble rousing so they come up with this sh*te instead. Doesn't show the manifesto, just a smear campaign against a party member. Corbyn has stated that abolishing the monarchy is not in our manifesto because we aren't going to do it. - Doesn't stop the Daily Mail putting it in - large type Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted March 10, 2018 Author Share Posted March 10, 2018 John52 - 2018-03-10 10:00 AM antony1969 - 2018-03-10 7:31 AM John52 - 2018-03-10 2:39 AM pelmetman - 2018-03-08 2:55 PM John52 - 2018-03-08 9:41 AM DavidGJH - 2018-03-07 4:15 PM Peter James who was banned from this forum. Youre wrong again. Peter James was not banned. Did he leave of his own accord? ;-) ......... Am I the only "original" nut job left who has never been banned or advised to leave? 8-) ........ Nope because Peter James (yes me) was not banned or advised to leave. It was a misunderstanding that got out of hand. Peter James was sent off for the situation to cool down. Suspended for 3 months and told he would be welcome to return. I thought it best to return with this new name 'John52' for a fresh start to avoid anyone stirring it and trying to restart the argument. PS I have no other names on this forum. So you got banned for 3 months Peter James got banned from posting for 3 months. But just to say banned implies the ban is still in force - and implies that the new name is being used to evade it which is not the case. So If you must cut it down to one word the word is 'suspended' Now can you say why Osborne is using 2 names *-) So you got banned for 3 months ... Just like I said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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